I'm out there.

David Bowie, Merry Christmas, Mr. Lawrence

Read this post before. Get over yourself. I see that you're alive, of sorts, but what is it that you actually learned from that experience that has caused you to modify your behaviour for the rest of your life? In other words you proved to someone that you're a jerk now you come here and share the same thing with every one else. Now what do you propose for Act lll?

Good evening dragoness.
I think that to determine inclusion and belonging as one and the same is a somewhat sorrowful thinking. Inclusion by its very definition grants its enemy, the opposite; exclusion some considerable power. A method of exclusion, as I am sure you are well aware, is used in many religions to justify fear and dominance. We live often to a standard that says..."Its my ball and if you don't play by my rules, I will take my ball away".
Also I disagree with your statement that "Self is independence". To become exclusive i.e without, is essentially to isolate oneself thereby being without a sense of belonging. Being Independent is not about belonging :it is about being entrapped in a world of hurt and rejection, a world of exclusion. Ahh what the heck do I know.

Good evening Jess.
Wow I am so tempted, or should I say no, I will, send you a flower and in a curious sense of chivalry I offer it with a profound sense of thanks that you have found such a humanity in yourself that you are so willing to share that with your children. You see, I was the "bad guy" in my marriage and it took ten years of divorce to see and accept that for what it was, and to make steps to correct a very serious character flaw, but I learned, ahh if only such learning were easy...
Well anyway, to admit to ones loved children that they choose their flaws as an escape from a high standard, most probably self imposed,
oohh.. this is getting a little beyond my understanding and away from the topic.... I was just trying to say thank you for what you are teaching your children. Such courage. Such acts of personal responsibility.
This is really what I meant when I offered my opinion on ones sense of belonging. To be a part of.... I am sure that Alfred Adler, the father of individual psychology, would consider the guiding of and communicating with others about belief systems and ideals really does encourage a sense of belonging even in the commonwealth of mingle. Is this not a commonwealth? Is this not a place to feed and be fed? Is this not a place where judgement is suspended? For the most place..yes. Is this not a place to be nurtured and to nurture?
Oh well rose coloured glasses sometimes get in the way.

And on that note I must go to bed. It is nearly eleven oclock pm here in London and work in the morning demands that I get my beauty sleep. Good night.

Self discovery.
The greatest need that man has is to belong to the commonwealth. All man needs to belong. That is the guiding principle
of why we are. We need to be together. We need to belong. All that remains is to formulate the commonwealth we belong in and to. If one were to form a standard of being that is ouside of the societal norm then the evolution of the human psyche is truely finished. But as you pointed out earlier in this discussion morality is a personal issue. The "moral imperative " is really to do with how one interacts within ones commonwealth of belonging. That takes personal accountability for being a member of that commonwealth.

The moral imperative to personal responsibility can still be taught, the ears of the hearer may be blocked but that does not detract from the imperative itself.

I accept that your belief system allows for personal responsibility which is the point I was somewhat ineffectually trying to make. The "moral imperative" that George Orwell alluded to, although atheistic,was aimed at the generation of the 1940's-50's, that he saw as being essentially lost because their belief system somehow became seriously flawed resulting in a loss of personal and thence social responsibility.

I apologise if you have been offended that was certainly not my intent, but even the Christian belief has within its tenets, the acceptance of personal responsibility. Just because you see aChristian saying or doing something that you consider un Christian does not mean that they are necessarily evil, it just means that they are human.
My point is that a moral imperative is a fair guide for living a moral, responsible, personally accountable style of life.

Those who believe in Karma try to take personal responsibility for their actions in this time so that their belief (in reincarnation) will lead them into betterment, next time. Not religious wars.
This is not about Christian or non Christian beliefs. It is about personal responsibility.

This is not about a belief in heaven and hell. If you had really read what I wrote you would have seen that it is about a belief in what comes after life and how one responds to that belief in this life.

There was a time when people believed in heaven and hell, where there was no doubt as to the preferred destination. The real point to life was essentially to build a stairway to paradise, which does not mean that people behaved perfectly. The world was still a very cruel place. People believed in a judgement at some point in the after...life. Now it appears that fewer people believe in this life after death, thus a lowering of the standards for interactive/intercoursive responsibility.
The essayist George Orwell although an avowed atheist believed that this disbelief was the greatest cause of the breakdown of moral and social behaviour. The loss of a belief effected a loss of personal responsibility.

There was a time, and in some places there still is, when the vast majority of marriages/relationships were determined by the village matchmaker, social caste, social class, parents, attacks by horny pirates, etc...A lot of these relationships can only be judged by the contentment in the marriage. Not all. In the Bible one man had to work for fourteen years to finally be with the one he really wanted.Most arranged marriages were from outside the marriage and looks had very little to with the end result. Superficiality and inauthenticity are certainly at the forefront of todays thinking. Some folks are not the greatest beauties, but once you begin to look at the soul....there you can find wonderful beauty....beauty to make even a grown man weep.
Idealistic. yes...but I just do not care.

There is no "I told you so" here but there is a somebody who heard your story and recognises that the hurt is not going to just go and play with itself somewhere else. I feel for you and I wish great strength for you right now. I speak a blessing to your soul for comfort and wisdom.

Somehow it appears to have worked.

I believe that being a single, and sometimes lonely guy recently back in the United Kingdom I welcome the attention but not a the expense of my self dignity, nor my intellect. Yes I would welcome the opportunity to be in a respectful,dignified and loving relationship and I think that these scammers are just preying on human fragility. Mine and all who are on dating sites.
They embody the very worst of human greed, they destroy faith and corrupt positive human values. They rot the very atmosphere they inhabit.
I have heard many horror stories of sensitive people "losing their faith in mankind" in the spell of such monsters.
I believe in the teleological principles of Alfred Adler, who postulated that the greatest need of the human person is the need to belong to a community, and the community in terms of many on this site is man and woman is relationship. Thus the very mandate that we follow is at risk from these horrible people. If they are seen or smelled, report them.

Scammers are from all over. I have had two young ladies contact me over the past month, both quite young, both ostensibly from Eastern Europe and both want to have a relationship with me or marriage or both. Guess what...they both needed to come to London and needed money for the airfare....blah blah blah. After two emails they were deeply professing their love and I am left with a sense of amamzement that they must assume that someone could be so guilable. Sometimes lonely yes...but not that foolish.

The social evolution of the ME NOW identity/generation has unfortunately created a vaccuum in the expectations of men and women.
I believe that opening the door for a lady is less a right for her and more an honour for me. Flowers following a date is as much a joy in my choosing them as it is for her in receiving them. Then there is the thank you phone call, not a text, and the opportunity for asking for another date. Holding hands? Now that is the begining of all sorts of wonder.
Etiquette is the begining of grace in a relationship and it may well go on forever.