All I can do is take what you are asking for and show you what it means in the Bible....I can't make you believe anything redy.....I can only give you what I know to be truth.

The word "virgin" (Isaiah 7:14)

ANSWER:

14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you [c] a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and [d] will call him Immanuel. (Jesus Christ)

The name "Yahweh" (YHWH) Is just another name for God...
The term "Sons of God"; and incorrectly translating forbidden sexual practices.

The above redy is to general.....You need scripture or something to show me what your asking here. "Sons of God" which we are also sons and daughters of God.

Redy wrote:

Literal Translation- . In the New Testament, the two verses 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy 1:10 are often mistranslated as condemning homosexuality in English Bibles (but not in the Roman Latin Vulgate Bible or the 1545 German Bible of Martin Luther). Mistranslation is based on two ancient Greek words "malakoi" & "arsenokoitai" (Greek letters " " literally, "male-beds"), which was a new word used by Paul (Saul) at the time and not a common term for homo-sexuality.

ANSWER: Let's break this down and show the whole picture here scripturally

1st Corinthians 7:The very fact that you have lawsuits among you means you have been completely defeated already. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be cheated? 8Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers.

9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

Sexual Immorality
12"Everything is permissible for me"—but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"—but I will not be mastered by anything. 13"Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"—but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body. 14By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh." 17But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.

18Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body. 19Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

Redy Wrote:

Because Paul was speaking in a religious context, the word "arsenokoitai" has been translated as referring to male-pimps or customers in temple prostitution, a common practice in so-called pagan rituals widespread in Temple Cult worship of the time. [The minor term "malakoi" (used to describe "soft" clothing) is non-sexual and has been translated as "effeminate" (KJV), although others state "weaklings" or "morally weak, lazy" men.]

ANSWER: Sometimes I just get amazed at what people think and where they get their information. I have no clue what arsenokoitai means but malakoi means

men who were perceived as having the quality of unmanliness, softness or delicacy, shown by moral weakness, Which none of these has anything to do with the subject at had....or if it does....I don't know how.....And if this is an offhand way to say gay men......no

Redy wrote:

Rarity of Words- . The ancient Greek word "arsenokoitai" occurs in only those 2 verses, 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy 1:10. Logically, if homosexuality were considered a sin, there should be many verses about it, and the word "arsenokoitai" would occur more than twice if it had referred to a major issue, such as homosexuality; the rarity of the word fits the logical translation: the word "arsenokoitai" refers to the rare practice of temple prostitution, not general homosexuality. (See: 73 references to arsenokoit* found in TLG E Feb/2000, "http://www.jeramyt.org/gay/arsenok.htm".) Yet, precisely because the word is so rare and had no formal definition, the word "arsenokoitai" is crucial in fostering misinterpretation of the Bible: a more common word could not be so easily redefined.

ANSWER:

9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders. There is no misleading or non understand the interpretation.....I don't know......I think most or anyone can interpret anything to fit how they want it...Look at Jim Jones....But for me...whether it be because of my faith.....I just don't see that it is hard to interpret.

Redy Wrote:

Priorities - . The verses in the Bible follow certain priorities: for example, the words "adultery" or "adulteress/adulterer" (Greek "moixoi" ) occur 47 times in the King James Version; however, the word "arsenokoitai" occurs only 2 times, and the common terms of that time period about homosexual activity are not mentioned in the Bible at all (such as man-boy pairing, Greek "erastes-eromenos"). Condemning homosexuality in Biblical times was not an issue, not a priority, at all.

A Sanity- Test - . Since adultery & adulterer are mentioned 47 times in the King James Version, it could be expected that a sin would be mentioned many times in the Bible: the condemnation of lying/liars occurs over 70 times ("liar" 21 times, "false witness" 19, "lying" lips/tongues 31 times); murder is prohibited 35+ times ("murderer" 20 etc.); and stealing is condemned 73+ times ("steal" 23 times, "thief/robber" 50+, except stealing for food: Proverbs 6:30 "Men do not despise a thief, if he steal to satisfy his soul when he is hungry." [KJV]). However, the common terms (used in those days) to describe homosexual activity are not even mentioned. It doesn't make sense to translate a few rare words & phrases as condemning homosexuality, when specific sins are mentioned many times in the Bible--it simply doesn't pass a sanity-test.

Reality- Test - . During the time period of 1 Corinthians 6:9 & 1 Timothy^ 1:10,:the word "arsenokoitai" occurred in only a few religious writings, such as a later text describing Adam deceived to have sex with serpent-god Naas. The erotic literature of the period never used the word "arsenokoitai" but used other ancient Greek terms ("erastes-eromenos": man-boy pairing) to describe homosexual practices, and those Greek terms were never mentioned in the Greek texts of the Bible. To try to re-interpret & translate other Bible verses into condemning those specific (unnamed) acts is just not realistic--it doesn't pass a reality-test ("reality_check"). The translation of the ancient Greek New Testament must fit the language & cultures of the time period. The translation must match the reality of that era.

Old-Testament Literal Translation - . The infamous verse Leviticus 20:13, often used to condemn homosexuality, is about a married-man with another male, in the "marriage-bed" as with his wife. See the Latinized Greek for Leviticus 20:13 below:
"Kai hos an koimEthE meta arsenos koitEn
gunaikos, bdelugma epoiEsan amphoteroi;
thanatousthwsan, enoichoi eisin."
[Lev 20:13 in Greek Septuagint LXX].

The translation of the Greek term 'gunaikos' is interpreted to mean: wife. Hence, the verse actually forbids male-male adultery, pertaining only to a married man.
Similarly, for Leviticus 18:22, the wording of the original Hebrew is very different from the KJV form:
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind:
it is abomination." [Leviticus 18:22, King James Version]
However, the original Hebrew for Leviticus 18:22 reveals a different 3rd meaning:

"We-et-zakar lo' tishkav mishkevey 'ishshah" [Lev 18:22 Hebrew, Latinized]
("And-with a-male NOT lie-down in beds-of a-woman") [Lev 18:22 literal translation]

So, the Hebrew Leviticus 18:22 mentions: someone + a male + a woman; hence, a forbidden 3-way.

Those 2 infamous Leviticus verses actually mention other women or wives, rather than male-male relationships, as is often the misinterpretation & mistranslation.

When many aspects of Biblical issues are considered, there is no textual basis for misinterpreting & mistranslating Bible verses to condemn homosexuality: the original Hebrew & Greek texts of the Bible do not condemn homosexuality at all, and so, homosexuality should not be considered a sin by today's society.

Finally, the question arises: In 1611, did the Bible translators/scribes for King James purposely mistranslate Bible verses into English because they had intensely resented King James, with his open homosexuality & various male lovers? The answer might never be known.




ANSWER:


Leviticus 20
Punishments for Sin

1 The LORD said to Moses, 2 "Say to the Israelites: 'Any Israelite or any alien living in Israel who gives [a] any of his children to Molech must be put to death. The people of the community are to stone him. 3 I will set my face against that man and I will cut him off from his people; for by giving his children to Molech, he has defiled my sanctuary and profaned my holy name. 4 If the people of the community close their eyes when that man gives one of his children to Molech and they fail to put him to death, 5 I will set my face against that man and his family and will cut off from their people both him and all who follow him in prostituting themselves to Molech.

6 " 'I will set my face against the person who turns to mediums and spiritists to prostitute himself by following them, and I will cut him off from his people.

7 " 'Consecrate yourselves and be holy, because I am the LORD your God. 8 Keep my decrees and follow them. I am the LORD, who makes you holy.

9 " 'If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death. He has cursed his father or his mother, and his blood will be on his own head.

10 " 'If a man commits adultery with another man's wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death.

11 " 'If a man sleeps with his father's wife, he has dishonored his father. Both the man and the woman must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

12 " 'If a man sleeps with his daughter-in-law, both of them must be put to death. What they have done is a perversion; their blood will be on their own heads.

13 " 'If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

14 " 'If a man marries both a woman and her mother, it is wicked. Both he and they must be burned in the fire, so that no wickedness will be among you.

15 " 'If a man has sexual relations with an animal, he must be put to death, and you must kill the animal.

16 " 'If a woman approaches an animal to have sexual relations with it, kill both the woman and the animal. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

17 " 'If a man marries his sister, the daughter of either his father or his mother, and they have sexual relations, it is a disgrace. They must be cut off before the eyes of their people. He has dishonored his sister and will be held responsible.

18 " 'If a man lies with a woman during her monthly period and has sexual relations with her, he has exposed the source of her flow, and she has also uncovered it. Both of them must be cut off from their people.

19 " 'Do not have sexual relations with the sister of either your mother or your father, for that would dishonor a close relative; both of you would be held responsible.

20 " 'If a man sleeps with his aunt, he has dishonored his uncle. They will be held responsible; they will die childless.

21 " 'If a man marries his brother's wife, it is an act of impurity; he has dishonored his brother. They will be childless.

22 " 'Keep all my decrees and laws and follow them, so that the land where I am bringing you to live may not vomit you out. 23 You must not live according to the customs of the nations I am going to drive out before you. Because they did all these things, I abhorred them. 24 But I said to you, "You will possess their land; I will give it to you as an inheritance, a land flowing with milk and honey." I am the LORD your God, who has set you apart from the nations.

25 " 'You must therefore make a distinction between clean and unclean animals and between unclean and clean birds. Do not defile yourselves by any animal or bird or anything that moves along the ground—those which I have set apart as unclean for you. 26 You are to be holy to me [c] because I, the LORD, am holy, and I have set you apart from the nations to be my own.

27 " 'A man or woman who is a medium or spiritist among you must be put to death. You are to stone them; their blood will be on their own heads.' "

Again redy this can go around and around and never stop. You I am assuming are a lesbian......Ok well I should not assume...but it comes up often enough that you are questioning it. Anyone can make or justify their behavior......I have done it also.....But no matter what it will not make a sin right in god's eyes......God will as I do love the sinner but he will never put up with the sin....and when all is said and done.....each and everyone of us will be held accountable for all we do or don't do. This is what I believe this is what I know.

Mt. 18, 1-5.

"At that hour the disciples came to Jesus, saying: Who, thinkest thou, is the greater in the kingdom of heaven? And Jesus, calling unto him a little child, set him in the midst of them. And said: amen I say to you, unless you be converted, and become as little children, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, he is the greater in the kingdom of heaven. And he that shall receive one such little child in my name, receiveth me."
===============================================================================================

When did we lose the innocense? It would be so easier to accept God if we still would have the ability to be amazed that children have.

Dear Daddy from Heaven, please grant me the blessing that in my heart I can become like a child. In that way I will be more free to let you love, and therefore, i will be able to love you. I ask you this in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ who lives and reigns in the unity of the Holy Spirit and is God forever and ever.

Amen.

Its because you are wrong in your assumptions about womens place in ancient Jewish society

I dont know where your getting this from




"creation was frustrated by the will of God that made it a form of bondage to the children of God. So it looks like we all existed"

I have no idea what that is your talking about

Redy wrote:





Ok, Deb here’s the thing. The author of the above is stating that WORDS have been misinterpreted. Now you are intelligent enough to know that putting a wrong word into a sentence can change the meaning of the sentence. You want to read the story and show that the word FITS, but that’s not the point. The point is that it’s the WRONG word and thus the meaning is changed.

Redy Wrote:




They get this information from ‘scholarly’ knowledge, maybe through the Holy Spirit, I couldn’t say for sure, can you?



No..... what? So they are not talking about homosexuals?

Redy wrote:


ANSWER:


Well dear you are using another one of THOSE questionable verses because again the word homosexual in your answer is a word that has been misinterpreted according to many scholars.

Redy Wrote:



ANSWER: the answer was that you simply typed in the Leviticus 20 from your bible. How is that a response to the above? I’ll tell you what I'll enter it the way it is being explained.

Leviticus 20:13 was one of the versus in question, not the whole chapter.

“ If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.”

What the Scholar above is says is this:


You see it’s explaining to you the ACTUAL words that were written and how they were mistranslated. Obviously you can’t understand nor do you know the languages being referred to. Neither do I, so how do YOU know ‘your translation’ is better than a scholars?

Leviticus 18:22
“Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.”

What the above scholar is saying is this:


Do you see now that changing words ESPECIALLY when transcribing to other languages can be easily mistranslated? You don’t know the difference so you’ve been taught to believe something that is false.

Finally the last part was this

Deb said


Because this is what YOU KNOW you will never see another truth, you will always seek only to verify what you believe you know. So I will put it to you another way. I will give you MY interpretation of Romans 14. Enjoy.

Romans 14
The Weak and the Strong

While this chapter may seem to be talking about food, it is discussing matters much greater. I would like to tell you how I interpret this passage. Please feel free to correct me if I err.

1.Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters.

2. One man’s faith allows him to eat everything, but another man , whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables.

3. The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him.

No matter the level of faith you perceive in another, you should not allow what you believe to guide others actions or beliefs. You may not think someone should be gay, or be divorced or have premarital sex, but that is how YOU believe, and you have not, the right to judge. According to this a person can be divorced or gay and their faith may be stronger than your own, so you should not judge.

Romans 14 Cont.

4. Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5. One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind.

6. He who regards one day as special does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.

7. For none of you lives to himself alone and none of us dies to himself alone.

8. If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.

Each person is ultimately accountable only to one master and whether he stands or falls is not for you to decide. FAITH is strongest in the mind of one who is fully convinced that they are act righteously for themselves and not for others.

Romans 14 cont.

9. for this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

10.You , then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God’s judgment seat.

11. It is written: “As surely as I live, ‘ says the Lord, ‘every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.’”

12. So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God.

A reminder of the reason Christ died, that he is Lord of the quick and the dead, not you. No matter what each of us has done, at the time of reckoning we will stand side by side to be judged. Of this you can be sure.

13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in your brother’s way.

14 As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean.

15. If your brother is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy your brother for whom Christ died.

16. Do not allow what you consider good to be spoken of as evil.

Each of us must make up our own minds not to place stumbling blocks in our brother path. Do not allow the law to discriminate against your brother in the name of what you consider good (your God) or it will be spoken of as evil. You can stop that from happening by making your brother equal in all matters of the law.

Romans 14 cont.

17. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit,

18. because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men.

19 Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification.

20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble.

21. It is better not to eat meat or to drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall.

The kingdom of God is not a place for pride but for humility, for in humility there is no judgment but only righteousness, peace and joy and anyone who serves Christ with humility is pleasing to God. So make every effort that will lead to mutual expansion of the mind, and seek not to dictate what each much decide was the reason for Jesus to be here. It is better not to partake of freedoms and liberties than to place them before your brother as a deterrent to stop behavior you have unrighteously judged.

Romans 14 Cont.

22. So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the man who does not condemn himself by what he approves.

23 But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.

So while you accept, and allow the beliefs and actions and faith of others, keep your faith between you and God. You do not condemn yourself for doing what you don’t believe, even if you allow others to do so. But you will condemn yourself if you do not reconcile your own actions with your own beliefs, that is a sin.

In the end what Romans 14 conveys is that you can not dictate what YOU believe others should do or how they should act, in so doing your are showing your faith to be weak. Further you are obliged not to place stumbling blocks in your brothers path, for all of your paths will ultimately lead to God’s judgment alone. At that time you will be asked to account for your actions and you must answer for your gay brothers and sisters who suffered for the obstacles of discrimination you refused to remove from their path.

Tell me, have I made an adequate interpretation?

I'm not interested at all in the debate which is being taken place here because most of the people who know me, know were I stand in all those issues.
However, I want to add something when a person reads the Bible without the light of faith hardly will get the real meaning or message of it, but just what he/she wants to read in benefit of his/her personal agenda or intentions.

I won't say anything further because I'm not in a debating mood, and I won't be in a long long time.

TLW

Mirror you sound totally confused about my interpretation of Britty puzzle for me. Well obviously the HS is not kind to me. Would you like to interpret it for me?

Ok but then it gets funky becuase it says that creation was frustrated by the will of God that made it a form of bondage to the children of God.



What does this mean sweetheart?

�The friend who can be silent with us in a moment of despair or confusion, who can stay with us in an hour of grief and bereavement, who can tolerate not knowing... not healing, not curing... that is a friend who cares.�
Henri Nouwen

Why Mirror, it means that the spirit (the soul) is caged as to bondage by the physical form. So Nature (creation) is frustrated by the will of God that would force it to put the spirit into such bondage.

Ok, well time for bed. I already have so many more questions. I'll see you all tomorrow. Nice chatting with you all. Be well, sleep tight.

PS - see no debate just everyone expanding their minds.

Are you saying the spirit and physical form arnt supposed to be together as they are in humans?

You believe humans are spirits who got trapped in physical form?

Dear God:

I'm full of desires,
full of wishes,
full of expectations.
Some will come true; a lot won't, but in
the middle of my satisfactions and frustrations,
I trust you.

I know you will never leave me alone
and you will comply with your divine promises.
Even when things seem
not to follow my path
I know they follow your path
And at the end
your path is the best for me.

Oh Lord! Reinforce my hope
in particular when my countless wishes
don't come true.
Never let me to forget that your name is LOVE.

Amen

by Henri Nouwen.
===========================================================================================

I found this prayer in a book I'm reading which is spanish. I tried to find the same prayer in english online, and I couldn't.
So I translated the best I could, I hope you guys get the message in the right way.

TLW

Redy,

What we are hoping for, is that you see that coming to Jesus for an affinity to his words and ways and truth and the potential life in Him, spiritually, is a worthy endeavor.

Though there is a theological component to scriptural posterity, there is ever more present the walk with God, endued with the Holy Spirit.

The invitation is preserved for whosoever will.

That is the prerequisite for entering into the one accord of the saints. That one accord comes from the leading of the Holy Spirit within each, and jointly and severally we follow that lead by virtue of the harmony found in unison.

That is not a universal contemplation, but rather the evidence of the gospel having entered into the hearts of those that are so inclined.

Theological disputations can only afford excuse, and often engender contempt for the walk when judged as hypocritically judgemental biases exhibited in self righteous indignation happening upon Christians in transparency.

Sufficient numbers of inadequate teachers and usurpers of the truth seeking to justify themselves before mankind do in fact display their errors through their much speaking and do more harm than good for the Christian faith, but still, change it not, nor diminish it.

It begins with coming to Jesus.

It becomes an inherent walk with God by the anointing of the Holy Spirit as a prerequisite component of true baptismal rebirth from the death of the flesh and its leading into the birth of the spirit into life towards God in spirit and truth. The teacher, then, is the Holy Spirit.

The scriptures and the law merely bring anyy to a point of determination as to the desire to know God and be pleasing to God.

It is not an inevitable consequence forcefed to mankind.

Doctrinal questions that dance around the decision to be made to follow Jesus' words or not do nothing to advance the will of any to enter into this walk.

The truth is, that effective Christian witnesses of the power of God's love in Christ are never distracted from being engaged towards the paramount attention and focus of our testimony of that which we have been apprehended of in so edearing ourselves to God's redemptive fellowship in the spirit, which is different from our souls.

The soul that served the flesh, now serves the spirit, even though the flesh is dead, it still struggles to control the soul, but the spirit hungers and thirst for God and the soul follows the spirit, and not the flesh, to the pursuit of attaining the fullness of Christ manifest upon our person in mastery.

Our apprehensions do sequester our intentions most severly to represent that it is God that transforms all individuals, not us throug our clever and articulate expositions in eloquence or simplicity.

There is an elegance that draws people to the truth in Christ.

But that elegance always demands by virtue of conscience in one's regard that the treasure sought is worth more than the treasures known.

The carnal treasures are many and pleasurable. Very alluring and very powerful.

The spiritual treasures are unknown at the time of such a personal dedication, but not entirely unknowable or incomprehensible to the carnal mind.

Having been thoroughly ensconced in carnal treasures in my youth and having found them insatiably unfulfilling, I chose to surrender their value in temporal gratification for something believed to me at the time to be worth endeavoring to apprehend. It was far more joy unspeakable than I could have ever imagined when actually apprehended of by the true deliverance into God's grace and tender mercies.

But the flip is not without it's sorrows.

This is a beseiged way of life.

It is falsely coveted, maligned, misrepresented, pretentiously mimicked, mocked, and generally drug through the mud by disengenuous ones seeking self justifications from men and fronting a pseudo-intellectual elitism of advantage and privilege.

That is to say, the churchianity vs. Christianity duality is the biggest disturbance; not the questions of those seeking to understand what makes us tick.

The ones that seek to know what makes us tick are more often than not led further astray by the counterfeit.

The real deal will be the ones that remind the seeker that Jesus holds the answers and that the Holy Spirit is the teacher.

In closing, seeking excuses leads to more questions, but seeking God leads to the answers.

learn, grow, and be at peace.