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Topic: Does God love sinners?
Mentork's photo
Sun 10/05/08 01:13 PM
Edited by Mentork on Sun 10/05/08 01:13 PM
Well my god is Confucius

And he definitely doesn't love everyone...

If you rape and kill all the women in the village, no he doesn't love you anymore, your an evil bastard.

But he likes some people who don't worship him, your a good person even though you worship Zeus? Sure your invited to the afterlife!

Also he doesn't make you pray for forgiveness for things you didn't do. In fact, you don't have to pray for forgiveness at all, as long as you don't do anything to horrible, and no he wont forgive everything.

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 01:13 PM
Edited by tribo on Sun 10/05/08 01:15 PM




20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh

splendidlife's photo
Sun 10/05/08 01:19 PM





20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?

splendidlife's photo
Sun 10/05/08 01:23 PM
Albert Einstein
Orson Wells (before he got fat)
Raymond Burr
Igor Stravinsky

Never had a crush on Sinatra.

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 01:55 PM






20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?


HMM?? well if you had it with a dead guy NO!!

but if you had it in a room ful of their pics with battery operated toys HMMM? na still no,

but if you were thinking of me??bigsmile

enderra's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:24 PM
yes and everything in between

splendidlife's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:41 PM
Edited by splendidlife on Sun 10/05/08 02:45 PM







20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?


HMM?? well if you had it with a dead guy NO!!

but if you had it in a room ful of their pics with battery operated toys HMMM? na still no,

but if you were thinking of me??bigsmile


Thinking of you would be Blasphemy!

:wink:

Krimsa's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:43 PM
Necrophilia is against the law in most states. Dont ask me why I know this. laugh

splendidlife's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:47 PM

Necrophilia is against the law in most states. Dont ask me why I know this. laugh


Thank God He Loves Sinners.
:laughing:

Krimsa's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:50 PM
Wait a minute. Now thats a good question. Would sex with a dead person be considered a sin? Its with a human and technically you arent hurting anyone? How would that be designated sinwise exactly?

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:51 PM

Necrophilia is against the law in most states. Dont ask me why I know this. laugh


AHH!! you finally gave your religious beliefs away mt ladylaugh tongue2 -

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:53 PM

Wait a minute. Now thats a good question. Would sex with a dead person be considered a sin? Its with a human and technically you arent hurting anyone? How would that be designated sinwise exactly?


i don't know whether its sin or not - but its definitely not on my things to ever do list - noway noway noway noway noway noway

Krimsa's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:54 PM
Well now you know why I keep all those Popsicle sticks handy. You just never know with that rigor. laugh laugh

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:54 PM








20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?


HMM?? well if you had it with a dead guy NO!!

but if you had it in a room ful of their pics with battery operated toys HMMM? na still no,

but if you were thinking of me??bigsmile


Thinking of you would be Blasphemy!

:wink:


AW thats ok i'd forgive you after the fact - bigsmile :thumbsup: :angel: waving winking

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:55 PM

Well now you know why I keep all those Popsicle sticks handy. You just never know with that rigor. laugh laugh


HMMM? are we talking viagra mortis here???

Krimsa's photo
Sun 10/05/08 02:59 PM
laugh laugh

There was an old Punk Rock song back in the 80's I think by TSOL (True Sounds of Liberty) that did a number about sex with dead people. It was very in back then. Thats how I learned the definition for the word. It was a more "Innocent time". laugh

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 03:04 PM

laugh laugh

There was an old Punk Rock song back in the 80's I think by TSOL (True Sounds of Liberty) that did a number about sex with dead people. It was very in back then. Thats how I learned the definition for the word. It was a more "Innocent time". laugh


never heard it - must have been a blast - hahaha

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 03:05 PM

Well my god is Confucius

And he definitely doesn't love everyone...

If you rape and kill all the women in the village, no he doesn't love you anymore, your an evil bastard.

But he likes some people who don't worship him, your a good person even though you worship Zeus? Sure your invited to the afterlife!

Also he doesn't make you pray for forgiveness for things you didn't do. In fact, you don't have to pray for forgiveness at all, as long as you don't do anything to horrible, and no he wont forgive everything.


strange - i didn't know confucius was a god?

splendidlife's photo
Sun 10/05/08 03:10 PM









20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?


HMM?? well if you had it with a dead guy NO!!

but if you had it in a room ful of their pics with battery operated toys HMMM? na still no,

but if you were thinking of me??bigsmile


Thinking of you would be Blasphemy!

:wink:


AW thats ok i'd forgive you after the fact - bigsmile :thumbsup: :angel: waving winking



Exculpated Again!

bigsmile

tribo's photo
Sun 10/05/08 03:16 PM










20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? {repliest…: or, answerest again, or, disputest with God?}
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: {fitted: or, made up}
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 ¶ As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Do you see what I'm saying?

OH, and by the way my background is similiar to your as being an x-believer but well read in the book.


I actually love that scripture........but if I may try to answer your question............

One, clay is not a being. It has no thoughts, no feelings, no desires of its own....to an extent..... By that I mean, that thinks bode easier for the potter if he sits down to make a "creation" but allows that creation freedom to design itself. I've done hair a good part of my life, and I was rather good at styling it, but that is because I let the hair tell me best where to put it. There are parts, hair growth, etc. that have it's own "design" instead of manipulating it completely the best outcome is when you go with the flow..... I know, this was just an observation when it comes to "art", but I suppose people use pottery for practical purposes, if they want a bowl they want a bowl..........

However, I am not ok with being someone elses "bowl" or "cup". I am a living, breathing, being not an inanimate object. So to compare mankind with pottery sounds all romantical and such........but it just doesn't quite fit, imo.

Do we as humans have the right to clone human beings to make slaves out of them?? Do we as parents (in essence we had a huge part in their "creation") have a right to force our "way" on them.........even as adults??

I don't think so. I am somewhat of an artist, a creator of sorts, with words and other things............ Art is something unto itself. I have written several poems that seemed to "be". I didn't give them life, but rather I gave them a voice.

I don't believe "God" (if there is one) "created" us from scratch, but rather that he gave us a medium. Our energy was already there, even if it was a part of him, once brought forth it becomes a life unto it's own.

(I'm not sure if I'm explaining this correctly)

What you are speaking of, imo, is slavery. To create a conscious, living being to suit your own purposes............ If that is what "God" did, then I feel we are right in rebelling................




of course "clay" was just a analogy my lady, verse 20 was really the point being made.
and for sure i do take that [vs 20] as meaning he has all the rights and we if we choose to believe and follow him have none or very little. actually only the right to fall in line with everything he wants is all we have. He becomes "LORD" master, we become slaves/sheep/"followers" - it seems no different to me than the fuedel system of times past. and causes just as much strife today. But some people like that idea of the powerful protector to look to and follow loyaly all their lives - for me? i am a rebel though not fowl hearted, i choose to make my own way, but i can understand this god spoken of and see why many would gladly follow him.


In time the Rockies may crumble, Gibraltar may tumble
They're only made of clay
But our love is here to stay

-Frank Sinatra


Boy!! your just pulling out all your personal idols today huh? Bob, Frank, Who's next?:tongue: flowerforyou

Hey and you gotta change that pic of yours you look like you just had multi orgasmic sex and someone took the shot 10 seconds later - laugh laugh laugh


Jealous?


HMM?? well if you had it with a dead guy NO!!

but if you had it in a room ful of their pics with battery operated toys HMMM? na still no,

but if you were thinking of me??bigsmile


Thinking of you would be Blasphemy!

:wink:


AW thats ok i'd forgive you after the fact - bigsmile :thumbsup: :angel: waving winking



Exculpated Again!

bigsmile


NAH - just vindicated - flowerforyou

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