HOW TRUE!!!!

Because sex is a big part of my character, my life would probably simplify greatly if I lost my sex drive. It tends to get me in trouble.

What up?!! I don't know about you guys but I am about sick and tired of the cool and rainy crap out there. When is it gonna warm up?!!

I did give my heart to Santa! Was baptized by snow on a yearly basis (I was very devout being from the north and all). Was "Saved" by the power of presents (I was a very materialistic child). THEN at 8, I found out he was a lie!

Maybe I have more in common with those who once believed in Jesus than I thought!

PERFECT!

Can I get your list of who falls into what "catagory" once you have completed it?

I actually appreciate this Tribo. I am new as well and it does help to have a general idea of what people's general "religious" opinion is when reading their posts. It helps keep things into perspective. For example, I should never expect Abra or JB to give me biblical basis for their being a God. Their well researched and articulate response may or may not give me evidence of a God but it wouldn't be Biblical evidence of a Biblical God because they do not believe in the Bible let alone the Biblical God. If one understands a posters bias up front, the reader can read and respect the posted opinion and HOPEFULLY not be as easily offended.

Anyone who says they are a “Christian” should (in theory) mean that they agree with the Apostle’s Creed. So in my opinion I would say it would be fair to place anyone who believes the following under the label “Christian”.

Apostle's Creed:
I believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Creator of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:
Who was conceived of the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into hell. [See Calvin]
The third day He arose again from the dead.
He ascended into heaven
and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty,
whence He shall come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy *catholic church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and life everlasting.

Where I get a little upset is when I am accused of being a right wing, bible thumping, self righteous, judgmental extremist simply because I call myself “Christian”. THOSE labels I will not wear. Yes I am a Christian that is more right than left and will quote the Bible if it is relevant to the conversion but I am to aware of my own inadequacies to judge others and be self righteous. Yes there are "Christian" who are those things. BUT not all "Christians" are.

Totally agree.

Clouded-I am sorry to hear that you don't have a strong support system readily accessible to you. Can I pray for one for you? The internet is great but it doesn't replace a one on one conversation over coffee followed by a really good hug.

You handled the situation perfectly in my opinion and I am in total agreement with your family and friends. I wonder though, if those who know you and your situation best are in agreement with you, then why do you feel then need to ask the internet world who doesn't? Since I don't know you, and I really don't want to offend you, the act of going to the internet world for affirmation rather than accepting and respecting the opinion of those who love you would make me question your maturity. As I said, I do not mean offend you, I am just trying to point out something this other b!tch might be seeing that might lead her to believe you are immature.

I disagree. This doesn't sound like a quiet, meak, submissive woman to me...

Proverbs 31:10-31
10 Who can find a good wife? For she is worth far more than rubies that make one rich. 11 The heart of her husband trusts in her, and he will never stop getting good things. 12 She does him good and not bad all the days of her life. 13 She looks for wool and flax, and works with willing hands. 14 She is like ships that trade. She brings her food from far away. 15 She rises while it is still night and makes food for all those in her house. She gives work for the young women to do. 16 She gives careful thought to a field and buys it. She plants grape-vines from what she has earned. 17 She makes herself ready with strength, and makes her arms strong. 18 She sees that what she has earned is good. Her lamp does not go out at night. 19 She puts her hands to the wheel to make cloth. 20 She opens her hand to the poor, and holds out her hands to those in need. 21 She is not afraid of the snow for those in her house, for all of them are dressed in red. 22 She makes coverings for herself. Her clothes are linen cloth and purple. 23 Her husband is known in the gates, when he sits among the leaders of the land. 24 She makes linen clothes and sells them. She brings belts to those who trade. 25 Her clothes are strength and honor. She is full of joy about the future. 26 She opens her mouth with wisdom. The teaching of kindness is on her tongue. 27 She looks well to the ways of those in her house, and does not eat the bread of doing nothing. 28 Her children rise up and honor her. Her husband does also, and he praises her, saying: 29 "Many daughters have done well, but you have done better than all of them." 30 Pleasing ways lie and beauty comes to nothing, but a woman who fears the Lord will be praised. 31 Give her the fruit of her hands, and let her works praise her in the gates.

That is soooooooooo COOL!!!!! Thank you for sharing!!!

Not sure how you want to count me. I guess it is a matter of perspective.
Got "saved" then later didn't believe AT ALL.
However, I FIRMLY believe and consider myself a Christian but for now, I am practicing my faith by going to a church. Based on that information, you could put me in or out of that box, your choice. I would say I am NOT with you because even though I have walked away from the church, my beliefs have stayed the same.

It baffles and alarms me as well and unfortunately I believe that it is only going to get worse and worse. (aren't I just a ray of sunshine )That is why I piped in. I have been reading these posts for the last few weeks. I have piped in here and there but for the most part have kept to myself. I find the conversations fascinating but have chosen to keep to myself primarily because I find that most of the conversations turn into Christian bashing. Being a Christian, I am use to that but it REALLY frustrates me when Christians fall into the same trap and sink to the same level and get into bible bashing and self righteous talk. This type of conversation and evangelism, IN MY OPINION, only fuels non-believers fire even more and does NOTHING for the cause of Christ. If I was harsh with you I apologize, it just happens to be a HUGE pet peeve of mine.

I don't find you correcting others misconceptions disrespectful, I find your opinion disrespectful.
Now let's move on to what I interpreted your question to really be....(I of course am going to answer from the Christian perspective...all others are going to have a field day I'm SURE) I would agree that it SEEMS like the core values have gone away but if you think about it, these battles have been going on since the fall of man and those core values will continue to dwindle until the second coming.

This is where you said it. I am aware that you are only stating an opinion. However, I find your opinion offensive. In MY opinion, you are not extending common decenscy nor common courtesy to other people who may not share your religious views. Some of the most wonderful people I have ever met have not been christian and some of the most dispicable people I have met have stood on the pulpit. I think the more appropriate question should have been, "I have noticed that common decensy, common courtesy and honesty have become a lost art. Where, when and how, in your opinion, did the breakdown in these core values happen? Did the MAJORITY of the worlds population ever really have them? Or is this just a battle that the world has been fighting since the beginning of time?"

OK I consider myself to be a christian and this pisses even ME off!!! I do agree with you that common decenscy, common courtesy and honesty have gone on the wayside. HOWEVER, Christians are not the only ones that have these traits. Just like it is not only the Christians that are guilty of making such hypocritical, self righteous, judgemental and idiotic statements like "it seems as if only truely dedicated christians understand these things"

You pose a very good question. This is my theory…

Please indulge me for a moment to talk about mankind; I will get back to the angels.

I like to use the analogy of God as the Father. God is my father very much like my earthly father. My father loves me very much. He raised me in his home and did the best he could to raise me well. He provided a safe place, with a roof over my head, toys to play with and nutritious food to sustain my body. He made sure all of my needs were taken care of and taught me what I needed to know to learn and grow. This could be considered a “heaven”. As a child I was expected to be nothing but a child and to play and grow as children do. However, even though my home was a haven for me to learn, grow and play, there were rules to follow. I had to treat my father with the respect that he deserved. I had to follow his rules and treat him with the respect that he deserves for providing me that haven. If I did not follow his rules there were consequences that I had to pay. Those consequences were not there because he loved me any less but BECAUSE he loved me and knew what was best for me. I didn’t always understand or like his rules but just because I didn’t like his rules, it didn’t make the home he provided me any less of a haven. I was not a perfect child by any means. I was quite rebellious in my teen years. Matter of fact I remember between the ages of 15 and 17 my whole mission in life was to split my parents up and get my father to move out of the house. Why? Because his rules sucked! I wanted to drink and smoke pot and screw my boyfriend and he was getting in my way. I did not see the wisdom in these rules because I was not an adult. I had not lived enough life to know why adults can drink and smoke and screw but I couldn’t. When my father came home and caught me buck naked in his bed drunk and stoned with my boyfriend, he threw me out of his house. That haven would no longer be my home as long as I chose to continue that behavior. I hope that we can agree that these rules were in my best interest at the age of 15. If my father had NOT had these rules, the home he would have provided me would NOT have been a haven. It would not have kept me safe from harm while I was growing and developing into an adult that could make her own informed decisions as an adult.

Now let’s get back to the Angels and Lucifer. God is the Father. Heaven is his house. The same rules applied to them and now us. Lucifer was being a rebellious teenager and his gang of angels was in toe. Lucifer got too big for his britches and big daddy kicked his butt out.

You might ask “If heaven was perfect why would they rebel?”…..Same reason I did. I thought I knew better than my father what was good for me.

“If God created everything and is all powerful why didn’t he create perfect angels and children that would obey or intervene when they wanted to misbehave?”….If God would have wanted robots he WOULD have created them. Instead God wanted his angels (and his children) to REALLY love him. So he gave them free will to choose to love him or not. God didn’t intervene because he gave them free will not because he couldn’t. He wanted them to CHOOSE to be obedient out of love and respect for him and his wisdom and because “he told them so”. They chose not to….so there were consequences for their actions.

“If God is all-knowing then wouldn’t he know the repercussions of his own actions? That Lucifer would rebel and he would have to throw him out of his house and then the battle lines would be drawn??”…Of course he did. God in his infinite wisdom created the bad right along with the good because how can we appreciate good if we don’t know what bad is. If we have never tasted bitter than how can we possibly know what sweet is?

“Why would God put the bad out there and then punish them (us) for choosing it?”….They weren’t cast out the first time they chose to disobey. They were cast out because they refused to STOP disobeying.

If I took the time to research and explain how everything you just said could be viewed completely differently, would it make any difference in your opinion of God? If so, just say the worked and I will take the time to write up a rebuttal and get back to you because it will take a little time. If not...I will save my time and leave you with this. You have a good argument. I respect your opinion, however....completely disagree.

Interesting perspective. Maybe this is just a matter of Bible interpretation....in my experience of reading the Bible, the God is ALL powerful, ALL knowing, ALL loving AND nicer than anyone I have ever met here on earth. Now I haven't met you so it is very possible that you are nicer than anyone I have met but from what I have read of God, if you are nicer than He is...that would be AMAZING. Then again maybe you have done more Bible reading than I have. Where in the Bible does it say that he is NOT these things?