Jewish people were tortured , persecuted, incarcerated and worked to death or murdered in an attempt to eradicate their race from humankind ... they had no choice whatsoever . Ludicrous to draw any parallel with vaccination . Every choice has a consequence. Although there can be elements of manipulation when it comes to making choice it is wrong to assume that all choice is manipulated . That is just your own ideology attempting to control and manipulate others into supporting/validating your own choice . We will never agree . I am happy for people to choose to be vaccinated or not . You on the other hand are claiming that anyone choosing vaccination is being manipulated .. perhaps some are susceptible to manipulation but you cannot apply that to every individual . Some choose vaccination because they value their health/health of their loved ones and do not feel threatened by medical science . Any consequences as a result of not being vaccinated are hardly comparable with murder and hate of a race . I Find that comparison totally disrespectful to the millions who lost their life during the Holocaust . Will leave it at that .

If someone has to be brainwashed to take protection against a virus that has killed 3.1 million people worldwide, I don’t know what to say to that. And if it’s only shown to be deadly .08 percent is the argument, who is being selfish here? How many would there be if it weren’t for the stay at home, or no vaccine? Did you lose a loved one?

How anyone living in democracy is comparing this to Nazi Germany is beyond me. Anne Frank lived in an attic for four years.

If you get caught drinking and driving, you’re arrested. Is that taking your freedom away or is that a consequence of your actions?

The answer is there is so many things that WE WILL NEVER KNOW because the actions have already been taken. Why are some states that had less restrictions with fewer deaths and cases then those with stricter restrictions? What are the long term affects that we will see from things that have been done? And things that were not done? Just maybe eliminating some of the weak people is not such a bad thing? How many of the people who died would have been dead in a year or two anyway? Ironically I was at a funeral yesterday for a friend that died of covid 2 months ago after being on a ventilator for 46 days. There were also many people who did not even know they had it, or were just tired and sore for a week. I have been told my whole life its a virus let it take its course. I don't get flu shots and it is very rare I get flu type symptoms. Do masks really do anything? Or as soon as you touch your mask does that make the contraction that much easier? Is being too clean going to lead to other issues? If you never consume dairy you will become lactose intolerant, if you don't get germs your body won't know how to handle it when you do. Have you looked into the 1918 influenza outbreak? No vaccine, it ran out of hosts, but variants are still around to this day. By stretching things out we have allowed Corona to mutate and it will continue to do so. Nobody knows how this could of been or will be, everything is just a guess at what to do and why to do it. The waste of money and taking of control by the government is also going to be a big issue. People in low middle class and below with kids most likely got $20k to $40k extra thru the last year and a half and I guaranty most of them wasted it, and many have not paid rent because there was no eviction. Its easy to take somebody out of the ghetto, but its hard to take the ghetto out of somebody. The poor will be worse off after all is said and done by their poor choices. Then there is the flip side of corporations taking advantage of "free" money. Such things as payroll protection and then hiring new people at lower wages and no benefits. Then we have the population making more on unemployment then working so they are not going back to work. Brainwashing is nothing new, it has formed society to what it is good and bad. But when is the government control so much that nobody else gets a say in what goes on?
Driving is a privlage not a right and that's why you have to be a certain age and get a license. There are also restrictions involved in drinking. But it's more to do with the government telling you WHAT YOU CAN NOT DO then telling you what you MUST DO.

We live in a random, chaotic, unpredictable Universe.
No matter the brainwashing there will be those who are not affected.

Have you ever heard the term "Smarter than an 8th grader"?
There's a general rule of thumb when dealing with the public.
Most public interaction is based on an 8th grade education.
In other words, concepts are presented to the public as if they were addressing 8th graders.
With the internet and personal education opportunities it offers, public presentation has increased to 10th grader levels of understanding.
In other words, concepts are presented to the public as if they were addressing 10th graders.

Those of us with understanding above the 'norm' are able to see thru the manipulations a bit easier. However, as with all things, things adapt and public presentations have multiple 'spheres' of understanding levels.

The general population are still addressed at the 8th grade level.
A large portion of the population is also influenced at the 10th grade level.
A smaller portion is addressed at 12th grade/graduate level.
A tiny portion of the population is addressed at higher levels of understanding.

Where you or I may see the influence much of the world does not. Yet, most of the world fails to see all the influence. There are exceptions but they are few and far between.
Usually, the few who can see the influence have the ability to set things in motion which offsets the influence in the masses. It breaks the influence agenda which causes those in control to adjust accordingly.
Much of the time, by turning to their favor in some way so it then again advances their agenda.

Much of our lives are based on concepts without a reality basis.
Money and power are two such illusions.

Money and power are so strong, nearly everyone seeks it in their lives.
Yet, neither concept has basis in reality.
Wealth is a sense of ownership.
Power is a sense of submission.

If you think about it, the only thing you actually own is your body.
The only power you actually have is your own.

When you are born and when you die, none of your wealth remains with you.
You only have power over another if they are willing to submit to you.

Work is not a requirement for life but it is a brainwashed concept in which people comply even when they don't really want to.
Be a good citizen, go to work, make more money, get power.
None is a requirement to be alive yet many people think it is.
Brainwashing saturation of society.

Society is a condition of influence.
An attempt at unity.
No society is in total, complete unity.
You can survive without society influence if you choose but it is a very different life.
A society in perfect unity is evidence of total, complete brainwashing.
A compliance of the many to the will of the few.
Most people can't or won't see this but some do.

How much of this is still democratic when a large group thinks and chooses and then gets excluded and robbed of their freedom?
Why can't you even open up to see the other side of it all? Even to entertain the possibility of you having had the wool pulled over your eyes?
How can you agree with loads of people that will be robbed of their freedom? How is THAT democracy? How is THAT not selfish?
Comparing this to drinking and driving is like comparing tomatoes and cheese. it makes no sense whatsoever.

You now call lots of people -including me- selfish? Do you feel that's right, only because I exercise my right of freedom and my right to choose?
Anne Frank was one Jew, 6 million were murdered.
Would you agree if the people who choose to remain natural would be put in camps?
How far does your conviction go and how far would you be willing to go to condemn other people who have a different belief -which should be their right if it was truly a democracy.
Would you be fine if I was confined to my home for the rest of my life? Or put in a camp, forced to do labour work, be experimented on, barely given any food? Ridded of my own clothes and belongings, forced to wear camp clothes?
Who are you and others like you to rob me of my democratic rights and the freedom to choose, to live a dignified, human-worthy life?
In a democracy one group of people do NOT have the right to rob other people of their rights and freedom. So how is your conviction congruent with democracy? It is fascistic or communistic.
How have you then not been brainwashed to step out of democratic thinking into fascistic thinking?

Just questions to consider, not to answer.

We're truly not far away from people who chose the vaccine, and the ones who are scared, to condone all this and forcing the other group into a real bad situation.
So... who's selfish here...

I didn’t call anyone selfish for taking or not taking the vaccine. I pointed out that the people I hear say only .08% of the population have died, and then add comments here like “maybe eliminating the weak people is not such a bad idea, or they would have died in a year or two anyway” it’s appalling. And yes, that ideology is selfish. I do not care one way or the other whether a person gets the vaccine or not, I agree, it’s their choice. I resent the tone in all the passive agressive responses here with “8th grade” mentality, etc., I consider myself an intelligent person, and I will just bow out of this discussion as we have a completely different outlook on life and I refuse to get pulled into this extremist thought.

The world must be flat otherwise we would all fall off, you must be an "extremist" if you think it is round. Last time I checked this is the Science and Philosophy section, not the "Politically Correct" section. Things are not always black and white, or what we are told to believe. It takes an open mind to think outside the box that has been formed around us. Science has been a big part of human development, making things up has also been a big part of what makes us human. An "intelligent" person should be more open to different views and understand that they have been programmed to believe what the man wants them to believe. Selfish is one of humans most powerful traits, I see it more and more each day in people. Some know that they are selfish and try to compensate for it, while others are just clueless and therefore unable to open their minds to others. Selfish is keeping Grandma alive while she is in pain and hooked up to machines just because you are afraid to let go of a life. In nature if you take an animal out of a nest and put it back often times the mother will reject or kill it even if there is nothing wrong with it. People forget that people are animals too, but humans have altered much of their natural instinct for better and worse. I really do wish they would teach people in the "8th grade" to think a little deeper into why things are the way they are, and that they are not required to conform to everything their elders have taught them. Things like religion should be chosen by the user, not passed down by each generation. The problem with the pandemic is so much of it needed to be rushed thru without any science involved. The "experts" had maybe 2 or 3 months getting to know the virus. Would you want me operating on you after 2 or 3 months of studying it? Do masks really make things better? Or worse? Maybe the stop the occasional bodily guild from coming into contact? Or maybe touching the mask makes it easier to transmit? Or maybe breathing the same warm air helps incubate the virus? The data is not out there. What are the long term affects of the vaccines? How long will the vaccine last? What about mutated viruses? There is so much that is just a guess and yet the high up politicians took control often disagreeing with other politicians and waving their magic wand like a dictator. Every time you get into a car you have a risk of dying, yet billions of people do it everyday. Everything in life has its risks, and sooner or later everyone of us will die from something.

I agree with much of what you have said. My issue is that I don’t believe the pandemic is
worldwide facism as someone said or that we are all walking around like some brainwashed
zombies unable to still think for ourselves and we will all be living under a dictatorship. We
have people still alive today that fought against facism and if it came to that, we’d do it again.

I think you’ll like this video Sparkle. It is on topic and timely.

https://youtu.be/fdzW-S8MwbI

"Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it" George Santayana

http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2021/may/07/the-criminalization-of-dissent/

This article is Sad, more and more like 1984. I hope the Germans show that they have learned from the past.

I think most people do not realize these so called "bad" things have changed and formed the world to what it is. The technology developed in the second world war makes it possible for all of us communicate on here. There were so many things that came out of that time, and other things that resulted because of it. Just imagine if the pilgrims would not have come to America wiping out most of the indigenous people both thru disease and the killing of them. America has been a huge factor in changing the world for better and worse and it started by others going there and claiming the land. Of it was not for slavery the United States would not have formed the way it has. 90% of black people in the US would not even exist if it was not for slavery, and our food, music, over all culture would be way different. Clearly we can't predict what direction things would have went had certain events not taken place or if people and the world would be better or worse off. You have to take the good with the bad, its relative like hot and cold, light and dark, up and down. With out good there is no bad. Without bad there is no good. There is much concern about invasive species, on of the most recent is murder hornets that kill honey bee colonies. Corona Virus is also an invasive species doing much damage. The list is extensive of creatures and plants that have changed ecosystems and peoples way of life. However the most invasive species the world has ever dealt with is the Human. They have caused more destruction then any other, and often they are also the cause of many other invasive species becoming issues. So if we do away with all the "bad" things then do we do away with humans in general and all the destruction they have caused?

Whoever controls the media,
controls the mind.

-Jim Morrison

From https://friendlyatheist.patheos.com/2021/05/11/conspiracist-the-unvaccinated-are-being-treated-just-like-jews-in-the-holocaust/

It' a pity the brain, washing machine never breaks down.

Yeah, if only...

Very interesting and yes, very timely, unfortunately...
Thank you for sharing.

Indeed sad.
And I'm not too sure if the Germans have learned from the past. Much of the EU chit is run by the Germans. They're a powerful nation, and many of their previous powerful people -incl scientists- went to the US and continued their chit there.

Let's just hope that enough people wake up in time to stop what we're painstakingly close to be headed for.

it is hard to disagree with any of your comments..

the concept of open mind should definitely come with the ability of seeing and analysing the bigger picture..

although before sharing my theories i must point out that i found quite controversial the association of nazi ideals listed to support an anti-fascist philosophical community..

my great grand father was a fascist, i grew up listening my father telling stories of how my great grand father multiple times saved our village from some hidden nazi bombs hideouts, and of all the social/economical developments Mussolini brought to the italian country..
it is well thought in history books how the choice Mussolini made to associate with Hitler has been made based upon the protection of his people, who would have otherwise faced destruction from the german hands, and not a choice based upon shared beliefs..

fascism was a dictatorship, yes, but unlike nazism, not all dictatorships are ruled by violence and punishment for those who disagree..

that brings me to elaborate on the fact that most religions, political parties, governmental authorities, and any other organisations (declared or secret) all share some common goals and values of a greater well being for the humans..

they only differ in methods (hence being the subject of discussions and disapprovals) and various degrees of fanaticism that more often than not, alters the original purpose for what the partition was created..

i personally agree with the concept of utter freewill, but we all are just humans, we all are very limited in our knowledge and comprehension, we enjoy believing we are more intelligent or more worthy than other species and we also instinctively like to believe that the way we think is better than other members of our own specie..

but what if we only know what we know, and there's still so much we don't know yet?
u know what comes next ;)

we all have a cellphone, a car, and use electricity, but how many of us really know how 2 build this stuff?

what if those who control our society and us in it, possess a valid reason 4 doing so?
what if it wasn't a secret that yes, we're destroying ourselves, yes we're destroying our mother planet and yes we don't deserve freewill if continuing using our freewill today means that future generations will have to seek a living on another planet because we spoiled theirs..

we don't always know better, we can only do our best to try n understand others, because they might have answers we don't have yet..

Cause and Effect

We exist in a Universe which is subjected to cause and effect at all scales.
This cause and effect ripples out in layers and waves.
The effect we experience at any given moment is a result of cause which may have happened in the distant past which has nothing to do with the effect we're currently experiencing.

Some stuff in the moment happens immediately from cause creating an effect which is clearly recognized. However, there's no way to be absolutely sure that cause is not a result of a past effect.

There's also no way we can tell if the cause and effect in the moment is going to cause an effect in the distant future. Its possible to 'set in motion' a determined cause and effect plan. However, aside from goal success, there is no way to predict how the different effects spur additional changes unrelated to the initial goal.

"Steering the Masses" using a 'cause and effect' strategy always results in changes which can't be predicted. This is usually handled by diversion strategies so the masses focus on the goal and not the total change.

It is entirely possible a safeguard system was introduced to the public nearly a century ago when mass media first initialized. Possibly initiated by 'free masons' or another secret society.
Let me explain:

The general public has always had an imagination. During work, minds are focused on the task at hand. At rest, minds are free to wonder.

If, during that period of free time, the mind could be directed to think in certain ways about certain things, it would be possible to focus minds on pre-planned objectives.

Radio, newspapers and magazines are made mainstream.
The masses become addicted to distant NEWS and entertainment from strangers.
The "media' starts to become trusted and anticipated by the masses.
At one time, many people huddled around the radio at night anticipating a show or NEWS broadcast.

Once a condition of mass saturation is reached, along comes television.
Now the idle mind is bombarded by images which support the audio. The masses start bringing televisions into their homes. They huddle around them, eagerly awaiting their next 'fix'.

Meanwhile, the controlling group(s) direct the focus of the masses away from the activities they wish to keep secret and initiate a public mindset in the direction of their current agendas. They do this by dangling sex, greed and power as a carrot.

Then, the personal PC is introduced to the masses. People fill their homes with personal computers. The internet grows and people become addicted to current events in distant places. Virtual wealth takes place, people have wealth without the actual gold.

NEWS broadcasts become opinionated. "Authority" figures are brought in to support the opinions or shoot down opinions not in alignment with the controlling interest.

Mobile personal communication is developed. Wireless internet is developed. Costs come down and those are made available to the masses. People start to become addicted to their phones and electronic devices, their attention is diverted from their immediate surroundings in favor of the immediate gratification offered by their phones.

The focus of the masses is slowly shifted from natural environment awareness to virtual awareness which can be directed and delivered according to the control group's agendas. The 'effect' is shifted from masses to personal.

Plus, this trend is continuing. Look at current personal communications technology. You are directed to the features they want you to use. Sometimes, your customized options are limited to only what a stranger or distant group allows you to have. They 'sell' these control measures as beneficial to you but they have an agenda.

Customize your phone. Send us 'feedback' of what you want and we will give it to you. When you visit a site multiple times, we will make it easier for you to do so. Meanwhile, someone (most likely someone you will never meet or associate yourself with) gains detailed information about you, what you like, what you buy, when you are online, where you look, how long you looked at it and with GPS, where you are at. Cameras are widespread, microphones are everywhere. It is supported under the guise of beneficial and convenient but A stranger knows you, better than you do.

The number of people getting "lost in their phones" is increasing. It effects their daily lives because they are no longer paying attention to their immediate surroundings, they are not looking where they should be looking.

Meanwhile, control groups can divert attention away from where it should be.
Set up a fall guy to cause a conspiracy over there and nobody looks over here where you carry out your agenda strategy.
Not everyone is interested in following a wrongful-death cop shooting story so multiple diversion tactics are initiated at the same time.

People have been programmed to favor immediate gratification. Offer immediate gratification and people will focus on it. Make it cheap and easy and you get higher saturation in the masses.
Just remember...
"If you buy a diamond ring for a dime, you probably have a diamond ring not worth a cent."

It doesn't matter if the media is radio, television, personal PC, a gaming system or a cell phone, The media has become a brainwashing tool used on the masses.
Not till you can 'step away' from those influences can you 'see' the effect they are having. Not only in the masses but in personal lives as well.

As we continue to isolate from others and immediate reality is it 'causing' an 'effect' which will manifest in the future?

Is it all a planned strategy of an unknown controlling group for an unknown, unrealized grand agenda?

How deep is the planned 'cause and effect' strategy?

What might be the ultimate goal?

How unpredictable and widespread are the 'effects'?

The human species is slowly becoming a global mind.
Events in another continent now effect the masses globally.
Cultures and societies are changing to accommodate alien ideals.

Is this the natural way of things or is this a purpose driven agenda?

Cause and effect is a condition of reality within this Universe.
Reality is reality, it doesn't care, doesn't regret and doesn't make allowances.

Thinking cause and effect can be controlled for a predicted outcome is delusion.
There are too many levels of change to predict and control all.
The best that can be hoped for is reaching part of the goal.
The grand strategy must be constantly adjusted to accommodate reality's unknown cause and effect.

These are concepts most people won't take time to consider.
Yet our daily lives are directly 'effected' by them.
We are 'conditioned' to 'brainwashing'.

I here what you're suggesting Tom4Uhere, but i don't believe that the majority of the population doesn't know or doesn't consider how bad is for themselves and for others (especially by giving the bad example to the new generations) to procrastinate and mingle over their materialistic possessions and superfluous lifestyle standards..

no i believe instead that they do know how they are not doing the right thing by letting themselves being manipulated (for it is not a secret that modern depression, anxiety n overall disorders are mainly caused by abusing of the personal investment into procrastination rather than some healthy real living amongst others or the nature)..

people know that smoking is seriously bad, but since the media started telling the truth about the realistic effects on health, the number of smokers hasn't changed much..
similarly everyone knows that society uses and manipulates us into living a standardised life "academic knowledge + academic degree based job + family + socially acceptable lifestyle, properties and mindset" ..

but no one simply care much..
all people care about is the easiest, most comfortable living..

so in the end how much really people are brainwashed and how much they simply choose to give up their soul and will to the highest bidder?