Yes, there is indeed a "Theory of Evolution". That is the intellectual explanation of how evolution could have occurred, and that "theory" is becoming increasing elaborate as we learn more and more about how evolution actually did occur.

However, in addition to that "theory", there is also the evidence. And the evidence for evolution is overwhelming. We don't even need to show precisely how mankind evolved from a specific lower animal. The evidence that life evolved over vast periods of time becoming increasingly complex is an observed reality of planet Earth.

Besides, the Bible claims that the Earth was created in 6 days, and man was created within that same period of time. Well we know that's not true. Dinosaurs lived for at least 300 million years with no humans around. So clearly the bible contains false information. You can be absolutely guaranteed that it's false.

May I ask you why you are so obsessed with the biblical myths? What do you find about them that attracts you so?

It seems to me that nothing could possibly make a genuinely compassionate person happier than to discover that the Bible is nothing but false myths.

It would mean that you aren't at odds with your creator.

It would mean that you aren't a shameful sinner who has grossly disobeyed God.

It would mean that no God had to send his only begotten son to be crucified to pay for YOUR SINS.

What could be greater joy than to realize that all those things are utterly false?

Surely you wouldn't be disappointed to discover that they are false?

So why do you push so hard to try to support them as "Truth".

Are you simply afraid that they might be true and if you refuse to believe in them you will be shunned by God as they fables claim?

Surely you don't believe that a genuinely all-wise all-compassionate God would be so cruel and heartless to reject people for simply not believing in fables that contain such absurdities.

God asking people to stone heathens, kill their wives and children?

God instructing people to stone sinners to death?

God punishing people with plagues for not believing in him?

God using a blood crucifixion as his method of showing "LOVE"?

I don't know about you, but none of those thing appeal to me. I would much prefer that the stories are indeed just fables. I have absolutely no incentive whatsoever to even remotely want them to be true. They are an abomination to both mankind and God.

So what is it that attracts you to these stories so much? Why are you so determined that they should be true?

And would you be sad if you were to discover for certain that they are indeed false?

Is so, why?

Why would it make you sad to discover that the biblical stories are false?

Would that lead you to feel that atheism is the only other possible option?

I don't need to believe in ancient Greek or Hebrew fables to believe in a mystical spiritual essence to life.

Do you?

Perhaps that's truly the difference between us.

You can't imagine a spiritual existence without a specific fable that makes the promise of such a thing.

But I can.

So I have no need for any fables.

The truth of the universe suits me just fine.

I have no problem having evolved from lower life forms. In fact, I don't even believe that humanity necessarily represents the best possible life form by far. Heck, I can even imagine better scenarios. And I'm a mere mortal man.

Well considering that is not my belief, nor have I have even remotely suggested that it is, I suppose there isn't much sense in attempting to converse with you any further.

Have a great day!

The very idea of a "jealous god" when there are supposedly no other "gods" to be jealous of is an oxymoron.

The gods in question don't have to exist for God to be jealous of them. The fact that people worship the false god's in enough.
I'm not asking you to agree with me just try to sound a little more intelligent when you respond.

I agree that the entire fable is based on this oxymoron.

The fallacy is that there can be no "other gods" if there is only one true God. This is the mentally that came from Greek Mythology where there were many gods. It's obviously just an extension of that same sort of mindset. The Hebrews were simply trying to reject the notion of "other gods" in favor of their "one true God".

But that's the oxymoron right there.

These entire fables are based on nothing more than one culture trying to claim superiority in terms of religious fables.

Evidently they convinced you.

But I see through them like a plate glass window.

The very idea of a "jealous god" when there are supposedly no other "gods" to be jealous of is an oxymoron.

So the whole thing was a farce from the very start.

You're finally catching on.

Yes, it most certainly is my opinion based on pure logic and rational thinking. In my opinion it's an obviously and blatant falsehood to be accusing people who are clearly worshiping a God of rejecting God. That's a crystal clear oxymoron, IMHO.

Yep, that is indeed my opinion. Absolutely.

And it truly doesn't matter to me who recognizes the truth of this observation. As far as I'm concerned its truth value does not depend on other people's opinions.

If I drop a heavy weight on my foot and it hurts, and you voice an opinion that I shouldn't feel a thing, you opinion would be utterly meaningless to me. My experience trumps your opinion.

The same is true in this case. I can clearly see that to accuse people who are attempting to worship a God of rejecting God is an oxymoron. I don't need any further proof. There's nothing you could possible say that would change the truth of the situation.

The obvious truth is the obvious truth. And that's my opinion.

Suggest to me some television series you like. I've run out of ideas since I finished the last series of House.

Shows I like and have seen every show of are X-files, House, Lost, and Dr Who.

I don't need any proof for my views because I'm not attempting to prove anything. That's your misunderstanding.

I merely offer knowledge of truth. There will be those who can see it, and there will be those who cannot. It doesn't matter to me. I just put it out there as food for thought. Take it or leave it.

The Christians are the people who are obsessed with "proofs" because they are determined to try to convince everyone that the Bible is the "word of God", and they are hard-up to try to 'prove' their claims. But in truth, they have no proof to offer.

In fact, there is no need to disprove the claims of the Christians because they have no proof of their claims in the first place.

As to your arguments for how you think fish might have survived a world wide flood, I'm truly not interested in your views. I've been a keeper of fish for most of my life. I'm vividly aware of just how sensitive they are to these things. So I have first-hand experience with it so I don't need anyone to offer me their guesses.



You could try, but it would be a futile approach.



I'm am educated on the Bible and this is precisely why I know that it's baloney.

It's the greatest Christian falsehood to believe that just because the biblical God supposedly existed outside of the universe this places the legitimacy of the fables beyond the reach of science.

That's simply untrue.

The biblical fables claim that mankind's fall from grace is what brought death, disease and imperfections in to the world. There are even places where it claims that this event is what caused plants to grow thorns.

Well, today we know that these fables are false in that claim. So even if some supposed "God" exists outside of the universe where he is supposedly untouchable by science, it still leaves the fact that the fables themselves are false.

The fables accuse the Egyptians and Canaanites of "rejecting God", but simultaneously these same fables recognize that both of those cultures were indeed attempting to worship "God". In fact, the Canaanites evidently took their worship of "God" so seriously that they were sacrificing their own children in hopes of appeasing the God.

Sure, the authors of the biblical fables accuse these cultures of worshiping "false gods". But that's where they made their fatal error and exposed themselves to be doing nothing more than creating man-made myths.

You see, these cultures could not have possibly used their FREE WILL CHOICE, to reject the creator of this universe, whilst simultaneously continuing to worship what they believed to be the creator of this universe.

So the authors of these fables shot themselves in the foot on this one.

You can't have people using FREE WILL CHOICE to reject the creator of the universe whilst simultaneously still under the belief that they are attempting to appease the creator of the universe.

And that flies in the face that these cultures were FREELY CHOOSING to reject "God".

And please notice here that this has nothing at all to do with science. These stories cut their own throat. They are clearly false and have no merit at all.

So they have proven themselves to be false. Why would I need to point to any websites on the Internet as "proof" of something so obvious?

You just read it here, there's no need to go anywhere else. This is not a mere 'opinion', this is a crystal clear fact that's written right into the biblical stories. Just read the stories and you'll see.

You can't have people who have supposedly rejected "God" worshiping 'false gods', because that clearly shows that they have not rejected "God" at all. On the contrary, they are clearly trying hard to worship "God".

If they were CONFUSED about who "God" is then that can only be "God's" fault. You can't have people who have purposefully rejected their true creator going around worshiping make-believe creators. That's just utterly absurd.

So the whole fable fails on it's own. It doesn't need science to prove that it's false. It's clearly just the accusations of one culture attempting to pretend that the "Gods" of other cultures are 'false gods', but that doesn't fly.

You can't have knowingly and willfully rejected God via your FREE WILL CHOICE and still be attempting to worship God (even if you have the idea of God wrong, that doesn't change the fact that you are clearly trying to worship God, rather than reject God)

So the fables are necessarily false man-made religious finger-pointing.

And that shouldn't be the least bit surprising because that what people did in those days and particularly in the Mediterranean region. It was a common practice for every culture to accuse the other cultures of worshiping "false gods".

But that very accusation holds no merit.

So there's nothing to disprove. The fables are simply false.

You don't need to look anything up on the Internet, you should be able to figure this one out on your own.

another hindsight thought


could I or you or anyone else ever truly claim to know the feelings that exist between any two people? How could someone ELSE ever convince me that my parents did or did not care for me?

I think , when it comes to emotions, we usually come to our conclusion from personal experience as opposed to third party information.


So , does God care?

Yes. My personal experiences has shown me he cares about me. I cant fathom that I would be the only one he cares about which leads me to believe he cares in general, but I cant convince anyone ELSE whether he cares about THEM,,,they have to come to that conclusion(or not) on their own.


to quote miles,,,,,,Peace

I agree with Gwendolyn. Here statement was a logical statement and wasn't Ad Hominem at all.

This is such a typical tactic. When solid points are made that cannot be refuted people just try to change the focus and pretend that the conversation is becoming personal insults.

The fact is that a world wide flood caused by rain in 40 days that Noah and his family could have survived is indeed illogical on so many levels it's not even funny.

Just the event itself is utterly illogical. The event could not have been caused by any "natural process". Of course, it wasn't supposed to be, it was supposed to be caused by God. The excess water would have had to come from somewhere other than the earth. And it would have also had to have been drained back off the earth after the flood. All of this having taken place with 40 days or so.

That's an illogical event to be sure.

There are so many illogical things associated with this event as well. Like what would have happened to all the fresh water species of fish and aquatic life. Anyone who keeps aquariums will tell you that you can't just toss fresh water fish into salt water and expect them to survive for 40 days.

But that's exactly what would have happened if the oceans were mixed in with all the rivers and lakes. Which would have had to have happened in a worldwide flood.

You could argue that rainwater is fresh water and since the flood was caused by rain the saltwater of the oceans would have been diluted into freshwater. But in that case then all the saltwater fishes would have died. So there is no logical resolution to the problem. Therefore the whole idea is illogical.

Beside when the water finally receded how would the fresh water fish end up back in lakes and streams, and the saltwater fish end up back in the oceans?

You could say that "God took care of all those details via his miracles". However, miracles are indeed illogical so that really doesn't help with the original point.

Plus there is no geological record of any such flood, which would stick out like a sore thumb in the geological record had it ever occurred. Plus the Human Genome project has put together a picture of the entire development of humanity from early cave man times up until today. That DNA record in fossil bones would have also had to have been disrupted between cave man days and the present time, but no such disruption is seen, on the contrary the picture is precisely what would be expected without any major disruptions.

So it truly is illogical to believe in a worldwide flood during the period of mankind's presence on earth.

Thus we end up with religious people starting to confess that it may indeed have been a local flood. But then there would be no need for an Ark to save the animal kingdom. Plus a local flood would leave open the question of whether all humans were killed in the flood, or just one local area?

In other words the whole story falls apart. Because every thought of every human was supposed to be evil, etc.

The story is illogical. That's just a fact.

So rather than being offended by that you should just confess that, yes, a believe in a Zeus-like God is already illogical.

After all, since when are these religions supposed to be "logical"?

If you want to talk about things being illogical, I would personally say that it's extremely illogical for a supposedly all-wise and all-powerful God to have to have his son butchered on a pole in order to forgive mankind their sins.

To me, that's about as illogical as things can be. A supposedly all-wise, all-powerful God should have been able to come up with a better solution to this problem, IMHO.

I mean, if infinite wisdom and power means that problems can't be solved any better than this, then that's a pretty LIMITED infinity if you ask me. And that's a logical contradiction right there.

Actually it's just the opposite of how you are thinking Spider.

If a global flood had taken place over a 40 day period as the biblical tales suggest, that catastrophic event would have produced an extremely high abundance of fossils from that particular event. But we don't see that.

You can't just take all fossils and attribute them to a single 40 day flood.

DUH!

So the reasoning you've just given here actually supports the fact that no such momentary flood ever took place, but there is no single sentiment layer that suggests any such thing.

However, none of that is even relevant. We're way beyond that now. Modern day scientists have been piecing together the human genome story of our evolution and that story is perfectly in tact from the time we left Africa as roaming nomads to the time that we began to evolved into larger civilizations.

The flood itself could not have occurred in early cave man days. That would be impossible because the fable of the flood describes the existence of cities, as well as having Noah's family building a large Ark. This is well beyond the capabilities of cavemen. Not mention that the story itself supposedly survived the period in some sort of written form.

Therefore this catastrophic biblical flood would have had to have occurred beyond the period of civilization and a major use of tools.

Well, the genome project has clearly shown that no such catastrophic flood could have possibly occurred. Because if it had occurred it would have disrupted the genome record. But that didn't happen. Thus no such flood could have possibly occurred.

It's a done deal.

The idea that the biblical flood could have actually occurred is nothing more than a pipe dream of religious zealots. The scientific evidence shows clearly that no such catastrophic disruption of human development had ever taken place.

So just like we dismiss Greek Mythology because there are no Gods on Mr. Olympus, we can likewise dismiss the biblical mythology because there never was any "Great Flood" that is part of what these tales claim.

Of course there are many other reasons to dismiss these tales as well, but the flood story is definitely false.

Not

The Old Testament is knock off of Zoroastrianism, Summerian Epics and Vedas, The New Testament rips their stories from everything else that was before it it's a miracle to me how so many people put faith in that simple book

Shining Armour, my dear, you can't argue with people who know everything because god told them what they know.

You can only have logical discussions and debates with people who are ignorant in some areas and admit that they don't know everything. Otherwise, you are beating your head against a brick wall, and the only thing that feels good about that is stopping.

Matt 10:28-29
28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
NKJV


all i am saying is we are not immortal.. that is a gift. Our future spirit will either inherit Life everlasting or will be killed destruction. no hell fire for humans forever.

Rev 20:4-6
5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of Yahweh and of Messiah, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
NKJV

Rev 20:13-15
The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
NKJV

Immortality was given to those who was born Immortal like the Angels. Not man we are changed at the twinkling of an eye then we become immortal but know this..

1 John 3:13-15

13 Do not marvel, my brethren, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love his brother abides in death. 15 Whoever hates his brother is a murderer , and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.
NKJV
Blessings of Shalom..Miles

P. S. Yahshua is the name given the Messiah.. The Family name of a son.

Yahshua literally means Yahweh Saves or Salvation

Everyone who Calls on the name of Yahweh shall be Saved

Biblical proof?

What do those 2 verses say?

and 3 parts to Elohim.. Yahweh says he is 1 and thier is no other. Yahshua called him his father and Yahshua had to leave to Send the Spirit. Blessings..Miles

Thier is nowhere in the Scriptures that says we have an immortal soul and will live forever.

It says immortal life is a gift and the wages of sin is Death not life.. Shalom..Miles

You are describing Jane Fonda and Ted Turner perfectly!!

And yes, Muslims DO hate America. One of their holidays is an anti-American one where they burn our flag and chant "Death to America"....yeah, they really love us!!