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| Topic: Does no mean no? | |
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sorry if the truth is hard to read the question was does 'no mean no' and I believe that to be a cliche that harms more than it helps so I am providing the exceptions where it may not exactly mean NO, or at the least, it may not mean no to the person who is meant to receive it anymore than silence would mean no to that person they have to have 'no' communicated in a way they can receive it I cant stand in my home in Vegas and merely say 'dont eat popcorn' to my kid visiting in ohio,,,and expect him not to eat it its as pointless as saying nothing, if the intended recipient has been obstructed from RECEIVING the message,,, ,,,thats all I didn't say the truth was hard to read. I do find it sad that you're making so many excuses, though. And the popcorn example doesn't work if you're comparing it to sex, as when they're having sex, they're together. and people are always hearing each other when they are together right? well, I cant help what people want to believe,,,Im just trying to give advice from someone who has been there,,, |
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I guess what I'm trying to say is that it doesn't sound like you're giving advice. It sounds like you're making excuses for me who for some reason aren't listening, or choosing not to listen. What you're writing makes it sound like you think it's ok if they ignore no/stop/whatever.
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I guess what I'm trying to say is that it doesn't sound like you're giving advice. It sounds like you're making excuses for me who for some reason aren't listening, or choosing not to listen. What you're writing makes it sound like you think it's ok if they ignore no/stop/whatever. thats not what Im saying at all,, sorry if it comes across that way for someone to hear a dissent and not aknowledge it is different thing , from not hearing it at all or from having overwhelming communication that doesnt match the words,,,, in the end, I dont think its alot of words that get people to that point, and I dont think people should be relying on the words to stop it not by themself,,,,ever its a physical thing, becoming aroused initiates with physical communication, dissenting should likewise involve something PHYSICAL,,,, |
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I guess what I'm trying to say is that it doesn't sound like you're giving advice. It sounds like you're making excuses for me who for some reason aren't listening, or choosing not to listen. What you're writing makes it sound like you think it's ok if they ignore no/stop/whatever. thats not what Im saying at all,, sorry if it comes across that way for someone to hear a dissent and not aknowledge it is different thing , from not hearing it at all or from having overwhelming communication that doesnt match the words,,,, in the end, I dont think its alot of words that get people to that point, and I dont think people should be relying on the words to stop it not by themself,,,,ever its a physical thing, becoming aroused initiates with physical communication, dissenting should likewise involve something PHYSICAL,,,, It still doesn't sound like you're giving advice. It sounds like you're making excuses. Perhaps it's just the way you write. |
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probably,, I dont think I can give advice to anyone with their minds made up anyhow
probably noone can,,,, |
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and your partners are never focusing on pleasuring you in return? have you ever heard of tantric sex,,,,,I highly recommend it to anyone looking for a heightened experience I've looked into Tantra. Too much like religion for me. Besides, I find sex pleasurable enough as is. As for a partner focusing on me, sure, I've had that. But, I take more pleasure pleasuring her. I enjoy being in control and teasing her. |
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Big words with the whole thing that there is a huge difference between taking unnecessary risks and ignoring additional factors germane to making a situational judgement. We know Alcohol can and does impair judgement. Likewise in a party situation I can likewise include other drugs into the picture. Also within relationships there are dynamics that when they change so does attitude, behaviors, and communication. Now why is it women who are physically abusive attracted to men who likewise are physically abusive? Some relationships crave the abuse. Like it or not there are facts that many over look. people get involved with each other for all the wrong reasons. A one night stand becomes a fake facade of a relationship that for the moment seems right but later on it isn't? Or maybe that financial security looks good. Too many people paint in shades of black and white what is gray. A dirty fact of life women refuse to get is rape is a reproductive strategy good or bad! Strength still does play into this. Animal nature likewise still does play into this. Right, wrong, or Andy is just a bastard does not matter. Life itself could care less. Rape sucks but if you are so concerned with it train to defend yourself. Strengthen your bodies! Train your minds to be in control of insane situations. Why perpetually live in the victim place? These arguments become "all men are bastard" arguments anyways and then we see a stratification of two kinds of men here, those that will disagree and be civil about it (which at times I barely qualify as Civil but hey, 'bite me, bite you back,' eh) and those who just kiss azz and agree hoping for the sympathy ticket. Andy cannot see life in the terms of human good and evil. There is strategy, maneuvering, and life itself is full of need and one of those is to propagate against some really hostile odds. Life itself changes and operates by some pretty honked up rules that at times are very arbitrary! And there are ways of cheating in life. I didn't make up the rules. I didn't make up a rule book for life. But other people live in some pretend world fabricated to please their senses. You know it is people who make my ability to see good and evil so blurry. Bad side, rape is violence. Good side, it guarantees humanity goes on in the next generation. At least I didn't say, "if rape was bad god would prevent it." Want to discuss some real fake morality there? I think I can speak these words with rather strong conviction, 'control is just an illusion.' In the scope of the world let alone the universe we are only in control of ourselves barely! Are some of you not glad to not be trapped in Blue Meanie land? I sure am NOT! You keep making excuses for rape. There is no excuse. Period. And again you are putting words in my mouth. You think I had anything to do with designing life as we know it? Quit trying to kill the messenger! There is no excuse for intellectual Ignorance either, PERIOD! So now what? Going to hit the dead horse some more? I just make points you don't like or they disagree with your sentimentality. In YOUR mind there is no excuse for rape. Evidently MOTHER NATURE NEVER GOT YOUR MEMO! It clearly MUST serve a purpose otherwise it would have been done away with when Mankind descended from the trees. |
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being 'good' together is about alot more than sex there is an emotional and intellectual connect that makes sex that much more fulfilling ,,,,too many bypass any emotional or intellectual connect Im warning against it so others dont go through preventable situations, or put men in positions to be labeled for life because of a lack of communication,,, sex is not a VERBAL interaction, it is a physical one,, focus on communicating PHYSICALLY, and dont rely on your 'words' to be getting through to an aroused partner,,, What you seem to be doing is finding every little excuse you can think of for why no wouldn't mean no. It just surprises me, since you've said you're a rape survivor and you continue to make excuses for men. sorry if the truth is hard to read the question was does 'no mean no' and I believe that to be a cliche that harms more than it helps so I am providing the exceptions where it may not exactly mean NO, or at the least, it may not mean no to the person who is meant to receive it anymore than silence would mean no to that person they have to have 'no' communicated in a way they can receive it I cant stand in my home in Vegas and merely say 'dont eat popcorn' to my kid visiting in ohio,,,and expect him not to eat it its as pointless as saying nothing, if the intended recipient has been obstructed from RECEIVING the message,,, ,,,thats all And this was a disambiguation from another topic that got locked. No does mean no. But what I am trying to do is increase awareness to how to prevent being raped but NOOOOOOOOOO! Some members here are using my own words to attempt to make it sound like I am justifying rape. I can see that intellectual conversation is above some members, male and female! Likewise I can see passion is categorized as anger. I am not going to agree with anyone just to make points. If there is an honest agreement I have with someone I will make that clear. Some members are Rape Crusaders and I am so opposed to them on so many levels. Honestly some men should have nothing to do with women and the same goes for some women here and elsewhere! I can clearly see some people are SO socially dysfunctional they are ready to grab a rope and hang anyone who disagrees with them. But it is like I said before too, what are the facts behind the crime? And I am going to say thins one more time and I hope some of the other members can read this clearly enough to get what I am saying... If a woman baits a man and suddenly says no and she is raped she got what she deserved! Screw you if the concept of putting yourself in danger seems to go completely above your head! If I had to sit on a jury hearing a rape case you had better bet her conduct plays into the case JUST AS MUCH AS HIS CONDUCT DOES! the difference is, A man who stalks, attacks, and rapes a woman deserves to have the harshest penalties thrown at him. A woman who plays the slut and coerces men into thinking they are going to get some only to have her pull out on him at the last second I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO SYMPATHY FOR AT ALL! he may deserve punishment but for him a slap on the back of the hand is all he should get. At most a few months on jail vs. years! I have come across a few women who like this game and to me a person like this deserves what they get! People with this pattern of behavior make victims out of others just to amuse themselves. They get off on hurting other people. Screw the Psychology! And to compound harming another by leading them on? Again I have so sympathy for stupid people. WHY? DO NOT DANGLE MEAT IN FRONT OF A STARVING DOG AND NOT EXPECT TO GET BITTEN! Rape sucks and rape is wrong but don't expect me to feel ANY sympathy for weakness or stupidity. |
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And again you are putting words in my mouth. You think I had anything to do with designing life as we know it? Quit trying to kill the messenger! There is no excuse for intellectual Ignorance either, PERIOD! So now what? Going to hit the dead horse some more? I just make points you don't like or they disagree with your sentimentality. In YOUR mind there is no excuse for rape. Evidently MOTHER NATURE NEVER GOT YOUR MEMO! It clearly MUST serve a purpose otherwise it would have been done away with when Mankind descended from the trees. Just because certain things happen, it doesn't mean there's a good reason, or excuse for it. I also didn't put words into your mouth. Look at the last paragraph of the post I replied to. You said it again. It's not that I only think there's no excuse for rape. It's that there is no excuse. You may disagree and may think it's justified, but it's illegal and never justified. Making excuses doesn't make that any different. |
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No means no...People who use double talk to claim otherwise should be ashamed...A clear concept of saying no is especially important to teens who often lack the communication and social skills necessary to cope with intimacy...Even though men and women don't always communicate in the same way, having sex with someone who does not want to and does not consent is rape, it is a crime...
Double talk about the meaning of the word no should always be denounced...Yes and no are two of the simplest forms of communication....Saying no leaves zero possibility for miscommunication morally, linguistically, and legally and it does not matter what you are wearing when you say it, what you are doing when you say it, or how you say it, it still means no...My suggestion to anyone, man or woman, who thinks there is any doubt about the meaning of the word NO is don't ever have sex...You just might find yourself trying to redefine the meaning of the word to a judge and jury..... |
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And again you are putting words in my mouth. You think I had anything to do with designing life as we know it? Quit trying to kill the messenger! There is no excuse for intellectual Ignorance either, PERIOD! So now what? Going to hit the dead horse some more? I just make points you don't like or they disagree with your sentimentality. In YOUR mind there is no excuse for rape. Evidently MOTHER NATURE NEVER GOT YOUR MEMO! It clearly MUST serve a purpose otherwise it would have been done away with when Mankind descended from the trees. Just because certain things happen, it doesn't mean there's a good reason, or excuse for it. I also didn't put words into your mouth. Look at the last paragraph of the post I replied to. You said it again. It's not that I only think there's no excuse for rape. It's that there is no excuse. You may disagree and may think it's justified, but it's illegal and never justified. Making excuses doesn't make that any different. So how does one fit a punishment to fit a crime? Like I have been TRYING to say, how can you punish one party for bad behavior when something someone else does puts them in the firing line for violation? First and foremost it is a misconception of men that women like to be "Taken." But strangely the idea of a woman "being swept off of her feet," has been romanticized for YEARS in literature but any English Lit major who especially knows Shakespeare and other literary classics and writers used the term early on to mean "she got in bet right on first sight." "Swept off of her feet and right into a bed." I don't care if you see what I say as an excuse. I see life in hard cold facts. There is what humans make up and what is real. Society is made up. It is an abstract construct. What you see as vice could be anothers' virtue. I am just the Devil's Advocate. Its a tough job. So I should wish the death penalty for a group of men in a biker bar when a slut gets her *** handed to her vs. a woman who is sitting at home and a man comes through the window and takes her by force? I see a problem in that you discount the environment, personal behavior, and others factors to justify a black and white view of something I cannot see in such contrasting terms. Maybe a woman should wear pants instead of a miniskirt at a bar. At least it leaves less room for doubt. But going to a bar with a miniskirt and no panties? That just SCREAMS "EASY MEAT," to most dogs. And in a noisy bar you cannot hear the word NO much like you cannot hear anyone scream in outer space! A punch to the side of the head is a sure fire way of saying no. I have to say the irony here is that at least most whore I do know from my past never complained about being victimized even though they have been. They just get revenge. To them it is an occupational hazard! Others got paid more for it! So hey, am I opening up a dark underbelly here of humanity's own sinful nature??? I stand between the light and the dark. What am I supposed to think? Just because something doesn't fit your aesthetic sense does not mean it has no purpose in life... 
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I really felt that - just once - everybody could agree on an issue.
I really did. No means no. If a girl says no to any sexual activity, regardless of how far into the process you've gone, you must stop, and if you do not stop you are raping her. If you rape a girl and go to prison for having been convicted of that rape, you do not deserve to raped yourself, as this does not undo what has already been done to the girl that got raped in the first place or solve anything at all. Rather, it would most likely further unhinge the emotionally fractured mind of any individual that can't control their sexual impulses. |
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I really felt that - just once - everybody could agree on an issue. I really did. No means no. If a girl says no to any sexual activity, regardless of how far into the process you've gone, you must stop, and if you do not stop you are raping her. If you rape a girl and go to prison for having been convicted of that rape, you do not deserve to raped yourself, as this does not undo what has already been done to the girl that got raped in the first place or solve anything at all. Rather, it would most likely further unhinge the emotionally fractured mind of any individual that can't control their sexual impulses. I'm actually surprised at how many people (not just here) do not think no means no. And I'm even more surprised that someone here is trying to explain and argue for the purpose of rape. |
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No means no...People who use double talk to claim otherwise should be ashamed...A clear concept of saying no is especially important to teens who often lack the communication and social skills necessary to cope with intimacy...Even though men and women don't always communicate in the same way, having sex with someone who does not want to and does not consent is rape, it is a crime... Double talk about the meaning of the word no should always be denounced...Yes and no are two of the simplest forms of communication....Saying no leaves zero possibility for miscommunication morally, linguistically, and legally and it does not matter what you are wearing when you say it, what you are doing when you say it, or how you say it, it still means no...My suggestion to anyone, man or woman, who thinks there is any doubt about the meaning of the word NO is don't ever have sex...You just might find yourself trying to redefine the meaning of the word to a judge and jury..... 
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Edited by
MzMariah
on
Wed 12/26/12 02:13 PM
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I want to know why is it always the woman being accused of being slutty who apparently "deserves" to be raped. And also now, gang raped apparently! What if it were a man, say he went into the same bar, got a little drunk and was perceived as "acting gay" maybe he had some stupid pose which got those drunk rapists all worked up to a lather and they gang raped him with a broomstick? Was he asking for it because he was stupid?
How can he communicate no? |
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And here we are with guys looking for sympathy points and women here who just will not listen... Double Speak? Really?
There is a difference between condoning an action vs. saying, "Put yourself in danger and you get no sympathy." Is it my imagination or are people progressively getting dumber here? A) Devil's Advocate here... B) WHATEVER?!?! C) Does this change human nature? D) How does any of this make anyone a better person? E) Even Little Red Riding Hood was smart enough to not trust the wolf. F) I am not justifying squat but likewise questions I ask are turned into justification. G) If you give a mouse a cookie, he will want a glass of milk. H) People put themselves in messed up situations every day. I) People are not as smart as they pretend they are. J) Crusaders scare me. K) Oppressed people have a bad habit of becoming the oppressors. L) You can tolerate the presence of a Misogynistic faith such as Islam BUT damn if someone shows a lack of sympathy for some damn good reasons and suddenly I AM A MISOGYNIST? M) Some of you women have it off way too easy in the West like in (ESPECIALLY IN) America. N) Like women don't victimize men in other ways... O) this list is getting a little long... And to the person who says I am redefining being Judge and jury, some people here need to take a good long look in a nearby mirror... I hate jury duty becasue of having to ask the hard questions that some people here seem afraid of answering becasue they themselves know in their heart that although rape is wrong if a woman put herself in a position to get raped and she does, how do you evaluate a punishment to fit the crime? Doing wrong and leading to wrong does not make a wrong right. But being a victim from your own stupidity makes you your own worst enemy. Reckless endangerment can apply to a victim if their stupidity led them to get raped. So pardon me if I have not kicked this dead horse enough yet. I want to see if I can make it pop! |
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Well by your terms Little Red Riding Hood did go travelling through the woods, that stupid slut should have known better.
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How does your opinion make you any better than a radical Muslim? Women STILL get raped even when they wear robes from head to toe.
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 What is a Kangaroo Court without Kangaroos? |
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Well by your terms Little Red Riding Hood did go travelling through the woods, that stupid slut should have known better. Little Red didn't get eaten although a nasty stalker was after her... And lucky for her a man was around to deal with the wolf! 
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