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| Topic: Is Abortion Right In This Instance? | |
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Edited by
2OLD2MESSAROUND
on
Tue 05/12/15 08:10 AM
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uche9aa asked >>>
Can somebody help us with the annual statistic of deaths that occured or resulted from abortion and abortion related complications worldwide or at least a country, please I'll keep looking but data isn't easy to come by when countries consider this information to be highly unpleasant as with the sensitive issue about female genital mutilations. CONSEQUENCES OF UNSAFE ABORTION The estimated annual number of deaths from unsafe abortion declined from 56,000 in 2003 to 47,000 in 2008. Complications from unsafe abortion accounted for an estimated 13% of all maternal deaths worldwide in both years. [4] Declines since 2003 in the annual number of deaths from unsafe abortion, along with concurrent increases in the annual number of unsafe abortions performed, indicate that the risks associated with clandestine procedures may be decreasing. In the United States, legal induced abortion results in 0.6 deaths per 100,000 procedures. Worldwide, unsafe abortion accounts for a death rate that is 350 times higher (220 per 100,000), and, in Sub-Saharan Africa, the rate is 800 times higher, at 460 per 100,000. [4] Almost all abortion-related deaths occur in developing countries, with the highest number occurring in Africa. Unsafe abortion is a significant cause of ill-health among women in the developing world. Estimates for 2005 indicate that 8.5 million women annually experience complications from unsafe abortion that require medical attention, and three million do not receive the care they need. [5] Treating medical complications from unsafe abortion places a significant financial burden on public health care systems in the developing world. According to a 2009 study, the minimum annual estimated cost of providing post-abortion care in the developing world is $341 million. [6] In developing countries, poor women have the least access to family planning services and the fewest resources to pay for safe abortion procedures; they are also the most likely to experience complications related to unsafe abortion. Unsafe abortion has significant negative consequences beyond its immediate effects on women’s health. For example, complications from unsafe abortion may reduce women’s productivity, increasing the economic burden on poor families; cause maternal deaths that leave children motherless; cause long-term health problems, such as infertility; and result in considerable costs to already struggling public health systems. http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_IAW.html Here's another important fact to review; the abortion counter...just keeps clicking onward and upward around the WORLD >>> Number of Abortions - Abortion Counters
Each real-time abortion counter is based on the most current statistics* for the number of abortions in the US & the number of abortions Worldwide. http://www.numberofabortions.com/ |
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The one thing that I can't press on enough is that these babies don't deserve to die. It's not fair that they should be denied a life. I know it's hard on these young mom's that had to go through this. They will need lots of councilling and support but killing there babies that is no answer. If they did do that, to Me they would be no better that those terrorists. Those terrorists don't care about life that is why they can take it so easily, a child's life is a special thing it's new and untainted by whatever happened to bring that life about, tthat life is innocent and to kill it would be truly a terrible act just like what those terrorists are doing. i would still disagree with this, they were formed in an act of a crime being committed, so no real reason for them to deserve to live in the first place... remember your thoughts here if your ever abducted, raped and impregnated without your consent or want... it's a discussion, nothing more... if you say you would keep it, then more power to ya, thats what i have been saying all along that it's only the womans decision, not anyone elses... i offered my opinion, nothing more, and you certainly don't have to agree with it... i can't say because i'm not a woman... but i also do not see it as killing anyone, so abortion would be a great option... 
Amen, still on the level of agree to disagree, but murder is murder, or taking the life of another is the taking the life of another. Even if that life hasn't been born into this physical world. It's still a living being inside that woman.
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Thanks to those who have made an effort in providing us with some form of data.
But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion". I think the subject of this discourse is about deliberate abortion in general - whether safe or unsafe. And I say as a Bible believing/practicing Christian (based on Bible), that deliberate abortion is sin - whether done safely or unsafely. Taking the life of an innocent baby is sin. The baby has life just like you and I. This position does not deny the trauma that a rape victim goes through. But for me, taking a stand for God's will is not necessarily bread and butter. |
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Jesusmyall stated >>>
Thanks to those who have made an effort in providing us with some form of data. But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion". I think the subject of this discourse is about deliberate abortion in general - whether safe or unsafe. And I say as a Bible believing/practicing Christian (based on Bible), that deliberate abortion is sin - whether done safely or unsafely. Taking the life of an innocent baby is sin. The baby has life just like you and I. This position does not deny the trauma that a rape victim goes through. But for me, taking a stand for God's will is not necessarily bread and butter. uche9aa asked for some data/stats and I found something compiled with a 2012 data information date; the title wasn't 'MINE' it was from the agency doing the report! Sadly, you seem unable to read that data and it would have been a truly �clairissement moment for you. If you can't get beyond the title and read what is enclosed in the data then that really speaks volumes about a point of view! But as with the mule - the water trough - and getting the mule to drink; life can be like an Aesop Fable 
The data is in the encapsulated reading material for 'SAFE ABORTIONS' but don't let that stop you from ignoring it! Good Grief!!! |
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mom333: you told me in another polictial topic never say never. Heed your advice
Jesusmy all: Thank you for you concern but my situation is different than the topic as I don't remember anything As I have said, until you are in that situation, don't judge. God is the only judge...not you. And for the love of Pete...stop the quotes. They go on forever |
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Edited by
mom333
on
Tue 05/12/15 12:10 PM
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mom333: you told me in another polictial topic never say never. Heed your advice Jesusmy all: Thank you for you concern but my situation is different than the topic as I don't remember anything As I have said, until you are in that situation, don't judge. God is the only judge...not you. And for the love of Pete...stop the quotes. They go on forever |
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mom333: you told me in another polictial topic never say never. Heed your advice Jesusmy all: Thank you for you concern but my situation is different than the topic as I don't remember anything As I have said, until you are in that situation, don't judge. God is the only judge...not you. And for the love of Pete...stop the quotes. They go on forever oops...you said to stop the quotes...sorry about this!!!! My understanding about the community here is that it is a multi-religious community. My position about abortion is completely connected with my faith and that I think I have the right to express here. For me, taking innocent life is unbiblical, whether it is the life of an adult or it is the life of an unborn child. As a Christian, I do not rationalize on whatever the Bible is clear upon. Sorry, if this offends you! |
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2old2messaround, thanks for the data and link you provided above. I appreciate your understanding. But let nobody get it twisted, THERE IS NOTHING LIKE "SAFE ABORTION" so far a death of either the mother or the fetus or the 'potential' child occured. Its blue murder. We should beware of what we say here beacause it could influence some people's lives and decisions negatively or positively both now, the future and eternity!! "Dont be a partaker of other men/women's sin" You never can tell who is reading all we 've been saying here. Thanks
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Edited by
2OLD2MESSAROUND
on
Tue 05/12/15 02:32 PM
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uche9aa stated >>>
Can somebody help us with the annual statistic of deaths that occured or resulted from abortion and abortion related complications worldwide or at least a country, please As with my nickname {2old2messaround} I don't play games and I despise people that do! So you weren't really wanting any FACTUAL DATA when you posted that question that I responded to and then your buddy trolled in here with his problem about the wording of the facts from my link with this post: Jesusmyall stated >>>
Thanks to those who have made an effort in providing us with some form of data. But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion". I think the subject of this discourse is about deliberate abortion in general - whether safe or unsafe. And I say as a Bible believing/practicing Christian (based on Bible), that deliberate abortion is sin - whether done safely or unsafely. Taking the life of an innocent baby is sin. The baby has life just like you and I. This position does not deny the trauma that a rape victim goes through. But for me, taking a stand for God's will is not necessarily bread and butter. Then you can't be bothered to even READ THE DATA/REMARK TO THE POINTS OF THE DATA and you reply with this blather about "don't be a partaker of other men/women's sin" >>> uche9aa stated >>>
But let nobody get it twisted, THERE IS NOTHING LIKE "SAFE ABORTION" so far a death of either the mother or the fetus or the 'potential' child occured. Its blue murder. We should beware of what we say here beacause it could influence some people's lives and decisions negatively or positively both now, the future and eternity!! "Dont be a partaker of other men/women's sin" You never can tell who is reading all we 've been saying here. Thanks What government agency are you working for &/or with that you are now so highly concerned about "PEOPLE READING ALL WE'VE BEEN SAYING HERE?" You put the topic out here for this community to discuss and now you've asked for a data source and yet again when the data provides more documentation about South Africa --- you have issues with the data; and suddenly someone is POSSIBLY LOOKING OVER YOUR SHOULDER READING WHAT WE ALL ARE POSTING/SAYING ABOUT THIS SUBJECT MATTER!!! GOOD GRIEF It's really off putting since my entire stance on this TOPIC you've placed here is that this 'CHOICE' for these 214 young women will be between their doctor and their GOD and no one ELSE!!! You seem hell bent on forcing members to THINK LIKE you do and that's just not going to happen! If forcing humans to think in like minded ways were possible then those 214 young women wouldn't have been subjected to those cruel/inhumane things by the ILK of Boko Herem and Nigeria would move out of the dark ages about the way that they treat all the female species! What a wonderful world that would be for everyone to live in! |
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What government agency are you working for &/or with that you are now so highly concerned about "PEOPLE READING ALL WE'VE BEEN SAYING HERE?"
You put the topic out here for this community to discuss and now you've asked for a data source and yet again when the data provides more documentation about South Africa --- you have issues with the data; and suddenly someone is POSSIBLY LOOKING OVER YOUR SHOULDER READING WHAT WE ALL ARE POSTING/SAYING ABOUT THIS SUBJECT MATTER!!! GOOD GRIEF It's really off putting since my entire stance on this TOPIC you've placed here is that this 'CHOICE' for these 214 young women will be between their doctor and their GOD and no one ELSE!!! You seem hell bent on forcing members to THINK LIKE you do and that's just not going to happen! If forcing humans to think in like minded ways were possible then those 214 young women wouldn't have been subjected to those cruel/inhumane things by the ILK of Boko Herem and Nigeria would move out of the dark ages about the way that they treat all the female species! What a wonderful world that would be for everyone to live in! 'Well Said! Logical Views! I Concur'! 
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my friend abortion is the sin like killing other man... real it is very bad to all generation.
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my friend abortion is the sin like killing other man... real it is very bad to all generation.
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2old2omessaround,
Thanks for throwing more light on your name! I am not in any way offended by your statements. Neither do I feel put down. The expression of your opinion is your right! What attracted my attention in the data you shared was the term that I commented on as in my sentence - "But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion" ". I do have a right to express myself too and it should not become a source of anger to you! As a Social Development worker, I know clearly the meaning attached to safe and unsafe abortion. The reason the data you could easily lay hold of, is that of unsafe abortion is because safe abortion is deemed to be okay and usually people do not bother about that. As a matter of fact, one core reason (in the social development world) why people have pushed for the legitimization of abortion, is that by popular opinion, legitimacy reduces the chances of unsafe abortion taking place - it is argued that if abortion is legitimate, people can do it in hospitals and safe places without necessarily having to hide and do it in unsafe places that claim the lives of the mothers. But my expression is that as a Christian, who believes that JESUS CHRIST is the way, the truth and the life ...that the BIBLE is God's word and also that obedience to God is the manifestation of my faith in HIM, I can only take a stand that is in line with the BIBLE. For me, my human reasoning, anger, disgust and emotions are not the determinant factor in my position on this. The BIBLE says not to take innocent life (whether it is a baby's or an adult's)and anything that contradicts that, is to me, a SIN. So whether abortion is safe or unsafe, abortion is sin - so long as it is the taking away of innocent life, including babies/children who are products of rape. The baby/child committed no crime! My position is based on the BIBLE and not my personal feelings. Following God is not necessarily about feeling good! It is about obedience to HIM and HIS instructions, whatever the price! |
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Edited by
2OLD2MESSAROUND
on
Wed 05/13/15 05:40 AM
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Jesusmyall stated >>>
What attracted my attention in the data you shared was the term that I commented on as in my sentence - "But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion" ". I do have a right to express myself too and it should not become a source of anger to you! As a Social Development worker, I know clearly the meaning attached to safe and unsafe abortion. The reason the data you could easily lay hold of, is that of unsafe abortion is because safe abortion is deemed to be okay and usually people do not bother about that. As a matter of fact, one core reason (in the social development world) why people have pushed for the legitimization of abortion, is that by popular opinion, legitimacy reduces the chances of unsafe abortion taking place - it is argued that if abortion is legitimate, people can do it in hospitals and safe places without necessarily having to hide and do it in unsafe places that claim the lives of the mothers. Anger; Not hardly, frustrated - most assuredly; you are the very product that created the scenario that allowed the ILK of the BOKO HEREM to excel at what he does to the female gender of your society! Your government putting 'MEN' in position of jobs where their ability to dictate Social decisions based upon your STRONGER MORAL CODES then those of what is better for the humans that you are supposed to be looking out for! That's the self-righteous injustice that makes data collection for women a 'BACK ALLEY/BACKWARDS' way of dealing with reporting! You claim that it's a 'MEDIA BIAS' to get abortion done legally and yet just as with your blindsided view of female mutilation {out of sight out of mind = it isn't happening in my country anymore} SORRY, the reports & data that are still be collected prove you WRONG - HORRIBLY and factually wrong! You don't understand 'EQUALITY' about what a female is allowed to think and feel because: A.) you aren't one B.) you & your country won't grow beyond treating female gender as nothing more then a procession {a breeder for your species} C.) In the SOCIAL DEVELOPED WORLD we Female's have the RIGHT TO SAY what we will and will not allow to happen within our own body!!! And that is between our GOD/ Our Doctor - PERIOD. You don't get a VOTE! *from the link*
In the United States, legal induced abortion results in 0.6 deaths per 100,000 procedures. Worldwide, unsafe abortion accounts for a death rate that is 350 times higher (220 per 100,000), and, in Sub-Saharan Africa, the rate is 800 times higher, at 460 per 100,000. Interesting: your job and your strong faith must often get twisted into conflict and yet a huge part of my thinking finds that you don't allow that to happen in any way shape or form --- you'd always put your faith over what SOCIAL NEEDS would benefit the human in your area! Sorry, but I've read far too much about the way the male species 'CONTROL' what/how the lives of the suffering get what they 'NEED' there in your Rainbow Bright World...color me cynical.
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Edited by
uche9aa
on
Wed 05/13/15 06:58 AM
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2old2messaround, please, have you been to Africa or Nigeria? I can perceive you buy and assimilate all the junk journalism of hate, racism, campain of calumny and make believe stories of most western media line, hook and sinker. The ferocious manner you assert your view that Africa and in particular Nigeria treat their female folk with disdain smacked more of stereotype and misinformation. Jesusmyall is female lawyer and have stated it often here that she works with a social development orgnization in Nigeria. She refuted your assertions based on first hand information, not merely on religious sentiments. There is no society thats 100% perfect as far as male/female dichotomy is concerned. I need not state my profession here but I can categorically tell you that most of those data you get on net is overly exaggerated for some covert reasons, sinister motives or primordial interests. I trust your virtue of tolerance to diversity of opinions and mature logical reasoning. Thanks
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uche9aa stated >>>
2old2messaround, please, have you been to Africa or Nigeria? I can perceive you buy and assimilate all the junk journalism of hate, racism, campain of calumny and make believe stories of most western media line, hook and sinker. The ferocious manner you assert your view that Africa and in particular Nigeria treat their female folk with disdain smacked more of stereotype and misinformation. Jesusmyall is female lawyer and have stated it often here that she works with a social development orgnization in Nigeria. She refuted your assertions based on first hand information, not merely on religious sentiments. There is no society thats 100% perfect as far as male/female dichotomy is concerned. I need not state my profession here but I can categorically tell you that most of those data you get on net is overly exaggerated for some covert reasons, sinister motives or primordial interests. I trust your virtue of tolerance to diversity of opinions and mature logical reasoning. Thanks You've corrected my WRONG assumptions about Jesusmyall's gender; how was I too know??? My apologies to her but the manner and her approach was most worded in a 'MALE' gendered way of speaking! 
I have ZERO stereotypical POV for any foreign country {quite the ASSumption for you to ASSume so} and yet all of the data/links and my fellow friends and associates from 'Doctors Without Borders' that arrive in your country and provide so many of the health benefits that your own GREAT NATION DENY those very same women because they go against the forced Muslim/Male faith and once they become educated and demand something better...well your ability to carry the banner forward and remain blind, speaks volumes! I don't create the data - the data speaks for itself; squeal/squirm and become belligerent about it all you want but you can't deny FACTS and yet you keep trying too! Wanting to discuss a topic such as this with open minded Socially forward thinking nations will garner you and your buddies nothing but serious head butting and more frustration --- You can't see beyond your rigid Muslim faith and MALE POV and the freedoms that America has finally awarded my gender has moved us light years ahead of you! Good Luck with your search for marital happiness; but I think you've gone to far afield - SERIOUSLY!
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Jesusmyall stated >>>
What attracted my attention in the data you shared was the term that I commented on as in my sentence - "But I noticed the constant reference in the information to "unsafe abortion" ". I do have a right to express myself too and it should not become a source of anger to you! As a Social Development worker, I know clearly the meaning attached to safe and unsafe abortion. The reason the data you could easily lay hold of, is that of unsafe abortion is because safe abortion is deemed to be okay and usually people do not bother about that. As a matter of fact, one core reason (in the social development world) why people have pushed for the legitimization of abortion, is that by popular opinion, legitimacy reduces the chances of unsafe abortion taking place - it is argued that if abortion is legitimate, people can do it in hospitals and safe places without necessarily having to hide and do it in unsafe places that claim the lives of the mothers. Anger; Not hardly, frustrated - most assuredly; you are the very product that created the scenario that allowed the ILK of the BOKO HEREM to excel at what he does to the female gender of your society! Your government putting 'MEN' in position of jobs where their ability to dictate Social decisions based upon your STRONGER MORAL CODES then those of what is better for the humans that you are supposed to be looking out for! That's the self-righteous injustice that makes data collection for women a 'BACK ALLEY/BACKWARDS' way of dealing with reporting! You claim that it's a 'MEDIA BIAS' to get abortion done legally and yet just as with your blindsided view of female mutilation {out of sight out of mind = it isn't happening in my country anymore} SORRY, the reports & data that are still be collected prove you WRONG - HORRIBLY and factually wrong! You don't understand 'EQUALITY' about what a female is allowed to think and feel because: A.) you aren't one B.) you & your country won't grow beyond treating female gender as nothing more then a procession {a breeder for your species} C.) In the SOCIAL DEVELOPED WORLD we Female's have the RIGHT TO SAY what we will and will not allow to happen within our own body!!! And that is between our GOD/ Our Doctor - PERIOD. You don't get a VOTE! *from the link*
In the United States, legal induced abortion results in 0.6 deaths per 100,000 procedures. Worldwide, unsafe abortion accounts for a death rate that is 350 times higher (220 per 100,000), and, in Sub-Saharan Africa, the rate is 800 times higher, at 460 per 100,000. Interesting: your job and your strong faith must often get twisted into conflict and yet a huge part of my thinking finds that you don't allow that to happen in any way shape or form --- you'd always put your faith over what SOCIAL NEEDS would benefit the human in your area! Sorry, but I've read far too much about the way the male species 'CONTROL' what/how the lives of the suffering get what they 'NEED' there in your Rainbow Bright World...color me cynical.
IF WRITING THESE KINDS OF THINGS GIVES YOU PLEASURE - PLEASE BY ALL MEANS, CONTINUE TO WRITE THEM, SO THAT YOU CAN DERIVE YOUR PLEASURE. AT THE END OF THE ROAD OF LIFE, EVERYONE OF US WILL ACCOUNT TO THE ALMIGHTY GOD FOR EVERY WORD, DEED, ACTION. YOU PROBABLY MEAN TO INSULT AND DEMEAN AND HUMILIATE WITH YOUR WORDS...BUT SORRY, YOU GOT THE WRONG PERSON. I AM VERY PROUD OF MY GOD. I AM ALSO VERY PROUD OF THE COUNTRY THAT HE (MY GOD) PUT ME IN! HAVE A VERY PLEASANT DAY. |
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Dear 2old2messaround,
IF WRITING THESE KINDS OF THINGS YOU WRITE GIVES YOU PLEASURE - PLEASE BY ALL MEANS, CONTINUE TO WRITE THEM, SO THAT YOU CAN DERIVE YOUR PLEASURE. AT THE END OF THE ROAD OF LIFE, EVERYONE OF US WILL ACCOUNT TO THE ALMIGHTY GOD FOR EVERY WORD, DEED, ACTION. YOU PROBABLY MEAN TO INSULT AND DEMEAN AND HUMILIATE WITH YOUR WORDS...BUT SORRY, YOU GOT THE WRONG PERSON. I AM VERY PROUD OF MY GOD. I AM ALSO VERY PROUD OF THE COUNTRY THAT HE (MY GOD) PUT ME IN! HAVE A VERY PLEASANT DAY. |
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@2od2messaround. Another point of correction. Uche9aa is a born again bible believing christian to the core!!!!!
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2OLD2MESSAROUND,
I actually feel so amused by your misconceptions about me and my country that I feel compelled to send you this bit: Really, I have seen some people like you (I mean with all the wrong propaganda in their thoughts...imaginations...daily dreams...etc about Nigeria) come into Nigeria as internationals in Development organizations and after two or three years, when it is time to go, they cry 9no kidding) and talk about all the warmth and hospitality and friendliness that they will miss. Some even desperately look for all available options to be able to stay. One guy landed at the Abuja airport in Nigeria and could not believe his eyes....and kept talking and talking to people about his wrong perceptions and utter shock! I should invite you to Nigeria one of these days...you will probably faint when you discover you have been terribly deceived by negative propaganda! |
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