Touche

I'm serious this time...

That is understandable.

The bottom line is indeed FAITH.

And the question truly is, "Why would you want to put your faith in such a dismal picture of a God?"

Why would you want to believe on pure faith, that you are at odds with your creator?

Do you feel like you're at odds with your creator?

I don't.

If you do, then maybe this is the religion for you.

Do you want to have faith that God is a male-chauvinist?

I don't.

Do you want to have faith that our creator is appeased by blood sacrifices?

I don't.

Do you want to have faith that our creator just sits back and lets people misunderstand his instructions and do terrible things in his name?

I don't.

Why would I want to believe any of those horrible things on pure faith?

The Bible is a nightmare and the picture it paints of God is not good.

Why would I want to believe in a nightmare on pure faith?

I hear ya!!

See Man Walking in

Relationship and Fellowship

WITH GOD in the Beginning.....


See Sin Entering In.....

See Sin Causing SEPARATION Between Man and God......

See God Sending Us His Son as Our Saviour...Our Redeemer....

See How Believing and Recieving This Beautiful Saviour...JESUS.....

RESTORES Us BACK WITH GOD ??

SEE?

What I see is a mean ass god in the OT and yet you lay no claim to that and attempt to dodge him as being the "Pre-Christian" deity in some capacity. Then the NT and Jesus comes along and you claim thats when the REAL god and Jesus show up. Thats ridiculous. In the OT, it describes the actual creation of the earth. That is the same god. He never swaps out later. If he does, show me that passage please.

Fair is the sunlight,

fair is the moonlight ,

and all the stars in heaven above ;


Jesus shines brighter ,

Jesus shines purer ,

and brings to all the world His love ;


Fair are the meadows,

fair are the woodlands ,

robed in the flowers of blooming spring ;


Jesus is fairer,

Jesus is purer ,

He makes the sorrowing spirit sing .

Beautiful Savior!

Lord of the nations,

Son of God and Son of man ;


Glory and honor,

praise, adoration ,

now and forever more be thine .

Amen.

So Born Agains must reject the OT? Is that the deal?

No, that makes no sense at all.

A God who can't forgive men of their "Sins" unless they commit the ulimate sin of nailing his son to a pole?

No, that makes absolutely no sense at all MorningSong.

What I see is a man who denounced the terrible morals that had been taught in a godforsaken dogma of a crude culture, and they nailed him to a pole because they were indeed a very crude culture just like the Old Testament that THEY WROTE!

The idea that an all-wise, all-powerful God would be appeased by having his son nailed to a pole make no sense to me at all.

A God who would be appeased by such an act is already a demented God.

Why can the Biblical God only solve problems using violence?

That should be a Red Flag right there.

A supposedly all-wise God can't come up with any better solutions?

That certainly doesn't say much for the scope of divine wisdom now does it.

If god was omnipotent he could have just made humans perfect so there would be no need for "saviors" and guilt associations at all but as it is, we are homo sapiens, animals, related to primates. We are not perfect.

I'm sorry MorningSong.

I could never see the crucifixion of someone to pay for my sins as being "Romantic".

Sorry.

The whole idea is that it was supposed to be YOUR FAULT!

In fact, if you don't CONFESS that it's YOUR FAULT, then you aren't accepting the sacrifice at all.

Have you ever done anything that would warrant being crucified?

If not, then how could it be YOUR FAULT?

Trying to romanticize this picture is ludicous.

I mean, I know a lot of people love to romantize this, but please, does it truly make any sense at all to romantize the idea that someone had to be crucified for YOUR SAKE?

If I thought that I was genuinely that guilty about something I'd be sore ashamed of myself. And I certainly wouldn't be trying to romantize it.

The Amalekites were of a more wicked and murderous disposition than the Lamanites.--Alma 43:6

Good to know.

************************************************************************************************************************************************************


http://www.promiseofgod.com/oneday/


************************************************************************************************************************************************************

God DID create man PERFECT....

but man SINNED....

cause God ALSO created man with a FREE WILL ....

to choose right or wrong....

See....God did NOT create man to be a ROBOT...

But Krimsa...Here is the GOOD NEWS...

Believing and Recieving Jesus as Saviour....

RESTORES Man Back with God...

LIKE IT WAS IN THE BEGINNING!!!

See Now?

Why then do Christians use Jesus as an excuse for bigotry and to denounce their brother's spirituality?

Is that the way it was in the Biginning?

If becoming a Christian restores people with God then why are Christians so nasty?

Well, then again, I guess if God is the God of the Old Testament that explains it.

There are different levels of maturity for christians in the spiritual realm....

just as there are different levels of maturity in the natural realm.

Also..

some that claim to be Christians..... might not even be christians at all.

"You shall know them by their fruits."

Well, personally MorningSong, I don't blieve that our creator is appeased by blood sacrifices so I'll pass on the whole mythology.

However, even use seem to recognize that many Christians may not be spiritually sincere.

So that goes along with what I'm saying anyway.

Christian organizations that denounce Gays, denounce the scientific fact of evolution, denounce stem cell research, and denounce non-Christians as being ungodly would all have rotten fruit.

So clearly even if you're right the major Christian organizations and Churches in this country are false Christians who have rotten fruit.

very interesting thread...having been a believer for many years...I always find the thoughts of those of different persuasions enlightening.

I will just say....I believe God was holding up the wings of an airliner on the Hudson River in NY.

I know God is real because I experience his presence daily in my life.

I know that Jesus lives and that I will see all those who I have lost who also beleived, because I cannot accept part of the scriptures as truth and reject part of it. Either God is who he says he is or not. A holy god cannot live in the same place with sin so He provided us a way to be in his presence.

I must turn in for tonight but will check this out again tomorrow.

But, if man sinned, then man was not perfect.