TexasScoundrel writes:

"So, you believe in creationism? Do you also believe in the talking snake from the garden of Eden? Do you believe Jonah lived in a whale?"

A whale?

A whale? Are you kidding me?

Can you show me the reference in the Bible where it states that Jonah lived in a whale? A whale? That is never mentioned in the Bible.

As Satan can take many forms, including those who walk among us, why wouldn't I believe that? Yes, I believe this did occur. You may think this is foolish, but then again, I am surprised that you felt Jonah lived in a whale, considering you are well read in the Bible.

Never once did it state that Jonah lived in a whale.

Lastly, you cannot merely place one verse out of context. If you are going to quote something, quote the full context. Otherwise, stating one verse does nothing but diminish your credibility.

great fish has become whale,, like fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil has become apple


I know its not in there as whale or apple, but I understand what people refer to when they use those terms,,,,

Ummmm really the Bible does tell us that it will confound scholars, isnt that what has happened, they really have to pull everything apart so it no longer even has a heart, The bible speaks to your heart not your head. God shows you things through his word.
It was written for the troubled and confused, the people who where reaching out to him in faith. Yes these men are highly trained and its great that they believe that they have it worked out.
But truthfully there is nothing that any of us can say that is going to change each others opinions.
I have a simple faith, that I do not want torn apart by overzealous educated baboons. As that is quiet possibly where they believe we came from.

But I want a faith founded on my belief in gods word and what i have seen of him. Not on some mans educated guess, that some other educated person will disprove later.

So maybe everyone can respect each others beliefs and I really hope that you have based your beliefs on what you know to be true, not some other persons belief or educated guess.

If it is from your ownd searching and learnings great, but never take anyones elses belief and make it yours. gods word says tht seek and ye shall find, it doesnt say let others seek and ye shall find. so if you dont search how can you know.
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Msharmony, I was saying that because TexasScoundrel was claiming he was such an expert, and we should never mix up words in the Bible.

Keep in mind that the original post was that I love to read this book.

I do remember

Yeah, that's exactly how I feel when someone brings up creationism in any kind of serious way. I know from this point on reason is out the window and without reason we are reduced to the level of animals.

"Reason is the greatest enemy faith has..."
Martin Luther

By the way, the Hebrew word for whale and fish are one in the same. Therefore, using the term whale is just a accurate to the text as fish.

If reason is the greatest enemy faith has, then you will want to throw evolution out the window.

It takes more faith to believe evolution than it does God or the Bible for that matter.

I agree here. It is more rational to believe that we came from a Creator than to believe in evolution (that we came from an amoeba).

I disagree. I don't see how that's more rational at all.

Think of the odds that it would take to form a human from an amoeba. Now, contrast that against a Creator making us. Which has greater odds of happening?

Hey, at least nobody is going with the Big Bang approach. That is a bit far-fetched, even for nonbelievers.

Do you really want to open this can of worms?

What you say is simply not true. The evidence for evolution is overwhelming and anyone that takes the time to understand it sees this. Evolution has been proven over and over for the past 150 years with almost no change from Darwin's idea. All modern biology is based on it. When genetics was discovered (something Darwin never thought of) it fell into place exactly the way evolution predicted it should.

This is why evolution is taught in public school and creationism isn't. Creationism simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny. It's just poor science.

I'd go so far as to say Darwin has given us the most beautiful, simple and elegant idea in history.

But, this isn't the place to argue the validity of evolution. You should start a thread in the proper forum.

"Do you really want to open this can of worms?"
Sure, why not. This is fun.

"What you say is simply not true."
Of course it is.

"The evidence for evolution is overwhelming and anyone that takes the time to understand it sees this."
If this were the case, it would be The LAW of Evolution, not The Theory of Evolution. Evolution has not been proven. You can have as many theories as you want, but until something is proven, that's all it is.

"Evolution has been proven over and over for the past 150 years with almost no change from Darwin's idea."
See above.

"This is why evolution is taught in public school and creationism isn't. Creationism simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny. It's just poor science."
Oh, come on. You know and I know why evolution is taught and Creationism is not. People do not want to have Bible study in schools because of the separation of Church and State. Until 1962, Bible study was part of public schools.

"I'd go so far as to say Darwin has given us the most beautiful, simple and elegant idea in history."
Darwin is merely a cure for insomniacs. Want to go to sleep? read The Origin of the Species.

"But, this isn't the place to argue the validity of evolution. You should start a thread in the proper forum."
To reiterate, the purpose of this post was merely to state that I like reading the Bible. As you are changing topics, that might be a good idea for you to do.

Double post, sorry

First of all, learn to use the quote button.

Evolution is a theory. It's not a hypothesis. In science a theory has been tested a number of times and is agreed to be the best answer so far discovered. There are few laws in science because anything could change if new evidence is discovered. Sort of the opposite of faith.

I think the bible SHOULD be taught in school. It's had a such huge impact on wester civilization it cannot be denied. It should be studied the same way we study the works of Homer (the Iliad and the Odyssey).

I found Darwin's book fascinating. I couldn't put it down.

"First of all, learn to use the quote button."

It makes the posts too long. This way is more efficient. Try it. You'll see.

"Evolution is a theory. It's not a hypothesis. In science a theory has been tested a number of times and is agreed to be the best answer so far discovered."

According to whom? Unbelievers such as yourself? You're not going to prove God exists or He does not exist. And you can test something all you want, but you can't prove evolution. That is why it is a theory.

Case in point: We do not have The Theory of Gravity, do we? We have The Law of Gravity. If you could prove evolution, it would be a law.

"There are few laws in science because anything could change if new evidence is discovered. Sort of the opposite of faith."

I agree here. Unlike evolution, which is wishy washy and that is why, as you say, "anything could change," God and Christ do not change.

"I think the bible SHOULD/b] be taught in school."
We agree again. Who'd a thunk it. Also, it is Bible (not bible). You may not agree with it, but it is capitalized.

"It's had a such huge impact on wester civilization it cannot be denied. It should be studied the same way we study the works of Homer (the Iliad and the Odyssey)."

Sign me up.

"I found Darwin's book fascinating. I couldn't put it down."

Pages and pages about turtles. Z-z-z-z-z-z!!!

April 1881 (Darwin's Struggle with Faith)

Darwin finishes his Autobiography. It is a private memoir, a record for his family. It is not meant to be published -- at least in his lifetime. In it, Darwin struggles with his religious beliefs.


"[A] source of conviction in the existence of God ... follows from the extreme difficulty or rather impossibility of conceiving this immense and wonderful universe, including man with his capability of looking far backwards and far into futurity, as the result of blind chance or necessity. When thus reflecting ... I deserve to be called a theist."

I do not know what Darwij believed or didnt believe, I do know that i loved science and there are many many theory's, but that is just what they are, when something is called a theory its just that, an idea of how things happened, Darwin had an idea and tried to prove it, but it is still just called a theory not fact.
Many people have theory's and then they are changed as time moves on.

and I have looked at evolotion and creation, creation is very easy to believe as it all falls together.
Evolotion is a much more difficult theory to grasp. for example, if everything started and slowely evolved why has it stopped, Why when we have sheep in Australia do the stupid things still grow tails that get maggoty and kill them, surely they would have begun to see some evolutionary change in the hundreds of years that they have been living in a climate that they are not suited to.
How did humans survive evolution, we would have been destroy by stronger animals,as we are the weaker species.
The only things that change are the things that we interbreed or destroy.

The more important question is how did you stay awake while reading it?

Ok so I guess we should believe what science proves, not the theory's but the proof so we really should listen to these highly educated men..

I bet people think I am silly for believeing in fairytales, and yet they believe in evolution.

According to the theory of evolution, at some time in the distant past there was no life in the universe -- just elements and chemical compounds. Somehow, these chemicals combined and came to life.

However, scientists don't really know how life came to be. Even Stanley Miller, whose experiments are cited in most biology text books, says that the origin of life is still unknown. The idea that dead material can come to life all by itself is not consistent with scientific observation.

The leading mathematicians in the century met with some evolutionary biologists and confronted them with the fact that according to mathematical statistics, the probabilities of a cell or a protein molecule coming into existence were nil. They even constructed a model of a large computer and tried to figure out the possibilities of a cell ever happening. The result was zero possibility! - Wistar Institute, 1966

Professor Edwin Conklin observed, "The probability of life originating from accident is comparable to the probability of the Unabridged Dictionary resulting from an explosion in a printing shop."

Under normal circumstances, creatures give birth to the same kind of creatures. It is established scientific fact that like begets like. On rare instances, the DNA in an embryo is damaged, resulting in a mutant child that differs in some respect from its parent. Although a few mutations have been scientifically observed that are beneficial, most mutations produce inferior offspring. For the theory of evolution to be true, there must be a fantastic number of creative mutations that produce new kinds of offspring which are better suited for survival, and therefore are favored by natural selection.

Darwinists claim that the reptile-to-mammal evolution is well documented. But for reptiles to evolve into mammals at least some of these transformations must have happened:
• Scales had to have mutated into hair.
• Breasts had to have evolved from nothing.
• Externally laid eggs had to evolve into soft-shelled eggs that were nourished by an umbilical cord and placenta in a womb.

• It has never been observed in any laboratory that mutations can cause one species to turn into another. Despite this, evolutionists believe that given enough time, some animals will eventually evolve into other creatures.

• Evolutionists claim that although we have not actually observed these things happening, that does not mean that they are impossible. They say it simply means they are extremely improbable. Evolutionists think the world has been around long enough for all these highly improbable things to happen.

• Sir Fred Hoyle, of Cambridge University stated that statistically the chances of one cell evolving was the same as a tornado passing through a junkyard and giving you a fully functional Boeing 747.

I so love science it is a great adventure, like looking at little boxes of surprises

I still remember this book in high school. I think that Darwin had a weird "turtle love" thing going. With all of God's creation around him, instead of enjoying the beauty of the Galapagos Islands, what did he do?

Study turtles.

Maybe he needed a hobby. Or a woman.

this has made me see you in a totally different light