if god killed jesus, then whomever nailed the nail, stuck the spear would be god........this is not to speak that be what is true, but rather this be the illogic that say god killed jesus........that does not hold to logic, as no human has ever seen god, and has no proof of such, nor what "god" can look like, then "whom" be god..........

abraham was told to murder by god, so any that believe in the text in word alone condone murder, so no matter what is said, it is irrelevant, as it is written in plain site, and abraham even pre-meditated it, lol......so what if he changed his mind after he raised the knife, the police today would easily show "intent to murder" if he was caught in the same act as described, and by your logic, if he believed god, he would HAVE to say "god told me to do it".......

no human can percieve the the meaning of text is the point, as the whole truth can be ANYTYHING.......

you can prove ANY belief by the words of the bible, and the logic that sees more and the true meaning of words written within never comes from reading or studying the book........

this logic is NEVER recieved by any that read, as to read show one seek to BETTER THEMSELF, SAVE THEMSELF, ENJOY THEMSELF, FEEL GOOD ABOUT THEMSELF, EDUCATE THEMSELF........why many don't WANT to read, but the mind try to make feel guilty for not doing so, bring all to FOLLOW THE HEART, or greatest desire..........what humans greatest desire be to do because of guilt, lol........the words within are encrpyted, as the text itself say any word in the human language used within can be applied to either the past, present, or future, or as applying to the pyhsical realm or spiritual realm, which this alone leaves a possible 5 different meanings for any words spoken........then if all potential possibilities are worked into combinations with the 5 possible, there now become 10 possible scenarios of the meaning, lol..........wonder why the number of grace spelled out within text was the number 5, lol..........there is no individual that look within to FIND anything that can find the truth, as the very motive of seeking the TRUTH is damned by the text itself in many quotes.........

so what basis does any human have to draw any assumption as to meaning......let whomever believe whatever they may, each one only have the confidence their own heart holds, and if there is ONE DOUBT WITHIN THE BEING, then the truth is not known beyond a shadow of a doubt, and THIS be the FIRST proof of any knowing the whole truth, and then the second be any words spoken have the same power as the god spoken of within the text, and as such, any words spoken will NEVER be proven to be untrue, and even each word spoken will ALL BE PROVEN TO COME TO PASS.......so it seems as futile which be the very idea, lol

this be the only evidence of any truth that i would believe in, as it was said "MANY will come in MY NAME", lol......the true meaning it would seem as......."if any SAY they come from me, they do not...........why many "unbeleivers" are really afraid by the mind, but the heart knows to RESIST any that say they are christains.........jmo

the spear and the nails didn't kill Jesus or Jesus would have died instantly ...Jesus may have even recovered from those injuries if treated and for all anyone knows Jesus could have died from a inoperable Brain Aneurysm that had nothing to do with his wounds ..so exactly how Jesus died is all speculation ...

that is why in Christian belief when it comes to matters of life and death if is left in the hands of God ...so it wasn't Jesus or Jesus's wounds that made the decision to take Jesus's life because Jesus do not control life and death .. God controls life and death and no matter what anyone did to Jesus or Jesus did to himself he could not die unless it was God's Will ..

really, then why did he say "Into your hands, I command my spirit"?

Jesus can command all he wants to but he dosen't command God ... God may have accepted that spirit because that was God's Will to do so ....

He didn't command God, he commanded his own spirit. God did not take it but accepted it.

If you gave me an apple I didn't make you give it to me, but I did accept it.

again Jesus command his spirit into God's hands and what if God refuse to accept it would Jesus still have died or not? .. "Chazster" see how you are trying to take power from God and make him lesser than Jesus ...as a Christian shouldn't you believe that God has the absolute power over life and death not Jesus

As an atheist, you have no right to tell me what I should believe as a Christian. Jesus is God as part of the Holy trinity. Jesus is the one that shall come to judge the living and the dead. I am not taking away any power from God, because God bestowed power onto Jesus who is in fact part of God.

"Chazster" I'm not telling you what to believe I merely trying to place you on the path to true rightousness ..

and if you as a Christian are going by the teachings of Jesus then know that Jesus never taught anything about being a part of any Holy Trinity.. writers include The Holy Trinity sometime after his death...and that's why Jesus said that he would sit on the right hand side of God not that he was God ..

but for the sake of argument let's say that Jesus was part of the Holy Trinty and was God and had the power over life and death .. that would mean that Jesus was not killed by anyone other than himself ..The Holy Trinity only proves that the concept that "The New Testament" was based on was a total farce

if one confess belief in "god", then scriptures are believed to be INSPIRED or FROM "god", then by professed belief in such, ALL words within are considered as "prophecy"......prophecy as decsribed within speak "WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN THAT CANNOT FAIL".........

seems this would eliminate any notion that thoughts, word, or actions are to be self-controlled by recieving any words from within as "commandments", as text damn this as unbelief, and also make one that speaks of text as "commandments" not of their own god......

Again, you are an atheist and you can not tell me the path to righteousness either. The Holy Trinity is a belief in the Catholic Church and I am Catholic. I never said if he does or does not have control over life and death. It is taught that he rose Lazerous from the dead though. He could have easily died from the nails and spear. He was hanging for who knows how long and could have easily bleed out. I mean when you are dying from loss of blood its not hard to know when you are close. Since I wasn't there I can't say what exactly killed him.

Now would you please find something to do other than trolling.

Well if Jesus came to "take away the sins of the world," who would you say killed Him?

If a soldier came to fight a war and died, who would you say killed them?

What's YOUR point?

Mine was that Jesus died for all mankind's sins...so what that means is we all killed Him.

Jesus was God & no man could do anything to Him unless it was part of the plan of God. Get it?

apparently someone has too..so why not me ..I can make you "phisher" of men if you follow me



sorry "Chazster" you are mistaken.. you did say that Jesus had control over life and Death since you claim that Jesus because of the holy trinity was part God ..so make up your mind ..either Jesus is God or he is not ..everytime you get conered you jump back and forth ,,



which means you can't claim that God didn't killed Jesus ..that was "God's Divine Plan" that Jesus would get killed



I am doing something "Chazster"...I'm placing you on the path to Heaven ...that is my gift to humanity

the question begging to be asked is HOW was he going to accomplish this, as the greatest sin it was said was to NOT love thy neighbor as thyself, so if interpretation of his words leads to thinking any one be better, be wiser, more good, then something is being LEFT OUT of a whole truth that saves the world, or jesus was the false prophet, and the christian the true prophet.......

what are you talking about ????

My cahtolic brother "Gets it" ,Quickstepper.
I pray this haughty spirit in you leave ,Quickstepper , in Jesus Name ,Amen.

Ok...keep your opinions to yourself...OK? It's not for you to judge my intentions.

"If Jesus were here today, the right wing would paint him as part of the 'cut and run' crowd." - DJ Hughley on "Real Time with Bill Maher."

Aren't you in for a shocker. LOL