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Topic: The Anti-Bush Nobel Peace Prize
no photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:44 PM


Good, that means Obama gets to believe differently as well.


Yes he can. However as president I would hold him to a slightly higher standard than everyone else. As I pointed out it is within our countries "regulations" that everyone should do this if the flag is present. It would seem inappropriate for our president to refuse to follow this whether he has to or not.



Ahhhhhhh thank you! Well said.

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:46 PM

I don't know why I'm posting this because some of you wont read it. How do I know this ? because I've posted several portions of it and it was just ignored. But what the heck I'll do it. Some might appreciate it.

http://www.usflag.org/flagetiquette.html

Flag Etiquette
STANDARDS of RESPECT
The Flag Code, which formalizes and unifies the traditional ways in which we give respect to the flag, also contains specific instructions on how the flag is not to be used. They are:

The flag should never be dipped to any person or thing. It is flown upside down only as a distress signal.
The flag should not be used as a drapery, or for covering a speakers desk, draping a platform, or for any decoration in general. Bunting of blue, white and red stripes is available for these purposes. The blue stripe of the bunting should be on the top.
The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use. Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.
The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.
The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.
When the flag is lowered, no part of it should touch the ground or any other object; it should be received by waiting hands and arms. To store the flag it should be folded neatly and ceremoniously.

The flag should be cleaned and mended when necessary.

When a flag is so worn it is no longer fit to serve as a symbol of our country, it should be destroyed by burning in a dignified manner.



Note: Most American Legion Posts regularly conduct a dignified flag burning ceremony, often on Flag Day, June 14th. Many Cub Scout Packs, Boy Scout Troops, and Girl Scout Troops retire flags regularly as well. Contact your local American Legion Hall or Scout Troop to inquire about the availability of this service.





Displaying the Flag Outdoors
When the flag is displayed from a staff projecting from a window, balcony, or a building, the union should be at the peak of the staff unless the flag is at half staff.

When it is displayed from the same flagpole with another flag - of a state, community, society or Scout unit - the flag of the United States must always be at the top except that the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for Navy personnel when conducted by a Naval chaplain on a ship at sea.

When the flag is displayed over a street, it should be hung vertically, with the union to the north or east. If the flag is suspended over a sidewalk, the flag's union should be farthest from the building.

When flown with flags of states, communities, or societies on separate flag poles which are of the same height and in a straight line, the flag of the United States is always placed in the position of honor - to its own right.
..The other flags may be smaller but none may be larger.
..No other flag ever should be placed above it.
..The flag of the United States is always the first flag raised and the last to be lowered.

When flown with the national banner of other countries, each flag must be displayed from a separate pole of the same height. Each flag should be the same size. They should be raised and lowered simultaneously. The flag of one nation may not be displayed above that of another nation.


Raising and Lowering the Flag
The flag should be raised briskly and lowered slowly and ceremoniously. Ordinarily it should be displayed only between sunrise and sunset. It should be illuminated if displayed at night.
The flag of the United States of America is saluted as it is hoisted and lowered. The salute is held until the flag is unsnapped from the halyard or through the last note of music, whichever is the longest.


Displaying the Flag Indoors
When on display, the flag is accorded the place of honor, always positioned to its own right. Place it to the right of the speaker or staging area or sanctuary. Other flags should be to the left.

The flag of the United States of America should be at the center and at the highest point of the group when a number of flags of states, localities, or societies are grouped for display.

When one flag is used with the flag of the United States of America and the staffs are crossed, the flag of the United States is placed on its own right with its staff in front of the other flag.

When displaying the flag against a wall, vertically or horizontally, the flag's union (stars) should be at the top, to the flag's own right, and to the observer's left.


Parading and Saluting the Flag
When carried in a procession, the flag should be to the right of the marchers. When other flags are carried, the flag of the United States may be centered in front of the others or carried to their right. When the flag passes in a procession, or when it is hoisted or lowered, all should face the flag and salute.


The Salute
To salute, all persons come to attention. Those in uniform give the appropriate formal salute. Citizens not in uniform salute by placing their right hand over the heart and men with head cover should remove it and hold it to left shoulder, hand over the heart. Members of organizations in formation salute upon command of the person in charge.

The Pledge of Allegiance and National Anthem
The pledge of allegiance should be rendered by standing at attention, facing the flag, and saluting.
When the national anthem is played or sung, citizens should stand at attention and salute at the first note and hold the salute through the last note. The salute is directed to the flag, if displayed, otherwise to the music.


The Flag in Mourning
To place the flag at half staff, hoist it to the peak for an instant and lower it to a position half way between the top and bottom of the staff. The flag is to be raised again to the peak for a moment before it is lowered. On Memorial Day the flag is displayed at half staff until noon and at full staff from noon to sunset.

The flag is to be flown at half staff in mourning for designated, principal government leaders and upon presidential or gubernatorial order.

When used to cover a casket, the flag should be placed with the union at the head and over the left shoulder. It should not be lowered into the grave.


I read it. All I can say is I have never been fond of ritual made up by people with a vested interest in programing other people. I dont' care what people do with the flag. Some guy somewhere has the flag all over his home, a throw for his couch, etc etc. Why the heck should I be bothered by that? Some one burns a flag, and that ruins me day or my life? Nope...

Atlantis75's photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:46 PM
Edited by Atlantis75 on Mon 10/12/09 04:46 PM


The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


get em tiger drinker

I can sue Jessica Simpson too!




DaveyB's photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:47 PM

The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


Fortunately these are regulations and do not have the force of law, as was shown in the many court cases some years back against flag dishonoring practices.

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:48 PM



The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


get em tiger drinker

I can sue Jessica Simpson too!






I have one similar like hers, gonna sue me too? sad

Atlantis75's photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:49 PM




The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


get em tiger drinker

I can sue Jessica Simpson too!






I have one similar like hers, gonna sue me too? sad


Well, It needs evaluation. I need a picture sent to my email address, you wearing that bikini. bigsmile

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:51 PM





The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


get em tiger drinker

I can sue Jessica Simpson too!






I have one similar like hers, gonna sue me too? sad


Well, It needs evaluation. I need a picture sent to my email address, you wearing that bikini. bigsmile

:laughing: Little chilly right now :laughing:

Atlantis75's photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:56 PM
Edited by Atlantis75 on Mon 10/12/09 04:57 PM



Well, It needs evaluation. I need a picture sent to my email address, you wearing that bikini. bigsmile

:laughing: Little chilly right now :laughing:



You got no easy way out of this. I need to see this, because you might be violating a code here. Wear it in your room and make a picture.

You must understand the seriousness of this issue. shades

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:59 PM











The president is the figurehead for this country so to me the flag is synonymous with him. He represents this country in the exact same line as the flag.



So then if one shows respect to the president they should also show respect towards the flag?


Yea, people do not have to hold their heart when the president is in the room or if the anthem is playing when he is in the room...lol So the same applies for the flag.

But military personel have to salute him and the flag.
So should the president not be held to the same standards seeing he is the commander in chief?


TJ...I agree with you. IMO the presidents should....but people have different opinions ohwell


"I say the pledge and put my hand over my heart for my own reasons. Not everyone has the same reasons as me for doing it or not doing it. as long as people don't try to say I can't do it....I am not bothered by what others do."

Make up your mind Rose.laugh If you are not bothered by what others do then that should include Obama, he too is an american. Because some believe they should preform some ritual doesn't mean everyone has to think so or do so. Are we free in this country or not?

I don't need my president to be a robot, I expect him to be who he is. If he prefers to do it sometimes or no times, that's him. Just as it is TJ to do as he thinks is right for him. And for me to not do it at all.


he is also the commander in chief and the leader of the country, but I didn't say he should be forced to or thrown in jail for not doing it. yes I hold certain people more accountable for certain things. never said to get him out of office because he choses not to do it or to do it.

I never said anyone HAD to do it. should and has to aren't the same. I think he should....but that is my opinion but he (like everyone else) does have the right to chose not to.




So you hold him accountable to what? To do something because you think it's proper? Just want to clarify..


yes...just like other etiquettes. but I also stated that not everyone has the same opinion and I have my own reasons behind my opinion

I"m not forcing anyone to believe as me. I am stating MY opinion and acknowledging that others believe different

I'm not saying others are wrong for their opinions...I'm saying I don't agree


Good, that means Obama gets to believe differently as well.



ummmm I think I have said that, didn't I???? do you think I'm wrong or just disagree?


Yes I did, then you said you thought that presidents should. so that is why I asked for clarification. Seem contradictory.

I really don't care though, one is free to be contradictory as well. :smile:

TJN's photo
Mon 10/12/09 04:59 PM


The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


Fortunately these are regulations and do not have the force of law, as was shown in the many court cases some years back against flag dishonoring practices.



Your right but isnt Obama the commander in chief? The highest in the military? So should he not held to the same standards of our military's protocol on this subject?

DaveyB's photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:00 PM
Edited by DaveyB on Mon 10/12/09 05:01 PM

I don't know why I'm posting this because some of you wont read it. How do I know this ? because I've posted several portions of it and it was just ignored. But what the heck I'll do it. Some might appreciate it.

http://www.usflag.org/flagetiquette.html

Flag Etiquette


Note here that all of this is about the flag. And I think we all know about saluting the flag as being "expected". In a sense a case could be made that saluting when a flag is not present could be dishonoring the flag in the same kind of reasoning used by Christians in saying you should not worship an engraved image.

So if a flag was present, and I think it was, based on the fact that everyone else had their hand over their heart, then I agree. (I think of Hillary as being big on protocol so I suspect she would know and assume the appropriate posture)

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:01 PM




Well, It needs evaluation. I need a picture sent to my email address, you wearing that bikini. bigsmile

:laughing: Little chilly right now :laughing:



You got no easy way out of this. I need to see this, because you might be violating a code here. Wear it in your room and make a picture.

You must understand the seriousness of this issue. shades


Uh-oh scared a you
laugh rofl laugh

Don't sue mescared



no photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:02 PM



The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


Fortunately these are regulations and do not have the force of law, as was shown in the many court cases some years back against flag dishonoring practices.



Your right but isnt Obama the commander in chief? The highest in the military? So should he not held to the same standards of our military's protocol on this subject?


Why do you keep repeating the same question over and over?

yellowrose10's photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:03 PM












The president is the figurehead for this country so to me the flag is synonymous with him. He represents this country in the exact same line as the flag.



So then if one shows respect to the president they should also show respect towards the flag?


Yea, people do not have to hold their heart when the president is in the room or if the anthem is playing when he is in the room...lol So the same applies for the flag.

But military personel have to salute him and the flag.
So should the president not be held to the same standards seeing he is the commander in chief?


TJ...I agree with you. IMO the presidents should....but people have different opinions ohwell


"I say the pledge and put my hand over my heart for my own reasons. Not everyone has the same reasons as me for doing it or not doing it. as long as people don't try to say I can't do it....I am not bothered by what others do."

Make up your mind Rose.laugh If you are not bothered by what others do then that should include Obama, he too is an american. Because some believe they should preform some ritual doesn't mean everyone has to think so or do so. Are we free in this country or not?

I don't need my president to be a robot, I expect him to be who he is. If he prefers to do it sometimes or no times, that's him. Just as it is TJ to do as he thinks is right for him. And for me to not do it at all.


he is also the commander in chief and the leader of the country, but I didn't say he should be forced to or thrown in jail for not doing it. yes I hold certain people more accountable for certain things. never said to get him out of office because he choses not to do it or to do it.

I never said anyone HAD to do it. should and has to aren't the same. I think he should....but that is my opinion but he (like everyone else) does have the right to chose not to.




So you hold him accountable to what? To do something because you think it's proper? Just want to clarify..


yes...just like other etiquettes. but I also stated that not everyone has the same opinion and I have my own reasons behind my opinion

I"m not forcing anyone to believe as me. I am stating MY opinion and acknowledging that others believe different

I'm not saying others are wrong for their opinions...I'm saying I don't agree


Good, that means Obama gets to believe differently as well.



ummmm I think I have said that, didn't I???? do you think I'm wrong or just disagree?


Yes I did, then you said you thought that presidents should. so that is why I asked for clarification. Seem contradictory.

I really don't care though, one is free to be contradictory as well. :smile:


the first post that you quoted me on was not referring to BHO or any other president. I didn't even realize he got brought up until after I posted that. I was referring to every day citizens

you assumed I was referring to one thing when I wasn't. could have cleared this up earlier I guess huh?

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:03 PM


I don't know why I'm posting this because some of you wont read it. How do I know this ? because I've posted several portions of it and it was just ignored. But what the heck I'll do it. Some might appreciate it.

http://www.usflag.org/flagetiquette.html

Flag Etiquette


Note here that all of this is about the flag. And I think we all know about saluting the flag as being "expected". In a sense a case could be made that saluting when a flag is not present could be dishonoring the flag in the same kind of reasoning used by Christians in saying you should not worship an engraved image.

So if a flag was present, and I think it was, based on the fact that everyone else had their hand over their heart, then I agree. (I think of Hillary as being big on protocol so I suspect she would know and assume the appropriate posture)


That would appear to be the situation unless the others just felt like saluting the air, which is highly unlikely.

Atlantis75's photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:05 PM
Edited by Atlantis75 on Mon 10/12/09 05:21 PM





Well, It needs evaluation. I need a picture sent to my email address, you wearing that bikini. bigsmile

:laughing: Little chilly right now :laughing:



You got no easy way out of this. I need to see this, because you might be violating a code here. Wear it in your room and make a picture.

You must understand the seriousness of this issue. shades


Uh-oh scared a you
laugh rofl laugh

Don't sue mescared


Not even your pretty smile can save you here lady...

smile2

TJN's photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:06 PM




The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


Fortunately these are regulations and do not have the force of law, as was shown in the many court cases some years back against flag dishonoring practices.



Your right but isnt Obama the commander in chief? The highest in the military? So should he not held to the same standards of our military's protocol on this subject?


Why do you keep repeating the same question over and over?

frustrated because no one has answered it!

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:06 PM



The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use.

Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard
The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, fireman, policeman and members of patriotic organizations.


The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.


I can probably sue half of the internet retailers, walmart, village fairs and other shopping centers, going by those rules.


Fortunately these are regulations and do not have the force of law, as was shown in the many court cases some years back against flag dishonoring practices.



Your right but isnt Obama the commander in chief? The highest in the military? So should he not held to the same standards of our military's protocol on this subject?


One would think that his standards should the same or even higher since he is the commander in chief.

Some standards are higher than others:wink:

no photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:07 PM





Doesn't military have to salute while in uniform? The President is not in uniform..

The Salute
To salute, all persons come to attention. Those in uniform give the appropriate formal salute. Citizens not in uniform salute by placing their right hand over the heart and men with head cover should remove it and hold it to left shoulder, hand over the heart. Members of organizations in formation salute upon command of the person in charge.


Wow TJ, I give you credit for trying, but something so simple can be so complicated to others.
:thumbsup:


Not complicated at all. Don't tell others what they should and should not do. Simple! You want to follow, go ahead, who's stopping you. It's a free country last I heard. Nothing complicated about being free to express yourself as you see fit.


Well the so called commander in chief should be held accountable for a lot of things INCLUDING respect. Yes, it's a free Country and that gives us the right to expect the so called president to respect the very men and women that sacrifice so much more than any one of us has or ever will. I don't expect anything from you or anyone that doesn't voice my opinions as you don't me. You're right it's not complicated, the president of the United States should respect our military. If they salute him why would it be so difficult for him to salute back. He is no better than us and does not rise above the respect that should be given to our brave men and women. And you don't tell me not to tell others what to do, when it comes to any elected official you're damn straight I expect the most from any one of them. Gee whiz.noway


He IS the commander in chief, and he has shown respect for our military and he has also saluted them.

As for not expecting me or anyone that doesn't voice your opinion? HUH. Sorry that didn't make sense.

I can respect and care for our military with out the pledge or the placing my hand over my heart ritual. And no you can't tell others what they should and should not do, even if you want to. Of course you are free to think it all day long.

DaveyB's photo
Mon 10/12/09 05:10 PM

I read it. All I can say is I have never been fond of ritual made up by people with a vested interest in programing other people. I dont' care what people do with the flag. Some guy somewhere has the flag all over his home, a throw for his couch, etc etc. Why the heck should I be bothered by that? Some one burns a flag, and that ruins me day or my life? Nope...


Nope and you shouldn't have to. But our government asks us to do those things, not required but we are asked to. Don't you think if our government asks us to do something that our president should be willing to do it? Otherwise it's a "do as I say and not as I do" sort of thing and that I have no respect for.

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