Topic: doesn't "Jesus is God" goes against God's law | |
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Sorry wrong article link...good link but not the one I wanted ot share.
I only can paste it. Sorry: The Word of God is addressed to men, and therefore it speaks the language of men. Because we cannot rise to God's level He, in grace, comes down to ours and converses with us in our own speech. The Apostle Paul tells us of how he was "caught up into Paradise and heard unspeakable words which it is not possible (margin) to utter" (2 Cor. 12:4). Those on earth could not understand the vernacular of Heaven. The finite cannot comprehend the Infinite, hence the Almighty deigns to couch His revelation in terms we may understand. It is for this reason the Bible contains many anthropomorphisms-i.e, representations of God in the form of man. God is Spirit, yet the Scriptures speak of Him as having eyes, ears, nostrils, breath, hands, etc., which is surely an accommodation of terms brought down to the level of human comprehension. Again; we read in Genesis 18:20, 21 "And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous, I will go down now, and see whether they have done altogether according to the cry of it, which is come up unto Me; and if not, I will know." Now, manifestly, this is an anthropologism-God speaking in human language. God knew the conditions which prevailed in Sodom, and His eyes had witnessed its fearful sins, yet He is pleased to use terms here that are taken from our own vocabulary. Again; in Genesis 22:12 we read "And He (God) said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou anything unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son, from Me." Here again, God is speaking in the language of men for He "knew" before He tested Abram exactly how the patriarch would act. So too the expression of God so often in Jeremiah (7:13 etc.) of Him "rising up early" is manifestly an accommodation of terms. In the same way we understand the words of Genesis 6:6-"It repented the LORD that He had made man on the earth"-as an accommodation of terms to human comprehension. This verse does not teach that God was confronted with an unforeseen contingency and therefore regretted that He had made man, but it expresses the abhorrence of a holy God at the awful wickedness and corruption into which man had fallen. Should there be any doubt remaining in the minds of our readers as to the legitimacy and soundness of our interpretation, a direct appeal to Scripture should instantly and entirely remove it-"The Strength of Israel (a Divine title) will not He nor repent: for He is not a man, that He should repent" (1 Sam. 15:29)! "Every good and perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with Whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning" (James 1:17)! One Scripture which we often find cited in order to overthrow the teaching advanced in this book is our Lord's lament over Jerusalem: "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!" (Matt. 23:37). The question is asked, Do not these words show that the Saviour acknowledged the defeat of His mission, that as a people the Jews resisted all His gracious overtures toward them? In replying to this question, it should first be pointed out that our Lord is here referring not so much to His own mission as He is upbraiding the Jews for having in all ages rejected His grace-this is clear from His reference to the "prophets." The Old Testament bears full witness of how graciously and patiently Jehovah dealt with His people, and with what extreme obstinancy, from first to last, they refused to be "gathered" unto Him, and how in the end He abandoned them to follow their own devices, yet, as the same Scriptures declare, the counsel of God was not frustrated by their wickedness, for it had been foretold (and therefore, decreed) by Him: see, for example, 1 Kings 8:33. Matthew 23:37 may well be compared with Isaiah 65:2 where the Lord says, "I have spread out My hands all the day unto a rebellious people, which walketh in a way that was not good, after their own thoughts." But, it may be asked, Did God seek to do that which was in opposition to His own eternal purpose? In words borrowed from Calvin we reply, "Though to our apprehension the will of God is manifold and various, yet He does not in Himself will things at variance with each other, but astonishes our faculties with His various and 'manifold' wisdom, according to the expression of Paul, till we shall be enabled to understand that He mysteriously wills what now seems contrary to His will." As a further illustration of the same principle we would refer the reader to Isaiah 5:1-4: "Now will I sing to my wellBeloved a song of my Beloved touching His vineyard. My wellBeloved hath a vineyard in a very fruitful hill: And He fenced it, and gathered out the stones thereof, and planted it with the choicest vine and built a tower in the midst of it, and also made a winepress therein: and He looked that it should bring forth grapes, and it brought forth wild grapes. And now, O inhabitants of Jerusalem, and men of Judah, judge, I pray you, betwixt Me and My vineyard. What could have been done more to My vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, it brought forth wild grapes?" Is it not plain from this language that God reckoned Himself to have done enough for Israel to warrant an expectation-speaking after the manner of men-of better returns? Yet, is it not equally evident when Jehovah says here "He looked that it should bring forth grapes" that He is accommodating Himself to a form of finite expression? And, so also when He says "What could have been done more to My vineyard, that I have not done in it?" we need to take note that in the previous enumeration of what He had done-the "fencing" etc.-He refers only to external privileges, means, and opportunities, which had been bestowed upon Israel, for, of course, He could even then have taken away from them their stony heart and given them a new heart, even a heart of flesh, had He so pleased. Tools Email to a Friend Print Version Bookmark / Share Subscribe to Desiring God podcasts, feeds and email subscriptions. From the series: The Pleasures of God From the topic: The Sovereignty of God Related Resources * History's Most Spectacular Sin (Online Books) * I Am the Lord, and Besides Me There Is No Savior (Sermons) * If the Lord Wills (Sermons) * Introduction to Spectacular Sins (Interviews) * Are There Two Wills in God? (Articles) Related Products The Pleasures of God: The Sermon Series (MP3 Audio CD Set) Ruth: Sweet & Bitter Providence (Audio CD Set) History's Most Spectacular Sin (Case of 100) (Case of Outreach Booklets) Sustained By Sovereign Grace—Forever (Audio CD) History's Most Spectacular Sin (Outreach Booklet) The Pleasure of God in All That He Does Listen | Download | Podcast Excerpts: Listen Download: Audio | Audio Excerpt By John Piper February 1, 1987 Psalm 135:6 Whatever the Lord pleases he does, in heaven and on earth, in the seas and all deeps. Two Assumptions Underlying This Series Two assumptions lie at the foundation of this new series of messages on the pleasures of God. 1. An Assumption About the Worth of a Soul The first assumption is that "The worth and excellency of a soul is measured by the object of its love" (Henry Scougal). If we apply that to God, then one way of beholding the worth and excellency of God is to meditate on what he loves. Another way to put it would be to say that the measure of God's dignity is determined by what he delights in. Or another way would be to say that the greatness of God's excellence is registered by his enjoyments. What he takes pleasure in signals the beauty and the preciousness of his character. 2. An Assumption About How We Are Transformed The second assumption is that when we fix our mind's attention on the worth and excellency of God, that is, when we meditate on his glory, we are changed little by little into his likeness. And we all with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being changed into his likeness from one degree of glory to another. (2 Corinthians 3:18) So my goal in these next 12 weeks is to direct your attention to the pleasures of God revealed in Scripture; in the hope that you will see in them some of the infinite measure of God's worth and excellency; and in seeing this glory that you might rise one step at a time into his likeness; so that at home and work and school people will see your good works and give glory to your Father in heaven. Portray his pleasures in preaching. Behold his glory in listening. Approach his likeness in meditation. Display his worth in the world. May God be gracious to bless the ministry of his Word in these weeks. God Has Always Been Exuberantly Happy Last week we focused on the pleasure that God the Father has in his Son. The most important lesson to be learned from that truth is this: God is and always has been an exuberantly happy God. He has never been lonely. He has always rejoiced with overflowing satisfaction in the glory of his Son. You might say that the Son of God has always been the landscape of God's excellencies or the panorama of God's perfections. And therefore from all eternity God has beheld with overflowing satisfaction the magnificent terrain of his own radiance reflected in the Son. God Is Not Constrained by Anything Outside Himself A second lesson to learn from this truth is that God is not constrained by anything outside himself to do anything he does not want to do. If God were unhappy, if he were in some way deficient, then he might indeed be constrained from outside in some way to do what he does not want to do in order to make up his deficiency and finally to be happy. That is the way we are. We come into the world knowing almost nothing and have to spend years and years going to classes or learning in the school of hard knocks. Parents and teachers tell us to do things that we don't like to do because we need to do them to overcome some deficiency in ourselves—to increase our knowledge or strengthen our bodies or refine our manners. But God is not like that. He has been complete and overflowing with satisfaction from all eternity. He needs no education. No one can offer anything to him that doesn't already come from him. And so no one can bribe him or coerce him in any way. You can't bribe a mountain spring with bucketfuls of water from the valley. Therefore God does what he does not begrudgingly or under external constraint as though he were boxed in or trapped by some unforeseen or unplanned situation. On the contrary, because he is complete and exuberantly happy and overflowing with satisfaction in the fellowship of the Trinity, all he does is free and uncoerced. His deeds are the overflow of his joy. This is what it means when the Scripture says that God does something according to the "good pleasure" of his will. It means that nothing outside God's own pleasure—the pleasure he has in what he is, nothing but that pleasure—has constrained his choices and his deeds. God Does Whatever He Pleases This brings us to the focus of today's message—"The Pleasure of God in All That He Does"—and today's text: Psalm 135. The psalm begins by calling us to praise the Lord: "Praise the Lord. Praise the name of the Lord." Then, starting in verse 3 the psalmist gives us reasons for why we should feel praise rising in our hearts toward God. It says, for example, "Praise the Lord, for the Lord is good." The list of reasons for praise goes on until it comes to verse 6, and this is the verse I want us to focus on this morning: Whatever the Lord pleases he does, in heaven and on earth, in the seas and all deeps. Psalm 115:3 says the same thing: Our God is in the heavens; he does whatever he pleases. This verse teaches that whenever God acts, he acts in a way that pleases him. God is never constrained to do a thing that he despises. He is never backed into a corner where his only recourse is to do something he hates to do. He does whatever he pleases. And therefore, in some sense, he has pleasure in all that he does. Isaiah uses the same Hebrew word (as a noun) in Isaiah 46:10 where the Lord says, My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my pleasure. On the basis of these texts and many others we should bow before God and praise his sovereign freedom—that in some sense at least he always acts in freedom, according to his own "good pleasure," following the dictates of his own delights. He never becomes the victim of circumstance. He is never forced into a situation where he must do something in which he cannot rejoice. Does God Really Take Pleasure in All He Does? This is a glorious picture of God in his sovereign freedom—to do whatever he pleases and to accomplish all his pleasure. But it would be a fuzzy picture, a bit out of focus, if we stopped here. To bring it into focus and sharpen it up we have to ask this question: "How can God say in Ezekiel 18:23 and 32 that he does not have pleasure in the death of any impenitent person, if in fact he accomplishes all his pleasure and does whatever he pleases?" The Question Raised by Ezekiel 18 In Ezekiel 18:30 God is warning the house of Israel of impending judgment: "Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, says the Lord." And he is urging them to repent: "Repent and turn from all your transgressions." At the end of verse 31 he says, "Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of any one, says the Lord God; so turn, and live." This seems to be a very different picture than the one we saw in Psalm 135, where God does whatever he pleases. Here he seems to be cornered. It seems that he is forced into judging them when he really doesn't want to. He seems to be about to do something that he is not pleased to do. Is he going to accomplish all his pleasure or not? Is God really free to do all everything according to his good pleasure? Or does his sovereign freedom have its limits? Can he do whatever he pleases up to a point, and then after that is he cornered into doing things he only grieves to do? We Cannot Limit God's Freedom to Nature We might try to solve the problem by going back to Psalm 135 and saying that God does whatever he pleases in the natural world but not in the personal sphere. After all it says in verse 7: He it is who makes the clouds rise at the end of the earth, who makes lightnings for the rain and brings forth the wind from his storehouses. But this effort to limit God's freedom to the sphere of nature will not work for two reasons. 1. One is that if God controls the wind and makes it blow whenever and wherever he pleases—which is certainly true (remember Jesus' "Peace! Be still!")—then God is responsible for the destruction of thousands of lives by drowning because of the storms and hurricanes and tornadoes and monsoons and typhoons which God has brought forth from his storehouses over the centuries. So when Psalm 135 says that the Lord does whatever he pleases, it has to include the taking of personal life at sea through the wind which he alone controls. 2. But the text doesn't leave us to draw out silent inferences like that. The psalmist goes on in verses 8-11 to say that God's sovereign freedom was shown most vividly in the Exodus out of Egypt: 8) He it was who smote the first-born of Egypt, both of man and of beast . . . 10) who smote many nations and slew mighty kings . . . That is the second reason you can't limit the freedom of God in this psalm to the natural realm. When the psalmist says in verse 6 that "whatever the Lord pleases he does," he doesn't just refer implicitly to the tragedies owing to wind; he also refers explicitly to the destruction of rebellious Egyptians, and nations, and kings. This is the scope of what God does when he does whatever he pleases. So in Ezekiel it says that God is not pleased with the death of unrepentant people, and in Psalm 135 it says that God does whatever he pleases including the slaying unrepentant people. And the very same Hebrew verb is used in Psalm 135:6 ("he pleases") and Ezekiel 18:32 ("he has pleasure"). The Problem Gets Worse Before I suggest a solution to this problem, let me make it worse. Many Christians today have a conception of God that isn't troubled by his being cornered into doing things he doesn't want to do. And I can easily imagine that one response to what we have seen so far would be to say that we have created an artificial problem because Psalm 135 doesn't actually say that God takes delight in destroying the Egyptians. Perhaps someone would say that "doing whatever he pleases" in Psalm 135:6 is just a figure of speech and doesn't carry the sense of pleasure or delight. And so they would say that God only grieves when he must judge unrepentant sinners, and there is no sense in which he is doing what he is pleased to do. In answer to this I would say again that the same word used in Psalm 135:6 for God's being "pleased" is used in Ezekiel 18:32 for God's not being "pleased." Then I would direct attention to Deuteronomy 28:63 where Moses warns of coming judgment on unrepentant Israel. But this time it says something strikingly different from Ezekiel 18:32, And as the Lord took delight in doing you good and multiplying you, so the Lord will take delight in bringing ruin upon you and destroying you. (Cf. Proverbs 1:24-26; Revelation 18:20; Ezekiel 5:13.) So we are brought back to the inescapable fact that in some sense God does not delight in the death of the wicked (that is the message of Ezekiel 18), and in some sense he does (that is the message of Psalm 135:6-11 and Deuteronomy 28:63). A Solution to the Problem I have commended a solution to you before and I will commend it again: namely, that the death and misery of the unrepentant is in and of itself no delight to God. God is not a sadist. He is not malicious or bloodthirsty. Instead, when a rebellious, wicked, unbelieving person is judged, what God delights in is the vindication of truth and goodness and of his own honor and glory. When Moses warns Israel that the Lord will take delight in bringing ruin upon them and destroying them if they don't repent, he means that those who have rebelled against the Lord and moved beyond repentance will not be able to gloat that they have made the Almighty miserable. Quite the contrary. Moses says that when they are judged, they will unwittingly give an opportunity for God to rejoice in the demonstration of his justice and his power and the infinite worth of his glory 'Numbers ' tv show. Math geniuses are so far beyond our understanding and God is infinetly beyond theirs. Let us not turn theology into Philosophy . Rationalism God of the Possible Discards the Unknown, Mysterious Dimensions of God The Bible continually portrays God as One whose character and ways are infinitely beyond any substantial human understanding and whose future plans will not be overturned by anyone or anything. Here is a Scriptural sampler.28 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, OR WHO BECAME HIS COUNSELOR? (Rom 11:33-34). "And all the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, but He does according to His will in the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of earth; and no one can ward off His hand or say to Him, 'What hast Thou done? . . . (Dan 4:35). "For My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways," declares the LORD. "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts" (Isa 55:8-9). Do you not know? Have you not heard? The everlasting God, the LORD, the creator of the ends of the earth does not become weary or tired. His understanding is inscrutable (Isa 40:28). How precious also are Thy thoughts to me, 0 God! How vast is the sum of them! If I should count them, they would outnumber the sand. When I awake, I am still with Thee (Ps 139:17-18). How great are Thy works, 0 LORD! Thy thoughts are very deep. A senseless man has no knowledge; nor does a stupid man understand this (Ps 92:5-6). How blessed is the man who has made the LORD his trust, and has not turned to the proud, nor to those who lapse into falsehood. Many, 0 LORD my God, are the wonders which Thou has done, and Thy thoughts toward us; there is none to compare with Thee; if I would declare and speak of them, they would be too numerous to count (Ps 40:4-5). The LORD nullifies the counsel of the nations; He frustrates the plans of the peoples. The counsel of the LORD stands forever, the plans of His heart from generation to generation (Ps 33: 10-11). Openness advocates, so bent on philosophically and anthropocentrically finding closure in defining and explaining God, cannot properly handle the tensions that are presented in Scripture when the divine side and the human side are both presented side-by-side without any sense of contradiction or need of special explanation. For instance, take the inspiration of Scripture. All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness (2 Tim 3:16). For no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God (2 Pet 1:21). Paul, a bond-servant of Christ Jesus, called as an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God . . . . to all who are beloved of God in Rome . . . (Rom 1: 1, 7). I, Tertius, who write this letter, greet you in the Lord (Rom 16:22). Who wrote Romans? God the Father? God the Spirit? Paul? Or Tertius? The answer is "Yes!" There was a Divine side and a human side." Do we understand fully how it works? "No!" Do we accept it by faith? "Yes!" Do we believe that God dictated all of Scripture, even though we know that He actually dictated some? "No!" Do we believe the human authors could have exercised their own will and human acumen to override what God intended to be written? "No"! Can we explain this with full satisfaction to the human mind? "No!" Do we have to? "No!" We must live with the tension that God determined and man participated in recording what Scripture itself calls "the Word of God," not the "Word of men' (1 Thess 2:13).30 The same tension exists in understanding that Christ is fully God and fully man. Who can explain it? No one, but we believe it by faith as taught in the Bible. Mental tension also exists in attempting to understand what part God plays and what part man plays in individual human salvation. The same tension is experienced in reconciling how God's will and foreknowledge relate to the will of humans. When faced with these immensely important issues which stretch the human mind to and sometimes beyond its limits, it is best to let God be God, to rest in the fact that God has not revealed an unabridged knowledge of Himself in Scripture, and to decide on behalf of God being determinative rather than humans. It will never be God's lack of knowledge concerning humans, but rather our finite, limited understanding of God that creates the intellectual difficulties with which we struggle.31 "Human reason, therefore, must adjust itself to God's being and not the reverse." 32 Thus, this subject is an exegetical issue not a philosophical one; it is decidedly revelational in nature. - Show quoted text - |
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Untill gen 2:4 we see Elohim creating. This is plural. Which woulld match what Yahshua said he was the word and created all things through the father. Yahshua was created a spirit being from his Father Yahweh. Which of the Angels have I called my son. Elswhere Yahweh says he is 1. As in the 3rd commandment. The Holy spirit came on the prophets in the OT the same one that came at Pentacost. We do not have any trinity. It is solely the Father who gets things done. Through his people. Yahshua obeyed his father and even said he does nothing unless the father tells him too. The Holy Spirit is not a Diety as Yahweh is Yahshua is divine but he is not Yahweh. The Holy Spirit is the Breath or spirit of Yahweh. As what happened at Pentacost you saw Yahshua as a tongue ( the word of Yahweh) and Yahweh as a fire that can not be consumed. Just like Moses in the desert. Claiming Yahweh as anything but one very well may be Blaspemy which will not be forgiven in this life or the one to come..Blessings..Miles right "Miles" that is what I mean ..this clearly shows that Yahshua was clearly not Yahweh ...and that the trinity is actually a violation of God's law oh c'mon guys, just because you want to interprate the book to suit your needs doesn't mean your correct. look at all the evangelicals thinking theres a rapture coming or that the rebirth of israel is a sign of the end. you can beleive it if you want - but thats just comfort food like your greasy stuff and beer - it only last til you excreciate it the next day. "Tribo" ...since what was in "Miles" post was also clearly written in bible then how can it be our interpetation ... we didn't write the thing the very fact you read it and determine what you think it says makes you funches guilty as charged go to jail - donot pass go - donot collect greasy food and beer. |
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Or to sum up in brief. If God repented like a man would/could. That would mean He is not infinetly happy. That would mean something/s happened that upset Him. That would mean He didn'nt know something and He could learn and not be all knowing.
He reveals Himself to us in terms we can understand. We are told that we have to choose Jesus for salvation then we read. It was God who chooses us. For if we chose it would be a reward for salvation and not a gift...etc.. |
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to answer the question yes called jesus a god is going agnaist gods law
jesus was a prophet not a god |
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Thats the point. He didn't repent. Just like he knew where Adam was before he asked. And why He knew Abrahams heart before He told him to sacrifice his son and the bible says " Now I know you love me" God knew before. He knows everything. " Not a bird falls out if the sky dead outside of the will ( hidden decree) of God. God' ssoverign over all people and thier hearts: "Kovere" ..it God knew before he made man that he would be sorry for creating them and would repent for doing so but yet created them anyway and repented again that he was sorry ...makes God sound crazy not ominscient |
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Sorry wrong article link...good link but not the one I wanted ot share. I only can paste it. Sorry: oh my God ....oops I meant geez "Kovere" can't you just use your own thoughts ... |
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Untill gen 2:4 we see Elohim creating. This is plural. Which woulld match what Yahshua said he was the word and created all things through the father. Yahshua was created a spirit being from his Father Yahweh. Which of the Angels have I called my son. Elswhere Yahweh says he is 1. As in the 3rd commandment. The Holy spirit came on the prophets in the OT the same one that came at Pentacost. We do not have any trinity. It is solely the Father who gets things done. Through his people. Yahshua obeyed his father and even said he does nothing unless the father tells him too. The Holy Spirit is not a Diety as Yahweh is Yahshua is divine but he is not Yahweh. The Holy Spirit is the Breath or spirit of Yahweh. As what happened at Pentacost you saw Yahshua as a tongue ( the word of Yahweh) and Yahweh as a fire that can not be consumed. Just like Moses in the desert. Claiming Yahweh as anything but one very well may be Blaspemy which will not be forgiven in this life or the one to come..Blessings..Miles right "Miles" that is what I mean ..this clearly shows that Yahshua was clearly not Yahweh ...and that the trinity is actually a violation of God's law oh c'mon guys, just because you want to interprate the book to suit your needs doesn't mean your correct. look at all the evangelicals thinking theres a rapture coming or that the rebirth of israel is a sign of the end. you can beleive it if you want - but thats just comfort food like your greasy stuff and beer - it only last til you excreciate it the next day. "Tribo" ...since what was in "Miles" post was also clearly written in bible then how can it be our interpetation ... we didn't write the thing the very fact you read it and determine what you think it says makes you funches guilty as charged go to jail - donot pass go - donot collect greasy food and beer. "Tribo" please I gots to have that greasy food and beer ...where's your compassion |
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to answer the question yes called jesus a god is going agnaist gods law jesus was a prophet not a god "Chancey456"...to make up ones mind that your destiny is to be killed and then resort to doing everything to fullfilled that destiny is not being a prophet it's being suicidal |
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I did but you didn't get it. I posted an article that explains in detail the answer to your question. ..butI doubt you will read it. You're not looking for the truth your trying too hard to make a point that has no biblical grounds.
Read the article and make a point for point rebuttal . Just using childish remarks about posting an article and not using my personal words is just silly. Read it and lets see how much you really care about finding the truth |
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Edited by
krovere
on
Mon 10/27/08 10:28 AM
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to answer the question yes called jesus a god is going agnaist gods law jesus was a prophet not a god Ha..ha..It's like the old 'Jesus was just a good teacher' argument..lol A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic - on the level with a man who says he is a poached egg - or he would be the devil of hell. You must take your choice. Either this was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. |
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Untill gen 2:4 we see Elohim creating. This is plural. Which woulld match what Yahshua said he was the word and created all things through the father. Yahshua was created a spirit being from his Father Yahweh. Which of the Angels have I called my son. Elswhere Yahweh says he is 1. As in the 3rd commandment. The Holy spirit came on the prophets in the OT the same one that came at Pentacost. We do not have any trinity. It is solely the Father who gets things done. Through his people. Yahshua obeyed his father and even said he does nothing unless the father tells him too. The Holy Spirit is not a Diety as Yahweh is Yahshua is divine but he is not Yahweh. The Holy Spirit is the Breath or spirit of Yahweh. As what happened at Pentacost you saw Yahshua as a tongue ( the word of Yahweh) and Yahweh as a fire that can not be consumed. Just like Moses in the desert. Claiming Yahweh as anything but one very well may be Blaspemy which will not be forgiven in this life or the one to come..Blessings..Miles right "Miles" that is what I mean ..this clearly shows that Yahshua was clearly not Yahweh ...and that the trinity is actually a violation of God's law oh c'mon guys, just because you want to interprate the book to suit your needs doesn't mean your correct. look at all the evangelicals thinking theres a rapture coming or that the rebirth of israel is a sign of the end. you can beleive it if you want - but thats just comfort food like your greasy stuff and beer - it only last til you excreciate it the next day. "Tribo" ...since what was in "Miles" post was also clearly written in bible then how can it be our interpetation ... we didn't write the thing the very fact you read it and determine what you think it says makes you funches guilty as charged go to jail - donot pass go - donot collect greasy food and beer. What is wrong Tribo? Elohim is used untill it says this is the history then all of a sudden we have Yahweh Elohim .. Why? So tell me where I am Wrong.. Shalom...Miles |
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Wow...
You quote the very book that is used as a basis for falsely claiming a man... (i.e. walks,talks, excretes, takes baths) is god... and expect people to believe what is written is truth? That book is suspect since it has been touched and retouched by the TOOLS OF MAN until it is no longer a thing of god... But rather a tool used to fool even the elect of the churches of man and control the very faith you hold within you. |
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I did but you didn't get it. I posted an article that explains in detail the answer to your question. ..butI doubt you will read it. You're not looking for the truth your trying too hard to make a point that has no biblical grounds. Read the article and make a point for point rebuttal . Just using childish remarks about posting an article and not using my personal words is just silly. Read it and lets see how much you really care about finding the truth no "kovere" I'm looking to discuss what may be possible truths not to forever read all the 'google cut and paste" that be going on in it place ...there are some that try to paste the entire bible into a thread if you have read the article but yet you can't even place what you read in the article and condense it into your own thoughts to share then what does that say about the article don't wonder I will help you get over your "google cut and paste' addiction as i have helped many |
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8 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> planted <05193> (8799) a garden <01588> eastward <06924> in Eden <05731>; and there <08033> he put <07760> (8799) the man <0120> whom <0834> he had formed <03335> (8804).
9 And out <04480> of the ground <0127> made <06779> <00> the LORD <03068> God <0430> to grow <06779> (8686) every tree <06086> that is pleasant <02530> (8737) to the sight <04758>, and good <02896> for food <03978>; the tree <06086> of life <02416> also in the midst <08432> of the garden <01588>, and the tree <06086> of knowledge <01847> of good <02896> and evil <07451>. 10 And a river <05104> went out <03318> (8802) of Eden <05731> to water <08248> (8687) the garden <01588>; and from thence it was parted <06504> (8735), and became into four <0702> heads <07218>. 11 The name <08034> of the first <0259> is Pison <06376>: that <01931> is it which compasseth <05437> (8802) the whole land <0776> of Havilah <02341>, where <0834> there is gold <02091>; 12 And the gold <02091> of that <01931> land <0776> is good <02896>: there is bdellium <0916> and the onyx <07718> stone <068>. 13 And the name <08034> of the second <08145> river <05104> is Gihon <01521>: the same is it that compasseth <05437> (8802) the whole land <0776> of Ethiopia <03568>. {Ethiopia: Heb. Cush} 14 And the name <08034> of the third <07992> river <05104> is Hiddekel <02313>: that is it which goeth toward <01980> (8802) the east <06926> of Assyria <0804>. And the fourth <07243> river <05104> is Euphrates <06578>. {toward…: or, eastward to Assyria} 15 And the LORD <03068> God <0430> took <03947> (8799) the man <0120>, and put him <03240> (8686) into the garden <01588> of Eden <05731> to dress <05647> (8800) it and to keep <08104> (8800) it. {the man: or, Adam} 16 And the LORD <03068> God <0430> commanded <06680> (8762) the man <0120>, saying <0559> (8800), Of every tree <06086> of the garden <01588> thou mayest freely <0398> (8800) eat <0398> (8799): {thou…: Heb. eating thou shalt eat} {*} 17 But of the tree <06086> of the knowledge <01847> of good <02896> and evil <07451>, thou shalt not eat <0398> (8799) of it: for in the day <03117> that thou eatest <0398> (8800) thereof thou shalt surely <04191> (8800) die <04191> (8799). {thou shalt surely…: Heb. dying thou shalt die} {*} 18 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> said <0559> (8799), It is not good <02896> that the man <0120> should be <01961> (8800) alone; I will make <06213> (8799) him an help meet <05828> for him. {meet…: Heb. as before him} 19 And out of the ground <0127> the LORD <03068> God <0430> formed <03335> (8799) every beast <02416> of the field <07704>, and every fowl <05775> of the air <08064>; and brought <0935> (8686) them unto Adam <0120> to see <07200> (8800) what he would call <07121> (8799) them: and whatsoever Adam <0120> called <07121> (8799) every living <02416> creature <05315>, that <01931> was the name thereof <08034>. {Adam: or, the man} 20 And Adam <0120> gave <07121> (8799) names <08034> to all cattle <0929>, and to the fowl <05775> of the air <08064>, and to every beast <02416> of the field <07704>; but for Adam <0120> there was not found <04672> (8804) an help meet <05828> for him. {gave: Heb. called} 21 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> caused <05307> <00> a deep sleep <08639> to fall <05307> (8686) upon Adam <0121>, and he slept <03462> (8799): and he took <03947> (8799) one <0259> of his ribs <06763>, and closed up <05462> (8799) the flesh <01320> instead thereof; 22 And the rib <06763>, which the LORD <03068> God <0430> had taken <03947> (8804) from man <0120>, made <01129> (8799) he a woman <0802>, and brought <0935> (8686) her unto the man <0120>. {made: Heb. builded} 23 And Adam <0120> said <0559> (8799), This <02063> is now <06471> bone <06106> of my bones <06106>, and flesh <01320> of my flesh <01320>: she <02063> shall be called <07121> (8735) Woman <0802>, because she <02063> was taken <03947> (8795) out of Man <0376>. {Woman: Heb. Isha} {Man: Heb. Ish} 24 Therefore <03651> shall a man <0376> leave <05800> (8799) his father <01> and his mother <0517>, and shall cleave <01692> (8804) unto his wife <0802>: and they shall be one <0259> flesh <01320>. 25 And they were both <08147> naked <06174>, the man <0120> and his wife <0802>, and were not ashamed <0954> (8709). 1 ¶ Now the serpent <05175> was <01961> (8804) more subtil <06175> than any beast <02416> of the field <07704> which the LORD <03068> God <0430> had made <06213> (8804). And he said <0559> (8799) unto the woman <0802>, Yea <0637>, hath God <0430> said <0559> (8804), Ye shall not eat <0398> (8799) of every tree <06086> of the garden <01588>? {Yea…: Heb. Yea, because, etc.} 2 And the woman <0802> said <0559> (8799) unto the serpent <05175>, We may eat <0398> (8799) of the fruit <06529> of the trees <06086> of the garden <01588>: 3 But of the fruit <06529> of the tree <06086> which is in the midst <08432> of the garden <01588>, God <0430> hath said <0559> (8804), Ye shall not eat <0398> (8799) of it, neither shall ye touch <05060> (8799) it, lest <06435> ye die <04191> (8799). 4 And the serpent <05175> said <0559> (8799) unto the woman <0802>, Ye shall not surely <04191> (8800) die <04191> (8799): 5 For God <0430> doth know <03045> (8802) that in the day <03117> ye eat <0398> (8800) thereof, then your eyes <05869> shall be opened <06491> (8738), and ye shall be as gods <0430>, knowing <03045> (8802) good <02896> and evil <07451>. 6 ¶ And when the woman <0802> saw <07200> (8799) that the tree <06086> was good <02896> for food <03978>, and that it <01931> was pleasant <08378> to the eyes <05869>, and a tree <06086> to be desired <02530> (8737) to make one wise <07919> (8687), she took <03947> (8799) of the fruit thereof <06529>, and did eat <0398> (8799), and gave <05414> (8799) also <01571> unto her husband <0376> with her; and he did eat <0398> (8799). {pleasant: Heb. a desire} 7 And the eyes <05869> of them both <08147> were opened <06491> (8735), and they <01992> knew <03045> (8799) that they were naked <05903>; and they sewed <08609> <00> fig <08384> leaves <05929> together <08609> (8799), and made themselves <06213> (8799) aprons <02290>. {aprons: or, things to gird about} 8 And they heard <08085> (8799) the voice <06963> of the LORD <03068> God <0430> walking <01980> (8693) in the garden <01588> in the cool <07307> of the day <03117>: and Adam <0120> and his wife <0802> hid themselves <02244> (8691) from the presence <06440> of the LORD <03068> God <0430> amongst <08432> the trees <06086> of the garden <01588>. {cool: Heb. wind} 9 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> called <07121> (8799) unto Adam <0120>, and said <0559> (8799) unto him, Where art thou <0335>? 10 And he said <0559> (8799), I heard <08085> (8804) thy voice <06963> in the garden <01588>, and I was afraid <03372> (8799), because I <0595> was naked <05903>; and I hid myself <02244> (8735). 11 ¶ And he said <0559> (8799), Who <04310> told <05046> (8689) thee that thou wast naked <05903>? Hast thou eaten <0398> (8804) of the tree <06086>, whereof I commanded thee <06680> (8765) that thou shouldest not <01115> eat <0398> (8800)? 12 And the man <0120> said <0559> (8799), The woman <0802> whom thou gavest <05414> (8804) to be with me <05978>, she <01931> gave <05414> (8804) me of the tree <06086>, and I did eat <0398> (8799). 13 And the LORD <03068> God <0430> said <0559> (8799) unto the woman <0802>, What is this that thou hast done <06213> (8804)? And the woman <0802> said <0559> (8799), The serpent <05175> beguiled me <05377> (8689), and I did eat <0398> (8799). 14 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> said <0559> (8799) unto the serpent <05175>, Because thou <0859> hast done <06213> (8804) this, thou art cursed <0779> (8803) above all cattle <0929>, and above every beast <02416> of the field <07704>; upon thy belly <01512> shalt thou go <03212> (8799), and dust <06083> shalt thou eat <0398> (8799) all the days <03117> of thy life <02416>: 15 And I will put <07896> (8799) enmity <0342> between thee and the woman <0802>, and between thy seed <02233> and her seed <02233>; it shall bruise <07779> (8799) thy head <07218>, and thou shalt bruise <07779> (8799) his heel <06119>. 16 ¶ Unto the woman <0802> he said <0559> (8804), I will greatly <07235> (8687) multiply <07235> (8686) thy sorrow <06093> and thy conception <02032>; in sorrow <06089> thou shalt bring forth <03205> (8799) children <01121>; and thy desire <08669> shall be to thy husband <0376>, and he shall rule <04910> (8799) over thee. {to thy…: or, subject to thy husband} 17 ¶ And unto Adam <0121> he said <0559> (8804), Because thou hast hearkened <08085> (8804) unto the voice <06963> of thy wife <0802>, and hast eaten <0398> (8799) of the tree <06086>, of which <0834> I commanded thee <06680> (8765), saying <0559> (8800), Thou shalt not eat <0398> (8799) of it: cursed <0779> (8803) is the ground <0127> for thy sake; in sorrow <06093> shalt thou eat <0398> (8799) of it all <03605> the days <03117> of thy life <02416>; 18 Thorns also <06975> and thistles <01863> shall it bring forth <06779> (8686) to thee; and thou shalt eat <0398> (8804) the herb <06212> of the field <07704>; {bring…: Heb. cause to bud} 19 In the sweat <02188> of thy face <0639> shalt thou eat <0398> (8799) bread <03899>, till <05704> thou return <07725> (8800) unto the ground <0127>; for out of it wast thou taken <03947> (8795): for dust <06083> thou <0859> art, and unto dust <06083> shalt thou return <07725> (8799). 20 ¶ And Adam <0120> called <07121> (8799) his wife’s <0802> name <08034> Eve <02332>; because she was the mother <0517> of all living <02416>. {Eve: Heb. Chavah: that is Living} 21 ¶ Unto Adam <0120> also and to his wife <0802> did the LORD <03068> God <0430> make <06213> (8799) coats <03801> of skins <05785>, and clothed them <03847> (8686). 22 ¶ And the LORD <03068> God <0430> said <0559> (8799), Behold <02005>, the man <0120> is become as one <0259> of us, to know <03045> (8800) good <02896> and evil <07451>: and now, lest he put forth <07971> (8799) his hand <03027>, and take <03947> (8804) also of the tree <06086> of life <02416>, and eat <0398> (8804), and live <02425> (8804) for ever <05769>: 23 Therefore the LORD <03068> God <0430> sent him forth <07971> (8762) from the garden <01588> of Eden <05731>, to till <05647> (8800) the ground <0127> from whence he was taken <03947> (8795). 24 So he drove out <01644> (8762) the man <0120>; and he placed <07931> (8686) at the east <06924> of the garden <01588> of Eden <05731> Cherubims <03742>, and a flaming <03858> sword <02719> which turned every way <02015> (8693), to keep <08104> (8800) the way <01870> of the tree <06086> of life <02416>. 1 ¶ And Adam <0120> knew <03045> (8804) <0853> Eve <02332> his wife <0802>; and she conceived <02029> (8799), and bare <03205> (8799) <0853> Cain <07014>, and said <0559> (8799), I have gotten <07069> (8804) a man <0376> from <0854> the LORD <03068>. {Cain: that is, Gotten, or, Acquired} 2 And she again <03254> (8686) bare <03205> (8800) his brother <0251> Abel <01893>. And Abel <01893> was a keeper <07462> (8802) of sheep <06629>, but Cain <07014> was a tiller <05647> (8802) of the ground <0127>. {Abel: Heb. Hebel} {a keeper: Heb. a feeder} 3 ¶ And in process <07093> of time <03117> it came to pass, that Cain <07014> brought <0935> (8686) of the fruit <06529> of the ground <0127> an offering <04503> unto the LORD <03068>. {in process…: Heb. at the end of days} 4 And Abel <01893>, he <01931> also brought <0935> (8689) of the firstlings <01062> of his flock <06629> and of the fat <02459> thereof. And the LORD <03068> had respect <08159> (8799) unto Abel <01893> and to his offering <04503>: {flock: Heb. sheep, or, goats} 5 But unto Cain <07014> and to his offering <04503> he had not respect <08159> (8804). And Cain <07014> was very <03966> wroth <02734> (8799), and his countenance <06440> fell <05307> (8799). 6 ¶ And the LORD <03068> said <0559> (8799) unto Cain <07014>, Why art thou wroth <02734> (8804)? and why is thy countenance <06440> fallen <05307> (8804)? 7 If <0518> thou doest well <03190> (8686), shalt thou not be accepted <07613>? and if thou doest not well <03190> (8686), sin <02403> lieth <07257> (8802) at the door <06607>. And unto thee shall be his desire <08669>, and thou shalt rule <04910> (8799) over him. {be accepted: or, have the excellency} {unto…: or, subject unto thee} you have helped no one!!!!! |
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Untill gen 2:4 we see Elohim creating. This is plural. Which woulld match what Yahshua said he was the word and created all things through the father. Yahshua was created a spirit being from his Father Yahweh. Which of the Angels have I called my son. Elswhere Yahweh says he is 1. As in the 3rd commandment. The Holy spirit came on the prophets in the OT the same one that came at Pentacost. We do not have any trinity. It is solely the Father who gets things done. Through his people. Yahshua obeyed his father and even said he does nothing unless the father tells him too. The Holy Spirit is not a Diety as Yahweh is Yahshua is divine but he is not Yahweh. The Holy Spirit is the Breath or spirit of Yahweh. As what happened at Pentacost you saw Yahshua as a tongue ( the word of Yahweh) and Yahweh as a fire that can not be consumed. Just like Moses in the desert. Claiming Yahweh as anything but one very well may be Blaspemy which will not be forgiven in this life or the one to come..Blessings..Miles right "Miles" that is what I mean ..this clearly shows that Yahshua was clearly not Yahweh ...and that the trinity is actually a violation of God's law oh c'mon guys, just because you want to interprate the book to suit your needs doesn't mean your correct. look at all the evangelicals thinking theres a rapture coming or that the rebirth of israel is a sign of the end. you can beleive it if you want - but thats just comfort food like your greasy stuff and beer - it only last til you excreciate it the next day. "Tribo" ...since what was in "Miles" post was also clearly written in bible then how can it be our interpetation ... we didn't write the thing the very fact you read it and determine what you think it says makes you funches guilty as charged go to jail - donot pass go - donot collect greasy food and beer. What is wrong Tribo? Elohim is used untill it says this is the history then all of a sudden we have Yahweh Elohim .. Why? So tell me where I am Wrong.. Shalom...Miles oh c'mon miles, your always wrong - just accept it as your lot in life - |
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I did but you didn't get it. I posted an article that explains in detail the answer to your question. ..butI doubt you will read it. You're not looking for the truth your trying too hard to make a point that has no biblical grounds. Read the article and make a point for point rebuttal . Just using childish remarks about posting an article and not using my personal words is just silly. Read it and lets see how much you really care about finding the truth no "kovere" I'm looking to discuss what may be possible truths not to forever read all the 'google cut and paste" that be going on in it place ...there are some that try to paste the entire bible into a thread if you have read the article but yet you can't even place what you read in the article and condense it into your own thoughts to share then what does that say about the article don't wonder I will help you get over your "google cut and paste' addiction as i have helped many You prove my point once more. you don't want to know the truth. If you did you would have read one of the best articles on the topic refuting a heresy called open theism. Which I'm sure you know about in your vast quest for truth... Since you are not serious about actually learning something opposed to your own personal opinions I have to leave what I previously wrote as final Good luck in your 'search' |
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you have helped no one!!!!! "Tribo" I will make you "phisher" of men if you follow me |
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I did but you didn't get it. I posted an article that explains in detail the answer to your question. ..butI doubt you will read it. You're not looking for the truth your trying too hard to make a point that has no biblical grounds. Read the article and make a point for point rebuttal . Just using childish remarks about posting an article and not using my personal words is just silly. Read it and lets see how much you really care about finding the truth no "kovere" I'm looking to discuss what may be possible truths not to forever read all the 'google cut and paste" that be going on in it place ...there are some that try to paste the entire bible into a thread if you have read the article but yet you can't even place what you read in the article and condense it into your own thoughts to share then what does that say about the article don't wonder I will help you get over your "google cut and paste' addiction as i have helped many You prove my point once more. you don't want to know the truth. If you did you would have read one of the best articles on the topic refuting a heresy called open theism. Which I'm sure you know about in your vast quest for truth... Since you are not serious about actually learning something opposed to your own personal opinions I have to leave what I previously wrote as final Good luck in your 'search' "kovere" the person that wrote the article is not here to ask any questions about whats in the article..which means just like the bible I just suppose to assume the person that wrote it is right ...that is why I suggested that you use your own thoughts ...why is that so hard to do ...come on break the addiction and try thinking for yourself then you won't have "google cut and paste" the thoughts of others |
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you have helped no one!!!!! "Tribo" I will make you "phisher" of men if you follow me that'd be like god saying he'd save me - aint gonna happen - nor can you make me greaser of food!!! |
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