blondey,
being poor is no excuse.... the vaccines are free and are given out almost every where. people are actually being paid in some places to get the shots. and I'm willing to bet... there was something else going on if that was their excuse.
and theres no proof that the child would not have gotten sick any way if she had taken the shots. or that the shots them selves may not have killed her. or left other wise debilitated. they have done so with adults.
so you are playing russian roulette either way.
for every story you pull up.. there are thousands more where they had no after effects from getting sick. with out deliberately jabbing them in the arm with a vaccine that could also put them at risk..

chrystal... being poor is no excuse.... the vaccines are free and are given out almost every where. people are actually being paid in some placwes to get the shots.

while in principle, I agree.. the cure the child is given. should not be potentially as dangerous as the illness it's meant to fight. wouldn't you agree on that??
80 % effective, means 20% can still get sick after the shot (not counting break through cases).
with the additional risk. that all of those who received the shot, are now also at risk to have bad side effects from them.
thats an additional risk to the child. just as they were to us adults, that chose to get them. that not taking the vacc. will automatically remove.

this is something parents have the right to consider.

like I said. I'm not willing to tell them they should pick up a gun and point it at their child. then make them pull the trigger. no matter how good the odds are it is empty.
the vaccine is not a harmless cure all. it has proven to have a good potential to harm as well.

.

infant and child vaccs, .. dint realize they fell under the same guide line.

my understanding is you cant give child hood vaccs (measles, mumps, chicken pox) to an infant. they have to reach a certain age, before their bodies can handle them. which is why today, they are generally given prior to a child's first school year.
I also understand infant mortality, is largely based on the first few hours/days of life where complications from being birthed first appear.
in fact, a couple of the biggest first contact risks to infants, you are seeing now, is the growing rate of pre mature births and in vitro drug addiction.. so medical advancements, not vaccines.. are saving more infants lives today.

dont matter, since that was not in your original list any way blondey,
and it still dont change that I'm still here does it?
nor that the covid vaccines have some serious side effects, including deaths.
and the odds still favor school age children that catch covid.to be much less likely to have severe reactions too it(unless they have at least 1 pre existing condition) with an extremely high recovery rate.. then to have a bad one requiring hospitalization in an ICU..
yes, theres always risk with any illness.
whats the stats for adults and children that have came down with bacterial pneumonia from using the same mask for the full school/work day, for days in a row.
or from being forced to wear them while participating in sports?
theres risk just getting out of bed in the morning you can trip putting on your slipper and smack your head on a night stand. not saying it's likely. but it could happen.

lets try this perspective??
if there was 20 pistols on a table 6 shots per cylinder, and only one had a single bullet, the rest of the pistols are empty.
but you dont know which one holds the bullet, or if the hammer will strike it.. would you blindly walk up select one of them, and pull a the trigger.
while pointing it at your child ?
as I said, personally, I would choose not to make any one point any of them in the first place. and let them choose to just do their best to keep their child out of harms way.

no, and I would probably guess not. if I was I'm not aware of it.
I would have to check on if it was still active in the states. was not vaccinated against rabies or typhus either. LOL ;-) this gives a break down in total numbers, percentages and ages. for school age children. for the 20-21 school year.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6939e2.htm

hi blondey,
I had those child hood illnesses you mentioned as a child, rubella almost killed me..
back then, it was a common practice for parents to have us kids play together to catch them if one of us had one.. so, that we would be young enough to fight them off and be more likely not to have the side effects. that we would have , if we got them when we were older.

regarding covid,
the science supports that most children that are otherwise healthy. would have a very slim chance of having a severe reaction to covid .
of the 22% of otherwise healthy cases(no pre existing conditions) of child hood covid, there was a smaller than 1% that showed they were severe or life threatening..
as a medical professional, you should know that more kids are killed by bee stings, or bicycle accedents every year, then have had a severe reaction to covid. and while sad that some babies have died from covid.. I think you are well aware , that number is a miniscule number compared to the houndreds (thousands) of other causes of infant mortality, they are no less tragic, just because their not in the news.

I'm not by any means discounting the fact that any illness or death that might happen is aweful, when kids are concerned. no matter the cause.
but statistically speaking. with covid. the odds here are in their favor.

in regards to the hospitalizations.
a lot of them are being reported/ being investigated as being "non medically necessary", and are just patience being held for observation.
this is reportedly across the board. and not just kids.
the reports state, that because hospitals make most their money by doing elective procedures. (which are currently being prevented) hospitals are admitting covid patients, to fill the empty beds. so they can collect the insurance pay out.
this is not to say there are not some legit cases.
just that it is suggested the numbers have been overly inflated. to push the narrative.

personally, and speaking just for my self, I would be very concerned about the very real side effects that many people have had with the vaccines.
and I would weigh the risk/costs carefully. before forcing my child to take it.
I would not be able, in good conscience, to put my belief, ahead of the parents. suggesting that they should or should not vaccinate their child against covid. and at this point and time I would not force them too. it should be strictly left up to them.

because you gotta love when you get this E-mail from this site:



only to have your P. M.'s ignored, when you contact them to say Hi. ;-)

well there was also that black trans am from the 80's that spent a lot of time in the air( the knight industries two thousand(KITT).

LOL, I'm sure, there were plenty of women that would rather spend time on a boat on the water. then the guy driving it. ;-)

hi Cat,
I dont know how I missed your reply. I went to a local corvette rally. last month. there was a few super rare 65-68 sportsters (road racers) as the guest of honor. I dint have my camera. as usually it's just the same general mix of vettes. so I dint expect to see them there. there was only about 75-100 vettes represented. but it was still a really good show.

blonde in fairness, there are times when I do some ground maintenance as well. but it is not my primary job, and I did specify, that I was talking about the part of my job that required contact with the people living in those properties. so I apologize for my rebuke . that said, when I do have to take care of grounds maintenance. I'm at zero risk, because I am out side. by my self 90% of the time and when I'm not we are well distanced on the property working on different things..
any way I'm sorry, you are correct property maintenance can include some land scape work.

blonde, you need to go back and read what I wrote. you state I never supported wearing proper protection when it is needed, and that is not true.
in fact, I've stated you need to use proper safety gear that will actually protect you multiple times.
I also dint say wearing proper PPE in a covid rich environment was being paranoid, in fact I advised you personally to do so.
I said I was not being paranoid about fallowing reports that says we must wear it at all times. because it is not necessary to do so. while you state I'm in denial based on what you believe to be true. I state I'm fallowing the science I trust. just as your fallowing what you trust.
both points of view are supported..
I say I'm not at risk. because as I said medically I'm not. and I'm more at risk of being accidentally poisoned or electrocuted, then I am catching covid from work.

you state I'm repeating my self, well, so are you.
but you are saying I did not say things ,that I did say.
as well as saying things that I did not say nor imply.

when I stated non M95 masks were next to worthless, you countered my point, with out stating that you also recommend not using them. so I dont know what your personal stance was on non 95 masks other than, you seamed to be at least OK with them.
at any rate, I did not say you did wear paper or clothe masks, I said if they would make you feel safer. then that was your choice, as an example of peoples right to make their own decisions.
whether I agreed with them or not.
just as if you choose to walk down the street in full oxygen equipped bio hazard containment suit, would be your choice. (just dont expect too many others to do it too. ;-) )
I see a few people walking around wearing a mask out side, just walking by them selves (usually the blue paper ones). I have no problem with them choosing to do so.
my problem comes, when they try to tell me I have to also. because there is no proven data to prove we have to. (but I have also said that before.)
but there are several instances where wearing a mask out doors has put otherwise healthy people in the hospital and actually killed a few through asphyxiation.
they were people like joggers, kids playing sports, cyclists ect.. mainly due to restricted oxygen levels ,caused by moisture build up in the mask preventing proper ventilation. in short they suffocated them selves. to the point of blacking out or worse.

also we just had reports of up to a full third of this states medical staff , mainly nurses, walk off the job, rather than be forced to take any of the vaccines and / or were also fed up with being forced to wear sub standard PPE.
same with law enforcement and fire protection.
they are choosing to walk , rather than give in to government mandates. that stated they had to get vaccinated or not come in to work..
so there are large numbers of health and safety professionals, who are even more reluctant than I am. to fallow the current "guide lines".
this while those positions were all ready short staffed.

I'm not debating fauci, just the information, he and his cronies are putting out.
if your going to wear a full protection as you say, invest in a bio hazard suit. make sure the mask you wear is at least N/NK 95 rated and make sure that you wear the sealed goggles too. because covid can in theory spread through your tear ducts as well.. and an open face shield nor glasses will not block vapors.

I do property maintenance for a living, which means I'm in contact with the people living in those properties. so by my stated possisions on this subject, it has not changed my perspective. but living alone, I dont have to be isolated with any one that has been infected. if I was I would not care though. I'm not at high risk from covid. so if I was exposed and had a break though case, it would be likely to be very minor. and it would just boost my antibody count higher.

but until then, I will fallow the medical science I trust. so far it has not failed me.
and personally I'll continue to live my life just as I have been since before covid existed. and use the same safety measures I normally would during any flu out break.

I actually met the man a few times through Amy Boylan. I loved to just sit and listen to him speak. Carol was a very interesting person. I wish I would have recorded our visits. opportunities lost to hind sight..

as I mentioned before this is not the same report, but it has the same information, this is updated from the original report to still be current for the covid (SRS) virus.
but the counter point is what is politically expedient. so reports like these that goes against the cammand and control. gets buried . but that too, is based on which science you choose to believe. at this point anything fauci says is suspect, he's been caught in too many lies and now under investigation for helping to fund the lab where the virus was reportedly developed..
so I will continue listen to the independent labs studying the virus. that are continuing to get shut up for not falling in line.
and again,
and I'll circle back to my original point that started us on this discussion.
the corona virus is still spread the same as the flu, the flu mysteriously disappeared, even though it was widely said, (especially in the early stages of the virus) that it was extremely difficult to tell them apart.

until the politics and infighting is removed, and the truth is fully disclosed. there will continue to be a debate. and no one will know who for sure who to believe.
but I will lean away from those that are with fauci. his hands are too dirty..

at this point blondie, you are just verifying what I have said about it being transferred just like the flu breath from infected to non infected(airborne) close proximity, in high density. and surface contact.
a large apartment complex where contact is made on multiple common surfaces, spreads the virus to others making the same contact with them. samples of free air have not shown the virus still being viable in an airborne state out side of a close or confined space to be any different then the flu. which is still my original point.
I thought I posted the link showing the 3 hour with a 1 hour half life, I did not save it. this is not the same article but it has the same information.
https://www.acep.org/corona/covid-19-field-guide/home-safety/covid-19-aerosol-and-surface-stability/
this is the CDC explaining what is meant by airborne.
https://www.verywellhealth.com/cdc-covid-19-airborne-transmission-5081242

https://www.pennmedicine.org/updates/blogs/penn-physician-blog/2020/august/airborne-droplet-debate-article

thanks blondie, keep in mind what I said.. sustained airborne viability.
is not the same as not breathing it in and catching it in a confined space.

airborne- in open air floating on air currents the virus is not shown to viably exist, beyond speculation and theory.

it is found in close contact closed environments,
my point was it is transmitted just like the flu with a similar viability of transfer both airborne (breathing) and through surface contact.
the virus has a 3 hour viability with a 1 hour projected half life of infection possibility.
there are no cases shown where there has not been direct contact from a host either by touching a contaminated surface, or being in close proximity to them in a closed environment. there been nothing shown where breathing free air in an open environment has any case proven risk.
what I said about masks is true and born out. no matter what kind of mask option, they have to be properly fitted . but unless it is a M-Kn or N rated mask.. they will offer only minimum protection if any at all.

to clarify they are both spread through the respiratory exchange of fluids through close contact with infected people ( that is droplets and vaper caused by breathing). this is why we are suppose to keep our distance
wash our face and hands often, limit facial contact around the mouth and eyes, keep surfaces wiped down with disinfectant and wear face coverings that are mostly un effective, unless they have an approved rating of M-95 or higher.
many experts have said. if you can detect odors from the surrounding environment a virus such as the flu and covid, can get through as well.
and since the moisture from your breathing collects in that mask, it actually can become a breading ground for a virus. which is why they are not recommended for prolonged use, and recommended that they should be changed often. which most people dont do.
there is no evidence showing that covid-19 remains viable as a sustained airborne disease.