Community > Science & Philosophy

Topic: This guy believes that the earth is growing.
mightymoe Joined Sun 11/19/06 Posts: 37362	Sat 09/22/12 02:23 PM Edited by mightymoe on Sat 09/22/12 02:23 PM
I'm just surprised that you "scientists" can't make a simple and better case. What you consider simple has more to do with your own scientific inadequacy than our ability to explain it. Also the information is out on the web, we should not have to sit here and school you on the totality of plate tectonics. You are your worst enemy when it comes to understanding how things actually work. If the orbits of the planets traveling around the sun can change, perhaps grow larger and further away from the sun, then the matter orbiting around the center of the earth, might also be moving slowly away from the core. Everything apparently spins around something else and the galaxies themselves spin and move and expand. The universe, the galaxies, the star systems, the solar systems and the planets, all spin and .... expand? Or does everything spin and expand EXCEPT PLANETS? If so, why would planets be the only things that don't spin and expand? The centripetal force of the earths spin is NOT greater than the gravitational force. (Hint . . . by a huge factor) NEXT! Do you believe you know everything about gravity? Is it gravity that keeps the planets going around the sun? Why don't they just crash into the sun if gravity is greater? Why doesn't the earth cave in if gravity is greater? Are you saying that for the orbits of bodies in space, that sometimes change, the earth's gravity and centripetal force just happen to be perfectly balanced? How would you explain that? Luck? the orbits are balanced, and not by luck... after billions of years, the sun has already sucked most of the debris left over that didn't form the planets. what was left over was the the bodies left by their orbits. there is millions of systems in the universe that planets crash into the sun, we just happen to know ours the best. the proof of this is the gas giant planets can only form in the cold of the outer reaches of a solar system, and they have found a bunch of solar systems with the gas giants very close to the sun of that system. this means they formed in the outer regions, and moved in closer in the billions of years after forming. but none of the orbits are perfect, they all have minute changes in their orbits. even the moon is moving away from the earth at a rate of about 1 inch per year. That is interesting. (But I thought the moon was getting closer. It looks bigger.) no, they put a mirror on the moon on one of the last missions there, and they have been bouncing a laser off of it since, measuring the time it takes to get back to the earth.... thats how they know it is moving away from us... Okay so we have planets that are expanding their orbits, however slightly, and we have a universe that is expanding, however difficult that is to determine, and we have a moon that is gradually moving further away from the earth. But the earth itself, although it is also spinning, and all the matter (atoms) that make up the matter are also spinning, but the earth is NOT expanding. I see..... I guess the earth is very special. Different from all the other objects in the universe. Why? Because apparently the gravity that holds it is exactly equal to the centrifugal force. How verry interesting... i don't know of any other object in the universe that spins so fast it cancels gravity... but i will concede that it could be a possibility, however small, that the molten core could be expanding, the same way the sun does... but we can trace all the continents back for 100's of millions of years and show where they were connected, not by the earth expanding, but by continental drift. In a few million years in the future, they will be connected again... does this mean the earth is getting smaller?

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 09/22/12 03:24 PM Edited by Jeanniebean on Sat 09/22/12 03:29 PM
I'm just surprised that you "scientists" can't make a simple and better case. What you consider simple has more to do with your own scientific inadequacy than our ability to explain it. Also the information is out on the web, we should not have to sit here and school you on the totality of plate tectonics. You are your worst enemy when it comes to understanding how things actually work. If the orbits of the planets traveling around the sun can change, perhaps grow larger and further away from the sun, then the matter orbiting around the center of the earth, might also be moving slowly away from the core. Everything apparently spins around something else and the galaxies themselves spin and move and expand. The universe, the galaxies, the star systems, the solar systems and the planets, all spin and .... expand? Or does everything spin and expand EXCEPT PLANETS? If so, why would planets be the only things that don't spin and expand? The centripetal force of the earths spin is NOT greater than the gravitational force. (Hint . . . by a huge factor) NEXT! Do you believe you know everything about gravity? Is it gravity that keeps the planets going around the sun? Why don't they just crash into the sun if gravity is greater? Why doesn't the earth cave in if gravity is greater? Are you saying that for the orbits of bodies in space, that sometimes change, the earth's gravity and centripetal force just happen to be perfectly balanced? How would you explain that? Luck? the orbits are balanced, and not by luck... after billions of years, the sun has already sucked most of the debris left over that didn't form the planets. what was left over was the the bodies left by their orbits. there is millions of systems in the universe that planets crash into the sun, we just happen to know ours the best. the proof of this is the gas giant planets can only form in the cold of the outer reaches of a solar system, and they have found a bunch of solar systems with the gas giants very close to the sun of that system. this means they formed in the outer regions, and moved in closer in the billions of years after forming. but none of the orbits are perfect, they all have minute changes in their orbits. even the moon is moving away from the earth at a rate of about 1 inch per year. That is interesting. (But I thought the moon was getting closer. It looks bigger.) no, they put a mirror on the moon on one of the last missions there, and they have been bouncing a laser off of it since, measuring the time it takes to get back to the earth.... thats how they know it is moving away from us... Okay so we have planets that are expanding their orbits, however slightly, and we have a universe that is expanding, however difficult that is to determine, and we have a moon that is gradually moving further away from the earth. But the earth itself, although it is also spinning, and all the matter (atoms) that make up the matter are also spinning, but the earth is NOT expanding. I see..... I guess the earth is very special. Different from all the other objects in the universe. Why? Because apparently the gravity that holds it is exactly equal to the centrifugal force. How verry interesting... i don't know of any other object in the universe that spins so fast it cancels gravity... but i will concede that it could be a possibility, however small, that the molten core could be expanding, the same way the sun does... but we can trace all the continents back for 100's of millions of years and show where they were connected, not by the earth expanding, but by continental drift. In a few million years in the future, they will be connected again... does this mean the earth is getting smaller? They were connected "by continental drift?" I thought "drift" meant that they were "drifting." (apart?) So how could that "connect" them? And so you are saying that they will all "drift" back together again? Okay now I am really confused. Once upon a time there was one big continent. It broke apart and drifted apart and eventually, in a few million years in the future it will all drift back together again. Wow. I'm not sure I understand that at all.

mightymoe Joined Sun 11/19/06 Posts: 37362	Sat 09/22/12 04:11 PM
They were connected "by continental drift?" I thought "drift" meant that they were "drifting." (apart?) So how could that "connect" them? thats the theory... drift does not mean "apart", it just means moving... there are parts of it i don't get myself, like how the continents remain whole, and never get swallowed in the rifts, but i have never had anyone explain that to me.. And so you are saying that they will all "drift" back together again? since nobody knows the future, it is just a best guess... Okay now I am really confused. even geologists are confused a bit too...but they do know that the earth is not growing, satellite data confirms this. Once upon a time there was one big continent. It broke apart and drifted apart and eventually, in a few million years in the future it will all drift back together again. Wow. I'm not sure I understand that at all. think of it like ice on water, the fluid motion. the crust sits on a ball of lava, molten rock, but still a fluid. as the lava moves around, because the earths core is spinning, it makes the lava move, and that in turn makes the continents move as well..

metalwing Joined Fri 11/14/08 Posts: 26218	Sat 09/22/12 07:50 PM
They were connected "by continental drift?" I thought "drift" meant that they were "drifting." (apart?) So how could that "connect" them? thats the theory... drift does not mean "apart", it just means moving... there are parts of it i don't get myself, like how the continents remain whole, and never get swallowed in the rifts, but i have never had anyone explain that to me.. And so you are saying that they will all "drift" back together again? since nobody knows the future, it is just a best guess... Okay now I am really confused. even geologists are confused a bit too...but they do know that the earth is not growing, satellite data confirms this. Once upon a time there was one big continent. It broke apart and drifted apart and eventually, in a few million years in the future it will all drift back together again. Wow. I'm not sure I understand that at all. think of it like ice on water, the fluid motion. the crust sits on a ball of lava, molten rock, but still a fluid. as the lava moves around, because the earths core is spinning, it makes the lava move, and that in turn makes the continents move as well.. convection, mostly.

Bushidobillyclub Joined Fri 05/11/07 Posts: 5689	Wed 09/26/12 01:34 PM
JB I am just going to make up numbers here to make it easy. Lets say the force of gravity pulling you toward the center of the earth is 11. Lets say the centripetal force pulling out is 1. 11-1 = 10 Make sense? If not, your hopeless.

Conrad_73 Joined Sat 09/29/07 Posts: 22488	Wed 09/26/12 01:47 PM Edited by Conrad_73 on Wed 09/26/12 02:03 PM
I'm just surprised that you "scientists" can't make a simple and better case. What you consider simple has more to do with your own scientific inadequacy than our ability to explain it. Also the information is out on the web, we should not have to sit here and school you on the totality of plate tectonics. You are your worst enemy when it comes to understanding how things actually work. If the orbits of the planets traveling around the sun can change, perhaps grow larger and further away from the sun, then the matter orbiting around the center of the earth, might also be moving slowly away from the core. Everything apparently spins around something else and the galaxies themselves spin and move and expand. The universe, the galaxies, the star systems, the solar systems and the planets, all spin and .... expand? Or does everything spin and expand EXCEPT PLANETS? If so, why would planets be the only things that don't spin and expand? The centripetal force of the earths spin is NOT greater than the gravitational force. (Hint . . . by a huge factor) NEXT! Do you believe you know everything about gravity? Is it gravity that keeps the planets going around the sun? Why don't they just crash into the sun if gravity is greater? Why doesn't the earth cave in if gravity is greater? Are you saying that for the orbits of bodies in space, that sometimes change, the earth's gravity and centripetal force just happen to be perfectly balanced? How would you explain that? Luck? the orbits are balanced, and not by luck... after billions of years, the sun has already sucked most of the debris left over that didn't form the planets. what was left over was the the bodies left by their orbits. there is millions of systems in the universe that planets crash into the sun, we just happen to know ours the best. the proof of this is the gas giant planets can only form in the cold of the outer reaches of a solar system, and they have found a bunch of solar systems with the gas giants very close to the sun of that system. this means they formed in the outer regions, and moved in closer in the billions of years after forming. but none of the orbits are perfect, they all have minute changes in their orbits. even the moon is moving away from the earth at a rate of about 1 inch per year. That is interesting. (But I thought the moon was getting closer. It looks bigger.) no, they put a mirror on the moon on one of the last missions there, and they have been bouncing a laser off of it since, measuring the time it takes to get back to the earth.... thats how they know it is moving away from us... Okay so we have planets that are expanding their orbits, however slightly, and we have a universe that is expanding, however difficult that is to determine, and we have a moon that is gradually moving further away from the earth. But the earth itself, although it is also spinning, and all the matter (atoms) that make up the matter are also spinning, but the earth is NOT expanding. I see..... I guess the earth is very special. Different from all the other objects in the universe. Why? Because apparently the gravity that holds it is exactly equal to the centrifugal force. How verry interesting... i don't know of any other object in the universe that spins so fast it cancels gravity... but i will concede that it could be a possibility, however small, that the molten core could be expanding, the same way the sun does... but we can trace all the continents back for 100's of millions of years and show where they were connected, not by the earth expanding, but by continental drift. In a few million years in the future, they will be connected again... does this mean the earth is getting smaller? They were connected "by continental drift?" I thought "drift" meant that they were "drifting." (apart?) So how could that "connect" them? And so you are saying that they will all "drift" back together again? Okay now I am really confused. Once upon a time there was one big continent. It broke apart and drifted apart and eventually, in a few million years in the future it will all drift back together again. Wow. I'm not sure I understand that at all. nope,they will never drift back together again,they will just drift! Pangaea is no more!

metalwing Joined Fri 11/14/08 Posts: 26218	Wed 09/26/12 01:49 PM
JB I am just going to make up numbers here to make it easy. Lets say the force of gravity pulling you toward the center of the earth is 11. Lets say the centripetal force pulling out is 1. 11-1 = 10 Make sense? If not, your hopeless. If the centripetal force exceeded the force of gravity, the body would come apart and wouldn't exist anymore. In fact, it wouldn't exist in the first place.

Bushidobillyclub Joined Fri 05/11/07 Posts: 5689	Thu 09/27/12 09:44 AM
JB I am just going to make up numbers here to make it easy. Lets say the force of gravity pulling you toward the center of the earth is 11. Lets say the centripetal force pulling out is 1. 11-1 = 10 Make sense? If not, your hopeless. If the centripetal force exceeded the force of gravity, the body would come apart and wouldn't exist anymore. In fact, it wouldn't exist in the first place. Yes the ramifications would be extreme. My illustration was to show how one force is much greater than the other, and when the lesser force is subtracted it essentially does not exist. Not sure JB can handle basic arithmetic however.