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Topic: Truth
no photo
Thu 07/16/09 09:53 PM

ON THE OTHER HAND -- there's always the Other Hand --

IF EVERYTHING WE KNOW (i.e. REALITY) IS JUST AN ILLUSION -- "a holographic projection created by our brains after decoding specific vibrational signals" -- (i.e. subjective, Not really true),
THEN HOW CAN WE BE TRUE TO OURSELVES AND OTHERS? ? ? * * *



Reality exists on more than one level. Start with yourself, where you are right now, and be true. That means to be honest with yourself.

Know yourself and what you desire, and you will find your purpose. Follow your bliss, as they say. flowerforyou

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Thu 07/16/09 10:02 PM


Our viewpoint effects our perception of what we are viewing.


So I want to know Why...we attach names and meanings for everything we find in the universe...so there must be a reason why our viewpoints affect our perception...is it a clue pointing to FACT and TRUTH or is it just a fluke?


The observer operates through The MIND which organizes and categorizes things. The universe exists in "The Mind."

(Just as when you fall asleep after having been working all day perhaps on a new job, your mind will take the events of the day and organize and categorize everything you learned that day.)

All exchanges are exchanges of energy and information. The mind is like a computer. It processes data. The mind is not consciousness.

We are consciousness.




no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:07 PM


ON THE OTHER HAND -- there's always the Other Hand --

IF EVERYTHING WE KNOW (i.e. REALITY) IS JUST AN ILLUSION -- "a holographic projection created by our brains after decoding specific vibrational signals" -- (i.e. subjective, Not really true),
THEN HOW CAN WE BE TRUE TO OURSELVES AND OTHERS? ? ? * * *



Reality exists on more than one level. Start with yourself, where you are right now, and be true. That means to be honest with yourself.

Know yourself and what you desire, and you will find your purpose. Follow your bliss, as they say. flowerforyou

Thanx, but that's exactly my point:
IF I AM TRUE TO MYSELF, HOW CAN I BE SURE THAT'S NOT AN ILLUSION???

no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:20 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Thu 07/16/09 10:21 PM



ON THE OTHER HAND -- there's always the Other Hand --

IF EVERYTHING WE KNOW (i.e. REALITY) IS JUST AN ILLUSION -- "a holographic projection created by our brains after decoding specific vibrational signals" -- (i.e. subjective, Not really true),
THEN HOW CAN WE BE TRUE TO OURSELVES AND OTHERS? ? ? * * *



Reality exists on more than one level. Start with yourself, where you are right now, and be true. That means to be honest with yourself.

Know yourself and what you desire, and you will find your purpose. Follow your bliss, as they say. flowerforyou

Thanx, but that's exactly my point:
IF I AM TRUE TO MYSELF, HOW CAN I BE SURE THAT'S NOT AN ILLUSION???


laugh laugh

That would be your decision. You decide what is real. happy


no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:22 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Thu 07/16/09 10:25 PM
Taking your power back is knowing that you decide what is real and what is true.

I don't mean you should stick your head in the sand and ignore what is going on in the world, just know that it is all 'mind stuff.'

Why let others tell you who you are? Get to know yourself. Decide who you are.

You are consciousness. What you do with that, what you create, where you go, ..that is for you to determine.






no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:28 PM


I have always said that there is only one thing that I can be certain of, and that is that I exist.

I may not know what I am, but I do know that I exist.

I believe that I am not my body, or my brain or my mind.

I believe that I am consciousness.

I believe that it is from consciousnsess that I arise.

That is my truth. flowerforyou

no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:37 PM




ON THE OTHER HAND -- there's always the Other Hand --

IF EVERYTHING WE KNOW (i.e. REALITY) IS JUST AN ILLUSION -- "a holographic projection created by our brains after decoding specific vibrational signals" -- (i.e. subjective, Not really true),
THEN HOW CAN WE BE TRUE TO OURSELVES AND OTHERS? ? ? * * *



Reality exists on more than one level. Start with yourself, where you are right now, and be true. That means to be honest with yourself.

Know yourself and what you desire, and you will find your purpose. Follow your bliss, as they say. flowerforyou

Thanx, but that's exactly my point:
IF I AM TRUE TO MYSELF, HOW CAN I BE SURE THAT'S NOT AN ILLUSION???


laugh laugh

That would be your decision. You decide what is real. happy

Unfortunately, some "preople" refuse sharing my view of reality --where I am a Queen of the World! grumble

no photo
Thu 07/16/09 10:44 PM
Unfortunately, some "preople" refuse sharing my view of reality --where I am a Queen of the World!


You can be the queen of your own world anytime. When people are in your world, they must bow to the queen. But when you are in their world.... probably not so much.... bigsmilelaugh laugh laugh


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Thu 07/16/09 10:47 PM

I once saw a T-shirt that said:

"I'm really easy to get along with...

Once you people learn to worship me."


rofl rofl rofl

no photo
Thu 07/16/09 11:24 PM


I once saw a T-shirt that said:

"I'm really easy to get along with...

Once you people learn to worship me."


rofl rofl rofl


laugh that's qute!

However, I noticed most people are really blind -- they do not

see my Greatness! In fact, most of them are wondering the same thing -- about everybody else...

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Fri 07/17/09 09:43 AM
It would be a wonderful world if we all worshiped each other.flowerforyou

no photo
Fri 07/17/09 11:01 AM
Edited by Bushidobillyclub on Fri 07/17/09 11:02 AM
Ooohh, I hate QM! First it's a wave, now it's a particle...all depending on one's viewpoint. Does this actually mean that our viewpoint affects matter or is our viewpoint merely defective?
I think its an argument from ignorance to say we will never know as Abra indicated. So I tend to agree with your sentiment on viewpoint.

Perhaps it is just a matter of reference frame. We may need a vast reformation in mathematics to achieve any kind of objective understanding of quantum weirdness.

All I do currently know is that its far too soon to make sweeping absolute statements about what we can know . . .

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Fri 07/17/09 01:59 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 07/17/09 02:55 PM
I can somewhat understand quantum weirdness but from a premise not accepted by current physics.

Point of observation does effect what is being observed.

Sensory ability of an observer also effects what is being observed.

Each observer has a different and unique point of observation and each observer will have different sensory abilities, not to mention different ways of decoding the vibratory signals that they are receiving.

First, in order to get on the same page you must define "observer."

(Human, Animal, vegetable or mineral?)

Second, what are they observing? Third, what are their sensory abilities?

While the weirdness of the quantum world does not seem to mirror this world, perhaps it is only because it is on such a smaller scale. Maybe it does mirror this world but on such a slower, larger scale we don't notice it.

If, through hypnotism, a brain can be programed not to decode certain sensory input (an object for example) then the person will not see the object at all, in fact he can be made to see right through it. One story is about a hypnotist who programed a person not to see another person in the room. That person became invisible to the subject. An yet when the 'invisible person' lit up a cigarette and walked across the room the subject did see the cigarette... floating in the air and being smoked by an unknown presence.

If our brains can be programed NOT TO SEE something that is there, how many things might be there that we are NOT SEEING???

Quantum weirdness is nothing compared to some of the real weirdness in this world that most people DON'T SEE.
smokin











Fusion99's photo
Fri 07/17/09 03:49 PM
If our brains can be programed NOT TO SEE something that is there, how many things might be there that we are NOT SEEING???

Quantum weirdness is nothing compared to some of the real weirdness in this world that most people DON'T SEE.

Well, we can't see the vast ranges of EM radiation, yet we know it is there..can we program our brains to see the all the ranges and ones beyond, or must we "pray" that some day it might happen?

as for the weirdness, such as...?

no photo
Fri 07/17/09 11:02 PM
Edited by JaneStar1 on Fri 07/17/09 11:24 PM



I have always said that there is only one thing that I can be certain of, and that is that I exist.

I may not know what I am, but I do know that I exist.

I believe that I am not my body, or my brain or my mind.

I believe that I am consciousness.

I believe that it is from consciousnsess that I arise.

That is my truth. flowerforyou

...O'K, granted,you may be that... flowerforyou But then
you -- consciousnsess --
. . . . . . . . . . . . .cannot exist without a mind.\
and that, in turn, cannot exist without a brain..........\
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ cannot exist without a head...> Body_!
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ cannot exist without a body................/

In other words, while in Human form, we're bound to exist in Body_!

* What remains a mystery is How do we exist BEFORE the Birth and AFTER the Death? ? ?

no photo
Fri 07/17/09 11:24 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 07/17/09 11:26 PM




I have always said that there is only one thing that I can be certain of, and that is that I exist.

I may not know what I am, but I do know that I exist.

I believe that I am not my body, or my brain or my mind.

I believe that I am consciousness.

I believe that it is from consciousnsess that I arise.

That is my truth. flowerforyou

...O'K, granted,you may be that... flowerforyou But then
you -- consciousnsess --
. . . . . . . . . . . . cannot exist without a mind.\



It is the other way around.
Mind cannot exist without consciousness.
Consciousnsee is the life force.

But I guess your belief and understanding of this would depend on how you would define "existence" and whether you identify with consciousness or with your body.


and that, in turn, cannot exist without a brain.\
_ _ _ _ cannot exist without a head...> Body_!
_ _ _ _ cannot exist without a body../

In other words, while in Human form, we're bound to exist in Body_!

* What remains a mystery is How do we exist BEFORE the Birth and AFTER the Death? ? ?


I believe we exist as energy, information and consciousness that manifests as bodies and minds and brains or whatever we need to express ourselves in whatever environment or world we choose to go.


no photo
Fri 07/17/09 11:46 PM
Edited by JaneStar1 on Fri 07/17/09 11:57 PM





I have always said that there is only one thing that I can be certain of, and that is that I exist.

I may not know what I am, but I do know that I exist.

I believe that I am not my body, or my brain or my mind.

I believe that I am consciousness.

I believe that it is from consciousnsess that I arise.

That is my truth. flowerforyou

...O'K, granted,you may be that... flowerforyou But then
you -- consciousnsess --
. . . . . . . . . . . . cannot exist without a mind.\



It is the other way around.
Mind cannot exist without consciousness.
Consciousnsee is the life force.________ oops You got me!!!
_______And I agree with you on that!______
But I guess your belief and understanding of this would depend on how you would define "existence" and whether you identify with consciousness or with your body.


and that, in turn, cannot exist without a brain.\
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ cannot exist without a head...> Body_!
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ cannot exist without a body../

In other words, while in Human form, we're bound to exist in Body_!

* What remains a mystery is How do we exist BEFORE the Birth and AFTER the Death? ? ?


I believe we exist as energy, information and consciousness that manifests as bodies and minds and brains or whatever we need to express ourselves in whatever environment or world we choose to go.

Nevertheless, ENERGY must be contained somewhere...?
INFORMATION is useless since it is Not retained consciously...

Abracadabra's photo
Fri 07/17/09 11:59 PM
Edited by Abracadabra on Sat 07/18/09 12:00 AM

* What remains a mystery is How do we exist BEFORE the Birth and AFTER the Death? ? ?


Yes, that's true.

But isn't it already a mystery of how the universe came to be in the first place?

And if you understand modern science you may be aware that even the very physical nature of reality is still a total mystery.

So ulimtely not matter what we accept as truth it's still total mystery.

I came to grips with this quite some time back.

The belief that we come into being at birth and cease to be at death is every bit a mystery as anything else. We can't understand that any better than anything else. At first glance it might appear to make a little more sense. But if you truly sit around and think about it long enough you'll eventually realize that it doen't many any sense either really.

In fact, I've personally come to the conclusion that it actually makes more sense to me that we are eternal spirit.

Of course that's a personal view. But just the same. It actually makes more sense to me now. It actually seems more reasonable.

I think part of the reason for that is because of my understanding quantum mechanics and more recently of some theories of the Big Bang.

This whole universe arose from a quantum field (something we cannot possible comprehend). Virtual particles pop into and out of existence all the time constantly all around us and through us, including within our brains.

The whole universe and all of existence is manifest from the quantum field.

Well, perhaps wherever all this 'stuff' is coming from is the same thing as 'spirit'. Perhaps are true essence is quantum field. The quantum field is spirit.

Now it makes some sense. After all, even thought the quantum field itself is totally undetectable directly. We know that it 'exists' because things keep popping into existence 'out of it'. The entire universe being no exception.

So in a very real sense we know that something that is totally intangible to us 'exists'.

If we simply allow that the quantum field is 'spirit'. Then we know that spirit exists. After all, what is spirit but our true essence? We are the quantum field become manifest as physical phenomena.

We are spirit that has become manifest in a physical form.

Makes sense to me.

Is it a mystery? Sure. But no more or less than any other explanation. We'll never know what's going on for sure. So why not just believe the best thing we can imagine and live a happy life with that?

Sound good to me. bigsmile




no photo
Sat 07/18/09 12:22 AM
I AGREE WITH YOU WHOLE-HEATEDLY! ! !

Thank you very much for your modesty, i.e. admitting the impossible -- NOT KNOWING THE ANSWER!!! * * * * * * *

* IT TAKES A GREAT PERSON TO DO THAT...

no photo
Sat 07/18/09 12:29 AM
Nevertheless, ENERGY must be contained somewhere...?
INFORMATION is useless since it is Not retained consciously...


laugh

1. That would be a large container. bigsmile (of course large and small are relative) bigsmile :wink:

2. Agreed, information is useless unless it is used by a conscious intelligence. But information also must be organized and stored. That is where MIND COMES INTO PLAY.

I believe there is a field that is a universal MIND. It arises from consciousness. It contains information in all forms. Information is stored in matter, and it is stored in living things, and living beings. Everything is conscious and everything is energy and everything is information. Matter is information stored(memory.) All memory is accessible by consciousness. Everything is alive and connected.

"I am that, you are that, this is that and that's all there is."

(Depak Chopra):banana:










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