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| Topic: Religion Endangers Humanity And Its Future | |
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Interesting...you can become an ordained Atheist minister? http://firstchurchofatheism.com/index.php/become-ordained/ Eh, I'm already ordained under the Church of Secular Humanism, Universal Ministries, and Universal Life Church. |
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Interesting...you can become an ordained Atheist minister? http://firstchurchofatheism.com/index.php/become-ordained/ Eh, I'm already ordained under the Church of Secular Humanism, Universal Ministries, and Universal Life Church. really???? cool. My aunt was a Unitarian for a while. Now she is something else (can't remember the name) but it has to do with a force field of some kind??? |
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Interesting...you can become an ordained Atheist minister? http://firstchurchofatheism.com/index.php/become-ordained/ Eh, I'm already ordained under the Church of Secular Humanism, Universal Ministries, and Universal Life Church. really???? cool. My aunt was a Unitarian for a while. Now she is something else (can't remember the name) but it has to do with a force field of some kind??? Ummm, Star Wars?! LOL! |
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But is the argument of being a man just as equally as valid as blaming religion? Maybe the Y chromosome is really evil....who knows No, definitely not. The Y chromosome doesn't require that one have any particular belief - most religious organizations/traditions not only require that you have certain beliefs, they also require that acknowledge certain authorities. It is not just a question of 'was the violent person Christian' and 'was the violent person male' - it is more a question of 'was this violence encouraged by the persons beliefs'. It looks to me like too often, then answer is yes. |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Wed 01/20/10 02:44 AM
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I was under the impression that Atheism is simply the lack of belief in a God. You cannot have a belief that something does not exist. That is like a double negative. 
Its just a disagreement with the people who do believe in God. One person says: I believe in God. The other persons says: I don't believe. Not believing is not a "belief." But you are assuming that an Atheist is without belief - however this is not true. The religion of most - if not all atheists is Secular Humanism, and if not that - it's Uniformalism. Just because a "God" isn't involved, or believed in - does not mean there isn't a "religion" present. I am assuming no such thing. An atheist is a person who believes in SOMETHING. But God is no one of them. The term atheist means a person who has no belief in God. Any other beliefs you think he may have that you think goes along with that is your own assumption and interpretation of the word. Personally - I don't think any man is a God - especially his own. Does that make me an Atheist in terms of secular humanism? Does that now mean I am without religion and immune to the curse of the OP? Seems to me - the issue here is one of semantics and definition. And as with all posts where any personal definiton of the terms will do - this will go on for about 50 pages - if it doesn't get locked before then. Yes, the term "atheist" is interpreted many different ways, and mostly the wrong ways when assumptions are added. |
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I am assuming no such thing. An atheist is a person who believes in SOMETHING. But God is no one of them. The term atheist means a person who has no belief in God. Any other beliefs you think he may have that you think goes along with that is your own assumption and interpretation of the word. JB is correct. We can say that atheists have beliefs simply because they are human, not because they are atheists. There is only one belief universal to 'strong atheists' (the positive belief in the nonexistence of deities) , and there are no beliefs universal to 'weak atheists'. But you are assuming that an Atheist is without belief - however this is not true. The religion of most - if not all atheists is Secular Humanism, and if not that - it's Uniformalism. Just because a "God" isn't involved, or believed in - does not mean there isn't a "religion" present. This sounds like Fundamentalist Christian Kool Aid to me. If you are talking about a Secular Humanist, the intelligent thing to do is to say "Secular Humanist." To say "atheist" when you mean "Secular Humanist" is both dishonest and contrary to an intelligent development of thought, IMO. Its obvious to me, from listening to tons of Christian talk radio and reading many books on apologetics (intended for lay people, not theologians) that there is a massive trend of Fundamentalists Christians continuously repeating bizarre ideas, promoting false logic, and taking arguments out of their original context to obtain a kind of 'mass hypnosis' of the ridiculous . Saying that "atheism is a religion" is one of those phrases/memes/beliefs. It is complete an total nonsense, and obviously so if you just take a look at words composing the sentence. There are similar statements that an honest and intelligent person could make.... such as, "it looks like all humans, including atheists, have a belief system of some sort" or "it looks like all humans, including atheists, take a lot of their belief system on faith" or "many atheists participate in some cultural phenemona that are atheist in nature and yet which have the same qualities of religions" and on and on. Saying that "atheism is a religion" is at least as foolish as saying that "theism is a religion". |
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there is a massive trend of Fundamentalists Christians continuously repeating bizarre ideas, promoting false logic, and taking arguments out of their original context to obtain a kind of 'mass hypnosis' of the ridiculous. To be fair, the same can be said of the 'anti-religious atheist' camp. Some of the memes that some of them (or us? I'm atheist, and somewhat anti-religious, but I don't associate much with the people I'm about to speak of) .... that some of them mass-hypnotize themseves with include the myth that 'atheists are more logical than Christians'. This is obviously total BS - every group of people has a bell curve for various qualities of the individuals, and many 'anti-religious atheists' are less logical than the 'average person', its just how it goes. Another lie that some anti-religious atheists tell themselves is the idea that 'atheists categorically don't take things on faith' and the idea that 'no atheist participates in a religion'. I mean, they don't say these phrase just so, but they say other ridiculous and stupid phrases which revolve around these beleifs. So I can sympathize with someone who wants to challenge these foolish ideas that some atheists have about 'themselves as a group'. But challenging these myths by falsely stating that "atheism is a religion" hardly elevates the conversation. |
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Saying that "atheism is a religion" is at least as foolish as saying that "theism is a religion".
Yes, that would be funny. If someone asked my what my religion is and I said "theism" they would ask me what I meant by that. I would say: I believe in God, but I'm not sure which one.
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greed and power do more harm than any religion. People decide what is right for them on any number of basis, if one of those is the bible, so be it. In the end, it is still up to the individual what type of person they choose to be(with or without religion).
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athiests use logic? What kind of logic contends that humans came from monkeys when there are still primates in existence?
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my question is this....who supports our President??? he is Christian. so does that mean he is a danger because of this? No, our president is not blinded by the light. He's a sane Christian: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXcvbnzNIjg |
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Edited by
MiddleEarthling
on
Wed 01/20/10 04:21 PM
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my question is this....who supports our President??? he is Christian. so does that mean he is a danger because of this? No, our president is not blinded by the light. He's a sane Christian: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXcvbnzNIjg "An amazing & brave moral stance against the dogmatic prejudice of religion. A real surprise for an American politician." "We are no longer a Christian nation." "Folks haven't been reading the Bible." "...universal rather than religion-specific values." "...in a pluralistic society, we have no choice." "...religion doesn't allow for compromise." |
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athiests use logic? What kind of logic contends that humans came from monkeys when there are still primates in existence? Just as an aside, it is not logical to assume that 'being atheist' requires that one believe "humans came from monkeys". |
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His religion is one of the things I held against Obama but he was still a better choice than McCain. How so? Because he won the Nobel peace prize for - what was it - something he MIGHT do? Religion or believing in one can be a bad mark against someone in power. Because they will make choices based on the philosophy of the religion making them possibly very dangerous. But that goes to the incapabability of an individual to make sound judgements - not to the core of religious philosophy. If I have a corrupt leader using religion to support a subverted agenda, and I mix that with someone devoid of sound discernmet of what is right or wrong - the issue is not one of religion - but of human nature. Considering that religion encourages divisiveness, superiority, hypocrisy, I will disagree that it is just a human nature problem. Religion encourages wishing bad on humans who do not believe as you do. Religion encourages less self responsibility. To name a few of the issues with religion. Then add a position of power to all of those issues that religion has and you are asking for trouble. Until the religious can realize they are the same as all other people in the world regardless to belief with no special priviledges with god and no special treatment when they die and no superior morality or superior judgements, they should not be trusted in places of power. I've been a member of a religion most of my entire life - and I haven't experienced any of what you "claim" reliigon is responsible for. What are you basing your statements on? What experience do you have with religion? What are some examples that you can site where a religion is to blame - and not an individual or group of individual's interpretation of a religious philosophy is not to blame. The only example I can think of is Satanism and some forms of Witchcraft or Paganism where what you claim is more a part of the religious philosophy than the individuals who are interpreting it. And I know of no religion with a special priviledge with God. As a matter of fact - it is religion which keeps one from God more often than not. Obviously you are blinded by your own beliefs to see what I am talking about because the examples you gave are not even slightly on target. I was raised both Catholic and Baptist and have been around religious folks all my life. So I am speaking from personal observation. I have seen religion take a logical person and turn them into an illogical "righteous" mess. I have seen the damage religion has on children. I have seen personally people who feel "justified" and "righteous" that those who do not believe as them are deserving of bad things to happen to them. Every religion teaches divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy. I have studied different religions and it is the same with most of them. The major religions definitely do this. All of Christianity does it. All of the concepts in most religion contort logical thought and create a twisted sense of reality. So a person in power with this twist is not necessarily the best to make important decisions. I'm not blinded by my own beliefs - I just don't see the same thing you do through the clouded specticles you see life with. First off - we are not in disagreement about what goes on in the world - i see the same things you do as far as people doing injustices to themselves, and teaching children to do the same - but I don't see where the blame is on "religion" - and not the people intelligent enough to understand what it is they think they believe. Your caim that every religion teaches divisiveness, superiority and hypocracy is blatenly false. Period. not only is this not true - i say that you cannot name one religion outside of Satanism that can support this claim of yours. Certainly not christianity. And if that's your claim - I attest that you don't know what christianity is. Now - I'm not going to sit here and admit that there are not religions in this world who's philosophy is not inherantly damaging and dangerous. I would never make that claim. In fact - for the most part, I would tend to agree with the OP about his initial intent behind the firdt post. But for radically different reasons. I've seen all the damage that has been done since the religion of "Evolution" has been introduced into the main stream, and our children forced to accept it as truth. There has been no other religion throughout time that hs done more damage to the human race than that of evolution. From it we have the autrocities of Hitler and Stalin - euthanasia - abortion, all born out of the philosophies of Evolution. But my sense is - that this is not the aspects of religion that you'd agree with me on as far as it's destructive influence. Why? Because you are blinded by your own beliefs. So who's the blind one here? Who see's only what they want to see? Obviously you. You have missed on all of your examples still about the teachings of christianity. I cannot help you because of your blinders. You will continue to believe what you do, be it right or wrong. Most religions teach divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy, there is not way around it and individuality doesn't change it. If you follow the religion you will incorporate divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy in your beliefs, projections and judgements. |
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athiests use logic? What kind of logic contends that humans came from monkeys when there are still primates in existence? Actually the first humans may have evolved from a line of lemurs. |
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athiests use logic? What kind of logic contends that humans came from monkeys when there are still primates in existence?
The logic is only one chromosome being different, the similar skeletal structures, that there are an overwhelmingly large amount of physical similarities. In religion there is no logic, that is where blind faith comes in. In atheism, there is a reliance on the scientific method. A person using this method doesnt necessarily look at something as it being entirely right without testing it rigorously. The science-minded person will take a hypothesis and conduct the tests with the aim of disproving old theories. Religion teaches us not to question our faith. There is no logic in not evaluating something. So, yes, atheists use logic, and are some of the most logical individuals out there. There are sub-species that are formed, but the original creatures in which the sub-species formed from are still in existence. There is absolutely no logic in that a deity made a man out of dirt, then breathed into his nose, then he came to life, or that a rib was taken from a man in his sleep, and formed into a woman. But, then again, thats where blind faith comes in. |
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In atheism, there is a reliance on the scientific method. A person using this method doesnt necessarily look at something as it being entirely right without testing it rigorously.
For some atheists that is true, but certainly not all. The science-minded person will take a hypothesis and conduct the tests with the aim of disproving old theories.
True, and not all atheists are 'science minded', and not all 'science minded' are atheist. |
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His religion is one of the things I held against Obama but he was still a better choice than McCain. How so? Because he won the Nobel peace prize for - what was it - something he MIGHT do? Religion or believing in one can be a bad mark against someone in power. Because they will make choices based on the philosophy of the religion making them possibly very dangerous. But that goes to the incapabability of an individual to make sound judgements - not to the core of religious philosophy. If I have a corrupt leader using religion to support a subverted agenda, and I mix that with someone devoid of sound discernmet of what is right or wrong - the issue is not one of religion - but of human nature. Considering that religion encourages divisiveness, superiority, hypocrisy, I will disagree that it is just a human nature problem. Religion encourages wishing bad on humans who do not believe as you do. Religion encourages less self responsibility. To name a few of the issues with religion. Then add a position of power to all of those issues that religion has and you are asking for trouble. Until the religious can realize they are the same as all other people in the world regardless to belief with no special priviledges with god and no special treatment when they die and no superior morality or superior judgements, they should not be trusted in places of power. I've been a member of a religion most of my entire life - and I haven't experienced any of what you "claim" reliigon is responsible for. What are you basing your statements on? What experience do you have with religion? What are some examples that you can site where a religion is to blame - and not an individual or group of individual's interpretation of a religious philosophy is not to blame. The only example I can think of is Satanism and some forms of Witchcraft or Paganism where what you claim is more a part of the religious philosophy than the individuals who are interpreting it. And I know of no religion with a special priviledge with God. As a matter of fact - it is religion which keeps one from God more often than not. Obviously you are blinded by your own beliefs to see what I am talking about because the examples you gave are not even slightly on target. I was raised both Catholic and Baptist and have been around religious folks all my life. So I am speaking from personal observation. I have seen religion take a logical person and turn them into an illogical "righteous" mess. I have seen the damage religion has on children. I have seen personally people who feel "justified" and "righteous" that those who do not believe as them are deserving of bad things to happen to them. Every religion teaches divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy. I have studied different religions and it is the same with most of them. The major religions definitely do this. All of Christianity does it. All of the concepts in most religion contort logical thought and create a twisted sense of reality. So a person in power with this twist is not necessarily the best to make important decisions. I'm not blinded by my own beliefs - I just don't see the same thing you do through the clouded specticles you see life with. First off - we are not in disagreement about what goes on in the world - i see the same things you do as far as people doing injustices to themselves, and teaching children to do the same - but I don't see where the blame is on "religion" - and not the people intelligent enough to understand what it is they think they believe. Your caim that every religion teaches divisiveness, superiority and hypocracy is blatenly false. Period. not only is this not true - i say that you cannot name one religion outside of Satanism that can support this claim of yours. Certainly not christianity. And if that's your claim - I attest that you don't know what christianity is. Now - I'm not going to sit here and admit that there are not religions in this world who's philosophy is not inherantly damaging and dangerous. I would never make that claim. In fact - for the most part, I would tend to agree with the OP about his initial intent behind the firdt post. But for radically different reasons. I've seen all the damage that has been done since the religion of "Evolution" has been introduced into the main stream, and our children forced to accept it as truth. There has been no other religion throughout time that hs done more damage to the human race than that of evolution. From it we have the autrocities of Hitler and Stalin - euthanasia - abortion, all born out of the philosophies of Evolution. But my sense is - that this is not the aspects of religion that you'd agree with me on as far as it's destructive influence. Why? Because you are blinded by your own beliefs. So who's the blind one here? Who see's only what they want to see? Obviously you. You have missed on all of your examples still about the teachings of christianity. I cannot help you because of your blinders. You will continue to believe what you do, be it right or wrong. Most religions teach divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy, there is not way around it and individuality doesn't change it. If you follow the religion you will incorporate divisiveness, superiority and hypocrisy in your beliefs, projections and judgements. This is not Christ like, and I am sorry these are the types of experiences you have had. In trying to follow the example of Christ, I do not feel superior to anyone, I feel we all sin and that is mostly what I get the most flack about. I never say that I am better than anyone because I dont believe I am. I do aknowledge wrong from right though, regardless of if I am the transgressor or someone else,, and I get flack for that as well. |
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athiests use logic? What kind of logic contends that humans came from monkeys when there are still primates in existence? umm...the logic that comes from an understanding of various scientific principles. And..uh...just so you know, monkeys and humans came from the same branch of species. We did not come from monkeys. |
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my question is this....who supports our President??? he is Christian. so does that mean he is a danger because of this? No, our president is not blinded by the light. He's a sane Christian: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXcvbnzNIjg Really? Have you seens his economic and social policies? |
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