The blood sacrifice is still done today in some cultures, therefore the story that Jesus's sacrifice ended the need for all sacrifices doesn't hold any water ~~ except for people who believe it.
Yes Jeannie, you are right. For those who believe it. Not everyone in the world believes it.

Woo hoo!

eewww ...

Maybe free will is God's will.

Yeah. What good is love if it is forced?

What good is love to someone and found out that they are not the one you fell in love with, just the same face? For example, someone lied to you and later you found out that they were literally a different person? You got played.

You just want to argue with me. Whatever...

Your free will is of God.....


that was just to easy cs

People often put on a different face when they are trying to impress someone.

Here is how to spot a pickup artist so you will avoid being played:

http://spotapua.googlepages.com/

Sounds like a test to me! Why would God bother with this “impression” action at all? Does he not know what the outcome will be?
Another question in this equation: If the impression of God fails, is that also Gods will?
And then there is this; Could the devil have the same impressionistic ability on our free will? With all the decisions we make in a day, how can we know which are ours, Gods or the devils will?
Do believers in all this stuff feel, somehow, relieved of the burden of their decisions?
Or are they somehow divinely guided to always make Gods will primary?




This is so melodramatic I can hardly stand it.
The belief, here, seems to be that we “create” (or can create) the substance of our situations. Paraphrasing here: But we have to this with full awareness. Does that include awareness separate from our selfish desires and aspirations?
In other words, does what we manifest NOT affect others?
If we manifest the physical, does not the affect have the power of negativity to others even as it provides the positive for ourselves?
Would a true God NOT be AWARE of those possible affects and make “free will” choices that would avoid harming others?
Or is it possible that when you manifest you actually ARE aware of all possible affects on others? This being the case I might grant that you are god.




So for those who believe in a monotheistic god are we to presume that god could care less about those whose manifestations have been superseded by another’s?
This only brings up the scenario that Creative constantly brings up. The manifestations of a 35 year old man will obviously hold power over a 7 year old girl. How is this explained in the equation of manifestation and free will and the power of god to “impress”?

So the question remains, is “will” freely our own? How can that be, when god “impresses” and people “manifest” and all the while innocence suffers at the hands of both, while egos continue on a path of self dilusion?

good healthy points Redy.

I like it.

Self governance is something that seems altogether a choice sometimes and not necessarily inherent on all. Perhaps upbringing and childhood traumas hamper self governance more than we all realize.

That whole, abused becomes the abuser thing when left stuffed in the darkness of our minds too long or too severly.

Many friends and acquaintances of my youth never grew out of acting out and being unorthodox in their behavior and their personality escalated them beyond reason.

Most from my youth are a byword now. A third person narrative of case histories that seem like distant hearsay to me anymore.

I have seen some harsh things in my life and mistakenly asumed all to be masking their dark side in life.

I learned otherwise when my life became my own to live and started choosing different friends. The past left and my life was not bound by the things around me.

I just wish more dared to be independent enough to venture away from the traumas of youth at an early age.

This was far before I ever became a spiritual man .

But then, self governance and conscience have always been spiritual to me even more so now.

Oh, how I wish the tenderness of youth could be better nurtured.

I dared to be different with my own children and they have faired well for not being treated like small people without feelings and needs that are not recognized as all so very important to embrace and validate in even the smallest ways. Especially those little things that are borne of the realization that they are needful of safety and security and gentleness and affection and connection.

I best not rant on. I will get emotional over it.

I love children.

Well Wouldee - dare I say, not only are we in agreement, but I would like say that we have actually traveled paths in a similar manner.

Personally, I believe we are ultimately responsible for our own actions, no matter the reasons we make them. Sometimes they come out wrong, sometimes there really is such a thing as a mistake and repentance and if we are fortunate we have the chance to make amends. This is the only "manifestation" I feel worthy of attempting to make in my life.

JESUS said " Are father which art in heaven hollowed be thy name, thy kindom come THY WILL BE DONE in earth as it is in heaven. EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS IS GOD'S WILL. The only way it can't be both is if your will is not the lords will. you have free will to chose to do right or wrong. with GOD or an enenmy of GOD. you chose that. once a slave to the lord your will is whatever HE wants it to be.
SAINT JOE

C.S.;

I have not read all 8 pages of this thread - so forgive me if I've repeated this idea.

In understanding the context of "Free Will", you are correct. You cannot have both. Man does not have "free will" in the sense that God does. We have a free will if we look at the meaning of "will" as the freedom to make a choice, or the process by which we make a decision. However - interpreting "will" as the attempt to cause something to happen by thought - I would say our "freedom" is severely limited in this interpretation, as we lack in the overall knowledge of the potential outcome of the "desire" - which, if not in line with God's "will" has little - if no chance - of success.

Having said that - I believe man has a "freedom of choice" in all matters, which does not effect the outcome of God's will in any way. In this manner, I do not equate "will" with "choice", even though they may share a base definition.

Hey Eljay,

Long time no write...

A specific situation when considered brought up the question, actually. I quoted it below for you...



That question which Abra brought up in a different thread had really sparked the conversation's content...



How are ya? Are finally over that cold that you had been fighting for so long?

The model of Karma and reincarnation provides that all action is repaid in full. Everything is according to the Law. By appearances things may not seem fair, the innocent may seem to suffer but all experience is for the lesson ~~and all mistakes and debts are repaid in full.

How can an incarnated entity find compassion when it has never experienced being a victim? What ever experience it takes to learn the lesson, that is what experience is given by the higher self.

Do we then get to pick our parents also?