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| Topic: If you think intelligent design should be taught in schools. | |
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Edited by
Seamonster
on
Sat 12/06/08 06:47 PM
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idk. whover designed the human body was pretty intelligent. my "idea" is life (and the universe) is too complex to consider that it was not created by some masterful wonderful intelligent being. so..How, seamonster, do you think we got here? fossils and anylazing rock stuff dont explain anything to me. God worked in his own timezone and fossils just prove life exists and was complex way long ago. im talking about the first organic life. where do you think it came from?? how do you think it resulted?? and why shouldn't both of these "ideas" get valid and equal research. from students. O.K. But if they get equal time then so does the idea that we came here because an evil alien put us here to hide us from other aliens.(scientology) It would be immopsible to give every idea equal time. The truth is I don't know how we got here. But niether does anyone else. But to just jump on any crackpot idea that comes down the pike with no evidence to back it up is nits, and then to demand that all children be taught every crazy idea, and call those ideas theories is also nuts and wrong. ID can never make it to the point of theory because there is no evidence of it. It is as strong an idea as the scientologest one. |
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I 'm really starting to like this thread. It is a great way to waste time when bored!
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I 'm really starting to like this thread. It is a great way to waste time when bored! |
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to a point..i would agree.
children should be taught the absolute basics in grade/high school and if the seek understanding then they would pursue it. BUT i really think to people that teach their children that God created the universe...when they send them to school and at school they say NO..it was the big bang. well...maybe the should just take all discussion of HOW the universe came to be right out of school. |
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to a point..i would agree. children should be taught the absolute basics in grade/high school and if the seek understanding then they would pursue it. BUT i really think to people that teach their children that God created the universe...when they send them to school and at school they say NO..it was the big bang. well...maybe the should just take all discussion of HOW the universe came to be right out of school. |
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I 'm really starting to like this thread. It is a great way to waste time when bored! Ummm...it's called an exchange of ideas. I enjoy seeing how other people think. |
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Edited by
Winx
on
Sat 12/06/08 07:16 PM
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idk. whover designed the human body was pretty intelligent. my "idea" is life (and the universe) is too complex to consider that it was not created by some masterful wonderful intelligent being. so..How, seamonster, do you think we got here? fossils and anylazing rock stuff dont explain anything to me. God worked in his own timezone and fossils just prove life exists and was complex way long ago. im talking about the first organic life. where do you think it came from?? how do you think it resulted?? and why shouldn't both of these "ideas" get valid and equal research. from students. Take Anatomy and Physiology I and II and one will see how complex the body is, right? How about a Kinesology class for good measure. Those classes helped me realize that someone intelligent made us. There was no accident there. |
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idk. whover designed the human body was pretty intelligent. my "idea" is life (and the universe) is too complex to consider that it was not created by some masterful wonderful intelligent being. so..How, seamonster, do you think we got here? fossils and anylazing rock stuff dont explain anything to me. God worked in his own timezone and fossils just prove life exists and was complex way long ago. im talking about the first organic life. where do you think it came from?? how do you think it resulted?? and why shouldn't both of these "ideas" get valid and equal research. from students. Take Anatomy and Physiology I and II and one will see how complex the body is, right? How about a Kinesology class for good measure. Those classes helped me realize that someone intelligent made us. There was no accident there. E-V-O-L-U-T-I-O-N Are you trying to say that any other primate, or even mammal, body is not equally complex? Fossils do explain things, they show how animals have changed through time to get to where they are now. |
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Edited by
catwoman96
on
Sat 12/06/08 09:19 PM
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Evolution is how a species evolves. all or any complex species. because even the simplest species is quite complex.
evolution is not a definition that adequetly states HOW man (and everything else) came to be. |
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O.K. But if they get equal time then so does the idea that we came here because an evil alien put us here to hide us from other aliens.(scientology) o0 Scientology is crap. I don't care if any of you are scientologists (I'd venture to guess you're not, but hey, you never know). I have zero respect or tolerance for people that kill people like me (I don't care if it's on purpose or by "accident" it's still killing). |
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Edited by
aspiegirl
on
Sat 12/06/08 09:27 PM
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Evolution is how a species evolves. all or any complex species. because even the simplest species is quite complex. evolution is not a definition that adequetly states HOW man (and everything else) came to be. It started with single cells. How did they get here? Panspermia. RNA and clay catalysts. Any number of other theories. All more plausible than "some dude made things and put them here." |
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idk. whover designed the human body was pretty intelligent. my "idea" is life (and the universe) is too complex to consider that it was not created by some masterful wonderful intelligent being. so..How, seamonster, do you think we got here? fossils and anylazing rock stuff dont explain anything to me. God worked in his own timezone and fossils just prove life exists and was complex way long ago. im talking about the first organic life. where do you think it came from?? how do you think it resulted?? and why shouldn't both of these "ideas" get valid and equal research. from students. Take Anatomy and Physiology I and II and one will see how complex the body is, right? How about a Kinesology class for good measure. Those classes helped me realize that someone intelligent made us. There was no accident there. E-V-O-L-U-T-I-O-N Are you trying to say that any other primate, or even mammal, body is not equally complex? Fossils do explain things, they show how animals have changed through time to get to where they are now. Nope, wasn't trying to say that at all. |
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Edited by
catwoman96
on
Sat 12/06/08 09:46 PM
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Evolution is how a species evolves. all or any complex species. because even the simplest species is quite complex. evolution is not a definition that adequetly states HOW man (and everything else) came to be. It started with single cells. How did they get here? Panspermia. RNA and clay catalysts. Any number of other theories. All more plausible than "some dude made things and put them here." so I dont understand how it sounds impossible to believe this entire UNIVERSE was created by a higher power. if one can also believe, (and it is just a belief) that all lifeform on this planet evolved from what a single strand of RNA?? where did the first RNA come from? what about the clay? is this coincedental?? so then why on the moon has life not developed?? or venus?? saturn?? im assuming that we arent the only intelligent creatures that can evolve over years from a strand of RNA. I mean I see so many different variations of species already here on Earth. you say God didnt create the universe. and that this is just a belief. well it is also just a belief that he did not. |
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Edited by
Eljay
on
Sun 12/07/08 10:48 PM
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 My twelve year old just got home from school. I asked her how we we were made. she said our mommys and daddys. i said no silly how did the human race get started? she said adam and eve. I then asked her who put adam and eve here? and she said God. I told her never to forget that. This SHOULD be reinforced in schools. BUT since its not, I can reinforce it in my home. right, and you can reinforce that the world is flat and that the best way to get though life is to not think and just live by fear. She sould be fine, the world needs more ditch diggers anyway. Christians have never accepted that the earth is flat. Those Christians in the past who pushed that belief were ex-communicated. One of the first Christians to be ex-communicated was excommunicated for teaching that the earth was flat. Humans have known for 2400 years that the earth was not flat. The claim that people believed in a flat earth during the middle ages is used to make Christians look stupid. But it works the other way, because what is exposed is that you don't know an obvious historical fact. well Galileo and copernicus will be glad to here that. Because when Galileo spent the last yrs. of his life locked up by the christian church because of his ideas on the universe didnt jive with the bible he will be glad to know that it didnt realy happen. How do you know Galileo spent the last years of his life locked up by the Christian church? Can you provide evidence of this as fact? from wikipedia: Galileo's championing of Copernicanism was controversial within his lifetime. The geocentric view had been dominant since the time of Aristotle, and the controversy engendered by Galileo's presentation of heliocentrism as proven fact resulted in the Catholic Church's prohibiting its advocacy as empirically proven fact, because it was not empirically proven at the time and was contrary to the literal meaning of Scripture. Galileo was eventually forced to recant his heliocentrism and spent the last years of his life under house arrest on orders of the Roman Inquisition. I see - so your authority is winkipedia. And are you assuming that the author of this information was there? Again I ask - give me a "reliable" source. Not someone who read a book by someone who read a book about someone who read a book. You tell me that the bible is a bunch of stories - and you rely on Wink-a-whatever for your facts. Please. ok i never realy ever say this about anyone but you are an idiot. it is no wonder why you do not understand evolution, you can't even grasp basic history. your agrument is stupid. it's like saying how do you know hitler was a real person, were you there? did you know him? realy dude read a book sometime. besides the bible. you probably have'nt read that either. i'm not going to do all your research for you, you may actually have to look something up yourself. I know it means reading and possibly learning but try it out just once you may like it, who knows. To quote one of my favolrite songs... "I may be an idiot - but indeed I am no fool" I'm sure you were attempting to make a point here but I find it difficult dumbing down to your level to find it. I did not say that the point you made was incorrect - I asked you how you were able to verify it. You did understand that didn't you? Spider got it right away. What was your problem? I don't need you to do any research for me - I suggest you do it for yourself. Pick up a book on logic and dicover what a "false premise is". Hitler has been documented on film - Galileo was not. At least use an alagogy that applies. Having read your posts - I've forgotten more about the bible than you've demonstrated you know. How many times have you read it? Think because you took a college course or two that you've got it over on everyone? Wake up. Back your statements up with some facts. Show some understanding here. Not everyone is convinced that "Evolution as an origin of the Species" is fact - since there are no facts that support it without accepting unprovable postulates and premises that can't be supported. Demonstate if you will how the earth being billions of years old can be supported through science without having to accept "uniformalism" as fact, which is unprovable. But you knew that right? Because you've done the research like I have. Or... Have you? I know very little about you - so I won't make the mistake of saying that you haven't read the bible dozens of times like I have - or read three books a week, or have two degree's, have taught in High School and college, because I know you wouldn't make idiot statements like that about me since you know nothing about me. And if you ever get around it - answer me how it is you know that the testimonies you read about Galileo on Winkapedia are true, and the testimonies about Jesus in the bible are fairy tales. I'm having a difficult time trying to figure out how you reason things out. you have shown everyone the light thank you. Galileo was not ordered by the church under arrest because it is not on film. how could everyone have been so stupid. What I don't understand is why you are not teaching people like Hawkins and Cox. You are truly the most enightend person to ever wlak this planet that your upright walking god poofed here. again thank you for showing us that if it is not on film then it did not happen. Obviously you've missed the point. It isn't what happened to Galileo that is in question here - but the method of verifying it as fact. It has even less to do with your perception of my enlightenment - or the merit you have in your own statment of "fact". I asked you "How" you knew that your statement about Galileo was true. So far - you haven't even approached an answer on this. You merely attempted to assess my level of knowledge, and now your professioning to have an idea of my amount of enlightenment. So what is the reason you are avoiding my simple question? Embarrassed are you? |
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This idea that intelligent design is some kind of scientific theory is a great big joke. Theories needs to have power, what can this theory do to help explain nature as we see it now? Evolution has explained many things, evolution is the unifying theory of biology. What has evolution explained? Who has ever stated that I.D. is a "scientific theory"? Independent fields of science such as taxonomy, radio dating, ice cores samples, and tree ring dating have all matched up with the predictions of evolution and that isn't even mentioning the one field of research that hits one out of the park for evolution, that is genetics. Junk science. Non of it verifyable in a laboratory. Without genetics many fields of medicine would be dead ends now, literally. The human race is at a cross roads, and only through nano tech and genetics will our medical knowledge keep up with the demands of life in the 21st century. Genetics has nothing to do with Evolution. What's your point? What does ID do? I have not seen anything yet, other then look at something complex and presuppose it cannot be worked out so it must be made by an unfathomable creator. Jeremy. I.D. is is a theory. Like Evolution. Mere attempts to explain the origin of things. Unverifyable. That is why they are both called "theories" and NOT fact. To declare either one as such is just wishful thinking based on subjective acceptances of perceptions that fullfill one's personal choice of a world view. It is as easy to dismiss Evolution as it is I.D. read over your own posts and substatute evolution for ID and show me how you can disprove the validity of those statements as easily as you expect others to accept your disproving the validity of ID. I would expect that you'd need more information to support your own arguments in that circumstance. |
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idk. whover designed the human body was pretty intelligent. my "idea" is life (and the universe) is too complex to consider that it was not created by some masterful wonderful intelligent being. so..How, seamonster, do you think we got here? fossils and anylazing rock stuff dont explain anything to me. God worked in his own timezone and fossils just prove life exists and was complex way long ago. im talking about the first organic life. where do you think it came from?? how do you think it resulted?? and why shouldn't both of these "ideas" get valid and equal research. from students. O.K. But if they get equal time then so does the idea that we came here because an evil alien put us here to hide us from other aliens.(scientology) It would be immopsible to give every idea equal time. The truth is I don't know how we got here. But niether does anyone else. But to just jump on any crackpot idea that comes down the pike with no evidence to back it up is nits, and then to demand that all children be taught every crazy idea, and call those ideas theories is also nuts and wrong. ID can never make it to the point of theory because there is no evidence of it. It is as strong an idea as the scientologest one. But the same can be said for evolution. Who is to say that a fossil is proof we evolved from a rock, or that we are decendants of Adam? All it is proof of is that something existed a long time ago. How long? It can't be determined. Presummed - perhaps. Determined... No. So why are kids being taught that man has a common ancester with an ape when there is no way to verify it? I agree with you. We should not be teaching scientology to our children - though that has not stopped them from getting it into the classrooms. So too with Darwanism. GET IT OUT OF THE CLASSROOMS! |
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Who has ever stated that I.D. is a "scientific theory"? The idiots in Kansas that insist it should be taught in science classes. I again point you in the direction of the Flying Spaghetti Monster Genetics has nothing to do with Evolution. What's your point? Genetics has EVERYTHING to do with evolution. |
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So why are kids being taught that man has a common ancester with an ape when there is no way to verify it? I agree with you. We should not be teaching scientology to our children - though that has not stopped them from getting it into the classrooms. So too with Darwanism. GET IT OUT OF THE CLASSROOMS! If you want Darwinism throw out of school, then all other theories on the origin of life should be thrown out as well. Then there would not me any anthropology allowed in school, save for some cultural anthropology. No archaeology. No biological anthropology. And since we're throwing out all theories, no religion. And since children wouldn't have a foundation for these things, then it would be eliminated from colleges too. Then anyone who knows anything about it now will eventually die, and nobody will know anything about those subjects anymore. Closeing your eyes, plugging you ears, and screaming "LA LA LA! I CAN'T HEAR YOU!" isn't the answer. I'm fine with teaching creationism and intelligent design in school, just not in the science classroom, as they are not scientific theories. Likewise, evolution should be taught in the science classroom, and not in religious classes. |
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This idea that intelligent design is some kind of scientific theory is a great big joke. Theories needs to have power, what can this theory do to help explain nature as we see it now? Evolution has explained many things, evolution is the unifying theory of biology. What has evolution explained? Who has ever stated that I.D. is a "scientific theory"? Independent fields of science such as taxonomy, radio dating, ice cores samples, and tree ring dating have all matched up with the predictions of evolution and that isn't even mentioning the one field of research that hits one out of the park for evolution, that is genetics. Junk science. Non of it verifyable in a laboratory. Without genetics many fields of medicine would be dead ends now, literally. The human race is at a cross roads, and only through nano tech and genetics will our medical knowledge keep up with the demands of life in the 21st century. Genetics has nothing to do with Evolution. What's your point? What does ID do? I have not seen anything yet, other then look at something complex and presuppose it cannot be worked out so it must be made by an unfathomable creator. Jeremy. I.D. is is a theory. Like Evolution. Mere attempts to explain the origin of things. Unverifyable. That is why they are both called "theories" and NOT fact. To declare either one as such is just wishful thinking based on subjective acceptances of perceptions that fullfill one's personal choice of a world view. It is as easy to dismiss Evolution as it is I.D. read over your own posts and substatute evolution for ID and show me how you can disprove the validity of those statements as easily as you expect others to accept your disproving the validity of ID. I would expect that you'd need more information to support your own arguments in that circumstance. ID is not a theory. Evolution is. ID can and will never be a theory. It can not be tested therefore it can not reach the state of theory. So why should we teach things to children that has no evidence what so ever outside of the bible? It's like teaching that we all live in a flower because it says it in Horton Hears A Hoo. |
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So why are kids being taught that man has a common ancester with an ape when there is no way to verify it? I agree with you. We should not be teaching scientology to our children - though that has not stopped them from getting it into the classrooms. So too with Darwanism. GET IT OUT OF THE CLASSROOMS! If you want Darwinism throw out of school, then all other theories on the origin of life should be thrown out as well. Then there would not me any anthropology allowed in school, save for some cultural anthropology. No archaeology. No biological anthropology. And since we're throwing out all theories, no religion. And since children wouldn't have a foundation for these things, then it would be eliminated from colleges too. Then anyone who knows anything about it now will eventually die, and nobody will know anything about those subjects anymore. Closeing your eyes, plugging you ears, and screaming "LA LA LA! I CAN'T HEAR YOU!" isn't the answer. There would be no need to throw out anthropology - for it is merely a study of culture and development. Nothing wrong with that. Extrapolating it back a couple of billion years based on the current development (the "evolution" factor) is what needs to be dropped - not the science itself. The same with all of the sciences you mentioned. And college is an elective and selective choice. It doesn't matter to me what is taught in colleges - for the choice remains ith the student where and what they will take. It is not so in public education. I'm also not refering to private institutions, because here again - there is a choice offered. You need not send a child to a private institution where the corriculum is not in line with the parents world view. This idea of "balance" in teaching "theories of origin", and having to open up the field to everything from evolution to ID to UFO's to Satanism to mythology id unecessary as far as a requirement is concerned. So why is evolution taught in schools as a requirement? Who's not opening their eyes or blocking their ears? You're missing the forest from the tree you are staring at. I'm fine with teaching creationism and intelligent design in school, just not in the science classroom, as they are not scientific theories. Likewise, evolution should be taught in the science classroom, and not in religious classes. I'm fine with teaching evolution in school - just not in the science classroom. It is a world view religion. It belongs in a religion/philosophy class - for nothing needs the amount of faith to believe in it - than evolution |
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