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Topic: A Thank-You Note to George W. Bush
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Tue 03/04/08 10:14 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Tue 03/04/08 10:18 AM




your talking about a pentagram...Lindyy was talking about a pentacle...two completely different symbols with two completely different meanings....


The pentacle, a pentagram within a circle, is the most recognizable symbol of Wicca.



I wouldn't call them "completely different" symbols.
It is a five pointed star, the same symbol used on our American Flag and the same symbol on some Sheriff's badges.

Putting a circle around it only makes it a five pointed star inside of a circle. Whoever used it for whatever reason ~ means only what you or they want it to mean.

From Wikipedia:
The relationship between the words pentacle and pentagram (a five-point unicursal star) is unclear. The Oxford English Dictionary (Second Edition) treats the two as apparently synonymous, but notes that the actual history of pentacle is obscure. In an extended use, many magical authors treat them as distinct. In modern Tarot decks and in some forms of modern witchcraft, pentacles often prominently incorporate a pentagram in their design.

In any case, Lindy has no authority to "rebuke" me. To rebuke someone means to "sharply reprimand them." A reprimand, to be effective must come from someone in authority. Neither she or her religious idea of God has any authority over me. I dismiss her reprimand as a rant.




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Tue 03/04/08 11:47 AM
I wouldn't call them "completely different" symbols.
It is a five pointed star, the same symbol used on our American Flag and the same symbol on some Sheriff's badges.

Putting a circle around it only makes it a five pointed star inside of a circle. Whoever used it for whatever reason ~ means only what you or they want it to mean.



putting a circle around it only makes it a different symbol with it's own meaning....you might have cards you can read but that does not give you the power to change the english language...noway

Lindyy's photo
Tue 03/04/08 01:10 PM


In any case, Lindy has no authority to "rebuke" me. To rebuke someone means to "sharply reprimand them." A reprimand, to be effective must come from someone in authority. Neither she or her religious idea of God has any authority over me. I dismiss her reprimand as a rant.




Jude 1
1Jude, a servant of Jesus Christ and a brother of James,
To those who have been called, who are loved by God the Father and kept by[a] Jesus Christ: ……..
9But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"

And to you I say what the archangel Michael wisely said:

"The Lord Rebuke you."

Lindyy
A follower of Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior.


Lindyy says:

This is my pet peve. PEOPLE DO NOT READ!:angry:

My post said "The Lord Rebuke You." I do not have to do anything, the Lord will do the rebuking.:smile: :smile:

Lindyy
:heart:

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Tue 03/04/08 01:15 PM
Lidyy...do wiccans usually try try to hide their status ?

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Tue 03/04/08 01:38 PM
My post said "The Lord Rebuke You." I do not have to do anything, the Lord will do the rebuking.


You can believe whatever you want. But what I said was that neither you or "the lord" of your religious percepts have the authority to rebuke or reprimand anyone who does not accept their authority.

JB

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Tue 03/04/08 01:41 PM

Lidyy...do wiccans usually try try to hide their status ?



A wiccan worships the earth spirit. I am a pantheist. Not a Wiccan. Most Wiccans I know are proud to announce their beliefs.

Lindyy's photo
Tue 03/04/08 01:49 PM

Lidyy...do wiccans usually try try to hide their status ?


This is what JB quoted, from the same site I quoted:

From Wikipedia:

The relationship between the words pentacle and pentagram (a five-point unicursal star) is unclear. The Oxford English Dictionary (Second Edition) treats the two as apparently synonymous, but notes that the actual history of pentacle is obscure. In an extended use, many magical authors treat them as distinct. In modern Tarot decks and in some forms of modern witchcraft, pentacles often prominently incorporate a pentagram in their design.

----JB omitted, rather manipulated, to try to 'throw off course' the fact that the pentacle is a sign of a wiccan and in the tarot cards, which she admits to using.----

These are excerpts (to avoid using excess space, original post is still there) from my original post, which JB did not reference, a sign that she is trying to coverup something:

Wicca
From the Simple English Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Altars
Most Wiccans have special places in their houses where they go to pray and do magic. These places are called altars, or sometimes shrines. Wiccans put their holy objects on their altars. This is what you might find on an altar:
The pentagram and pentacle. A pentacle is a flat object with a Wiccan symbol on it. The symbol looks like a A STAR INSIDE A CIRCLE (Lindyy's emphasis -UPPER CASE LETTERS) In common usage, the star is by itself is a pentacle; being in a circle makes it a pentagram. However, because of differing meanings of the pentagram in different cultures and religions, many Wiccans refer to the Wiccan symbol as a pentacle to distinguish themselves from these other groups.

.....
Feom Lindyy's original post:

WICCANS/tarot:

http://altreligion.about.com/library/glossary/symbols/bldefswiccasymbols.htm

Symbols of Wicca and Neopaganism

There are many symbols associated with Wicca and modern neopagan belief systems. Some of the most universal Neopagan symbols include:

The pentacle, a pentagram within a circle, is the most recognizable symbol of Wicca. ....

The pentacle is used in a number of Wiccan rituals,....

Traditional Wiccan ritual tools:

The four most commonly used ritual tools in Wicca are derived from the magickal tools used by Ritual magicians of the Renaissance..... THEY ARE DIREDTLY RELATED TO THE SUIT SIGNS ON TAROT CARDS (Emphasis added -Lindyy -all upper case letters) and the four worlds of the kabbalah.
……….
..... also known as a pentacle in most Wiccan and Ritual Magick tradition. ………

Here is the website I quoted:

http://altreligion.about.com/library/glossary/symbols/bldefswiccasymbols.htm


People can form their own opinions as to the fact that she is a wiccan or not, but the above sure indicates that she is a wiccan.

Lindyy

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Tue 03/04/08 01:51 PM

I wouldn't call them "completely different" symbols.
It is a five pointed star, the same symbol used on our American Flag and the same symbol on some Sheriff's badges.

Putting a circle around it only makes it a five pointed star inside of a circle. Whoever used it for whatever reason ~ means only what you or they want it to mean.



putting a circle around it only makes it a different symbol with it's own meaning....you might have cards you can read but that does not give you the power to change the english language...noway


Anyone who utters a word can change the English language. I am only giving you my viewpoint as an artist.

(A pentagram is a five pointed star enclosed in a circle.)

That is all it is. It is nothing more than that. Only a human can assign it any kind of symbolic meaning, and it means different things to different people. I don't know how much plainer I can put that. If you don't understand, then you don't understand plain English.


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Tue 03/04/08 01:54 PM
Edited by northrn_yanke on Tue 03/04/08 01:55 PM
Only a human can assign it any kind of symbolic meaning,


I understand english very well...and what you keep on saying is that you can change the symbolic meaning to suit your purposes or needs at any given time...

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Tue 03/04/08 02:01 PM
People can form their own opinions as to the fact that she is a wiccan or not, but the above sure indicates that she is a wiccan.

Lindyy


You can assume whatever you like. It doesn't matter to me. I have no reason to lie about who I am or what I believe. (Just because I read Tarot, that does not make me Wiccan.) I see nothing wrong with being a wiccan, they are very gentle people who believe in taking care of the earth. As I said, I am a pantheist.

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Tue 03/04/08 02:05 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Tue 03/04/08 02:06 PM

Only a human can assign it any kind of symbolic meaning,


I understand english very well...and what you keep on saying is that you can change the symbolic meaning to suit your purposes or needs at any given time...


This is true. I can. I can change what it means to me, not to you. No one else can tell me what anything means to me or to you. It is people who decide what things mean. Meanings are never written in stone.

Generally, the pentagram is/has been used as a symbol of protection. Throughout history many people used it, including Christians.

But if I wanted to change it to mean something else, I could. In Tarot, it means wealth and abundance or money and material things.


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Tue 03/04/08 02:09 PM
This is true. I can. I can change what it means to me, not to you.


It has no meaning for you to tell me what is was used for and the history behind it. The only reason for changing the meaning of something is to deceive others..

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Tue 03/04/08 02:29 PM

This is true. I can. I can change what it means to me, not to you.


It has no meaning for you to tell me what is was used for and the history behind it. The only reason for changing the meaning of something is to deceive others..


I will say this one more time and then I will give up, because you obviously do not want to understand.

NOTHING has any meaning except the meaning that PEOPLE give it. NOTHING.

I tell you the history of the known meanings and uses of the pentagram or pentacle because that is what the discussion has turned into. You don't even know what a wiccan is.


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Tue 03/04/08 02:44 PM


This is true. I can. I can change what it means to me, not to you.


It has no meaning for you to tell me what is was used for and the history behind it. The only reason for changing the meaning of something is to deceive others..


I will say this one more time and then I will give up, because you obviously do not want to understand.

NOTHING has any meaning except the meaning that PEOPLE give it. NOTHING.

I tell you the history of the known meanings and uses of the pentagram or pentacle because that is what the discussion has turned into. You don't even know what a wiccan is.




It's not that I don't understand or don't want to understand...just because I don't accept your attempt at explaining it doesn't mean I don't understand...next time I go through a stop sign I'll tell the cop that symbols means different things to different people and to me that stop sign doesn't mean what everyone else thinks it means..I'll let you know what the cop says....bigsmile

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Tue 03/04/08 02:59 PM



It's not that I don't understand or don't want to understand...just because I don't accept your attempt at explaining it doesn't mean I don't understand...next time I go through a stop sign I'll tell the cop that symbols means different things to different people and to me that stop sign doesn't mean what everyone else thinks it means..I'll let you know what the cop says....bigsmile


Your example proves that you don't understand. The stop sign example: We, as a society have all agreed what a stop sign is supposed to mean. In fact, we passed a law to that effect.

But to a native in the African jungle who has never seen a stop sign, it does not mean that. In fact, he might decide that it is a sign that means "the evil white man cometh."

The Pentagram has had different meanings throughout history and so have other symbols. But the meanings have to be agreed upon by a group of people. The Christian group have "agreed" that it means that a person is a wiccan or a witch or even worshiper of Satan. So to them, that is what it means.

The wiccans have agreed that it means something very different, having to do with the five elements, earth, air, wind, water, and spirit or something on that order.

For me, as a tarot card reader, it represents coins, gold, money, abundance, wealth and the pleasure of physical life.

There you have it. Three different meanings.


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Tue 03/04/08 03:05 PM
well you see I don't bother asking deceptive people for their interpretation...

Symbols of Wicca and Neopaganism

There are many symbols associated with Wicca and modern neopagan belief systems. Some of the most universal Neopagan symbols include:

The pentacle, a pentagram within a circle, is the most recognizable symbol of Wicca. The pentacle represents the integration of body and spirit, and the spiritual mastery of the four elements. The pentacle is used in a number of Wiccan rituals, and as a Grade sign in Gardnerian and other traditions. The pentacle is often worn as a symbol of recognition amongst practitioners, especially those who practice a code of secrecy.



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Tue 03/04/08 03:11 PM
ummm...can we get back to: "G.Bush; butt-head or savior.. debate??
and leave ancient misunderstood symbols to the religious threads....noway

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Tue 03/04/08 04:23 PM

ummm...can we get back to: "G.Bush; butt-head or savior.. debate??
and leave ancient misunderstood symbols to the religious threads....noway



George Bush is pathetic. But he's really funny. He should have been a comedian.

cutelildevilsmom's photo
Tue 03/04/08 04:30 PM
I was watching the Queen Elizabeth special and let me say she made George and Laura look like hicks.It was embarrassing.

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Tue 03/04/08 04:36 PM
This whole "pentacle / pentagram" thing got started when some god-fearing, wiccan hating Christian saw a pentagram on my Icon picture and started quoting the Bible scriptures and "rebuking" all over the place, later joined by a second supporting Christian spewing his endless knowledge of the secret goings on in the wiccan society, implying that I am being "deceitful" and that I am a "wiccan." It's just their way of pointing a finger and screaming "burn the witch!" much like the people did one hundred years ago.

I had hoped that people had evolved a little bit more that this, and I am disappointed that modern intelligent people still act this way. And they call themselves "Christians." It makes me shudder.


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