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| Topic: Christian Persecution - an aggresive cancer growing rampantl | |
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Reported the Nashville Tennessean, “Crain said in a letter refusing their request that they had no right to the records given the separation of church and state, as well as constitutional rights to privacy of members whose names are on church rolls.”
Nashville resident Thomas Wesley wasn’t fooled. In a letter to the Tennessean, Wesley noted that Two Rivers hosted a Religious Right rally called “Justice Sunday II” in 2005. Wesley pointed out that speakers at this event “invited the audience to adopt the dangerous belief that scripture should guide Supreme Court decisions, not the rule of law. Thus, the audience’s respect for the importance of church-state separation was diminished.” Observed Wesley, “Ironically, Mr. Sutton’s lawyer has invoked the doctrine of church-state separation as a legal defense to a lawsuit stemming from church members’ alleging financial malfeasance. Cited in an effort to prohibit the disclosure of financial records to the plaintiffs, church-state separation conveniently transforms from a liberal ‘myth’ into a bona fide legal concern. Alas, the reverend resurrects church-state separation from its slandered ruin and asks that it be his legal salvation in his own time of trouble.” The court case is pending. It will be interesting to see if the “mythical” principle of church-state separation comes riding to the ACLJ’s rescue. If so, perhaps Robertson, Sekulow and the whole gang at the ACLJ will stop throwing mud at this great constitutional principle. That would be nice, but I won’t hold my breath. |
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Edited by
Fanta46
on
Sat 05/10/08 12:00 AM
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Interesting!!!
'"700 Club"" 
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Mmkay, let's say that a professor offered extra credits to students who admitted the possibility of a God or Gods, that would be equally disappointing. College, like any school in general, is meant to teach people how to think, not what to think. My two cents. Amen brother, schools can teach about religions, not stick them down peoples throats. |
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Edited by
Rathil_Thads
on
Fri 05/09/08 11:59 PM
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Oh come on Lindyy
Please get off your high horse. It is a philosophy class. There is supposed to be intelligent conversation and debate in such a class. No one is telling her that she can't believe in God and that she can't stay true to her faith. The professor said in the article you linked that "He has also said that to engage in dialogue, you have to at least acknowledge the possibility that God does not exist." And that is true. You have to have an open mind to others opinions to have a debate. I know that is hard for you since I rarely see you open to anyone elses thoughts and really never offer an argument that isn't full of contempt for what others argue. And yes, I already know your response because it's all you seem to repeat so let me get that out of the way for you too.. *Clears throat* LINDYY SAYS: Good sir, you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Gina's rights were oppressed and she was derided for her faith. (Is derided too strong a word?) You need to go back and read my post so that you can truly understand what a horrible thing this is. When will you all stop attacking peoples faith? Lindyy PTL PS. I hope I didn't trample your first amendment rights too much there. Was just trying to save time. and I also did you the favor of making the response a little nicer. |
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The first ammendment also allows you to voice your own opinion, no matter how skewed it is. Lady, you need to be a bit less narrow minded and see things from more than one point of view. Open your eyes!
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Lame, Lame, Lame,
And, talk about taking out of context!!!! Wrong, wrong, wrong. NO ONE, NO ONE has the right to have to admit to anything that one does NOT believe in. Your way of thinking sounds a bit dictatorial. You simply cannot stand the fact that I will NEVER change my stance on Christianity. Plain and simple. Lindyy
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Bump!!
Lindy's version, Gina had PERFECT grades on her Philosophy class assignments - UNTIL SHE TOOK A STAND FOR HER FAITH, IN OPPOSITION TO HER PROFESSOR (emphasis by Lindyy). ========================================================== The articles version, Although Gina maintains a 3.9 overall GPA and did very well on the first few philosophy class assignments, ============================================================= Again Lindy's version, The professor has not only docked her grades - he has also repeatedly derided Gina for her faith. =============================================================== The article (Lindy's link) her grades in the philosophy course dropped significantly after the question of God’s existence and attributes became the focus of class discussion. Gina read the assigned materials and participated in class discussions, presenting traditional philosophical arguments on whether God exists and whether He possesses certain characteristics such as being all-knowing or all-good. =========================================================== No where does it say deride, or say why her grades dropped. The points were for extra credit, The professor stated that he would increase any student’s grade on a previous assignment to a 100 if he or she made the following statement on the course’s online message board: “I am _____________ (put your name here). I am not free because I am determined.” ============================================================== I could suggest that the young woman (Gina) was unable to open her mind and cope with an honest and open discussion regarding a subject she herself brought into the classroom. Of course this would be as wrong as Lindy altering the text of the article. An article of which she makes repeated comparisons to her treatment on here by other posters. Perhaps the young lady and Lindy do in fact have a lot of the same personality traits. The inability to separate fact from fiction and the inability to accept any other opinion than their own. Of course that is just my opinion! |
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This is a repeat post. WRONG, there are many stories like this one that the ACLJ has handled. What's wrong dragon, does this exposure upset you and your liberal ways? If you feel it is a repeat, SO WHAT? Why bother to post other than to spew off your hatred for Christians. http://www.aclj.org/ go read for yourself. Lindyy If there are so many of them why post the same thing twice? I already commented on the other one of the same and had no need to repeat myself. If she had followed the rules to begin with this would not have happened to her. Religion is to be kept out of public institutions because of respect. Not everyone is religious nor are they the same religion as she is. Respect. Keep religion at home where it belongs and there will be no problems. This is true, however flip the coin over and look at it from her viewpoint. SHE has the right to have her beliefs, WITHOUT BEING TOLD HSE IS WRONG FOR THEM OR THAT SHE HAS TO ACCEPT SOMETHIGN THAT IS AGAINST HER BELIEF for the very same reasons that she can not preach christianity. |
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nobody is trying to get you to change your beliefs, just shut up and look at things from other peoples point of view. Unlike your little world, where there is only one way, your way, not everybody you talk to is WRONG. The only person who is WRONG in this thread is you, you are too thick headed to listen, I do not care what your profession is, I don't care about your faith, but when you are telling everyone they are wrong simply because they don't agree with you and your point of view puts you in the wrong, and who are you to tell people how to think?
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Bump!
If you read this enough maybe you'll understand exactly who you are representing!! !!!Hypocrite Alert!!!! http://blog.au.org/2007/09/28/hypocrite-alert-aclj-decides-churchstate-separation-isnt-so-bad-after-all/ Over the years, TV preacher Pat Robertson has said some pretty mean things about the wall of separation between church and state. During a 2002 meeting of the Christian Coalition, for example, Robertson told the crowd, “We have had a distortion imposed on us over the past few years by left-wingers who have fastened themselves into the court system. And we have had a lie foisted on us that there is something embedded in the Constitution called separation of church and state.” Top Robertson attorney Jay Sekulow has echoed these attacks. In a 2004 article, he wrote, “Too often, the ‘separation of church and state’ phrase is allowed to take the place of our actual constitutional provisions.” He called it a “guise” to take away the rights of Christians. It came as quite a surprise, therefore, when attorneys with the American Center for Law and Justice (ACLJ), a legal group Robertson founded, recently tried to employ the separation of church and state in their defense. ACLJ attorneys are representing the Rev. Jerry Sutton of Two Rivers Baptist Church in Nashville. A faction of 54 church members argues that Sutton is authoritarian and that he has misused church funds to pay for personal travel and his daughter’s wedding reception. The dissidents demanded to access to certain church records and were denied. So they went to court. The angry members say a Tennessee law that deals with access to the records of non-profit groups should apply in this case. Here’s where it gets interesting. Larry Crain, senior counsel for the ACLJ, is employing the separation of church and state in Sutton’s defense. |
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The first ammendment also allows you to voice your own opinion, no matter how skewed it is. Lady, you need to be a bit less narrow minded and see things from more than one point of view. Open your eyes! Sir, perhaps YOU NEED TO OPEN YOUR EYES to the fact that Christianity exists. Christianity is my only way of viewing things in life. I approach everything from a Christian perspective. Christian - a follower of Jesus Christ. He is the way, the truth and the light. And I stand firm and solid on HIS word. No one can make me change my mind, no one here on earth is that powerful. All honor, power and glory belong to the Lord God Almighty. Proud to be a Christian - a child of God. Lindyy |
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Christian Persecution - an aggresive cancer growing rampant I would like to object to the title of this thread. First you spelled aggressive wrong. Second, it is an exaggerated statement. When I see Christians being rounded up and having their heads chopped off then I will agree to someone making a statement like this. You are simply stirring up trouble. JB jb that is your opinion, DON'T EVER tread on my constitutional rights - freedom of speech and religion!!!! I will name my threads as I see fit, thank you very much! Yes it is my opinion. I have not tread on any of your rights. I see the title of the thread for what it is. Obviously you keep your head stuck in the sand! There are hundreds of cases like this going on in the US right now. I challenge you to go to the ACLJ site and read what they are doing, what courts they have cases in. JB, you do not get to the U.S. Supreme Court via nonsensical suits. Lindyy  I will agree with you that Colleges do more brain washing than teaching worthwhile things. That's why I never went to college. IMO College is for those who can't create anything on their own and need to have a diploma to get a job. Doctors are indoctrinated into being drug pushers for the Bush Family's drug companies. They crank out doctors now that do little more than prescribe drugs. But Ultimately, I wouldn't depend on the courts to hand down any justice in this or any matter that does not support the agenda of the global elite and their plan for world domination. But that is another subject. If you think you actually have any constitutional rights anymore you don't know much about how this system works since the corporation of the United States went bankrupt, ~~but that's a different subject too. Your head may well be in the sand. In any case, propaganda is permitted in this country, and that is why there is so much of it. Your crusade is a futile endeavor. JB |
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I would think if you are at college ,you would be open to listening to other points of view .doesn't mean you have to agree with them.If the student wanted to hear one point of view she should have gone to Oral roberts University or something.Philosophy is about all points of view not just one religion.Besides the article sounds bias. She was required by the school to take that philospohy class inorder to graduate. So she was being required to listen to something that went against her belief, and she was being told she had to "conform" (lack of a better word) to that teachers particular belief in order to pass. I am sure if it was nto a required course, she would not have taken it. |
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I don't think anyone is asking you to change your beliefs, but you can't in all seriousness expect everyone else to live by them. That is simply not going to happen! When you talk down to people continually, especially to others who don't necessarily believe the same as you do, you have to expect that there will be opposition. Posting subjects like this one where "belief" is the issue and the way it's being presented, it's going to be controversial. Your way isn't the only way. Try to have some understanding. 
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Edited by
Barbus
on
Sat 05/10/08 12:16 AM
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The first ammendment also allows you to voice your own opinion, no matter how skewed it is. Lady, you need to be a bit less narrow minded and see things from more than one point of view. Open your eyes! Sir, perhaps YOU NEED TO OPEN YOUR EYES to the fact that Christianity exists. Christianity is my only way of viewing things in life. I approach everything from a Christian perspective. Christian - a follower of Jesus Christ. He is the way, the truth and the light. And I stand firm and solid on HIS word. No one can make me change my mind, no one here on earth is that powerful. All honor, power and glory belong to the Lord God Almighty. Proud to be a Christian - a child of God. Lindyy So I am wrong for being a Catholic, we follow the same god, don't we? Its just I am not stuck on him as you are, my mind is open to many other things, I too had to sit through a philosophy class, and in my case, my teacher was a Bhuddist, and I heard a lot about her religion, but I was not offended by it, nor was I persicuted for being a Catholic, you are citing a single incident, ooh, one kid out of how many hunderds and thousands that attend college? |
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nobody is trying to get you to change your beliefs, just shut up and look at things from other peoples point of view. Unlike your little world, where there is only one way, your way, not everybody you talk to is WRONG. The only person who is WRONG in this thread is you, you are too thick headed to listen, I do not care what your profession is, I don't care about your faith, but when you are telling everyone they are wrong simply because they don't agree with you and your point of view puts you in the wrong, and who are you to tell people how to think? Shut up? A little bit of audacity on your part, I must say. Ask me if I care what you think of me? Go ahead. AND, dear sir, WHO ARE YOU TO TELL ME HOW TO THINK? TOUCHE!! Lindyy |
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Lame, Lame, Lame, And, talk about taking out of context!!!! Wrong, wrong, wrong. NO ONE, NO ONE has the right to have to admit to anything that one does NOT believe in. Your way of thinking sounds a bit dictatorial. You simply cannot stand the fact that I will NEVER change my stance on Christianity. Plain and simple. Lindyy UGH!! Who is asking you to change your stance on Christianity? Where do you get the things you post sometimes. I really think that you just read posts and have very selective things that you see. I could care less about what you believe and that you will NEVER change your stance. That doesn't mean that you can't have an open mind on the matter. I truly do commend you for being that strong in your beliefs. That is great, good for you. But stop giving grief to others that don't share your opinion. You come in here complaining about the fact that this persons first amendment rights were violated because some professor didn't share her views on religion and how wrong that is and you proceed to try to oppress and degrade any opinions that don't match yours. I don't want you to change what you believe. Have never asked you to once and never will. I would just like to see posts from you that aren't filled with all the extra not needed nonsense like calling people LAME or Obviously you keep your head stuck in the sand or any of the other stuff you add in there. I am as steadfast in what I believe as you are. Nothing you can say to me will ever change what I think or feel and I wouldn't dream of trying. BUT I also keep an open mind to other peoples points of views. It is possible to do both. So please. Never change your stance. I would be disappointed if you do, but at the same time stop degrading the people that don't believe as you do. |
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Gina was posed with the difficult choice of either violating her religious beliefs by publicly declaring, “I am Gina. I am not free because I am determined” or being penalized by failing to receive extra points like her classmates. Although most or all of the rest of the class made the required statement and took the points, Gina chose to adhere to her faith because she could not, in good conscience, make that statement. This was extra credit, and Gina made a choice. She was not penalized, as the story insinuates. She made a free choice, not forced, no points deducted, she just did not receive the bonus points. Not receiving bonus points is not a penalty! If she truly stood by her convictions then this would not even be a question. Sounds to me like she is trying to force her beliefs on the school and the professor.  if a professor is going to offer "extra points" to the class then he (or she) needs to make sure that the manner in which you earn those points does not violate someone elses constitutional rights (freedom of religion in Gina's case). By the professor stating that Gina wouldhave to make a public decleration that went against her religious beliefs (as part of a class that was mandatory for her to take), he violated her freedom of religion. He literally stated "in order to recieve extra points, you have to make a public decleration that my way of thining is correct, and yours isnt". |
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I am not telling anyone how to think, but to slow down and look at both sides of the story, without the blinders of religion on. You keep repeating the same old line again and again, you remind me of my parrot.
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I would think if you are at college ,you would be open to listening to other points of view .doesn't mean you have to agree with them.If the student wanted to hear one point of view she should have gone to Oral roberts University or something.Philosophy is about all points of view not just one religion.Besides the article sounds bias. She was required by the school to take that philospohy class inorder to graduate. So she was being required to listen to something that went against her belief, and she was being told she had to "conform" (lack of a better word) to that teachers particular belief in order to pass. I am sure if it was nto a required course, she would not have taken it. Yeah and Math is a required course for me in school. you better believe if I wasn't forced to take it I wouldn't. But I have to sit there like everyone else and be forced into solving formulas and equations I don't agree with. Or how about the Earth Science course they are making me take. I am going to sit there, suck it up, and get through it. |
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