My goodness he has a lot going for himself. You should be proud! I mean I see so many youth these days with no plans or futures. They simply don't have any motivations. I am not saying all children in the US are like this, but many seem to show little enthusiasm to life lately. Maybe it is just the area I live in also to come to this conclusion.

Nevertheless, yes I agree with everything you say. :)

To bad there isn't a group chat room to join. We would have a nice group of people chatting right now on these topics. Wouldn't you agree?

I understand. You grew up with the faith system you were taught and feel it is a normal way of life. You instinctley wouldn't hurt anyone regardless if you were introduced to Christianity or not.

You know the Buddhist believe that one shouldn't hurt anything in life that lives. Not even a mosquito! So in this perspective Buddhist would be proud of you when you mention you couldn't or wouldn't hurt anyone or thing. They believe this to be true because the bug or animal could have been your previous mother or elder at one time ressurrected again as such in this lifetime. Yes for many this is ridiculous but for them it is true.

Anyway yes I think I understand what you are saying.

I get it now. It is like they were halfway there ...they just have to have heart knowledge included and the change would have never occurred. Thank you for explaining your point of view. :)

So yeah I understand what you are going through. You were introduced to god at a very young age and lived with it and even witnessed historical events such as having god in the pledge. That must have been interesting to witness. Today you are not sure what to believe. It could be true or not and therefore you just believe within as a resolution. I think it is a valid point and what is most important is it works for you. Can I say safely that it works for you that you seek strength within and not from a higher identity?

Wow what a story! Yes I am glad he survived and what a huge baby you have! lol

When he is done growing he might reach 6 feet 7 or something! I would ask him if he enjoys basketball. They pay ridiculous wages for the NBA that only a 1 year wage could help him open up a business in no time.

I am just saying....lol

Yes it is true everyone has different ways of finding a peaceful bliss for themselves.

Joseph Campbell a famous mythologist and storyteller coined the phrase "Follow your Bliss" and I think that is important that we can today in this time and age choose what works best for us. I hope this will never be taken away from us in the future.

There is nothing wrong if a pantheistic way is the way you choose to live. If it works best for you then that is all that counts. Afterall, you are the one that has to be happy with it not anyone else.

For those that say they get their strength from within and are not in need of a higher identity or even morale support of a loved one...where do you think that comes from?

I ask for many mammals in our world get sick if they can't get morale support from a elder or another mammal of somesort. They get so sick that death occurs. This usually happens to younger mammals but there are cases of older animals also getting sick without affection, love, or communication. Are we any different?

I know we claim to be of a higher intelligence as humans but do you think when it comes to being alone with no morale support whatsoever that the within is enough to live off? Will a human not go insane, grow weak, or uncertain after such a long time.

I say this for many religious prophets such as Mohammed, Jesus, Buddha have endured long periods of time alone and suddenly come back with new wisdom to share with others and change ways one can think. Some come with astonishing stories that today some cannot believe can happen realistically.

Can being alone for so long provide illusions or miracles?

Sorry if the questions sound weird, but you have to admit it does open some dialogue right? lol

Very interesting. Let me see if I get this right if I can.

If one has faith but suddenly something happens to where they don't have faith anymore and don't believe what they once did to be true they are still consider "born again? regardless. Do you mean it is a temporary glitch?

I say this for I have met many that were Catholic and then changed to Protestant or Baptist then finally became Atheists or so they claim.

Are they not Atheists even though they say they are? I mean they did at one time "believe" but now don't anymore. Explain to me please. Thank you:)

So you have faith in yourself with the wisdom given to you for survival purposes. I think that is a valid answer for those that don't rely on faith....yet I am confused ....because you do have faith....but use it for self purpose only and not in a higher identity of somekind, or religious texts, or spiritual identity(s)

So faith is there but in a different way. You rely on it on your own and take responsibility for it. I know many buddhists ( I am not saying you are a buddhist) say that one must rely on self reliance when one doesn't have anyone to share such moments at the time. For many this isn't enough and usually resort to asking a identity for help such as praying instead.

You see both sides. I have observed it often when I was in the Army 18 months in a desert seeing some buddhist meditate for strength, muslims praying to allah, and majority christians asking for help from a god. It is interesting to see the different methods used when one feels weak or uncertain.

Perhaps one could also say that you had instinctive survival traits that every mammal has when it comes to shelter, food, and water. I am sorry you had to go through such ordeals at such a young age. It is however amusing that you had such inherant wisdom at such a young age, but I think it goes more in the lines of survival then actually using faith of anykind. I am sure you felt uncertain at times not knowing if you will have a meal that day if you were truly homeless at such a young age.

You are one tough cookie! It must be an Australian thing!

To the original question on page 1 of this forum.

Can people discuss religion with Atheists?

One of the things I do realize is that Atheists discuss a great deal about religion. I knew someone that only talked about it on a daily bases that I had to stop him and say look at that beautiful lady over there winking at you. lol

Although many atheists disapprove of any spiritual identity or religious text many actually know alot about it. I think serious atheists study alot about religion and interpret it differently then those that believe in it to come to their conclusion.

It surely does bring in a great deal of discussion between those that believe and those that don't. Rarely do they come to a understanding and truths though. I have yet to find one conversation to where a atheist will agree with someone who believes in their religion wholeheartingly.

Very true Ms. Harmony. There surely are so many idealogies out there that support and not support having a faith. This leads to another set of questions that will be twofold.

For those that carry faith:

Can a person that doesn't have faith still be grateful and show humility in their life even if they don't have guidance in the matter?

For those that do not carry faith:

What causes someone with faith to not show humility as of being grateful even though it is preached to them often throughout their lifetimes?

Mrs. Harmony if this is correct.....Since this message is in the religious forum it would be a faith in a god, spiritual identity, or religion.

Very good answers by the way everyone! Thank you!

Hello everyone. A good article and it really needs to be addressed to as many people as possible.

I wanted to add that there is some recovery in the most unlikely places.

Off the shores of Cuba there is recovery of fish loss, sea corrals, and special species (don't know the name now) that ensure that the sea stays healthy.

The reason why as biologists say is that the Castro Regime that has had a strict embargo for 50 years and longer ensured that the country stays poor and not so industrialized to keep the waters clean and growing. If the US wouldn't have used the embargo there would have been alot of business on the island to actually destroy precious life as we know it in the water and above. Many of the Everglade as of other birds and even the American Alligator have migrated to Cuba because of this reason.

The turtle population also is increasing as consevatists are finding ways to save them.

The island is unique for it hosts some of the smallest species in the world. The world's smallest humming bird, smallest frog, unique snails with colorful shells, and a host of other animals.

Some 20% of the island is protected by Castro's regime so no business can ever be created.

If this makes a significance difference to the world's oceans...probably not...but it sure brings a thought about how we as a people live and what drastic changes we would have to do just to ensure our seas are stable again.

Do you think a 2nd Civil War well happen in the United States?

I ask because I see such stark differences of opinions between Conservatives and Liberals that it is very frightening to see what will happen to this country in the near future. When it comes to deep issues, Congress shows little if any major positive resolutions that we need as people in this country.

14 trillion dollar deficit
Abortion Laws
Medicare
Foreign Policies
Unemployment Benefits
Retirement Benefits
Veteran Benefits
Unemployment issues
Tax issues

and the list goes on.....it just seems both sides contradict each other all the time.

So tell me how bad will it get in this country and do you think there will be a (significant) recovery showing promise for every state??

Thank you for taking the time to explain your opinions on the matter. :)

any care to give the last two posts a thought? Thank you:)

Faith is very important to a great majority of people around the world. For some it is a part of life like the air they breathe. For others faith is not necessary to live a good life.

The question is twofolds so please be patient.

Question for the faithful:

If you suddenly didn't have the need for faith anymore...could you imagine living a good life without it?


Question for those that don't need faith:

When times get hard to where you truly need morale support yet don't find any, where do you go to find strength?


Thank you

At this age (17-25) years many are going through different emotions then when one is older at (40 and up). Our minds change throughout time believing in many things we put our hearts into. Perhaps this young individual will change his mind and follow Christianity again....and perhaps he will remain a Atheist. Perhaps he will follow a different idealogy. I think it is good that he tells his parents about how he feels about it and communicates with them. There are a great deal of younger adults with no communication with their parents.

The main thing is that I hope that this individual and those that believe in atheism can live a life in peace and harmony with those that believe differently. It is important to feel happy in life.

I have met atheists, christians, muslims, wiccans, and buddhist...etc. etc. that each hold firmly on their beliefs and live great lifes running wonderful families. None in my opinion are wrong as they have not forced anyone to believe in what they do.

The ones we need to raise a eyebrow on are those that absolutely judge you and say you will go somewhere undesirable if you don't believe in the same thing. Those for me are dangerous people that can truly hurt others by enforcing fear into them. I hope in the future this will change. If it will I am not sure though.

The gentleman Abracadabra asks this question:


Could the Bible be a story about the will, intent, and actions of a God, but it has become extremely contaminated by the misguided opinions of the mortal men who recorded it?


I have contemplated for many years about how everything could have started. Christianity seems logical for over 2 billion people as of the Koran (Quran) for another 2 billion people. (Give or take on belief systems estimates even though some just check a religion when asked without truly worshipping or believing in it) and the many other religions are logical for each individual. Some folks are raised traditionally these belief systems and others found them later on in life.

For those that find it impossible to believe in a religion because of its imperfections, confusions, contradictions one should actually first ask if God is perfect in the first place.

What are the possibilities that perhaps God is not perfect when he or she created life as of the universe and its many trillions of galaxies in the same manner?

If this is the case then perhaps it is logical to think that life as we know it is not perfect because the one or ones (For those that believe in many gods) weren't perfect leading to such stories we read in these ancient texts. If this is true then yes perhaps any ancient text could be true in what they write, yet how odd that we as a human can conjure up a perfect Utopia. Isn't it odd? Or is it just me? But again that is why people believe in a heaven or higher levels of enjoyment...perhaps Nirvana?

One must also take in account that in those days the very same questions were asked but with less knowledge of what we know today. Ancient philosophers, scribes, teachers, and religious leaders of all kinds of belief systems believed at one time that the planet was flat and one could fall off it landing in a hell. Does any of this have to be accounted for? I believe it does.

Also we must also think about the question the gentleman Abracadabra asks if perhaps these ancient texts are misinterpreted. It is true that they were not originally written in English and therefore the translations could have been misinterpreted at the time. One can also think that we as a human species have the ability to be very imaginative and could have added more exciting stories to the texts to make it interesting in the first place. I mean look how many people read them still today although a small percentage of the population of this planet believe they belong in the mythology vault. Thomas Jefferson even tried to rewrite the bible so the supernatural events would be deleted out of the text to make it sound more realistic. I am not sure how far he got this done, but it must have been a lifetime endeavor if you ask me.

Nevertheless, whatever reasons we believe in we should perhaps ask first if the one (God) , (Goddess), many Gods or supernatural naturalistic energies as some believe in is perfect in the first place. If not, then we have alot to research and ask to find out more of how everything started in the first place.

I personally can only say "I don't know"...but I don't erase the possibility that perhaps we will find out more in the future. Of course for some the answers are right there when they read the bible, koran, torah, verdi, or any other ancient text, yet for others just because they are ancient old it is not enough evidence to lean on. This is why there are so many contradictions in the first place.

With the help of collaborated minds we could perhaps find more answers as time passes by. If the human population will agree together one day ...well that is another question perhaps for another time. :)

Wow alot of different practices are being described in here. Very interesting.

One could also say "it is difficult to say" to many of the great questions!

I guess there are different degrees of agnostics and atheism. I never seen myself as a weak atheist, but if there is such a term I guess it would be the first time that I would be categorized as such. I don't mind that term either.

In the end what I am saying is that I wouldn't know if there is a god or not. I know many (probably most) truly believe in a god or somekind of religious figure. I am really happy for them for I know they feel good about it and I support their efforts as long as they don't force their beliefs onto others in the process.

Logically or illogically whatever the reasons we seek for ultimate answers I think what is important is we find a way to find a middle ground to it all so we can live in harmony together. If we can do that then the few years we live on this planet will be more desirable.

Now how can we do this most effectively that we as a people can live more peaceful amongst each other. The current state of affairs around the world really makes one think if there will ever be a time to where all humans can somehow find peace in their hearts and minds even if we don't know all the answers we contemplate on.

I would love to hear from everyone who posted in here about how you feel about it. I realize we have some highly intellectual people in here with a great amount of wisdom off life in here. Go ahead and give it a go on how you feel, what you know, and how you tackle this impending problem as we know it. Thank you for the opportunity to chat here! Very nice!