Well the only thing I am concerned about the back and forth bantering
thing is that this system is being upgraded and they might put in a
Report Abuse type of a thing, so someone's ass is going to get booted
out. Either deleting his or her post or worse by getting their account
deleted. And I don't want to see that happen to you or anyone else
that's
all.

I myself don't really think that should happen. But I also don't really
want to see this site degraded as I have seen some other's. Namely a
place called mingles, which has been degraded to a discussing sewage of
the lowest form.
I'ld like to think this place is different. I don't mind a knock down
dragout fight once and a while but too much is too much. And the ladies
wont stand for it.

Take care guy.

Ghostrecon

In my opinion we are doing our ownselves in.
We are fucking our own selves up worse than the
terrorists ever could. We are outsourcing jobs to
India to save a few bucks. We are hiring illegals at
wages that people here can't afford to work for. We are
making it so that it will be harder and harder to find
work. We are letting people cross over the border and
giving them benefits (welfare) that US citizens have a
hard time getting. We are making it less and less important
for people to even speak English. We are becoming a more
selfish and greedy culture. I predict that the next attack
on the US will come from people crossing over our southern
border. We're going to hell in a handbasket and showing
terrorists how to get past security by having a practically
open southern border.

yeah, i don't have a problem with that. that is one of the things that i
like about this site is that it is not censored but you have to have
people that are willing to let it go and move on. if we don't have them
kind of people it will ultimately result in some form of censorship and
i don't want to see that either. i like the idea that we can have these
kinds of discussions and if they get a little heated we have the type of
people that do understand that it is the nature of the beast. i'm not a
bad guy and i don't think that you are either but people don't always
agree and sometimes there is miscommunication,it's a part of life and i
don't think people should hide from it; but if we all act like adults we
can have disagreements and not hold a grudge.

Yeah I sometimes can see this country going the way of the Roman
Empire. But hopefully not in my life time. The key thing is to try to
keep an optimistic view and not let the social concerns get you down. I
can see that in view of all that's happening, we tend to get a sense of
hopelessness. But as you said, Ignorance is bliss. But hopelessness is
hell. That's all that I was trying to point out in some of my jokes. If
we consistently feel doom and gloom then those things will turn into
reality for us. How ever if we try to keep an up beat view then nothing
can get you down. There that's my sermon for the day. You've been a
great congregation. I am the Reverend Flanders. LOL.

hey diddly ho neighbor. i get what you are saying and it can be a
problem. that's the thing that i don't seem to get across because i'm
writing it and not speaking it, i don't have that sense of hopelessness
and doom and gloom about those subjects. i just tend to be more
proactive than reactive. the big brother theory doesn't describe my
point of view because it is not that realistic. i just don't want to
give up what our ancestors fought for, i think to freely give up what
they died for would be a disservice to them. with the system of checks
and balances in place and all of the people who are not in the military
who would pick up arms to help defend this country if it were ever to be
attacked, i don't think the government could ever get away with
something like that. i'm all for fighting for my rights and liberties
but we have to fight for them. i kind of look at it in the way that
they are not ours to give away, we are just using them for awhile. they
actually belong to our forefathers and our children and i ain't giving
them up.

The only problem is I'm not sure the forefathers anticipated this
country being soo complex. In any thing that is complex we have
problems. I don't think they had the foresight to see just how
complicated every thong would get. For instance. Do you know you legally
don't have to pay taxes? That was the provocation for the colonist to
revolt. But if you decided not to pay your taxes, guess what. Your going
to be some guys girlfriend.

Now on the flip side if no one had to pay their taxes then this country
would grind to a halt.

So that said then our government isn't instituted to one day turn
against us. It's there to see to it that everyone has what they need.
Not everyone is going to be satisfied. That's the nature of life. we do
the best we can with what we have and hope fore the best.

Ghostrecon

the reason for the revolt was the unfair taxing practices of the
monarchy but i don't think that it says anywhere in the constitution
that we should be exempt from taxes.

No it doesn't say that , but I believe thats the premis for the whole
issue of the revolt. They probably didn't include it so that future
generations could decide for them selves.

that's why i do think that they thought about the complexities.
obviously they didn't know the future but they had a revolt based on the
unfair taxing practices of the monarchy but it included many other
issues. they had an idea for what they wanted of this country and like
you said, it would never survive without some sort of tax system. they
started taxing citizens as soon as the new government was established
but this country was based on so much more when it was established. at
the time you could not have a more progressive and free nation, they
were ahead of their time and were the architects of modern day
democracy.

I hardly think of this as true democracy. The ancient Greeks had true
democracy cause they invented it. Of course their society was primitive.
It was our for fathers who decided that we the people are too stupid to
really decide for the country, that's why they established the Elector
College to finally decide for us. But again, that's what we have to play
with. I wouldn't have it anyother way. The old saying goes " Don't wise
for something. Cause you just might get it. "

when the country was first established it was a free democracy, the
electorate college didn't come along til later. you are right though i
didn't even think about the greeks, i guess i never though of their
emporor along the same lines of a president with his cabinet because he
had more control over the decisions than our president does with our
system.

People we will never agree in this matter ever, we will always all
disagree.......I love this country, is my home, but I also disagree alot
with what our government does......This is all about control and power
that is all......After sept 11 I spoked with strangers around the world,
and the true is half of the war
fair us and the other half hates us, the is the true.

I think that their is a great different in helping another country and
taking over, and I am sorry but that is what our government been doing
since along I can remember, that is why the world hate us. I also
believe that our government does not get involve in somebody else war
unless their is something they want from the country or need. whether
you all like it or not all the world know this is the true.

I don't give a shit is the government is listening to my phone
calls,reading my e-mails, my mails, is not right but whether we want it
or not is been happening for the longest time, and will continue
happening. I don't care if they make us wait hours in the airport.that
they want to build a wall biger than china to keep inmigrants and
terrorits from enter this country is fine with me.

But hell will freeze over the day I will allow them, to control my life
my family and give up my freedon. We have many enemies that we need to
be careful about, but the worst kind is the enemie within in. I know
some of you know what I am talking about....

Never....give..up freedom what is safety if you aren't free??WILL

Right King,

The reason I say the ancient Greeks had a more true democracy is that
even though the elected person had supreme power, it could have easily
be taken away from him. For instance Cleisthenes, the founder of
democracy among the Greeks was eventually deposed by the very system of
government that he helped create.

(It was a new dawn for Athens. The ordinary Athenians had rescued their
city and seized power for themselves. Now they turned to the man whose
unique experience and disappointments had helped give them a new vision
of themselves.

Cleisthenes was recalled from exile and asked to build the world's first
government of the people - the demos - a system of government we now
know as democracy.) Source:

http://www.pbs.org/empires/thegreeks/

Ghostrecon

thanks for the new information recon, sounds like he was not only part
of the first democracy but the first coup of a modern government as well
lol

viva la revolution!!! WILL

remember, remember the 5th of november

I do>>>WILL

did you ever stop to think that 9/11 was engineered to allow an
increasingly fascist and fundamentalist republican gov't to get a
tighter grip on it's citizens and restrict some otherwise taken for
granted freedoms, as well as an excuse to flex it's muscles in the
middle east..wouldn't be the 1st time an american president was aware of
an attack on the US and did nothing to prevent it so as to get the
troops involved in something the president wants.
The US has spent it's history denouncing empires and empire building and
yet the US seems to want to do just that very thing for itself..isn't it
funny how when a very young US fought to kick the British out of the
country and used guerilla warfare to achieve that aim, yet when some
other country fights to keep the US out of their homeland,and uses
guerilla tactics to achieve that same goal, they are labelled as
terrorists?..what if the arab states had banded together and invaded the
US to take out Bush because THEY considered him to be evil and attempted
to bring the country under their control?..would the soldiers and ppl
fighting to kick them out by any means necessary be labelled as
terrorists? I think not.
I guess it all boils down to perspective..if yer in the western world
yer a patriot, if yer on the other side, yer a fanatic, or worse...Don't
get me wrong..what happened on 9/11 was nothing but terrorism of the
most cowardly kind..the Pentagon was the only legitimate military target
in the attack altho the methods were FAR from legitimate..the attack on
the Twin Towers, while on US soil, was an attack on the entire global
financial network..EVERYONE was affected altho NY definitely bore the
brunt of it... just don't let the fundamentalist and extremist wool of
some high ranking officials in the US gov't cover yer eyes
sorry..think I'm rambling...now where did I put my damn meds????

i agree with you on every one of you points animal. i don't think the
government had anything to do with the event but i do think they new a
little about it.