That delusion doesn't hold any water either. Unless you're willing to accept that God is a real bully and beats up on good people like Job.

Such a God would be a demon as far as I'm concerned. I'd rather atheism be true.

I don't blame "God" for anything.I don't believe HE is in control. Not of this world.Everything is human decision or natural proccess in this world

Yeah really. Don't even get me started on this crap.

The God who loves to hate.

I'll just leave this conversation now. You guys can have at it.

Does all of your anger towards me come from the thought that I do not worship in the same way that you do or follow the same religion? How does your anger against me help you?

Of course nobody wants bad things to happen to them. I don't think I ever said they did. But when they think of bad things that is what they are creating. When they fear instead of having faith that is the vibration they are sending out.

I have no "followers" silly you. You speak from a deep fear. You will get what you believe and this is what you believe:



Change that belief and you will change your life. Have you no faith?

Who was the very first person to come out with this philosophy called the laws of attraction?

Is it traceable to know who is credited for this?

Or was it in all religion documents one way or another?

But its good to see some action in this science/philosophy forum and the general religion forum starting to come back again.

This "secret" is older than the world. It is a universal law. Even the Bible says "Believe that you have it and it will be yours" or something on that order. It also says "Ask and it will be given." These are all universal truths.

The misunderstanding people have is they don't realize that they "ask" by thinking about it. Then they think about things they do not want. They fear things and they think about things that they fear. This emotion of fear gives power to the asking of the thing they fear.

The thinking stuff is waiting for your thoughts and your visual pictures. It does not understand it when you say "I DON'T WANT THIS THING I AM THINKING ABOUT." It can only see the visual picture in your mind. That is what you are asking for.

So if you think about death and war and fear it, then you are asking for death and war.

Be careful what you think about because that is what you are asking for. Become more aware of what you believe because that is the reality that you create.

According to Matthew Jesus supposedly said:


Matthew 21:22 "And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive."

There were no conditions place on this about whether or not god would be in the mood to grant them.

In fact, it clearly states all things whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer.

The Christians of course are under the erroneous belief that Jesus was assuming that a person would be praying to the God of Abraham. But that's clearly a misguided view as even Jesus himself did not support the teachings that were attributed to that ficticious God.

So you're right, that Jesus made this claim.

The problem is that it appears to be a false claim. Either that or people who pray simply don't believe and that's why it isn't working.

Clearly believing is an important part of casting this spell.

And apparently the only thing that is required that we believe is that the spell will be answered.

At least if we can trust Matthew to have correctly quoted Jesus and we can trust Jesus to know what he was talking about.

It could be that he was just a motivational speaker too.

It is not a false claim. The problem is that people don't know how to pray.

When they pray for someone who is sick and they are gripped with fear that the person is going to die, they might visualize the person dead. They might not have any faith of the person getting well at all.

Or if they pray for health but they believe that they will always be sick, their beliefs are what they visualize. They visualize sickness.

Those who pray for health by visualizing health (more than they visualize their fears of illness) will move towards things that will bring them towards health. If they think about sickness more, they will move towards sickness.

This is why placebos work. The people who believe they have been given a pill for pain, will feel less pain. Some people have been cured just because they believed they were cured. The medicine you take may have no effect on you if you don't believe that it will help.

This is why when a doctor tells a person they are going to die, that helps them die faster. I saw a doctor tell a woman in my care that if she did not move around more that she would catch pneumonia and two weeks later she caught it. She believed her doctor. Every time she went to him he told her how sick she was. She always came back from seeing him three times worse than before she went to see him. He totally controlled her condition by telling her she was sick. It made her sick.

On the other hand, my father forgets he can barely walk and he gets up some days and walks anyway. He forgets he has a cold and a cold does not last long in him.

Belief is a powerful thing. Why is that?

I'll tell you why belief is a powerful thing JB, because scripture says (whether you believe it or not) " your faith has healed you". the question is faith in what? faith in who? who is faith and what is faith." faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things unseen". the evidence of things unseen JB,even if you cant see it you must believe it. even if you cant visualize it you must believe it. Not everyone is visual or have a fantastic creative imagination to see the thing they hope for, but having faith can bring about the manisfestation. I dont agree with everything your preaching but I believe we can agree that you need faith in order for your hope to materialize. I dont agree about relying on the created universe to bid my wish, Instead I say rely on the one who created the universe. Isnt this One Far Greater?

Think about it.

In pantheism there is no difference between the creator and the created. They are one in the same. To claim that there can even be a seperation between them is nonsensical.

Especially if you're eventually going to claim that the creator is not responsible for the attributes of the created. (i.e. sin, etc.)

That even becomes more nonsensical.

Speaking of thinking about this. I actually have thought about it quite deeply.

If the one you are attempting to call "Far Greater" is the God of Abraham then I would have to disagree with the description.

The God of Abraham is assocated with the following:

1. Jealousy
2. Male-chauvinism
3. Being appeased by blood sacrifices
4. Asking people to stone sinners to death
5. Asking people to murder heathen, their wives, and children
7. Being mean to people who are totally faithful to him (i.e. Job)
8. Taking up bets with Satan (i.e. Job also)
9. Hating people who love their same gender.

I could go on and on an on.

But I'll stop there. This persona just doesn't match up with what I would consider to be a divine being.

I confess this is a personal call on my part. But I'd rather atheism were true than to believe that our creator has the personality as described by the Bible.

Thanks, but no thanks.

If I'm going to believe in a creator at least let me believe in a loving creator.

No one knows the true nature of the universe or God. To claim that you do only proves that you don't. I do know that faith and belief are powerful and they come after thinking thoughts. Attitude and attention, thought and belief, visualization and faith. These are part of the "secret" of creativity and our reality. The will is to be used to direct your thoughts and attention. It is your secret power. Gratitude and faith will put you in direct communication with the divine creative power. Worship as you will, and do good things. Think good thoughts. Don't condemn or judge others whom you do not understand, it will not benefit you. Don't allow anger or hatred to poison the divine within you.

In all things we find us...in us we find all things


In all gods we find us.....in us we find all gods.


We are the dark and the light....and the light IN the dark.


Just be all that you are supposed to be.


Just be.

Buy you sure seem to claim to know about this so-called "Law of Attraction" which even you confess has not been scientifically established.

You basically demand that this is the Law of the universe.

I'm open to a lot of possiblities, and I would even accept this as being a possiblity.

But whether or not you realize it, you come across as though you are preaching it as the gospel truth.

You're not merely presenting it as though it might be a possiblity. You're demanding that it's the LAW.

And here you are telling other people that no one knows the true nature of the universe.

Where's a mirror?

Not Mirror Mirror, but just a plain old mirror?

I certainly don't know the true nature of the universe. I do believe and have faith in the structure of it - what ever it is, and I believe in the the laws that hold it together. There has to be checks and balances (or laws/programs) that hold it all together and in balance otherwise we would simply not exist.

JB...

This quote troubles my thinking a little, could you assist in carrying it a little further?



So... in this sense, 'asking' is actually not necessarily asking as it is commonly thought of, correct? I mean, when one asks] for something, it presupposes a desired thing. something that is wanted by s/he who asks.

It is very misleading to use any word as is being done. The definitional distortion - if such a label exists - is the antithesis of the purpose of language. The term 'ask', when used to represent something other than what is commonly understood, means something completely different. When it is being used as it is, the term 'ask' truly means 'think of'...

If one should 'ask' - think of - something, then it empowers that thought to become an actual part of physical reality moreso than ones not focused upon... according to what I understand from what I have read.

It may sound far-fetched but I would like to carry this to the extreme...

If this claim were true, then it must follow that those who are completely naive regarding the existence of the possibility of failure would always succeed in their pursuits.

This claim when taken at face value necessitates the success of the clueless minded individual who knows of nothing to worry about.

Does it not?

Is that true? Throw caution(which was never had to begin with) to the wind, and enjoy whatever it is that you think about?

What is the cost?



By the way, I say the following with as much courtesy as I have...

Accepting random chance removes the foundation beneath what is being claimed.

Yes this is correct. The mere thinking of a thing is the "asking" of that thing.



(Man invented language before he knew the laws of the universe.)

Unfortunately the term "ask" is misleading. The "thinking stuff" (subconscious) has no language.

When a child is born he cannot speak. He does not know the meaning of "ask." He thinks about what he wants, he knows what he wants, (or does not want) but he cannot communicate that. So he just thinks and cries or points.

Images of things in the form of visual pictures is "the asking." Telepathy is the universal language -when it is utilized. When it is not, (as common here on earth) visual images and images of all kinds are the universal language. (emotion is also felt in telepathy)

(That is why I enjoy reading Tarot cards. -That is why I am an artist.)




Correct. The more persistent the asking, the more power is given to the manifestation/creation. (It does not usually manifest with a single thought.)



You are correct and this happens a lot.

In the Tarot it is the energy of "The Fool." He is clueless. He does not imagine he can fail most of the time. Because he does not envision or fear failure, he succeeds much of the time by blundering into success... not always because he is careless and clueless and has a lot to learn about the law of attraction. A few bad requests can get him in trouble. In the Tarot card picture, he teeters on the edge of a cliff, not thinking that he might slip and fall like most people.



It does not necessitate the success of the clueless individual, but it increases the chances of success providing all goes well and nothing new is created at the wrong place or time. The clueless (fool) does not know why he succeeds or fails. Often people call this "luck."

The cost is the randomness of which you speak. The clash of two closed systems that may be unexpected. The Fool being clueless, throws caution to the wind. If he succeeds as he often does, he does not know how he did it. If he fails, he learns a valuable lesson -- if he survives. It is better to know the law and use it consciously than to skate by it by being clueless.



Thank you for your question. It is a very good one.

In learning to read the Tarot cards, we start by giving each card a word that quickly describes the energy of the card. I gave the "Fool" the word, "clueless."

I am sure many people have seen a clueless person blunder by what seems to be "dumb luck" into success at every turn. This is the energy of the fool who does not think much about the pitfalls of life or business -- he just jumps in and does it. It is innocence and cluelessness combined. Never thinking of failure, he often succeeds because he takes action without hesitating.

People who fear to take any action and picture failure will not succeed. Hence a clueless fool has a better chance of success.

The better energy is the energy of the Magician which is what the Fool soon becomes after he learns more about how to get what he wants. The magician succeeds because he is not clueless and he has learned to think about and focus on the desired result.

If the fool succeeds, he does so unconsciously because he does not think about failure. He just thinks about doing. When the magician succeeds he succeeds by conscious effort and focus and manipulation of all kinds.

One of the reasons the "clueless Fool" is successful is because he uses intention and he does not consider failure at all. He intends to do something and he goes strait for it without hesitation.

He does not wish and hope. He intends and acts.

The pitfalls of the fool are his ignorance of other things at work in the reality in which he lives.

The magician, on the other hand, knows about the pitfalls. If the magician also knows about the law of attraction and knows that thoughts are requests, and if he has the will to direct his thoughts consciously (not unconsciously like the fool) then he will succeed by way of conscious self direction, avoiding the pitfalls by keeping his thoughts on what he wants more than on what he does not want.

Even so, if the magician does not use intention, he will not succeed. Intention moves action forward and does not consider failure as an option.

Even if a person (the magician) tries and fails, even when using intention they will still succeed in the end by learning from each failure and proceeding towards their goal.

Intention does not give up or accept failure as an option.

It is only when you change your intention before you succeed that the manifestation is halted. Even at that, it may have built up enough momentum to break through and manifest into your experience (reality) anyway.