100% FREE ONLINE DATING
sponsored links
Previous
| Topic: IS GOD RESPONSABLE FOR EVERYTHING OR NOT | |
|---|---|
|
|
|
On further reflection, I wonder what your point is. All things which are possible and exist are because of God. If God hadn't created you, would wouldn't have been able to post your rant. If God hadn't created me, I wouldn't have read it and mistaken it for a discussion. If God hadn't allowed for electricity, we wouldn't be able to post online messages. Etc, etc, etc. the bottom line is god is responsible for creating the opportunity for sin to take place, choices to be made, a fall from grace to occur. with out creation this would not be so. end of story. That's not true. God could have created the universe to only have animals. Then creation would exist without sin. But what God decided is that he wanted to do more for us and he expected more from us, therefore we have free-will. I think the problem is that you are so obsessed with disproving Christianity that you can't take a breath and realize your arguments are pointless. EVERYTHING depends upon God to exist, both good and bad. God created all good things and allowed his creations to choose to make good or bad actions. and here again open mouth insert foot - you have not taken my advice and went back as see wgats been fully discussed on this your talking out your A** spidey. go read!! |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
On further reflection, I wonder what your point is. All things which are possible and exist are because of God. If God hadn't created you, would wouldn't have been able to post your rant. If God hadn't created me, I wouldn't have read it and mistaken it for a discussion. If God hadn't allowed for electricity, we wouldn't be able to post online messages. Etc, etc, etc. the bottom line is god is responsible for creating the opportunity for sin to take place, choices to be made, a fall from grace to occur. with out creation this would not be so. end of story. That's not true. God could have created the universe to only have animals. Then creation would exist without sin. But what God decided is that he wanted to do more for us and he expected more from us, therefore we have free-will. I think the problem is that you are so obsessed with disproving Christianity that you can't take a breath and realize your arguments are pointless. EVERYTHING depends upon God to exist, both good and bad. God created all good things and allowed his creations to choose to make good or bad actions. and here again open mouth insert foot - you have not taken my advice and went back as see wgats been fully discussed on this your talking out your A** spidey. go read!! What if I disagree with the points made by you, Feral and Eljay? What then? Well, I'll just continue to make posts, if for no other reason than the fact that I make so much sense that you are having conniption fits after every post I make. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
On further reflection, I wonder what your point is. All things which are possible and exist are because of God. If God hadn't created you, would wouldn't have been able to post your rant. If God hadn't created me, I wouldn't have read it and mistaken it for a discussion. If God hadn't allowed for electricity, we wouldn't be able to post online messages. Etc, etc, etc. the bottom line is god is responsible for creating the opportunity for sin to take place, choices to be made, a fall from grace to occur. with out creation this would not be so. end of story. your more than welcome to disagree spidey - all im saying is things your saying now have already been brought up and your points discussed, you might want to know how the answers turned out before you bring everything back up again as your doing. That's not true. God could have created the universe to only have animals. Then creation would exist without sin. But what God decided is that he wanted to do more for us and he expected more from us, therefore we have free-will. I think the problem is that you are so obsessed with disproving Christianity that you can't take a breath and realize your arguments are pointless. EVERYTHING depends upon God to exist, both good and bad. God created all good things and allowed his creations to choose to make good or bad actions. and here again open mouth insert foot - you have not taken my advice and went back as see wgats been fully discussed on this your talking out your A** spidey. go read!! What if I disagree with the points made by you, Feral and Eljay? What then? Well, I'll just continue to make posts, if for no other reason than the fact that I make so much sense that you are having conniption fits after every post I make. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
On further reflection, I wonder what your point is. All things which are possible and exist are because of God. If God hadn't created you, would wouldn't have been able to post your rant. If God hadn't created me, I wouldn't have read it and mistaken it for a discussion. If God hadn't allowed for electricity, we wouldn't be able to post online messages. Etc, etc, etc. the bottom line is god is responsible for creating the opportunity for sin to take place, choices to be made, a fall from grace to occur. with out creation this would not be so. end of story. That's not true. God could have created the universe to only have animals. Then creation would exist without sin. But what God decided is that he wanted to do more for us and he expected more from us, therefore we have free-will. I think the problem is that you are so obsessed with disproving Christianity that you can't take a breath and realize your arguments are pointless. EVERYTHING depends upon God to exist, both good and bad. God created all good things and allowed his creations to choose to make good or bad actions. and here again open mouth insert foot - you have not taken my advice and went back as see wgats been fully discussed on this your talking out your A** spidey. go read!! What if I disagree with the points made by you, Feral and Eljay? What then? Well, I'll just continue to make posts, if for no other reason than the fact that I make so much sense that you are having conniption fits after every post I make. me = conniption fits....I think not.....and disagree with me all you want......I don't care. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? AB, That's a very poor debating tactic. What I mean by evil should be obvious, but I will answer your questions anyways... Q) What does it mean? A) morally objectionable behavior Q) What does it do? A) Evil does nothing, it is a description for behavior. Q) Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? A) Is rape only evil if religion says so? Is child molestation only evil because religion says it is? Is murder only evil because it's one of the 10 commandments? I realize you are trying to be deep and that's your schtick, but I would prefer if we could drop the schticks and try to discuss this like reasoning adults. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
God gets all of the credit and none of the blame. Oh man! I wish I had that luxury! Must be nice! Let's face it, the worst God does is to "Work in Mysterious ways"...how....convenient. right ****in on! or its part of his plan. yeah wish my plans were allowed that many snafus. lol. snafus involving ethnic cleansings and habitual murder and rape, ntm the assault on our senses that is everyday life. lol |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
me = conniption fits....I think not.....and disagree with me all you want......I don't care. Feral, That post wasn't directed at you. I haven't read the posts made previously, so I don't know if I disagree with you or not, I was making a point. My points are no less valid because I haven't read your posts, are they? Do you need to read everything I have said on a subject before you can voice your opinion? Tribo has no arguments to refute what I have posted, so he is trying to intimidate me into reading the whole thread (which I will never do) just to shut me up. I'm not sure where you got that I was talking about you having conniption fits, the post was a reply to something made by Tribo... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? AB, That's a very poor debating tactic. What I mean by evil should be obvious, but I will answer your questions anyways... Q) What does it mean? A) morally objectionable behavior Q) What does it do? A) Evil does nothing, it is a description for behavior. Q) Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? A) Is rape only evil if religion says so? Is child molestation only evil because religion says it is? Is murder only evil because it's one of the 10 commandments? I realize you are trying to be deep and that's your schtick, but I would prefer if we could drop the schticks and try to discuss this like reasoning adults. Got you to answer... so then what part of this particular debating tactic is poor. Also got a response from you that was in poor taste. I am an adult. I posted as such. I got a childish comment about adults. sorry to be contrary but murder is not one of the 10 commandants. It is ACTUALLY forbidden as one of the THOU SHALT NOT'S.   rape/molestation/murder and such are crimes... This does not make them evil. (Perhaps one might make the argument that a person that commits such acts might be considered evil) ... Um... Morally unacceptable behaviour...? by whose standards?... Who decides what is acceptable or what is not? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? AB, That's a very poor debating tactic. What I mean by evil should be obvious, but I will answer your questions anyways... Q) What does it mean? A) morally objectionable behavior Q) What does it do? A) Evil does nothing, it is a description for behavior. Q) Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? A) Is rape only evil if religion says so? Is child molestation only evil because religion says it is? Is murder only evil because it's one of the 10 commandments? I realize you are trying to be deep and that's your schtick, but I would prefer if we could drop the schticks and try to discuss this like reasoning adults. Got you to answer... so then what part of this particular debating tactic is poor. Also got a response from you that was in poor taste. I am an adult. I posted as such. I got a childish comment about adults. sorry to be contrary but murder is not one of the 10 commandants. It is ACTUALLY forbidden as one of the THOU SHALT NOT'S. rape/molestation/murder and such are crimes... This does not make them evil. (Perhaps one might make the argument that a person that commits such acts might be considered evil) ... Um... Morally unacceptable behaviour...? by whose standards?... Who decides what is acceptable or what is not? If child molestation were legal, would there be anything wrong with molesting a child? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Spider I think AB did make a valid point. If there was no "evil" or morally objectionable behavior or presumed "sinners" wouldn't the Protestants and the rest of them be out of business? You need us.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? AB, That's a very poor debating tactic. What I mean by evil should be obvious, but I will answer your questions anyways... Q) What does it mean? A) morally objectionable behavior Q) What does it do? A) Evil does nothing, it is a description for behavior. Q) Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? A) Is rape only evil if religion says so? Is child molestation only evil because religion says it is? Is murder only evil because it's one of the 10 commandments? I realize you are trying to be deep and that's your schtick, but I would prefer if we could drop the schticks and try to discuss this like reasoning adults. Got you to answer... so then what part of this particular debating tactic is poor. Also got a response from you that was in poor taste. I am an adult. I posted as such. I got a childish comment about adults. sorry to be contrary but murder is not one of the 10 commandants. It is ACTUALLY forbidden as one of the THOU SHALT NOT'S. rape/molestation/murder and such are crimes... This does not make them evil. (Perhaps one might make the argument that a person that commits such acts might be considered evil) ... Um... Morally unacceptable behaviour...? by whose standards?... Who decides what is acceptable or what is not? honestly youre going ot ask that? if someone murdered your family but it was legal, what then? would you forgive that person? would you say "oh hes doing what he needs to" no! you would kill him then feel awful. and thats what evil is, its that feeling we get when we KNOW were doing something wrong! |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
No sin has occured... How could it be sin. Unless you read only a small sour book. God did not create us for sin but for glory... Which path you take is your choice. I have no problem with you chosing to walk the path of sin with all of its fears, contradictions and final battles/destruction. that will leave more room on my less traveled way. I am walking with purpose for glory. I like living without guilt. Do you believe some actions are evil? Regardless of your belief system, are there certain actions which are always evil? Please specify the term evil... what does it mean? what does it do? Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? AB, That's a very poor debating tactic. What I mean by evil should be obvious, but I will answer your questions anyways... Q) What does it mean? A) morally objectionable behavior Q) What does it do? A) Evil does nothing, it is a description for behavior. Q) Would it be a problem if organized religion did not expound it? A) Is rape only evil if religion says so? Is child molestation only evil because religion says it is? Is murder only evil because it's one of the 10 commandments? I realize you are trying to be deep and that's your schtick, but I would prefer if we could drop the schticks and try to discuss this like reasoning adults. Got you to answer... so then what part of this particular debating tactic is poor. Also got a response from you that was in poor taste. I am an adult. I posted as such. I got a childish comment about adults. sorry to be contrary but murder is not one of the 10 commandants. It is ACTUALLY forbidden as one of the THOU SHALT NOT'S. rape/molestation/murder and such are crimes... This does not make them evil. (Perhaps one might make the argument that a person that commits such acts might be considered evil) ... Um... Morally unacceptable behaviour...? by whose standards?... Who decides what is acceptable or what is not? If child molestation were legal, would there be anything wrong with molesting a child? if your speaking present day socoiety you may be correct but past cultures things were acceptable in thier moral beliefs. so your only partialy correct as todays present society here and now. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Spider I think AB did make a valid point. If there was no "evil" or morally objectionable behavior or presumed "sinners" wouldn't the Protestants and the rest of them be out of business? You need us. Krimsa, Would a law making all women in the world sex slaves be morally right? If not, then doesn't that mean that there are objective morals allowing people their life and freedom? If you actually believe that if religion was wiped out and that there was a law making child molestation legal, then child molestation wouldn't be evil... well, I really don't know what to say. I can't imagine how someone's thinking can get so screwed up. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
if your speaking present day socoiety you may be correct but past cultures things were acceptable in thier moral beliefs. so your only partialy correct as todays present society here and now. So child molestation can be moral behavior in your opinion? That's a scary thought that people believe that. I know members of NAMBLA think that, but still. This is the reason I had to leave here, I should probably just never come back, there is no reasoning with some people. Just for the record, child molestation is wrong at all times and all places. No matter what the law says, the child cannot make those decisions for themselves and NOBODY has the right to make it for them. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
honestly you know inside whats evil. running over babies, kicking puppies, etc. lol. i dont see where this is such a thing?
time is a man made thing except when you factor in how well time cooperates with everything else. i think good and evil are the same, we have man evil and good, and basic evil and good. man evil: drugs sex rock and roll basic evil: murder rape man good: getting a door giving money to a homeless guy giving to your "church" basic good: keeping someone out of traffic saving animals lives upholding the rights of a basic human being any better? lol are we discussing human subjectivity?? or are we discussing the fundamental laws of good and evil in the universe? caus ehonestly theyre 2 seperate beasts.... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
me = conniption fits....I think not.....and disagree with me all you want......I don't care. Feral, That post wasn't directed at you. I haven't read the posts made previously, so I don't know if I disagree with you or not, I was making a point. My points are no less valid because I haven't read your posts, are they? Do you need to read everything I have said on a subject before you can voice your opinion? Tribo has no arguments to refute what I have posted, so he is trying to intimidate me into reading the whole thread (which I will never do) just to shut me up. I'm not sure where you got that I was talking about you having conniption fits, the post was a reply to something made by Tribo... I am sorry love I didn't see the context in which my name was used just saw quoted in tribo's.....so sorry....But I don't want people to always beleive what I say...again comes down to choice.... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
ok hrere's the crux of my OP for all who are argueing about sde issues ok?
god created everything correct? in doing so he created the potential for sin to enter into that creation by giving men free will and free choice correct? then if sin did enter he is responsible for the sin entering correct? WHY? if he had not created as he chose to do, then sin as we know or think of it could not exist - thus he is responsible for it and everything else in creation you can not seperate one part of creation out and say NO he's not reponsible for sin, no more than you can seperate out goodness and say he's not responsible for good. bottom line? "GOD" is responsible for allowing sin to come about to allow man to br tempted by another of his creations/satan whom already had sinned before man was ever created, so he had full knowledge as to what could go wrong beforehand and still want forward with hid plans, thus gos is guilty of allowing the potential for sin to exist and be acted upon. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Edited by
Krimsa
on
Mon 10/20/08 03:17 PM
|
|
Spider I think AB did make a valid point. If there was no "evil" or morally objectionable behavior or presumed "sinners" wouldn't the Protestants and the rest of them be out of business? You need us. Krimsa, Would a law making all women in the world sex slaves be morally right? If not, then doesn't that mean that there are objective morals allowing people their life and freedom? If you actually believe that if religion was wiped out and that there was a law making child molestation legal, then child molestation wouldn't be evil... well, I really don't know what to say. I can't imagine how someone's thinking can get so screwed up. Are you asking me that question or telling me? Well it should be no surprise to you spider that in fact one of my largest complaints with the bible is the misogynistic undertones in which it expounds. You dont really require for me to start posting these examples do you? Try scrolling back a few pages on this same thread. The ladies of Zion and what god felt appropriate to do with their "hidden parts" No, thats why Im not a Christian and I refuse to subscribe. I dont like it at all. I cant stand for that lack of basic understanding and compassion for half of humanity. It bothers me. I wont make any secret of my grievances with Christianity or any of its misguided indoctrinations as it relates to women. The true Creators. I personally rely on my own conscious to provide me with an accurate moral compass to guide my action under questionable circumstances. I do not rely on religion to explain right and wrong or good and evil for me. I can distinguish this in my own head and heart. In fact all humans can unless they are mentally compromised in some respect. The only other psychiatric problem that I can think of off hand would be the designation of sociopath or another form of borderline personality disorder. Incidentally, its noteworthy that many people that have been associated with religious cults have been diagnosed sociopaths. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tribo and AB,
You both seem to believe that moral right is based on the law. In your opinion, is slavery right or wrong? It was legal before and it is illegal now. Do you think that because now it's illegal, it's wrong, but when it was legal it was right? It seems that your beliefs would result in a stagnant society that would always dwell within it's evil. Your beliefs would be counter-progress for a society. |
|
|
|
|
