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Topic: Why we Shouldnt have Faith In Science
arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 12:20 AM
I may have been wrong on the rabbit thing, may still be considered unclean, not important enough for me to read up on it very much. Just cook them, it'll be fine!

SharpShooter10 Joined Tue 11/20/07 Posts: 11271	Tue 09/30/08 12:22 AM
This one caught my eye because I raise rabbits. Leviticus 11:6 And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you. Rabbits do not bring up anything; they let it go all the way through, then eat it again. This description given in Leviticus is inaccurate, and that's that. Rabbits do not bring anything up and chew on it.There is no "cheweth of the cud" taking place here at all. long ago people thought that rabbits or hares chewd the cud, it is now known they do not making the cotton tail rabbit anyway, a clean food. Which would seem to indicate that either 1)God did not know that rabbits do not chew their cud, or 2)That particular passage of the bible was not "inspired by god" - which gives rise to the question: What else in the bible was not inspired by god? [edit: Or 3) That god did inspire that passage but decided to lie for some reason - which gives rise to the same basic question: What else might he have lied about?] God knew, the people of that time didn't Oh, whats the point of being "divinely inspired" then? Arent you supposed to know what god knows in those moments and that is why you are writing this stuff down? So in fact most all of these writings are what men's perceptions were at the time and not actually anything to do with god? Oh. Why is it called the bible then and so much fuss made over it? Krimsa, the very people that transcribed the bible in the front of it made the statement that they did their best and that one should check them out because mistakes can be made, it isn't major mistakes but some as in different meaning of words and some words in Hebrew don't exist in the english so they put the ones that they felt would be closest. The Bible is still true and the inspired word of God. But since you don't believe in it, it shouldn't matter one way or the other to you, maybe it does to someone else though

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 12:23 AM Edited by Krimsa on Tue 09/30/08 12:30 AM
The rabbit issue is not really the point Sharp. That is just plain stupid but for whatever reason, the writer of that particular passage had some pretty interesting takes on animals. If you scroll up, I think Belushi illustrated some more "misunderstandings" such as melting snails and bats equated with birds. I think the point being made (yes sometimes I make points) is that if the bible can be this ridiculous yet it is supposed to be the word of god in some respect or at least written by men who were inspired by him in some ambiguous capacity, then shouldn't these accounts of the beasts be just a little more accurate seeing as god designed and created them?

SharpShooter10 Joined Tue 11/20/07 Posts: 11271	Tue 09/30/08 12:24 AM
I may have been wrong on the rabbit thing, may still be considered unclean, not important enough for me to read up on it very much. Just cook them, it'll be fine! doesn't get cold enough here for me to eat the rabbits around here, don't like em anyway, try not to eat a lot of red meat either, but just sometimes, you can't beat a good old greasy cheeseburger

SharpShooter10 Joined Tue 11/20/07 Posts: 11271	Tue 09/30/08 12:28 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters.

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 12:34 AM Edited by Krimsa on Tue 09/30/08 12:35 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired".

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 12:53 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". just out of curiosity, what do believe in?

SharpShooter10 Joined Tue 11/20/07 Posts: 11271	Tue 09/30/08 12:58 AM Edited by SharpShooter10 on Tue 09/30/08 12:59 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". didn't say what you believed doesn't matter. You don't believe the bible is real and in God so what I or anyone says on these issues really will not matter to you one way or the other I would think. The original transcribers of the KJV even wrote a letter to the readers at the very beginning saying, "we did the best we could do" we may have and could have made mistakes, The readers are advised to research and look things up as well, this letter from them has been taken out of many modern bibles for some reason. A good student of Gods word will not just rely on the bible alone, one should research by as many means as possible that they can find, like the Massorah, Pentateuch or Tora, Septuagint, Apocrypha, even the Dead Sea Scrolls, A good Strongs Concordance, A Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic dictionary, and Interlinear bible with the Hebrew/greek and scripture together. And all of these will have no meaning or purpose to one who chooses not to believe. The Bible itself says that many will not understand, their eyes will be closed and their ears will not hear, nothing wrong with that either, it is for a purpose, because many are sceptical and analytical and just have to have proof, God puts the spirit of slumber on many because he loves them and it is a protection of sorts so that they will not commit the unforgivable sin when the anti christ is here.

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 01:14 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". didn't say what you believed doesn't matter. You don't believe the bible is real and in God so what I or anyone says on these issues really will not matter to you one way or the other I would think. The original transcribers of the KJV even wrote a letter to the readers at the very beginning saying, "we did the best we could do" we may have and could have made mistakes, The readers are advised to research and look things up as well, this letter from them has been taken out of many modern bibles for some reason. A good student of Gods word will not just rely on the bible alone, one should research by as many means as possible that they can find, like the Massorah, Pentateuch or Tora, Septuagint, Apocrypha, even the Dead Sea Scrolls, A good Strongs Concordance, A Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic dictionary, and Interlinear bible with the Hebrew/greek and scripture together. And all of these will have no meaning or purpose to one who chooses not to believe. The Bible itself says that many will not understand, their eyes will be closed and their ears will not hear, nothing wrong with that either, it is for a purpose, because many are sceptical and analytical and just have to have proof, God puts the spirit of slumber on many because he loves them and it is a protection of sorts so that they will not commit the unforgivable sin when the anti christ is here. finally, someone realized the fact that they said we did the best we could. wether they actually did or not is a mute point at this time in the history of the world. The only reason I even bothered to get involved in these forums is to try to get people to think for themselves instead of being led around like sheep to the slaughter by those who did the best the could. I have made plenty of mistakes in my life as every one else has as well. But I'm honestly trying to do the best I can without being judgmental of others. If I am tak'in the wrong way, Oh well. At least I'm willing to take achance for peace! I love you all!

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 01:19 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". didn't say what you believed doesn't matter. You don't believe the bible is real and in God so what I or anyone says on these issues really will not matter to you one way or the other I would think. The original transcribers of the KJV even wrote a letter to the readers at the very beginning saying, "we did the best we could do" we may have and could have made mistakes, The readers are advised to research and look things up as well, this letter from them has been taken out of many modern bibles for some reason. A good student of Gods word will not just rely on the bible alone, one should research by as many means as possible that they can find, like the Massorah, Pentateuch or Tora, Septuagint, Apocrypha, even the Dead Sea Scrolls, A good Strongs Concordance, A Hebrew, Greek and Aramaic dictionary, and Interlinear bible with the Hebrew/greek and scripture together. And all of these will have no meaning or purpose to one who chooses not to believe. The Bible itself says that many will not understand, their eyes will be closed and their ears will not hear, nothing wrong with that either, it is for a purpose, because many are sceptical and analytical and just have to have proof, God puts the spirit of slumber on many because he loves them and it is a protection of sorts so that they will not commit the unforgivable sin when the anti christ is here. Sharp what I and many of us who have pointed out these assertions are attempting to demonstrate is that the bible is chock full of tremendous heaps of nonsensical and erroneous claims. I dont think a simple misinterpretation of a few words here is to blame. If that were the case, you would have already demonstrated to us where our mistakes and lack of understanding lie exactly.Thus far it appears to me to be a happy mish-mashed messed-up hodgepodgey cocktail of myths and folklore and revisionist propaganda and who's-your-daddy reproaches intermixed with lovely stories of redemption and hope and oh yes sin and hellfire and death. It is so full of colorful holes that I cant even post them all over a six month period. Why would it require me to believe in anything or have faith in order that I have a better comprehension of these works? Is that so I can properly misunderstand them? Yes I am an analytical person by nature and I tend to take things at face value. Im not sure if that is necessarily a defect of character as you seem to be implying. Wouldn't god expect that people do in fact open their eyes and question? Whos sleeping here exactly?

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 01:22 AM
Oh well, I tried!

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 01:23 AM Edited by Krimsa on Tue 09/30/08 01:23 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". just out of curiosity, what do believe in? Oh you mean my "Yes" or "No" reply to your other thread didnt cover it?

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 01:27 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". just out of curiosity, what do believe in? Oh you mean my "Yes" or "No" reply to your other thread didnt cover it? You are free to believe whatever you want. Much like the men who wrote the many different versions of where humans came from and how we should live. I guess I have found in life that we would all be better off if things were a little simpler!

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 01:44 AM
well krimsa, either you believe in God or you don't, you believe in the bible or you don't, either way it is ones own personal choice, there is no middle ground really. The bible contains a lot of figures of speech, metaphors and parables, every single word is not always a literal meaning. It basically says not to eat scavenger animals, that's about it. but since you don't believe any of it, I can't see that it really matters. Well what I believe in doesn't really matter now does it? If I believed in the validity of the bible as being the word of god in written format then wouldn't I have even more interest in determining why these erroneous statements were made? As it stands now they are just being pointed out as clearly ludicrous assertions. I dont think you can just say "well it was those crazy old school Jews" and wash your hands of it. The OT was clearly included in the bible for a reason, namely that these authors were felt to be "divinely inspired". just out of curiosity, what do believe in? Oh you mean my "Yes" or "No" reply to your other thread didnt cover it? You are free to believe whatever you want. Much like the men who wrote the many different versions of where humans came from and how we should live. I guess I have found in life that we would all be better off if things were a little simpler! What are you going on about now? The Theory of Evolution? What does human anthropogenesis have to do with "how we should live"? I dont think the scientific community has any vested interest in how you choose to misinterpret the scripture or live your life. Dont you have a moral compass of your own to help you negotiate your behavior and distinguish between right and wrong?

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 02:08 AM
never mind

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 02:11 AM
never mind Yes that seems to be your pat answer when you cant seem to establish a coherent train of thought. How many beers did you have?

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 02:15 AM
better to do nothing in the face of denial

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 02:20 AM
better to do nothing in the face of denial And who would be doing the denying and protesting and who would be asking for clarification in this instance?

arkdanimal Joined Wed 08/27/08 Posts: 667	Tue 09/30/08 02:21 AM
no bite

Krimsa Joined Fri 04/25/08 Posts: 9960	Tue 09/30/08 02:24 AM
I didnt imagine you wanted to touch that question. Moment of clarity?