Men wrote the bible however. His own creation was interpreting (or so they claimed) what they thought god was telling them. So who else can we blame for this human derived emotion?

If the criminal in prison says " People should not molest children", does that proclamation, simply by virtue of his low status, not hold true even still?



Do we say to the artist " I can not find inspiration" so therefore you were not inspired?

Its not about "defining inspiration". No one can substantiate such an outlandish claim one way or another.

However one can easily point out the human emotion with which the bible was written and in particular, jealousy which is inconsistent with omniscience.

What on earth does that mean?

When our children are jealous of each other, even though we know that we love them equally,does that compare with the jealousy we'd feel should our children reject our love and sacrifice in favor of a stranger who did not produce, nurture or sacrifice for them ?

Clearly we are not communicating here. I have stated that yes, I agree with you that god's jealousy was indeed similar to that of a rejected lover or one who seeks to ostracize all romantic rivals or competitors for their chosen’s affections so as to prevent the love, or in this case "worship" of his creations from straying or returning to their old gods/goddesses.

What my argument is quite frankly is BECAUSE that is the kind of jealousy god was displaying, it would hold true that this is a human derived emotion that is based in a sense of insecurity and fear of loss.

What people miss is that God's jealousy is not that of a rejected lover, but that of a rejected parent.

Even if that were the case, it is STILL inconsistent with omniscience. Not to mention that those passages I took were from the OT. Jesus was not even around yet thus no sacrifices made. Also, read these passages and what god is demanding that they do. Much closer to the rejected lover I do believe.

"omniscience" simply means "All knowing". I see no inconsistency.

Plenty of God's people were slaughtered in his name before the crucifiction of Jesus.

I'm sure you've heard of Cain and Abel.

Its absolutely inconsistent with omniscience to be a little insecure jealous menace and demand that your own creation give up all deities that existed PRIOR to you showing up out of nowhere.

If he was "all knowing" you would think he would not be so emotional and fearful.

Yes we all know the story of Cain and Abel. God also caused that nonsense. God likes Abel's dead animals better than Cain's fruits and vegetables. God essentially rejected Cain's offering and Cain, in a fit of religious jealousy (hmm there is that jealousy again) killed his own brother.

Nice parenting there.

God is niether emotional, nor fearful.

God is pure love and before love can be fully experienced, it demands reciprocation.

We are not pure love. We are made from dust.


I've been guilty in my past of rejecting God's love in favor of wanting to believe he doesn't exist. Of only percieving him as a childish tyrant with nothing but spite and hatred in his heart. Of the false conception that it's the same to worship the sun as it is to worship him.

But once I was convicted by God's spirit to seek truth and light out of a sincere desire to know and understand pure love, the still and soft voice of the Holy spirit began to give me peace with the man made conceptions I'd had previously.
Until you begin to seek God's pure love, you can not begin to understand it.

Then explain the reason why this thread was posted?



I choose to love whom and when I want. That person does not have to reciprocate my affections. They dont even need to know. I love unconditionally and I expect nothing in return. Love should never be in exchange for prostration and unyielding subjugation. That is hideous and not true love by my definition. I am a human and not a god.



I realize you are just making a stab at a spooky analogy yet its not true and that needs to be pointed out. We are flesh, blood, bone and emotion. Created by human and delivered to this earth by human. No storks and no invisible gods.



This view is very realistic and truthful in its own right. There is a mountain of evidence from even the bible itself to support this initial instinct. It does not limit you from having a deeply enriching spiritual experience. Just leave out the man-made pretense.



I think I have a pretty good handle on it right about now and its not pretty.

Of course you are free to ask and offer only a little. That doesn't mean there's not an infinite more to be had.


Even scientist agree that we're essentially only made of carbon atoms. It's where we came from and it's where our earthly form is going. "dust to dust".


I can see how one can gather only negative connotations from the Old Testement teachings if they have hardened their hearts against the new Covenent and good news of salvation through intercession of Jesus Christ and his suffering on the cross.

It's apparent that you're a very intelligent individual Krimsa, and I applaud your willingness to mentally spar with Christians to confirm your own convictions. I just hope that in your quite moments, when you have no such indignance and your spirit is willing to listen to that still, soft voice telling you that God is real and he longs for your acceptance, that your intelligence is rewarded by the realization of his truth.

What does that mean? Were you speaking to me? Have I not offered enough? If I am ever unclear on a particular topic or passage, feel free to ask.



Of course I would not disagree with the scientific description of human matter. I was commenting on the fact that you said that humans are "made from dust". I would be disagreeing with the biblical definition of "dust" which is what I thought you were attempting to impart.

I believe that our mother's give birth to us. The female mammal is responsible for creation.



I think I can point out a few of those "loving" versus from the NT if you like? Shall I begin? I think if my heart was hardened, I would not take such issue with the bible in fact. Quite the opposite of your description of me.



I have no such "convictions". You are once again projecting your own fears onto me. I take the position that there are definitely some questionable passages in the bible and we need to take a closer look at these and not dance circles around them and attempt to re-invent what was written by these men. From a historical stand point, we know that there were plenty of other factors at play here. Lets not behave like blind bats as that will get us nowhere.

If it bothers some, so be it. There is nothing I can do to alleviate their worry. In my quiet moments I try to get away from all of this honestly and meditate.

How many parents get angry with their children but still love them? Do we, as parents, ever conceive of damming them to eternal hell? And where is their free will when it is undermined with threats of damnation for not believing in us?

Here's another word that goes along with negative thoughts of God...obsessed...decieved.

Even still Allen...God does not fall off His throne because of our unbelief or rebellion & wrong thinking. He never gets weary like we do.

(Just wanted to throw that in there.)

Are you making a point here? Obsession and a feeling of being deceived would also be emotions experienced by humans and NOT omniscient beings.

Good, let me add by asking some questions...

Why would an omniscient being need to be jealous of anything damn thing?

Humans/Animals are made in similar fashion, we naturally have jealous traits - how can the creator have, what would surely be to ‘It’, the same negative traits? 'It's' supposed to be superior.

If everyone's life story is unfolding before 'It's' eyes, said omniscient being already knows what's going to happen... 'It' wrote the script, lol. This would be like a screenwriter showing anger and revenge of his own character's behaviours.

Even if God does not put every word into my mouth, 'It' is responsible for mine and very one else’s existence. A writer (creator) is responsible for giving his character’s their roles.

Another point... if we are made in 'It's' image does that make 'It' human, or are we just picture comparisons in some other way?

Besides, if your god had actually possessed all of these wonderful attributes as you claim, then shoudnt the Pagans have just come to this realization on their own without the fear of condemnation and being run through with a sword? Shoudnt they have dropped their old religions and customs and embraced the new god Yahweh? Why did they continue to worship their old gods/goddesses? Why was Yahweh so worried that they would not give up their old ways and give him their full attention?

Maybe the Pagan gods were better? Maybe they were already "present" in the sense that they embodied the seasons and the wheel of life and the passage of time through the cyclic change of the Earth. Your god is oblivious to it and only seeks control and martyrdom.