It is not about being "more gooder" is it about deception. People have been deceived about what God says, and what God expects from us. You can look at the arguments in any perspective you want. From my point of view, if I saw you drop your wallet, I would tell you. If people ask about the Sabbath which they have, then I would tell them the truth.

If you find any place in the Bible that says that we no longer need to keep the Sabbath, then I will never post again, and I will stop keeping it.

Art

There was no New Testament for decades. All that time, the people observed what they always had. Changes only came hundreds of years later when the pagan Roman Emperor allied with the Church.

The Sabbath has always been kept by the faithful. Today there are millions of people who are not Jewish who keep this day holy.

Art

There is real meat in this post. I wish I could get something like this on my thread.

Anyway, in prophecy a day is pictured as a thousand years. Thus the Sabbath pictures the last thousand years (the millennium) of a 7 thousand year plan of God. Thus, it's theme is freedom from bondage, healing, peace, prosperity, and rest from all the wars, sickness, and famine that have plagued mankind because we have not followed God's way.

For this reason, Jesus was keeping the Sabbath, but not in the letter, but in the spirit of the Sabbath.

Art

It is not confusing in the Bible. It is confusing because of man's teachings about it.

The Sabbath was so important to God that He included it as one of the ten commandments. It was so important to God that He sent Israel into captivity and they are lost to history to this day because they failed to keep it.

The Sabbath is so important to God that He actually says it is His sign or His mark. Further, the Scriptures speak of a wicked Beast power coming at the end who would have his own mark, or sign. This Beast would change times. The mark of the Beast already exists. It is just not enforced by law just yet. As Daniel writes:

The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces. And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time (Daniel 7:23-25).

So, God thinks it is important. The enemies of God think it is important, but we have been fooled into thinking it is simply a technicality.

Art

Witness do not observe the Sabbath

SDS do not go door to door

Art

Does Any one Know Which Day is the Strongest day?

You will find over time that all the major faiths confess that they know the Sabbath was never changed to Sunday by God. It is a human invention.

Follow this one, and try not to be too embarrassed, pardon the expression,
Art

You are very beautiful Peachie. Did you lose your husband to an illness or accident?

On another level, Why Peachie? Do you believe it because your parents did? Why do you believe it?


Art

The Sabbath and God’s Church

"The gentile Christians observed also the Sabbath." Gieseler’s Church History, Vol. 1, ch. 2, p. 93

"Down even to the fifth century the observance of the Jewish Sabbath was continued in the Christian church." Ancient Christianity Exemplified, Ch. 26, sec. 2, p.527, Lyman Coleman

"The seventh-day Sabbath was... solemnized by Christ, and primitive Christians, till the Laodicean Council did in a manner quite abolish the observations of it." Dissertation on the Lord’s Day, pp. 33, 34

"The ancient Christians were very careful in the observation of Saturday, or the seventh-day... It is plain that the Oriental churches, and the greatest part of the world, observed the Sabbath as a festival... Anthanasius likewise tells us that they held religious assemblies on the Sabbath, not because they were infected with Judaism, but to worship Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath..." Antiquities of the Christian Church, Vol. II, Book XX

The Primitive Christians had a great veneration for the Sabbath, and spent the Day in Devotion and Sermons. And ‘tis not to be doubted but they derived this Practice from the Apostles themselves." A Discourse in Six Dialogues on the Name, Notion, and Observation of the Lord’s Day, p. 189

I understand. It takes one to know one. Well have fun before it is over

Art

Why?


Art

Yes, this is true. They changed to a later part of the month, but the day of the week never changed. The actual change came on a Thursday, and the next day was still Friday.

Regarding this change, wikipedia states:

"In conjunction with the system of months there is a system of weeks. A physical or electronic calendar provides conversion from a given date to the weekday, and shows multiple dates for a given weekday and month. Calculating the day of the week is not very simple, because of the irregularities in the Gregorian system. When the Gregorian calendar was introduced, the week cycle was continued unbroken. So Thursday, 4 October 1582 was followed by Friday 15 October."

Art

The Sabbath Throughout the Bible

The Sabbath was Created at the Beginning

"And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had made; and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it He had rested from all His work which God created and made." (Gen. 2:2-3)

The Sabbath Was Reinstated at Sinai

"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it." (Ex. 20:8-11)

The Purpose of God’s Sabbath

"Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, ‘Verily My Sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord That doth sanctify you. Ye shall keep the Sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: everyone that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. ‘Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord: whosoever doeth any work in the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.’ Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day He rested, and was refreshed." (Ex. 31:13-17)

Note: The word "sign" used in verses 13 and 17 is owth and can be translated "a signal," "a flag," or "a mark." Clearly, it is something that sets God’s people apart from all others.

~ ~ ~

"Moreover also I gave them My Sabbaths, to be a sign between Me and them, that they might know that I am the Lord That sanctify them." (Ezk. 20:12)

~ ~ ~

"I am the Lord your God; walk in My statutes, and keep My judgments, and do them; And hallow My Sabbaths; and they shall be a sign between Me and you, that ye may know that I am the Lord your God." (Ezk. 20:19-20)

~ ~ ~

Israel Polluted the Sabbath and God Punished Them for Their Rebellion

"But the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness: they walked not in My statutes, and they despised My judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and My Sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out My fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them." (Ezk. 20:13)

~ ~ ~

"... they despised My judgments, and walked not in My statutes, but polluted My Sabbaths: for their heart went after their idols." (Ezk. 20:16)

~ ~ ~

"Notwithstanding the children rebelled against Me: they walked not in My statutes, neither kept My judgments to do them, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; they polluted My Sabbaths: then I said, I would pour out My fury upon them, to accomplish My anger against them in the wilderness." (Ezk. 20:21)

~ ~ ~

Note: It is interesting to note that in the book of Revelation, God pours out His wrath in the form of trumpet plagues and vial plagues on those who have the mark of the beast. (Rev. 14:9-10)

~ ~ ~

The Sabbath Will be Kept During the Last Days

"But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day..." (Mt. 24:20)

~ ~ ~

The Sabbath Will be Kept During the Millennium

"And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, saith the Lord." (Isa. 66:23)

~ ~ ~

The Sabbath Was Honored by Jesus Christ

"And they went into Capernaum; and straightway on the Sabbath day He entered into the synagogue, and taught." (Mk 1:21)

~ ~ ~

"And He said unto them, ‘The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the Sabbath.’" (Mk. 2:27-28)

~ ~ ~

"And when the Sabbath day was come, He began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing Him were astonished, saying, "From whence hath this man these things? And what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?" (Mk. 6:2)

~ ~ ~

"And He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up: and, as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up for to read." (Lk 4:16)

~ ~ ~

"And came down to Capernaum, a city of Galilee, and taught them on the Sabbath days. And they were astonished at His doctrine: for His word was with power." (Lk. 4:31-32)

~ ~ ~

"And He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath..." (Lk 13:10)

~ ~ ~

The Sabbath Was Honored by Paul

"But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and sat down." (Acts 13:14)

~ ~ ~

"And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God. And the next Sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God." (Acts 13:42-44)

"And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three Sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures." (Acts 17:2)

The Church expected Gentiles to keep the Sabbath

"Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day (Acts 15:21).

Art

Just which day is the Christian Sabbath? While the vast majority of professing Christians believe Sunday is the new covenant Sabbath, your Bible declares otherwise.

Does it matter which day is kept by those who embrace Christianity and the Bible? Which day did Jesus keep? What about the apostle Paul and the gentile churches he raised up?

To those who believe God changed the Sabbath to Sunday, this booklet will present from the very words of leaders in both the Catholic and Protestant worlds a case for the Biblical Sabbath against which there is no rebuttal.

The following is a compilation of compelling quotes, questions and facts regarding the Sabbath and how many professing Christian denominations came to adopt Sunday as their day of worship. These quotes clearly demonstrate that despite its absence in most churches, the seventh day Sabbath is alive and well in the pages of your Bible.
Consider what the scriptures clearly state about God’s Sabbath as well as what those who reject this command clearly admit. The quotes you are about to read contain both the Biblical injunction regarding the Sabbath as well as the words of various religious communities concerning the Sabbath and Sunday.

I will start a post called Sabbath Confessions

It will be fun

Art

The lunar solar cycle is such that it does get off some over many thousands of years, However, a day is always a day. When the days get shorter or longer during the different parts of the year, it is still a day.

So, you count seven days, keep the Sabbath, count another seven days and keep that Sabbath, and so on until the sun burns out. The seven day cycle is not affected by the relationship of the sun is to the moon. That seven day cycle stands alone, and thus, while lost to God's people when in Egypt, it was restored in exodus 16, and validated by Ezra and Nehemiah in the restoration. It was kept by Christ 2,000 years ago, and we have records back to that time showing that the seven day cycle has never been changed. Thus, the seventh day today is exactly the same seventh day started at creation.

Art

Would you allow someone to attack and kill you or your family, rather than killing them? Would you kill an enemy soldier in war who wanted to kill you? Would you kill someone who was a threat to society?

Could you explain this more?

Art

Hi Miles,

I have a question about the 13. If there were twelve, and Judas was disqualified, then Matthias was chosen and recorded in the Bible, doesn't that make the 12 again? And, if you add Paul and Barnabas, then there are 14.

I have always wondered if Matthias was man's choice, and Paul was God's choice. I see that as a possibility, but the thirteen concept is interesting, but I think flawed.

For example, numerically, 12 is the number of God's government. Thus, the tribe of Levi was not included in the list of the tribes. It was always considered out side the list, and mentioned separately. Thus there were always 12. There were only 12 disciples who were made apostles by Christ and who were called the twelve during his ministry. He said that in the kingdom, the twelve would sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Further, when it comes to that which is permanent, and eternal, there are 12 foundations of the New Jerusalem, and each has the name of one of the apostles. Further, there are 12 gates that have the names of the tribes. There are only 12 thousand from each of the tribes of spiritual Israel in Rev 7, and Levi is one of them because they are all now kings and priests.

So, you get my point. Scripturally, there are twelve, and historically there were thirteen but Levi was not counted then, and only twelve are numbered on the headquarters building for the entire universe.

What do you think?

Art

Yes, this has always been a ploy of those who keep Sunday. They say the Sabbath is of the Jews. By this, they misdirect people.

The Sabbath is from God. He created it, and He commanded its observance. He gave the Sabbath to all 12 tribes of Israel. Because the ten northern tribes changed the Sabbath and Holy days, God sent them into captivity. They have become lost to history, but not to the church Jam 1:1. The Jews were also scattered in 70 Ad, but because they retained the Sabbath, Secular history knows where they are today.

Why is this important? The reason is that the Sabbath is the sign. A sign points to something or identifies it. The Sabbath identifies God's people. Thus, the Sabbath identifies the Jewish people to this very day, and consequently, people think that the Sabbath belongs to them.

In one sense, it does belong to them, but it belongs to Benjamin and Levi too, but they are called Jews by those who do not understand about the different tribes.

The Sabbath now belongs to all those who will choose to obey God because there is neither Jew nor Gentiles when it comes to spiritual Israel, the church.

One day the Sabbath will belong to all mankind, even those on this forum. Speaking of the millennium, God says:

Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

We will be there together one day. I recommend getting a head start, and keeping it now.

Art

I see that now. I am so stupid sometimes. I thought it was at the bottom and was like a quote that lots of people put at the bottom of all their posts. I apologize.



I was completely wrong on every single scenario I imagined about why you asked. I never would have guessed that you still did not understood my comment or that of Miles. He and I both explained to you that the calendar makes absolutely no difference when it comes to the weekly cycle. You can drop the term calendar from any conversations about the Sabbath. It has no bearing. But, you don't seem to believe us, and you don't do the research to find out the truth about calendars and the weekly cycle.



I studied calendar issues for two years, and wrote a small 60 page book on the subject. I do know about the calendar issues.



God's original calendar was 360 days. There were 12 months of exactly 30 days each. We can see this from the account in Noah's time when 5 months were 150 days long. We also see that God's prophetic calendar uses 360, thus, times time and a half , three and 1/2 years, and 42 months all have exactly 1260 days.

Something happened to the earth, perhaps during the flood, or the time the sun went backward, or the long day. Somewhere the axis of the earth has been changed.

Thus, at the time of the Exodus, God gave Moses the Caananite calendar for the purpose of keeping the annual holy days.

Exo 12:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying, This month shall be unto you the beginning of months: it shall be the first month of the year to you.

Thus, Moses was to use a month that already was in existence. Further, the Bible uses the term Abib, the term for the first month in the Caananite calendar, for the first month. Later, when the Jews came out of Babylon, they used the Babylonian calendar, and the term changes to Nisan.

Both of these calendars were luni-solar, taking both moon and sun into account--reconciling the differences. The modern Jewish calendar is far more sophisticated than either of these, however. It is a calculated calendar and was published by Hillel II in the mid 500's.

Hillel's calendar is the one the Jews use today. It is for the purpose of observing the annual holy days, and not the weekly Sabbath. The two are not connected in any way.



You must have said this three times and never understood what our answer was. It is just your feeling that the Sabbaths would not line up. They do line up, and are in NO WAY CONNECTED TO THE CALENDAR. The calendar can change from Roman, to Greek, to Jewish, and the Sabbath never changes.

As an aside, this is only true because the Romans set their weekly cycle to be 7 instead of what had previously been 5. Further, I would like to speculate on this.

The Romans hated the Jews, yet they adopted the Jews seven day week, and that week has continued to this very day. Check your calendar. It is Roman, but still has a 7 day weekly cycle. What is interesting to me, is that I think God intervened to cause them to change to the 7 day weekly cycle that the Jewish people had, even though the Romans hated the Jews. This prevented the problem you think exists, and it made possible the keeping of God's Sabbath throughout the empire that existed then, and western civilization that was yet to come.

I hope you will trust me on this, or do the research yourself so that you understand what you are talking about.

Thanks,

Art