Belushi,

welcome to the rest stop.

it may be quietly mused upon.

peace, love and grace

CS and Artsy

life is good.

my flesh is weak and tired and getting old, but my spirit is willing and young and compensating for that quite nicely.

Life does begin at 50 ee hah

Hope all is well and exciting with the new move.

have a great day.

Good call about the group decision. Did you know that 'whosoever' is mentioned in 163 verses of the Bible from Genesis to Revelations. 'Whosoever' must have had a long life span, huh?

Welcome to all in the Christian Coffeehouse.......

((((((James))))))) nice to see you buddy......


((((((((Britty)))))))) The Keeper of the Coffeehouse.....Thanks Britty for always being here for the coffeehouse and for me.


(((((((Wouldee))))))))) You are......all's sunshine on a rainy day.....You are the comfort with Britty when life is to much..You both inspire and teach to all that enter my coffeehouse....and from the bottom of my heart I love you both.....God Blesses the teachers......Thank you both for being rocks.....

sorry double post..........

Romans 12:2 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)

2And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God

HI Wouldee,

Life is indeed wonderful!

Wishing you a beautiful day!

No drama or debate here......just fellowship and friends......And if their is debate it is all bible based.....because what the heck....It is a Christian Coffeehouse.

I have to agree with the sweet debbie even though she did not say hello to me.
If those questions need to be answered, they need to be posted in a different post.

Acts. 5, 39
"But if it be of God, you cannot overthrow it, lest perhaps you be found even to fight against God."

=====================================================================================

The enemy is strong these days, yet God is with us. We won't be overthrown.

Dear Daddy from Heaven, please remain with us, and gives the strength to resist the attacks of those who diminish you. Forgive them because they don't know what they are doing. I ask you this in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ who lives and reigns in the unity of the Holy Spirit and is God forever and ever.

Amen

I am enjoying reading your posts and the prayers,
Miguel.

Hi Britty, Wouldee, Creative, Artgurl, TLW, Rainbow, it’s a while, nice to see you in here too, Feral. Beautiful day. Every day is a good day to lean NEW things.

It’s wonderful that you’ve found this place amidst the noise of the rest of the forums to, as Wouldee said, share your faith and edify and exhort one another in the joy of your hearts. Since this is a place where you come together as a group a like minded individuals sharing the words of your faith, I thought I could find some answers here. You know, away from the noisy forums, I mean who really comes here to argue.

So since it seems that I burst in here and my questions seemed a little out place let me begin again. I assure you Deb, this is Bible based. I ran across the following information on the internet.

Now you all understand how difficult it can be to ‘trust’ the w.w.w. . So I’m thinking, I need to find some verification. Since I don’t attend church I have to depend on those who do.
I would ask my friends here to talk with people at their church, but it seems those pastors already agree with this information.

So I thought you all could take this information to your authorities or maybe you even have the skills as led by the Holy Spirit, of course, to make comments or refute the information altogether.

Could it possibly be so, could the Bible possibly be misinterpreted by man? That wouldn’t make the Bible wrong, it would just make some people wrong, or maybe just misled. What do you think?

Here is the information I found.

English Bible Mistranslation
Greek/Hebrew texts Mistranslated. Bible translated wrong translation on homosexuality, same-sex love. Textus Receptus. -.Books -

For years, many documents have described the mistranslation of the Bible into English from the original Hebrew and Koine (ancient Greek) New-Testament writings. Issues of incorrect translation concern many areas, such as: the word "virgin" (Isaiah 7:14); the name "Yahweh" (YHWH); descriptions of angels; the term "Sons of God"; and incorrectly translating forbidden sexual practices.

There are several passages often mistranslated as forbidding homosexual activity; however, those Bible passages can be correctly translated by considering many aspects of the Bible, as a whole: literal translation, rarity, priorities, sanity-test and reality-test.


Literal Translation- . In the New Testament, the two verses 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy 1:10 are often mistranslated as condemning homosexuality in English Bibles (but not in the Roman Latin Vulgate Bible or the 1545 German Bible of Martin Luther). Mistranslation is based on two ancient Greek words "malakoi" & "arsenokoitai" (Greek letters " " literally, "male-beds"), which was a new word used by Paul (Saul) at the time and not a common term for homo-sexuality.

Because Paul was speaking in a religious context, the word "arsenokoitai" has been translated as referring to male-pimps or customers in temple prostitution, a common practice in so-called pagan rituals widespread in Temple Cult worship of the time. [The minor term "malakoi" (used to describe "soft" clothing) is non-sexual and has been translated as "effeminate" (KJV), although others state "weaklings" or "morally weak, lazy" men.]

Rarity of Words- . The ancient Greek word "arsenokoitai" occurs in only those 2 verses, 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy 1:10. Logically, if homosexuality were considered a sin, there should be many verses about it, and the word "arsenokoitai" would occur more than twice if it had referred to a major issue, such as homosexuality; the rarity of the word fits the logical translation: the word "arsenokoitai" refers to the rare practice of temple prostitution, not general homosexuality. (See: 73 references to arsenokoit* found in TLG E Feb/2000, "http://www.jeramyt.org/gay/arsenok.htm".) Yet, precisely because the word is so rare and had no formal definition, the word "arsenokoitai" is crucial in fostering misinterpretation of the Bible: a more common word could not be so easily redefined.

Priorities - . The verses in the Bible follow certain priorities: for example, the words "adultery" or "adulteress/adulterer" (Greek "moixoi" ) occur 47 times in the King James Version; however, the word "arsenokoitai" occurs only 2 times, and the common terms of that time period about homosexual activity are not mentioned in the Bible at all (such as man-boy pairing, Greek "erastes-eromenos"). Condemning homosexuality in Biblical times was not an issue, not a priority, at all.

A Sanity- Test - . Since adultery & adulterer are mentioned 47 times in the King James Version, it could be expected that a sin would be mentioned many times in the Bible: the condemnation of lying/liars occurs over 70 times ("liar" 21 times, "false witness" 19, "lying" lips/tongues 31 times); murder is prohibited 35+ times ("murderer" 20 etc.); and stealing is condemned 73+ times ("steal" 23 times, "thief/robber" 50+, except stealing for food: Proverbs 6:30 "Men do not despise a thief, if he steal to satisfy his soul when he is hungry." [KJV]). However, the common terms (used in those days) to describe homosexual activity are not even mentioned. It doesn't make sense to translate a few rare words & phrases as condemning homosexuality, when specific sins are mentioned many times in the Bible--it simply doesn't pass a sanity-test.

Reality- Test - . During the time period of 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy^ 1:10,:the word "arsenokoitai" occurred in only a few religious writings, such as a later text describing Adam deceived to have sex with serpent-god Naas. The erotic literature of the period never used the word "arsenokoitai" but used other ancient Greek terms ("erastes-eromenos": man-boy pairing) to describe homosexual practices, and those Greek terms were never mentioned in the Greek texts of the Bible. To try to re-interpret & translate other Bible verses into condemning those specific (unnamed) acts is just not realistic--it doesn't pass a reality-test ("reality_check"). The translation of the ancient Greek New Testament must fit the language & cultures of the time period. The translation must match the reality of that era.

Old-Testament Literal Translation - . The infamous verse Leviticus 20:13, often used to condemn homosexuality, is about a married-man with another male, in the "marriage-bed" as with his wife. See the Latinized Greek for Leviticus 20:13 below:
"Kai hos an koimEthE meta arsenos koitEn
gunaikos, bdelugma epoiEsan amphoteroi;
thanatousthwsan, enoichoi eisin."
[Lev 20:13 in Greek Septuagint LXX].

The translation of the Greek term 'gunaikos' is interpreted to mean: wife. Hence, the verse actually forbids male-male adultery, pertaining only to a married man.
Similarly, for Leviticus 18:22, the wording of the original Hebrew is very different from the KJV form:
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind:
it is abomination." [Leviticus 18:22, King James Version]
However, the original Hebrew for Leviticus 18:22 reveals a different 3rd meaning:

"We-et-zakar lo' tishkav mishkevey 'ishshah" [Lev 18:22 Hebrew, Latinized]
("And-with a-male NOT lie-down in beds-of a-woman") [Lev 18:22 literal translation]

So, the Hebrew Leviticus 18:22 mentions: someone + a male + a woman; hence, a forbidden 3-way.

Those 2 infamous Leviticus verses actually mention other women or wives, rather than male-male relationships, as is often the misinterpretation & mistranslation.

When many aspects of Biblical issues are considered, there is no textual basis for misinterpreting & mistranslating Bible verses to condemn homosexuality: the original Hebrew & Greek texts of the Bible do not condemn homosexuality at all, and so, homosexuality should not be considered a sin by today's society.

Finally, the question arises: In 1611, did the Bible translators/scribes for King James purposely mistranslate Bible verses into English because they had intensely resented King James, with his open homosexuality & various male lovers? The answer might never be known.

The Basilikon Doron is a treatise on government written by King James VI of Scotland, later King James I of England, in 1599. Basilikon Doron in Greek language means royal gift. It was written in the form of a private and confidential letter to the King's eldest son, Henry, Duke of Rothesay, born 1594. After Henry’s death in 1612, James gave it to his second son, Charles, born 1600, later King Charles I. It was printed in Edinburgh in 1599 and in London in 1603.

This document is separated into three books, serving as general guidelines to follow in order to be an efficient monarch. The first describes a king’s duty towards God as a Christian, the second focuses on the roles and responsibilities in office and the third concerns proper behaviour in the daily lifestyle.

As the first part is concerned with being a good Christian, James VI and I of Scotland and England instructed his son to love and respect God as well as to fear Him. Furthermore, it is essential to closely study the Scripture (the Bible) and especially specific books in both the Old and New Testaments. Lastly, he must pray often and always be thankful for what God has given him. All of these directions describe the behaviour of a devoted Christian.

In the second book, James encouraged his son to be a good king, as opposed to a ‘Tyrant’, by establishing and executing laws as well as governing with justice and equality. To boost the economy, it is important to invite foreign merchants into the country and base the currency on gold and silver. According to James, a good monarch must be well acquainted with his subjects and therefore it would be wise to visit all kingdoms every three years. During war, he should choose old but good Captains to lead an army composed of young and agile soldiers. In the court and household, he should carefully select loyal gentlemen and servants to surround him. When the time would come to choose a wife, it would be best if she were of the same religion and have a generous estate. However, she must not meddle with government politics, but perform her domestic duties. As for the inheritance, the kingdom should be left to the eldest son and not divided among all the children in order to ensure stability. Lastly, it is most important to James that his son would know well his own craft, which is to properly govern over his subjects. In order to do this, he must study the laws of his own kingdom and actively participate in the Council. Furthermore, he must be acquainted with mathematics, for military purposes, and world history, for foreign policy. These guidelines are more or less a universal model for a good ruler, which James chose to offer his son to closely study, thereby preparing himself for the throne.

The final portion of the Basilikon Doron focuses on the daily lifestyle of a monarch. For instance, James advised his son to eat meat in order to be strong for travelling and during war time. He must also beware not to drink and sleep excessively. Furthermore, his wardrobe should always be clean and proper and he must never allow his hair and nails to grow long. In his writing and speech, he should use honest and plain language. This last set of advice describes the basic manners every gentleman should follow, especially a king.

All of these guidelines composed a basic code of conduct to be followed by all monarchs and heads of state to rule and govern efficiently. James VI and I of Scotland and England assembled these directions as a result of his own experience and upbringing. He therefore offered the Basilikon Doron to his son with the hopes of rendering him an effective and competent ruler, and perhaps, to pass it down to future generations.


The Basilikon Doron repeats the argument for the divine right of kings, as set out in The True Law of Free Monarchies, which was also written by James. It too warns against "Papists" and derides Puritans. It advocates removing the Apocrypha from the Bible. The published Basilikon Doron may well have been intended to portray the king in a favourable light. James Sempill assisted James in composing it. Robert Waldegrave, who was bound to secrecy, printed seven copies at the king's behest. Henry Taylor said that he printed it on Waldegrave's press. Richard Royston, and later William Dugard, printed further copies.

The Basilikon Doron criticises both Roman Catholics and Puritans. This is in keeping with the king’s philosophy of following a 'middle path', as reflected in the preface to the 1611 King James Bible.

You have to remember that King James aunt Elizabeth commonly referred to as the Queen of England had her sister, Queen Mary of Scots, his mother beheaded. Queen Elizabeth never got married because she wanted to keep the peace in England. That upset King James but Queen Elizabeth before she died relinguished the throne to King James.

Di, I have researched this many times. My close relationship to the gay community has afforded me the opportunity to do so. I was in search of something that would lessen my fear of the things I was taught and heard many times. In searching; I found that there are many discrepancies. The bible that I have read and read and read has given me many things to ponder. I have found that there is way to many changes in attitude as well as the kindness that was stated so many times early on was changed to be idiotic and piggish. I have read where men were kind and loving to being horrible and selfish. As well as disembowling womankind. Making her less than and subject to lowlessness.

I have also read where those words were cyphered to mean whatever a man wanted them to mean. It is the same as now. We can change something to be what we want it to be if we talk long enough.

While I want to believe the bible. There are just parts of it that are too out there and changed for me to fathom. I still hang in there though. Trying to find where it comes together. But, it seems that there are missing pieces.
Kat

I am a fan of Queen Elizabeth the first who said, "There is only one Christ Jesus and one faith; the rest is a dispute about trifles."

Sounds like a wise woman.

Kat

Rainbow, as always, I enjoyed what you've shared. I do like history a great deal.

Kat, so you have trouble reconciling all that you have been "told" the Bible means. Your own reading has has indicated to you that someting is either amiss or missing. If that's the case then it seems to me that any sin that might follow from misunderstanding could not be somthing for God to harbor against you.

If that's the case then why all this staunch, unbendable, closed minded bigoty? Of course that's not a biblical question, so consider it rhetorical. (no answer required)

jumps on miguel and gives him big huge hug...sorry love I didn't even see ya.....would never not say hi to sweet miguel.

Redy you are always welcome and as long as topic doesn't turn into a fight....you want info then info you shall have.......I will return and answer the questions...going to pick up kids.....heart ya redy.


And if you want info good thing......but this will not turn into a battle......if so we will make another thread...ok Redy......