Yep they do.

Now go to bed.

How do we worship a book? We don't bow to the book, we don't pray to the book, we don't do anything to the book but read it.

You tout it as the word of God. You bet your life and your soul that it is the truth. You spend your lives "spreading the word."

You worship it.
You need to realize what worship means. Its not just bowing and praying.

I bet nothing, betting is gambling of the unknown. I know it's the word of God, I know it's the truth. But how does that constitute worshiping the bible?

Here are the definitions of worship, none of which apply to the bible.

1.
a. The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object.
b. The ceremonies, prayers, or other religious forms by which this love is expressed.
2. Ardent devotion; adoration.
3. often Worship Chiefly British Used as a form of address for magistrates, mayors, and certain other dignitaries: Your Worship.
v. wor·shiped or wor·shipped, wor·ship·ing or wor·ship·ping, wor·ships
v.tr.
1. To honor and love as a deity.
2. To regard with ardent or adoring esteem or devotion. See Synonyms at revere1.
v.intr.
1. To participate in religious rites of worship.
2. To perform an act of worship.

And in that case, we definitely don't worship the bible, we neither bow nor pray to the bible.

Exactly and it won't stop. I could post 10 more verses from the bible that are appalling and you will have a "christian" say that is not us. I don't represent this or it is not true...or we (meaning us non believers) don't understand, yet it states clearly in the bible these verses and what they mean and they try hard to go around it. Instead just see it as it is! Horrible insane people at the times dealing with people that they believed to be barbaric and unreasonable just because they don't live or think the same way they do.

We are in the 21st century and it looks like it will take some time before people finally realize that the bible is nothing on how we want our world to be. We want peace, love, and responsibility in keeping our earth healthy and clean. We want to preserve every Earthling and make it safe for everyone.
We don't want tyranny or to have to live in fear because someone says so. Will it happen? Maybe not in our lifetime, but I surely hope so when technology keeps advancing. Today we can send a text message across the world, put up cams and talk to different cultures, and learn other cultures without leaving our house. I prefer to visit the countries, but if you can't afford it reach out through the internet. The more people can do this the more we as a people can accept other lifestyles, cultures, and understandings. Hopefully we can open our minds to other philosophies and understandings and not be limited to one book and one understandings that Christians usually choose to support and teach.

I once talked to a christian about space and he says look into the bible...all the answers are there.

Then I started talking about our planet's natural catastrophes.. and guess what he said the bible tells you why they happen.

Then I talked about the dinosaurs...and he said that god sent them here to test our loyalty and faith to him.

Then I talked about how old the world can be and he said it is RIGHT THERE in the bible .....only 6000 years old!

A tear fell down my face that moment.

Christians as of Muslims and the Jews are all very dangerous people, but we have to stand up to them and show them a new light on how we should see our planet, the universe, life in general, and morales.

We have to try to make them understand that many people have found evidence for a great deal of things. I am not saying scientists have all the answers, but they have discovered many things that prove the bible wrong. Why not look into it and see for yourself. It is fascinating and interesting to see different discoveries in our lifetime.


Anyway yes Jeannie I agree. It is sad and I am sorry you feel this way. I would give you a hug if I was there and tell you it is people like us that can make a difference. One by one if you like.

And if you have no energy find it from your friends and family. It is what they are there for.

Christianity is about RELATIONSHIP.


NOT Religion.


Please....Take time to study the bible BEFORE discussing it .



We NO LONGER live under Mosaic law.



I would LOVE to see a Peaceful exchange on this forum, from now on.



I have shared from the heart...hope it has helped in some way.

But since my time is limited, I must move on now.


In closing....

Here is a message that I think speaks to us all..

Be Blessed now.

.......


......What does the Bible say about the Power of Words........

Answer: Words are not simply sounds caused by air passing through

our larynx. Words have real power. God spoke the world into being

by the power of His words (Hebrews 11:3), and we are in His image in

part because of the power we have with words. Words do more than

convey information. The power of our words can actually destroy

one’s spirit, even stir up hatred and violence. They not only incite

wounds but inflict them directly. Of all the creatures on this

planet, only man has the ability to communicate through the spoken

word. The power to use words is a very unique and powerful gift from

God.

Though it is a gift, our words have the power to destroy and the

power to build up (Proverbs 12:6). The writer of Proverb tells

us: “The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love

it will eat its fruit” (Proverbs 18:21). Are we using words to build

up people or destroy them? Are they filled with hate or love,

bitterness or blessing, complaining or compliments, lust or love,

victory or defeat? Like tools they can be used to help us reach our

goals or to send us spiraling into a deep depression.


Furthermore, our words not only have the power to bring us death or

life in this world, but in the next as well. Jesus said: “But I

tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment

for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will

be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned” (Matthew

12:36-37). Words are so important, that we are going to give an

account of what we say when we stand before the Lord Jesus Christ.



The apostle Paul wrote: “Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of

your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up

according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen”

(Ephesians 4:29). In this passage, Paul is emphasizing the positive

over against the negative. The Greek word translated “unwholesome”

means “rotten” or “foul.” It originally referred to rotten fruit and

vegetables. Being like Christ means we don't use foul, dirty

language. For some reason, many people today think it is macho or

liberating to use vulgar humor, dirty jokes, and foul language, but

this kind of talk has no place in the life of a Christian. Paul

continues: “ . . . but only what is helpful for building others up

according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.”

This is reminiscent of his words to the Colossians: “Let your

conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that

you may know how to answer everyone” (Colossians 4:6; see also

Colossians 3:16).


There is a remarkable parallel between Ephesians 4:25, lying;

Ephesians 4:28, stealing; and Ephesians 4:29, unwholesome talk. In

each case Paul is urging us to be a blessing for those with whom we

have daily contact. Paul is emphasizing that merely refraining from

telling lies, stealing, or unwholesome speech is not enough. The

truth is that Christianity is not a mere “don't” religion. As

followers of Christ we should emulate the example of Jesus whose

words were so filled with grace that the multitudes were amazed

(Luke 4:22).

Jesus reminds us that the words we speak are actually the overflow

of our hearts (Matthew 12:34-35). When one becomes a Christian

there is an expectancy that a change of speech follows because

living for Christ makes a difference in one’s choice of words. The

sinner’s mouth is “full of cursing and bitterness” (Romans 3:14);

but when we turn our lives over to Christ, we gladly confess

that “Jesus is Lord” (Romans 10:9-10). As condemned sinners, our

mouths are silenced before the throne of God (Romans 3:19), but as

believers, our mouths are opened to praise and glorify God (Romans 15:6).


Christians are those whose hearts have been changed by the power of

God, a change which is reflected in our words. Remember, before we

were saved, we lived in spiritual death (Ephesians 2:1-3). Paul

describes those who are dead in sin: “Their throats are open graves”

(Romans 3:13). Our words are full of blessing when the heart is

full of blessing. So if we fill our hearts with the love of Christ,

only truth and purity can come out of our mouths.


Peter tells us: “In your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be

prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the

reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and

respect” (1 Peter 3:1). Let the power of our words be used of God to

manifest the power of our faith. Be prepared to give the reason for

why we love the Lord—at anytime, to anyone. Our words should

demonstrate the power of God’s grace and the indwelling of the Holy

Spirit in our lives. May God enable us to use our words as an

instrument of His love and saving grace.

http://www.gotquestions.org/power-of-words.html


........


God Loves You All.....

So Do I.


Take Care Now.

This.

And let me say something too, in government there are so many laws anymore. Do they all make sense to you? Are they all fair? Are the punishments just? I certainly don't think so.

What makes "God's" laws any different? Because He's some divine authority supposedly, they can't be wrong?

I don't care WHO the laws come from, if they don't make sense the first time, they aren't gonna make sense the 20th time.

If it walks and talks like a duck.........

Ok, we don't now. Wonderful. But HOW can you defend some of the absolutely barbaric things done in the name of God and in the name of Mosaic law in the past?

What we live under now doesn't matter in that sense. You cannot tell me that these "punishments" were the works of a loving God. If that's what you think love is......then I suggest you reexamine the definition of the word, because that is not it.

certainly treason is considered a 'crime' punishable by death,, even if it is merely 'sharing secrets' because of the potential harm it places on others

I dont find it illogical that a people with such a EXTREMELY SIGNIFICANT responsibility(to be chosen) should be held to an extreme expectation to follow the laws given THEM and that blatant disregard for those laws(especially in cases with individuals who have previously been shown favor) would be a similar 'crime'

no need for apology, you are sincere and respectful in my opinion, and IM sure that as much as my experiences create my conclusions about life, so do your own and everyone elses,,,

I appreciate hearing about others experiences, even if our conclusions are different, when they are mature enough to be both sincere and respectful

..so thank YOU

believe it or not, millions who were raised WITH The bible turn out great too(perhaps billions)

its whats inside and for some 'the book' illuminates the good and for others it does not,,,

not everyone needs insulin injections, and for some insulin may actually damage them whereas for others inuslin can save their life

the bible is not for everyone, and what is in it is not only found inside the bible,, people come by their knowledge and wisdom in different ways,,,

But do these laws make sense? If you can show me how they do, than I am more than willing to take them up as legitimate.

Thing is though, it really can't be done. Laws such as: "do no work this day" or "do not wear this or eat that", are controlling and quite petty. That's to say nothing of the punishments that come with them, which are even worse yet.

If you're gonna make a law, you best have a damned good reason for creating it number one as opposed to "do as I say cause I told you to", and two, the punishment for breaking a law should be consistent with the crime.

The old testament laws fail on both of these counts. As such they really don't deserve any consideration as any type of truth.

I doubt I could make it make sense to most non believers because I find that there is a different frame of focus. Namely, it seems to me that most non believers I speak with place the focus and significance on the flesh,,,which makes it quite logical to find death or killing in any case a horrid and illogical thing

for me, the sense comes in trying to imagine(and I can only try)the great responsibility and privilege that accomodated being 'chosen'

its indeed extremely hard to imagine in the modern culture which is SO MUCH MORE excessive, spoiled, gluttonous, and lazy than what was expected in those times,,,when instant gratification , instant answers, instant explanations, instant rewards, etc,,, were probably much less the norm

for me, the sense comes in trying to understand how significant our SOUL/SPIRIT is to the creator than our flesh,, although we are not to abuse the flesh which houses our soul, it is still not MORE imporant to him( I imagine) than our soul.

I imagine this because our flesh has an existence which is a mere drop in the bucket compared to the potential ETERNAL life of our soul/spirit

so though in my mortal flesh, death and destruction of flesh may seem like the worst possible, unexcusable thing for a creator to do

in my faith, I understand that losing our soul forever would be far worse and was avoided on some occasions by protecting them from the world that our FLESHly homes required them to be exposed to and potentially corrupted forever by,,,

but Id bet the house that, as I said, that would not make sense to most non believers

No it wouldn't, and it's for the simple reason, that your God is making the suffering happen while they are still alive. There is nothing you can tell me, that is gonna justify that, nothing.

I understand the soul argument, but it does not justify allowing the flesh to suffer. Why couldn't God come up with a more humane way of taking the souls from the bodies if this was the case? Why did it have to be by say a great flood for example?

how would this be explained to us if it did happen, the bodies being taken from the souls? how do we know they were not?

I dont know that they were or werent , or if the flesh suffered or not, but I believe those times required much more SACRIFICE as a way of life than we can imagine in such technological times when EASINESS Is the goal

perhaps its an unavoidable consequence, like the guy who fell down the whole and had to suffer cutting his hand off to get out alive with the rest of his body,,,


perhaps there was not suffering of the flesh, but as a payment for saving the soul, I would understand the trade,,

Death and killing IS a horrid and illogical thing. There is no way you can diminish that fact.

And we are not "non believers." We believe in God. Don't try to take that away from us. You are not in possession of GOD and you do not own GOD.

It is your doctrine and dogma we reject. It is your alien god we reject. Yes, it is your god who is the false god.

Being 'chosen' to serve what I view as an evil alien posing as god is no privilege. Sorry if this sounds a bit harsh to you, but evil beget evil and the foundation of the Church is 'evil.'



The true source of creation is not after your soul to have as it as its own. Your SOUL IS FREE! It is only the apposing false gods who want your souls.

If the body, and LIFE was not extremely important, we would not be here living in the flesh.



If you ARE your soul, you cannot lose it. You can either be free or you can be in bondage to an alien god.




If I am a non believer, it is your alien god that I do not believe in.

Most Christians worship the Bible as a holy object. If you don't think you do, then good for you.

But you don't represent all Christians so how can you say "we?"

There goes morningsong asking us to read the bible again like a school teacher telling her students to do their homework. lol

Morningsong I tried to help you but it isn't working but I will say it again.

Explore other spiritual practices that are far more logical and peaceful. There is so much out there concerning such practices.

Start with buddhism first. Go ahead and do it!

Now you go on your merry way now. Bye bye. :)

and they often preach it as if it is the only logical source we humans need to live a good and happy life on this planet. I don't see it as positive or logical at all with such verses as slaughter the children, women, and men until nothing is left living in a town.