did you are did you not

say enforce laws on the books

those laws say deportation

is a penalty for illegal entry to this country

and you have been the one saying people say things that was not even remotely implied

do you remember posting this

---------------------------------

Sooooo, what your saying is traffic violators should get the chair as all crimes are punishable by death right???? Come on the punishment fits the crime. These people for the most part have hurt noone. Not saying there are not criminals in the bunch because all races and backgrounds have criminals but for the majoprity who are not criminals other than illegal status. You are buying into the racist mentality of them being less than human at some level and that is wrong. You cannot make a human into an expendable animal and make it right.

----------------------------------------

so what you are saying

interesting

again you accuse others of the actions you do

so do you think they should stay

so the price does not go up

get real

i already considered the possibility of the original post being wrong

but you have not let go of that issue

the national stats can not be used to dis prove locality stats

that is apples and oranges

again you ignore the fact that

if here illegally they knew it when they came they know it now

and if they are here now they are breaking the law now

and they should be dealt with

as the laws on the books say they should be

and again as post from the state dept site

blanket amnesty is illegal

and as in a previous post

illegals are getting injured at a hirer rate

and recieve less pay

go back and look

allowing them to stay is permitting them to

be considered subhuman and subjecting them

to subhuman treatment

were they could go home and help improve their home country

why is everyone thinks that these illegals are privaledged

to be here is this country so above the rest of the world

that makes the rest of the world subhuman standard

i for one do not think so

those that say they should stay is degrading the

rest of the world and saying the u s is better

than the rest of the world

i would consider that raciest in the form of nationality

adj, you are trying to make me out to be a back slider and I have not slide back from my orginal stand that this post is a fraud and propaganda. The aliens are here due to us and our love of cheap products and we bear the responsibility of those desires. Deportation of a few is imminent, I am sure due to their illegal activities outside of immigration status but to round them up like the Nazis did in days gone by is not an option of any humanity. So you can disect my answers and you will continue to come up with the same answer. I do not believe racist propaganda like the one posted originally should be allowed to stand as truth when it is not. Illegals that are here should be dealt with, with dignity and respect as they are human and deserve that name. We are responsible for the problem through our eternal search for the cheapest labor and cost we can find, resulting in slave labor being used to make our products cheaper for our pockets. Aliens will stop coming here when the desired work for them is not available anymore. Start enforcing the laws that have been ignored and make the aliens here an appropriate punishment and retribution to begin to make them legal as they should be. It is simple and not hate or fear producing. Humane and respectful is the goal. Do not depict them as animals of less than human status as the original post does. I cannot change your mind if you feel you are right but I can call the propaganda racist and hate filled as I have continually done throughout my posts. It is very racist and hatefilled. I am sorry if that offends anyone. The propaganda of which has no merit was created to be hateful and racist. Let me put that another way this information is false and lies and meant to demean other humans in a most derogatory way that is racist, fearmongering and hatemongering. I am not back sliding on my opinions they are clear and concise.

none of that changes the fact they are here illegally


none of that changes the fact you said that we should
enforce the laws on the books


if that makes you seem like a backslider that is not my issue but yours


the facts are what they are


they are and you said it

put 2 and 2 together equals deportation

plain and simple

or are you saying there are wmds (sarcasm)

excerpt from your post

but to round them up like the Nazis did in days gone by is not an option of any humanity. So you can disect my answers and you will continue to come up with the same answer. I do not believe racist propaganda like the one posted originally should be allowed to stand as truth when it is not. Illegals that are here should be dealt with, with dignity and respect

---------------------------

could you quote anywhere in this thread that this should not happen
------------
Illegals that are here should be dealt with, with dignity and respect
-------------

can you show any where that i insinuated this

---------------

Do not depict them as animals of less than human status as the original post does. I

from your post

----------------

your post

I do not believe racist propaganda like the one posted originally

------------------------

you still have not proved it racist

your post

Start enforcing the laws that have been ignored and make the aliens here an appropriate punishment and retribution to begin to make them legal as they should be.

------------------------------------

did you not see the limit of 50 post in the state department
law

-------------------------------------

my post from state department


SECTION 13 OF THE ACT OF SEPTEMBER 11, 1957

(71 Stat. 642; 8 U.S.C. 1255B)

as amended by section 17 of Public Law 97-116 and section 207 of Public Law 103-416

SEC. 13. Notwithstanding any other provision of law-

(a) Any alien admitted to the United States as a nonimmigrant under the provisions of either section 101(a)(15)(A) (i) or (ii) or 101(a)(15)(G) (i) or (ii) of the Immigration and Nationality Act, who has failed to maintain a status under any of those provisions, may apply to the Attorney General for adjustment of his status to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence.

(b) If, after consultation with the Secretary of State, it shall appear to the satisfaction of the Attorney General that the alien has shown compelling reasons demonstrating both that the alien is unable to return to the country represented by the government which accredited the alien or the member of the alien's immediate family and that adjustment of the alien's status to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence would be in the national interest, that the alien is a person of good moral character, that he is admissible for permanent residence under the Immigration and Nationality Act, and that such action would not be contrary to the national welfare, safety, or security, the Attorney General, in his discretion, may record the alien's lawful admission for permanent residence as of the date the order of the Attorney General approving the application for adjustment of status is made.

(c) A complete and detailed statement of the facts and pertinent provisions of law in the case.shall be reported to the Congress with the reasons for such adjustment of status. Such reports shall be submitted on the first day of each caledar month in which Congress is in session. The Secretary of State shall, if the alien was classifiable as a quota immigrant at the time of his entry, reduce by one the quota of the quota area to which the alien is chargeable under section 202 of the Immigration and National ity Act for the fiscal year then current or the next following year in which a quota is available. No quota shall be reduced by more than 50 per centum in any fiscal year.

(d) The number of aliens who may be granted the status of aliens lawfully admitted for permanent residence in any fiscal year, pursuant to this section, shall not exceed fifty.

http://www.uscis.gov/propub/ProPubVAP.jsp?dockey=2b289cf41dd6b70a61a078a9fbfbc379

----------------------

notice the date wonder if it is relievent


note section (d)

makes amnesty illegal

----------------------

do two wrongs make a right

if you break a law to do whats right

then the constitution i out the window

most of our products come from china and all our companies outsource to asia and mexico and my undies were made in SRI lanka so what cheap labor am i using in this country??

I will repeat myself yet again, Start enforcing the laws that have been ignored and make the aliens here an appropriate punishment and retribution to begin to make them legal as they should be. Appropriate punishment could be to wait longer for their status to be citizen. You see you do not work in the government and do not know how many different kinds of legal status there are. One can be just for work, one can be here just for school, one can be here just for a visit. They all can be legally here for different reasons. If we were to abide by that very restrictive and controversial requirement you are pushing for whatever your motive may be, we could give them legal status to work for 5 or ten years, they pay taxes under this status and we could legalize 50 of them a year. Not so hard to digest that way but very time consuming. But hey it would be humane that way. Deportation in masses is inhumane there is no humane way to do it. So that is off the table and it is racist and hateful to boot. We already went over the illegality of them being here. Punishment in our country for a victimless crime is probation not deportation. We do not deport people who commit victimless crimes. We are not communist russia and send them to the frozen tundra, it is laughable to even think like that. It would also be different if we had just caught them crossing the border illegally of course put them back on their side but for the ones who have been here a generation or so and they are contributing members of society and yes working slave labor is a contributing member of our society, they are here and are living so we should put consideration into the fact that they are already here. Regardless to the punitive aspect of the "unforgivable" fact they are not legally here. We already established they could not survive here had not one or more of "our citizens who we claim as ours" has brought them here and provided them with income to live and survive. Again, Nazi style roundups is not humane, you cannot make it right.

I have to again say as I have been saying the propaganda pushed in the original post is false and incorrect therefore it has been created for a purpose of which is hateful, racist, bigoted and unhuman. There is no other explanation for the hateful content of the post. Sorry again if that offends you it is racist.

Cute, do you eat fruit and fruit products? Slave labor here, in the form of illegals pick fruit and veges.

i eat local fruit products.lots of farms here and no migrant workers except for the legal Jamaicans which pick the apples every year and are well paid.NH has immigrants mind you but most are Asian.Most of the illegals busted here have been in the chinese restaurant buisness where they are exploited by their own people.I don't go up to foreign people and ask if they belong here but if a person is caught then they should either be brought into compliance or sent home.
I am a naturalized citizen myself and believe people should fill out the paperwork and get their green card.

The appropriate punishment is to sent their asses back where they came from.

Dragoness you keep resorting to all sorts of abstract issues like we brought them here for slave labor and racisim. Nobody brought them here, they came here of their own accord and they are free to leave anytime they want. The fact is they came here because they could make more money than they could make at home. They had the opportunity to enter this country legally but they did not want to waste the time and effort to do that so they said "screw you" and came across the border illegally.

As far as it being a race issue, it's not. It is a matter of legal vs illegal. If you come to America legally no matter where you are from, Welcome to America. If you come to America illegally no matter where you are from, go back home or be deported when you are caught.

If they had any balls they would press for social reforms in the ountry they came from and make it a better place rather than come here and try to turn this country in to the mess they left.

If you check another post on this forum you will see what Canada did with them. They said no way in hell are we letting these people in illegally.

from your post

Punishment in our country for a victimless crime is probation not deportation. We do not deport people who commit victimless crimes. We are not communist russia and send them to the frozen tundra, it is laughable to even think like that.

------------------------------

why don't you tell that to the guy that sold an oz mary jane

and the punishment for entering the country is

being made to leave it

as the laws on the books state

and you said should be enforced

-------

send them to frozen tundra

i only say do that if that is where their legal country is

which is what the laws on the books say

that you say should be enforced

-------------------

from your post

Appropriate punishment could be .....

it does not matter what it could be

law on the books say deport

and you said enforce laws on the books

your post

Start enforcing the laws that have been ignored ....

to change the punishments would be ignoring the laws on the books

Prison Statistics
Summary findings | BJS publications | Selected statistics |
Also by BJS staff | Related sites


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Summary findings
On June 30, 2006--

-- 2,245,189 prisoners were held in Federal or State prisons or in local jails -- an increase of 2.8% from midyear 2005, less than the average annual growth of 3.4% since yearend 1995.
-- there were an estimated 497 prison inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents -- up from 411 at yearend 1995.
-- the number of women under the jurisdiction of State or Federal prison authorities increased 4.8% from midyear 2005, reaching 111,403 and the number of men rose 2.7%, totaling 1,445,115.
At yearend 2005 there were 3,145 black male sentenced prison inmates per 100,000 black males in the United States, compared to 1,244 Hispanic male inmates per 100,000 Hispanic males and 471 white male inmates per 100,000 white males.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/prisons.htm





Jail Statistics
Summary findings | BJS publications | Selected statistics |
Also by BJS staff | Related sites


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Summary findings
Jails are locally-operated correctional facilities that confine persons before or after adjudication. Inmates sentenced to jail usually have a sentence of a year or less, but jails also incarcerate persons in a wide variety of other categories.

Jail facilities

At midyear 2006, 766,010 inmates were held in the Nation's local jails, up from 747,529 at midyear 2005.


In 2006, jails reported adding 21,862 beds during the previous 12 months, bringing the total rated capacity to 810,863.


94% of the rated capacity was occupied at midyear 2006.


On June 30, 2006 local jails were operating 6% below their rated capacity.


In Indian country on June 30, 2004, 68 facilities were operating with the capacity to hold 2,162 persons. These jails held 1,745 inmates and were operating at 81% of their capacity at midyear 2004.

Jail populations

From 1995 to 2005, the number of jail inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents rose from 193 to 256


From midyear 2005 to midyear 2006 the 12-month increase of 2.5% in the jail population less than the average annual increase of 3.8% since 1995.



Almost nine out of every ten jail inmates were adult males. However, the number of adult females in jail increased faster than males.

Jail population trends by age and gender, 1990 - 2006




Between 1990 and 2006, the number of white and Hispanic jail inmates increased at the same average annual rate. The number black inmates increased at a slower pace.

Jail population trends by race and ethnicity, 1990 - 2006




Blacks were almost three times more likely than Hispanics and five times more likely than whites to be in jail.

Jail incarceration rate trends by race and ethnicity, 1990 - 2006

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/jails.htm




http://www.whitehouse.gov/fsbr/crime.htm
http://www.ojp.gov/bjs/abstract/cvusst.htm
http://www.cityrating.com/citycrime.asp?city=Los+Angeles&state=CA

Even in the city of Los Angeles Attorney Generals Office on Crime statistics is nothing to validate this post. And I am getting tired of looking for validation of something I know to be erroneous.

Okay so what you are telling me is you all want to do a Nazi sweep of this country, make concentration camps and deport in mass humans who are to you no better than dogs who have gone in the wrong yard, okay, you have your right to that belief if you want. I am here to say I will not condone a Nazi action of any kind in America. So continue your "not racist" attempts to dehumanize these people and make them animals so that you can feel comfortable with your wish to turn America in to Nazi Germany, and I will continue with my human views of making them pay by some sort of probation or fines or both and then work to make them citizens as they are already here and working anyway. I will continue to push for my views in the legislature and hope my points are well taken.

Thank you dragon; for trying so hard to make your points. I read you well. I see no back sliding. I see someone that feels very much the human compassion side of this issue. Thing is; there are those that simply cannot see it as humane. It has all of a sudden become a legal issue, that some seem to asertain as point blank criminal. While I know that this is an issue of criminal; it is not just that. Yes, laws have been broken....................for many many years now. All of a sudden someone stands up and says, "lets stop this". Some of these illegals have been here nigh on 20 years. Working, living and contributing as any citizen. Yes, some have broken laws. as have million of others, legal people.

Forge; I say I am a woman and a mother because that automatically shows my heart. I happen to be a very caring and loving person. I also credit having my kids for my kinder, more compassionate heart. When I see this issue, I see the kids, the families, and the friends that are broken hearted.
Lives are being uprooted and tossed out to begin again.
That will be very hard and terrible for the families that have become used to living a somewhat comfortable life.
I am sorry if I cannot bring myself to be as hard haerted as others. It pains me to know the fear and wondering that these people are encountering. Yes, accountability should be given. But without all those thousands of dollars the government is asking for if they turn themselves in. How are they supposed to start again in that big of a hole?
I am all for them brought in, papered, and tracked. Then let them work and make a life, so long as they stay out of trouble. They MUST stay out of trouble. No new drug charges, or dui's or dwi's. No thieving, or anything that could be a felony. I think they should be given the chance to prove themselves. I want them legal as well. There must be a way that will work.
Kat

yes thank you dragoness for trying to make Martyrs out of criminals then equating us to Nazis when we don't buy your line of BS. All the while avoiding the crux of the issue which is these people came here illegally no matter what reason they used, they chose to come here and ignore our laws. Once again just exactly what part of ILLEGAL do you fail to understand. It's a simple question try to answer it without a bunch of liberal socialistic BS, finger pointing and smoke and mirrors. You don't get to obey only the laws you agree with, you HAVE to obey all of them or suffer the consequences. You don't reward people for doing the wrong thing or you encourage more people to do the wrong thing.

Cute, do you eat fruit and fruit products? Slave labor here, in the form of illegals pick fruit and veges.

Wrong,,
as usual> Your facts are incorrect! I have been studying this issue for years! You really should learn what is and what isnt about illegal immigration!

Agriculture jobs are covered under the H-2 worker visas! They arent illegal and can hardly be called slaves!

The program requires that the employer provide shelter and health-care! As the Ragu commercial says, "Its in there!"

There is also a waiting list for these jobs! Sending the illegals home, (and they are all criminals) will not stop one vegetable or fruit from being picked. (Of which 8% of the
total price for such is labor costs)

Your posts are very obviously emotionaly based without any facts or consideration for your fellow countrymen! I suspect you have an emotional ulterior motive for your support of illegal immigration!

It could be the only reason for the unfounded emotional outbursts that you have exhibited on here, and your willingness to take from American families a decent way of life!!

Im interested, although I think I already know what it is, What is your reasons?

I see no veterans supporting your beliefs, and veterans are what keeps this country free! We put our lifes on the line and our asses in the trenches for Americans and our families future!

What have you done for this country? Besides fight to give all our efforts away!

Lets hear the answer to those questions!!