Community > Posts By > Starsailor2851

 
no photo
Mon 07/14/08 11:24 AM


Islamists, Communists, Tyrants, Nationalists, Billionaire Socialists, and the Politically Correct Apologists that allow them to thrive.

That's the real axis of evil.


Dont forget the biggoted christians.

they are all evil


Did you just say all Christians are biggoted and evil?

Reason I ask because wouldn't 'biggoted' Christians' not be evil by definition?

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Mon 07/14/08 10:28 AM

What I think it means is: whoever built those pyramids is going to visit Earth again and start a new calendar surprised


Beat me to it. I've seen a couple of shows lately that have been showing Mayan sketchings on walls and ornaments they created, as well as stuff found in the pyramids in Egypt and stuff in the Mayan pyramid that look just like the classic image of a UFO that was presented in classic SciFi B-Movies. Some old paintings, including cave paintings, have the classic B-Moive alien spaceships as well. Some 15th, 16th, 17th, and 18th Century paintings as well have the same exact thing.

Christopher Columbus on his trip in 1492 to the New World has an entry in his own diary that talks about lights in the sky doing unusual things.

no photo
Mon 07/14/08 10:09 AM
Islamists, Communists, Tyrants, Nationalists, Billionaire Socialists, and the Politically Correct Apologists that allow them to thrive.

That's the real axis of evil.

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Mon 07/14/08 08:47 AM

Unprovoked war is Anti-American!

Peace Brother!


Firing on US and British jets = what? I suppose they accidentally leaned on the wrong button.

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Mon 07/14/08 08:32 AM

So anyone have thoughts on how this old knowledge became a new story?


That's quite easy. The uranium was finally shipped out of there. That's what makes it newsworthy. The US and Iraqi government was keeping the information and location on this uranium very tightly under wraps for fear of either it being hit during shipping or the site of it being targetted for attack. With the country so much more secure and confidence in the Iraqi government and forces it was finally sold and shipped off to some Canadian company.

There's the story.

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Mon 07/14/08 08:27 AM

I think this is kind of significant, but I am finding it hard to find more than people talking about it. I know people that personally saw it on the news and said they barely mentioned it and thought they were kind of trying to sweep it under the rug.


This is old news. This was reported right after we invaded and liberated Iraq. The uranium is old stuff that the UN allowed Iraq to store. Why they allowed this? I have absolutely no idea. However, I do remember them reporting that some of it was indeed enriched and do remember that it was Clinton that hit the Iraqi nuclear sites in '98.

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Fri 07/11/08 03:48 PM




i respectfully disagree with the characterization that one people's terrorist is another's freedom fighter. this represents the two parties conflict on equal footing and this is
typically not the case but certainly not in current Islamic
fundamentalist conflagrations.

you cannot reasonably make this symmetric equivalence.
Kim Jong-Il and Saddam Hussein saw themselves as
freedom fighters as they terrorized millions. They
even had supporters!

but they were no ones freedom fighter. their cause was/is
cancerous to humanity and to freedom. you cannot equate
the bombing of a schoolbus to shooting someone who is
attempting to launch a rocket at you.

that is why (among other things) that we have something
known as killing in self defense as a valid legal defense.

we attacked bin laden and overthrew the Taliban
to disrupt his attempts to kill us and Afgan santuary
of terrorists.

we attacked hussein because he had demonstrated a willingness
and capability to kill civilians in order to try to intimidate
his enemies and he openly threatened the US and our allies
while defiantly refusing attempts to disarm him. there was
also a concern that he was continuing to pursue nuclear options...and because of the oil he had plenty of mad money.

your argument that bin laden lives because of his lack of
oil is naive. if bin laden were to peek out of hiding he would
be taken out. he is merely hidden better and less effective
hence less of a threat.

bin laden like hussein is a man who gleefully cheers the slaughter of
innocent civilians in the name of Islam and provides funds
and support to those who do the killing.


The US went to Iraq for the following :
1 : the oil : to steal Iraqi oil .
2 : to have permanent military bases .
3 : For Israel to dominate the whole region .


When none of the 3 happen, then what are you going to use for the normal talking points? Not one of the three have occurred yet.


The three points are already there and only a ROBOT can not see them. Those who hate the truth hate humans due to hatred and racism . We can all see reality .


Where is the oil that we stole? why is Exxon's and Chevron's stock on a slide if they stole all the oil? Israel currently is dominating Egypt, United Arab Emirates, Turkey, and on and on? And, permanent bases, why would we need those when we already have plenty in other countries of the Middle East?

So, I am a robot, I hate humans, and I'm a racist too? lol

All one needs to look at is WHO are performing the personal attacks and unsubstantiated claims and rhetoric. It surely isn't I.

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Fri 07/11/08 03:42 PM
Edited by Starsailor2851 on Fri 07/11/08 03:43 PM






Here's how the Senate voted on 'a bill to amend the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 to establish a procedure for authorizing certain acquisitions of foreign intelligence, and for other purposes.'

http://markcrispinmiller.blogspot.com/2008/07/how-they-voted-on-fisa.html

This basically immunizes telecom companies from lawsuits and give warrantless eavesdropping privileges to the President, which is just what Bush Jr. wanted.

Here's how the Presidential candidates voted:

Obama: Yea
Clinton: Nay
McCain: Did not vote.

I'm not going to speculate at this time as to why McCain was absent for this important vote.

I am disappointed that Barack Obama and other Democrats caved in to the President.

I'm with Hillary on this one.


you got your info from a blog. i do not use blogs as credible sources. Obama did not vote on Fisa, however he did vote yea on the amendment to FISA that would have held the telecommunications companies accountable and answered the question of the legality of Bush's actions.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=110&session=2&vote=00019


The FISA vote was going to pass wheather Obama voted against it or not. Republicans would have used it against him to make him look weak on terrorism and put fear in people. After all the time spent on compromise???, how can the layman have any idea what is behind it, when the majority of the Senators are not priveledged to classified information from Bush??? I'm speculating that McCain is one of the priveledged Senators who does have access to the classified info on FISA. It is ridiculous and I think what angers me most is our Senator's will not all come together and demand to know, and they all failed.


So, essentially Obama was duped because he was an uninformed, new to the job, junior Senator who feared Republican attack dogs in the media because they have done so many damaging attacks thus far? huh?


If you are really interested read this article from Washington Post, it is the same plan of attack as usual.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/29/AR2008062901878.html


You said it, not I. If you got a problem with it I suggest you should have clarified your original statement. You did a far better job painting Obama as a clueless Senator with little power and easy to be duped than I ever could have.


Karl Rove don't you have more important places to be? laugh You must have read the article. laugh


I didn't write such an offensive post about my own political kind, Jesse Jackson.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 03:31 PM


i respectfully disagree with the characterization that one people's terrorist is another's freedom fighter. this represents the two parties conflict on equal footing and this is
typically not the case but certainly not in current Islamic
fundamentalist conflagrations.

you cannot reasonably make this symmetric equivalence.
Kim Jong-Il and Saddam Hussein saw themselves as
freedom fighters as they terrorized millions. They
even had supporters!

but they were no ones freedom fighter. their cause was/is
cancerous to humanity and to freedom. you cannot equate
the bombing of a schoolbus to shooting someone who is
attempting to launch a rocket at you.

that is why (among other things) that we have something
known as killing in self defense as a valid legal defense.

we attacked bin laden and overthrew the Taliban
to disrupt his attempts to kill us and Afgan santuary
of terrorists.

we attacked hussein because he had demonstrated a willingness
and capability to kill civilians in order to try to intimidate
his enemies and he openly threatened the US and our allies
while defiantly refusing attempts to disarm him. there was
also a concern that he was continuing to pursue nuclear options...and because of the oil he had plenty of mad money.

your argument that bin laden lives because of his lack of
oil is naive. if bin laden were to peek out of hiding he would
be taken out. he is merely hidden better and less effective
hence less of a threat.

bin laden like hussein is a man who gleefully cheers the slaughter of
innocent civilians in the name of Islam and provides funds
and support to those who do the killing.


The US went to Iraq for the following :
1 : the oil : to steal Iraqi oil .
2 : to have permanent military bases .
3 : For Israel to dominate the whole region .


When none of the 3 happen, then what are you going to use for the normal talking points? Not one of the three have occurred yet.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 03:29 PM




Here's how the Senate voted on 'a bill to amend the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 to establish a procedure for authorizing certain acquisitions of foreign intelligence, and for other purposes.'

http://markcrispinmiller.blogspot.com/2008/07/how-they-voted-on-fisa.html

This basically immunizes telecom companies from lawsuits and give warrantless eavesdropping privileges to the President, which is just what Bush Jr. wanted.

Here's how the Presidential candidates voted:

Obama: Yea
Clinton: Nay
McCain: Did not vote.

I'm not going to speculate at this time as to why McCain was absent for this important vote.

I am disappointed that Barack Obama and other Democrats caved in to the President.

I'm with Hillary on this one.


you got your info from a blog. i do not use blogs as credible sources. Obama did not vote on Fisa, however he did vote yea on the amendment to FISA that would have held the telecommunications companies accountable and answered the question of the legality of Bush's actions.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=110&session=2&vote=00019


The FISA vote was going to pass wheather Obama voted against it or not. Republicans would have used it against him to make him look weak on terrorism and put fear in people. After all the time spent on compromise???, how can the layman have any idea what is behind it, when the majority of the Senators are not priveledged to classified information from Bush??? I'm speculating that McCain is one of the priveledged Senators who does have access to the classified info on FISA. It is ridiculous and I think what angers me most is our Senator's will not all come together and demand to know, and they all failed.


So, essentially Obama was duped because he was an uninformed, new to the job, junior Senator who feared Republican attack dogs in the media because they have done so many damaging attacks thus far? huh?


If you are really interested read this article from Washington Post, it is the same plan of attack as usual.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/29/AR2008062901878.html


You said it, not I. If you got a problem with it I suggest you should have clarified your original statement. You did a far better job painting Obama as a clueless Senator with little power and easy to be duped than I ever could have.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 11:58 AM
Edited by Starsailor2851 on Fri 07/11/08 12:04 PM


Here's how the Senate voted on 'a bill to amend the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 to establish a procedure for authorizing certain acquisitions of foreign intelligence, and for other purposes.'

http://markcrispinmiller.blogspot.com/2008/07/how-they-voted-on-fisa.html

This basically immunizes telecom companies from lawsuits and give warrantless eavesdropping privileges to the President, which is just what Bush Jr. wanted.

Here's how the Presidential candidates voted:

Obama: Yea
Clinton: Nay
McCain: Did not vote.

I'm not going to speculate at this time as to why McCain was absent for this important vote.

I am disappointed that Barack Obama and other Democrats caved in to the President.

I'm with Hillary on this one.


you got your info from a blog. i do not use blogs as credible sources. Obama did not vote on Fisa, however he did vote yea on the amendment to FISA that would have held the telecommunications companies accountable and answered the question of the legality of Bush's actions.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=110&session=2&vote=00019


The FISA vote was going to pass wheather Obama voted against it or not. Republicans would have used it against him to make him look weak on terrorism and put fear in people. After all the time spent on compromise???, how can the layman have any idea what is behind it, when the majority of the Senators are not priveledged to classified information from Bush??? I'm speculating that McCain is one of the priveledged Senators who does have access to the classified info on FISA. It is ridiculous and I think what angers me most is our Senator's will not all come together and demand to know, and they all failed.


So, essentially Obama was duped because he was an uninformed, new to the job, junior Senator who feared Republican attack dogs in the media because they have done so many damaging attacks thus far? huh?

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Fri 07/11/08 11:53 AM
Okay, I will make it much easier. Should have done so for myself as well...lol.

"Ninety percent of his donors give $100 or less, and 41 percent have given $25 or less, according to the Obama campaign. Overall, he has raised 45 percent of his money in small contributions. Hillary Rodham Clinton's figure is 30 percent, Republican John McCain's is 23 percent." - http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10223.html

And, here is the slamdunk, much better than the Tenet slamdunk:

"Among small donors, students have given $303,000 to him, compared with less than $100,000 to Clinton and less than $20,000 to McCain." - http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10223.html

College STUDENTS giving $303,000 to Obama?

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Fri 07/11/08 11:47 AM

how do you figure oil stocks are down, seem like you been watching fox business news. you one of the few to watch that channel. as for Jefferson he is from . , so why should we be surprised. that the most crooked government in the usa.


I just went to Yahoo Finance to find that one out. Just look up Exxon and Chevron, and the other US companies. You can probably look up Total, BP, and other foreign ones as well, I wouldn't be surprised if those oil stocks are sliding as well.

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Fri 07/11/08 11:41 AM
Edited by Starsailor2851 on Fri 07/11/08 11:45 AM






If everyone is so strapped for cash, how exactly is it that Obama has been getting record amounts of cash from the American public? That ontop with how much Mccain, Clinton, and others have received. Something seems odd that records would donate and such, though supposedly everyone can barely survive each week.


It didn't occur to you that the average Joe is not the one donating money to the campaigns? Maybe it is the well off?

Many Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.

Obviously you are not a single parent with house payments.


If an individual is only allowed to donate $2300..... yeah, that idea of yours just doesn't add up. Even if these 'well off' people donate $2300 for the primary and $2300 for the general, the top that it is allowed, it still does not add up.


Like I said, "Average Joe does not have that kind of money to give to a political campaign."

It does add up.



This according to OpenSecrets.org

Obama has raised $287,397,945 (round to $287 million)
Clinton raised $229,422,030 (round to $229 million)
Mccain has raised $119,594,596 (round to $120 million)
Mitt Romney raised $107,065,257 (round to $107 million)

Just those 4 alone raised $743,000,000

Okay, you are going to tell me that only the 'well off' have paid all of that?

Now, to go with a Daily Kos article for Obama:

"According to Time, Obama raised over $100 Million last year from about 470,000 unique donors. According to this blog Obama has an average donation size of about $250. If we do the math, it comes out to $117.5 million, so I suspect the actual average donation was smaller: something like $215 per donor." - http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/2/14/193945/594/628/457024

Average size of donation was around $250. So, it was not the very well off paying the highest donation possible. And, if there were many spending $2300 for primary and $2300 for general campaign it would make them a unique donar. There are 470,000 of them last year and likely many hundred thousands more at this time of individual unique donars.

To pull down $4,600 to a $250 average you have to know that there were huge numbers of donations from people donating numbers less than $250. This proves that the average citizen is donating OR it means the 'well off' are donating incredibly cheaply.


Average Joe - mortgage payment, car payment and children and many Average Joe's have child support payments.

How many average Joe's do you know that gave to a campaign?
I don't know any.


I know a few. So, your argument to what I just posted essentially is, that the "well off" people are doing so bad in this economy that yes, some are giving the high limit of $4600, but most "well off" people are now only giving a few dollars, most of them doing so under $250.

I would just love to see Bill Gates writing a check to Obama's campaign for $250 and saying essentially the economy sucks and that is all he can afford.

"Sixty percent of the Obama campaign's funds come from people who have given at least $1000" - http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/politics/obama/chi-070725obama,1,2036333.story

Anyone real good with math here? Round up the 470,000 unique donors, as that number is from last year, to 500,000. Then, knowing that 60 percent have donated "at least" $1000, what does the other percentile of donations have to be to bring down the average donation to $250?

Essentially:

500,000 donors
60 percent donated $1000 plus
Average donation is $250

What percent is needed to be below $1000 for the average to be $250?

Or, is their too little info known? Use the $287,000,000 million dollars he raised number if you have to.

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Fri 07/11/08 11:34 AM






I suppose Fanta is smarter than Steve Coll and knows much more than he does as well. He must have the inside men and resources to get such information.


laugh laugh laugh laugh
This from sailor. Doctorer of facts and figures, King of the NeoCons who says hes a Democrat!
Boy Genius and master of momma and Daddies basement!

I have done more in one year of my life than you will in 20.
I have wrote many research papers on Afghanistan and the Soviet Invasion.
Hell, I was actually alive back then. Better yet, I was in the military when in all took place!
I cant vouch for Steve Coll, but I do know far more on the subject than you'll ever read in the Bushy Indoctrination manual little one!

laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh


A resort to a solely based personal attack. How old are you again? I based all that I said off of studies as well, mostly though DIRECT from Steve Coll. The fact you launched a solely personal attack and belittlement without providing these vast research papers that say something different than the Pulitzer Prize winning Steve Coll on the subject says alot.


Old enough to be your Daddy!!laugh laugh laugh

Of course if I was you'd be much wiser!!


Nice job of the duck and cover. Steve Coll said it right, you got caught with your pants down, so you decided to use childish face icons, belittle and personally attack someone far younger than you, and totally ignore the subject, which Coll has you seriously bested in. And, I based everything I said directly off of it.


Of course you did!
People just like you won him a Pulitzer, not because he knows what he's writing about!
If Id have used him as a reference Id have been laughed at and failed!
Instead I made A's.


Ummm... not to laugh too much, but you do know that the Pulizer Prize are the annual awards given out by COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY, right?

I suppose NeoCon hacks with a distorion of history have taken over Columbia University? laugh Had to use an icon, your statement is so beyond ridiculous.

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Fri 07/11/08 11:28 AM
Edited by Starsailor2851 on Fri 07/11/08 11:30 AM


Short Version:

Osama essentially got to the holy war on US idea when it was the US that Saudi Arabia came to during the first Gulf War. When Kuwait was invaded the Saudi royal family feared that Saddam might not stop for they were pushing closer and closer to the border of Saudi Arabia through Kuwait. Osama came to Saudi Arabia offering his assistance, for the right price and approval of the Saudi royal family, to assemble his own personal army and defend them from Iraq.

Saudi Arabia declined and went to the US instead. This extremely ticked him off, his ego trip, and he created vast problems following for both Saudi Arabia and the US.


This is pretty much what I gathered sir, yet why would Saudia Arabia believe that Saddam Hussein's forces would want to invade or attack Saudia Arabia? Did he have a grudge with them also?

As far as I understand Saddam Hussein wanted to reclaim Kuwait for in history it was a part of Iraq. He believed that that part of the country belongs to the Iraqi people. So if this is to be true why would he want to attack Saudia Arabia?

Did the Saudia Arabian family monarchs truly believe Saddam would be a threat or did they listen to advisors from other countries to believe that they would be a threat?

Also and I am sorry to make this so long. Why did we even get involved in the affairs of the Middle East. Where we paid to save Kuwait or do we think we are obligated to make sure every country is a democracy? If this is to be true then why don't we have forces in much more dire areas of the world where slavery, religious wars, and difference of opinions happen.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

John


Yes, Saudi Arabia did see Saddam and Iraq as a threat. I could go on at length, but I do remembering reading in various books about the scuds that Iraq did fire at Saudi Arabia. A few actually killed American troops in Iraq, but most of them were to hurt Saudi Arabia. I did a search on google and finally found the evidence to support the scuds hitting Saudi Arabia. Wasn't easy.

From the book, on Google's Book Site, called Desert Storm: Forgotten War.

"During the war Iraq launched 88 SCUD missiles (46 against Saudi Arabia....)" - Desert Storm: A Forgotten War By Alberto Bin, Richard Hill, Archer Jones, page 101. http://books.google.com/books?id=KgD1VyCgGAYC&pg=PA101&lpg=PA101&dq=46+scuds+
from+Iraq+entered+Saudi+Arabia&source=web&ots=q
MuLd7QkUP&sig=HceWNE59JUlrOCMY0DRBwa1Tgvo&hl=en
&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=9&ct=result#PPA101,M1

Link is soooo long I had to assist in editting it or it screwed up the thread. Might be spaces when you copy and paste it so take them out or post it in line by line.

They have that cited, in the footnote on page 101, you see where they got that information from.


There is also personal and diplomacy, as well as historical issues between Iraq and Saudi Arabia that are complex. I'm going to end with the Scud thing, but there is alot behind animosity, I actually read awhile back that Saudi Arabia was aiding Iran in the Iran-Iraq War, and that is another reason for being a bit angry, plus the relationship they had with the US. Bahrain and Qatar were actually hit by a very few Scuds from Iraq as well, likely due to US relations as well.

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Fri 07/11/08 11:12 AM




I suppose Fanta is smarter than Steve Coll and knows much more than he does as well. He must have the inside men and resources to get such information.


laugh laugh laugh laugh
This from sailor. Doctorer of facts and figures, King of the NeoCons who says hes a Democrat!
Boy Genius and master of momma and Daddies basement!

I have done more in one year of my life than you will in 20.
I have wrote many research papers on Afghanistan and the Soviet Invasion.
Hell, I was actually alive back then. Better yet, I was in the military when in all took place!
I cant vouch for Steve Coll, but I do know far more on the subject than you'll ever read in the Bushy Indoctrination manual little one!

laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh


A resort to a solely based personal attack. How old are you again? I based all that I said off of studies as well, mostly though DIRECT from Steve Coll. The fact you launched a solely personal attack and belittlement without providing these vast research papers that say something different than the Pulitzer Prize winning Steve Coll on the subject says alot.


Old enough to be your Daddy!!laugh laugh laugh

Of course if I was you'd be much wiser!!


Nice job of the duck and cover. Steve Coll said it right, you got caught with your pants down, so you decided to use childish face icons, belittle and personally attack someone far younger than you, and totally ignore the subject, which Coll has you seriously bested in. And, I based everything I said directly off of it.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 11:06 AM


I suppose Fanta is smarter than Steve Coll and knows much more than he does as well. He must have the inside men and resources to get such information.


laugh laugh laugh laugh
This from sailor. Doctorer of facts and figures, King of the NeoCons who says hes a Democrat!
Boy Genius and master of momma and Daddies basement!

I have done more in one year of my life than you will in 20.
I have wrote many research papers on Afghanistan and the Soviet Invasion.
Hell, I was actually alive back then. Better yet, I was in the military when in all took place!
I cant vouch for Steve Coll, but I do know far more on the subject than you'll ever read in the Bushy Indoctrination manual little one!

laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh


A resort to a solely based personal attack. How old are you again? I based all that I said off of studies as well, mostly though DIRECT from Steve Coll. The fact you launched a solely personal attack and belittlement without providing these vast research papers that say something different than the Pulitzer Prize winning Steve Coll on the subject says alot.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 11:03 AM




If everyone is so strapped for cash, how exactly is it that Obama has been getting record amounts of cash from the American public? That ontop with how much Mccain, Clinton, and others have received. Something seems odd that records would donate and such, though supposedly everyone can barely survive each week.


It didn't occur to you that the average Joe is not the one donating money to the campaigns? Maybe it is the well off?

Many Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.

Obviously you are not a single parent with house payments.


If an individual is only allowed to donate $2300..... yeah, that idea of yours just doesn't add up. Even if these 'well off' people donate $2300 for the primary and $2300 for the general, the top that it is allowed, it still does not add up.


Like I said, "Average Joe does not have that kind of money to give to a political campaign."

It does add up.



This according to OpenSecrets.org

Obama has raised $287,397,945 (round to $287 million)
Clinton raised $229,422,030 (round to $229 million)
Mccain has raised $119,594,596 (round to $120 million)
Mitt Romney raised $107,065,257 (round to $107 million)

Just those 4 alone raised $743,000,000

Okay, you are going to tell me that only the 'well off' have paid all of that?

Now, to go with a Daily Kos article for Obama:

"According to Time, Obama raised over $100 Million last year from about 470,000 unique donors. According to this blog Obama has an average donation size of about $250. If we do the math, it comes out to $117.5 million, so I suspect the actual average donation was smaller: something like $215 per donor." - http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/2/14/193945/594/628/457024

Average size of donation was around $250. So, it was not the very well off paying the highest donation possible. And, if there were many spending $2300 for primary and $2300 for general campaign it would make them a unique donar. There are 470,000 of them last year and likely many hundred thousands more at this time of individual unique donars.

To pull down $4,600 to a $250 average you have to know that there were huge numbers of donations from people donating numbers less than $250. This proves that the average citizen is donating OR it means the 'well off' are donating incredibly cheaply.

no photo
Fri 07/11/08 10:50 AM
Edited by Starsailor2851 on Fri 07/11/08 10:51 AM






Short Version:

Osama essentially got to the holy war on US idea when it was the US that Saudi Arabia came to during the first Gulf War. When Kuwait was invaded the Saudi royal family feared that Saddam might not stop for they were pushing closer and closer to the border of Saudi Arabia through Kuwait. Osama came to Saudi Arabia offering his assistance, for the right price and approval of the Saudi royal family, to assemble his own personal army and defend them from Iraq.

Saudi Arabia declined and went to the US instead. This extremely ticked him off, his ego trip, and he created vast problems following for both Saudi Arabia and the US.


power, greed, intolerance...etc...:wink:


Pretty much, Osama wasn't even the real hero of the Russian defeat in Afghanistan. The rich and highly educated Osama took all credit for the successes that were actually Ahmed Shah Massoud, the Northern Alliance leader who was tracking Osama in Afghanistan for us prior to 9/11. Mossoud HATED Osama with a passion for what he did to him and according to him Osama was a horrible field commander, as is evident by the very poor battlefield training of al Qaeda.


Again with the no real knowledge gang!!laugh laugh laugh

Try again!


Prove me wrong.


There's an old saying in the real world sailor that says never underestimate your enemy!
Of course you couldn't learn that unless you actually had to fight yourself!

Personally, Id have already tracked Osama down and killed him. Underestimating him is what GWB has done despite the first hand accounts of his bravery and military tactician genius fro knowledgeable westerners who actually fought with him. Some of these CIA, many private mercenaries who hired out to fight against the Soviets!
You have no credibility at all. Either in military tactics or known knowledge about Osama's deeds! You should read some at least!
I'll just dismiss your arrogant lack of knowledge for what it is, immaturity!


Steve Coll, a Pulitizer Prize winning author and journalist, is immature? He lacks knowledge and has no credibility either?

----

A GREAT article on Massoud, the CIA in Afghanistan and their relationship with Massoud, and the search for bin Laden there: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=3853553

Steve Coll wrote a great book, much more lengthier than the lengthy story from the source above called Ghost Wars.

Steve Coll is a Pulitzer Prize-winning American journalist and writer. Ghost Wars won him the prize in 2005.

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