Spider, what is your definition of an independent woman?

Well lacking the ability to perform necessary life skills makes one more dependent on others to get by! When I met my ex he had no idea how to operate a computer, work on a car, or balance a checkbook. It drove me nuts because he needed me for everything.

There are women that may know how to do these things, but prefer to make their man do it for them.

IMO...independent means that you will do those things without asking for your mans help! I can do a tune up on my car, but if I was with a capable man that didn't mind doing it I would allow him to along with the taking out trash & mowing. I'd make him some ice tea and a nice dinner to show my appreciation.

Having said that, I still consider myself independent because I don't actually need a man to accomplish those things and wouldn't ask/beg him to do them for me. If he wanted to, I'd let him! Other than that I would just do them myself.

Your damn right its heart breaking which is why I became independent. I didn't want to end up like her. As for laughing; you seem to think everything is funny so thought you might get a chuckle out of that too.

i know what you mean, for a long time i was a "female hater", because of what i went through in the past, but never gay... now i just realized the hate was directed at women, but really i hated myself for letting things happen the way they did... now neither matter anymore, because i know the truth... no need for hatin, people are just people

I think everyone who is hurt blames the others who hurt them. But if we move forward to the learning stage, we have take our responsibility in the whole situation and sometimes that is as simple as we chose the other person in the first place. Look for the lesson/s and then move on.

You know you are truly over someone when you can heartfully wish them happiness with someone else.

A woman who feels that a man has nothing to offer her. A woman who would choose to have a child without the father's influence. Like Jenny Garp.

Yep, I am friends with all my ex-boyfriends; even the one that hit me but sure am gun shy about giving my heart to anyone.

Maybe it is time for some just you time. I say that because you cannot even attempt a healthy relationship without trust. Well, you can but it will probably fail badly. And it is unfair to a new man to make him overcome all the crimes of the past men.

I learned this the hard way myself.

Oh, I know this which is why I am not looking for a relationship or even dating at this time. You are correct that it wouldn't be fair to any man feeling the way I do.

A woman who feels that a man has nothing to offer her. A woman who would choose to have a child without the father's influence. Like Jenny Garp or Theresa from "Looking for Mr. Goodbar".

Just because a woman chooses to have a child singley doesn't mean that a man has nothing to offer her. She may be ready for a child right now and a man just hasn't made it to the point of marriage with her yet,.

You perceive independent women in a negative light. That is why you are catching flak.

Something tells me, many of us who have been contributing to this thread do not agree with that definition. So yes, it seems as though you've been using a different definition. No wonder you've been replying that way.

I definitely had a different definition of "independent woman" from NavyGirl and that's my fault for not clarifying the definition.

A woman who can take care of herself is the norm to me, so using NavyGirl's idea of an "independent woman", I don't perceive them in a negative light.

But now I'm going to get myself in trouble...Men or women who choose to be single parents (do it intentionally, not because the partner died or abused them, etc) are a blight on society. The majority of teen suicides, teen criminals and adult criminals are the product of a single parent homes. Children need both a mother and a father and they frequently do suffer for lack of both.

I think we have all been saying the same thing; just the ability to do things on our own. It has nothing to do with being or not being with a man or what he has to offer. Lots of independent ladies are with men. I think in a relationship both have lots to offer to each other.

Although I will not agree with the part that will get you into trouble.

I am in agreement that male and female role models are optimal for children no matter who they are being raised by. They do need to see both sexes in action, taking care of the children and doing all the responsible life actions that will give the good examples. Seeing loving responsible people around them is so very important but s single mother can do this if she has close family and friends without having to have a boyfriend or husband.

Clarification is needed also on your data. Most of the criminals have addicted and/or dysfunctional, single mothers who have a lack of family and friend support for raising the children.

Criminals do come from two parent homes too. So not to stigmatize single parents.

I think he was confusing independent women with man haters, which is not what any of us were talking about.

http://www.civitas.org.uk/pubs/experiments.php
Lone mothers
-----Are poorer
-----Are more likely to suffer from stress, depression, and other emotional and psychological problems
-----Have more health problems
-----May have more problems interacting with their children
Non-resident biological fathers
-----Are at risk of losing contact with their children
-----Are more likely to have health problems and engage in high-risk behaviour
Children living without their biological fathers
-----Are more likely to live in poverty and deprivation
-----Have more trouble in school
-----Tend to have more trouble getting along with others
-----Have higher risk of health problems
-----Are at greater risk of suffering physical, emotional, or sexual abuse.
-----Are more likely to run away from home
Teenagers living without their biological fathers
-----Are more likely to experience problems with sexual health
-----Are more likely to become teenage parents
-----Are more likely to offend
-----Are more likely to smoke
-----Are more likely to drink alcohol
-----Are more likely to take drugs
-----Are more likely to play truant from school
-----Are more likely to be excluded from school
-----Are more likely to leave school at 16
-----Are more likely to have adjustment problems
Young adults who grew up not living with their biological fathers
-----Are less likely to attain qualifications
-----Are more likely to experience unemployment
-----Are more likely to have low incomes
-----Are more likely be on income support
-----Are more likely to experience homelessness
-----Are more likely to be caught offending and go to jail
-----Are more likely to suffer from long term emotional and psychological problems
-----Are more likely to develop health problems
-----Tend to enter partnerships earlier and more often as a cohabitation
-----Are more likely to divorce or dissolve their cohabiting unions
-----Are more likely to have children outside marriage or outside any partnership

Dragoness,

You seem to think that I said that all criminals, etc come from single parent homes. If you look at my post, I said "THE MAJORITY OF...", not all. I'm talking statistics here, not my opinion. If you want to look at the statistics and still feel that there isn't an issue with single parents, then that's your right.

This is just one source, there are plenty more on the internet and all show that while single parent homes can and do produce normal healthy children, they also frequently produce very troubled children.



Edit: The formatting on here sucks, sorry. Just follow the link and it will be easier to read.

"Children raised within their parents unhappy marriage, suffer more damage than children of divorce"