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| Topic: Rush Limbaugh says are Country is Dieing | |
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each situation is different, some victims will be hostile UNTIL they are shown how similar their behavior is to that they are complaining about,,,, There is a time for that, but not necessarily right away. true, seems it ended the hostility though,,,,last page has only been the two of us,,, |
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I think that everyone here would benefit from reading a book titled "Faith That Hurts, Faith That Heals". Yes, some people have been abused while participating in church activities as children. That abuse leaves them distrusting churches, and you really cannot "correct" them just by lecturing them. You have to get to know their personal stories and then help them work through their emotional pain that resulted from the abuse. Telling victims of religious abuse not to feel a certain way just won't work. I agree. Victims of abuse have to face their abusers, work through their own pain and their own circumstances so they can heal and move on. my point in saying 'get over abuse' was to hold a mirror to the statement that religious should 'get over' ourselves,, Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. That's far different from being told to get over my abuse as if it didn't happen, or get over the effects it had on me......very different. And as for hostility...honestly I get really tired of the back and forth at times.....it gets emotionally draining so when I get quiet that's usually why. I sometimes think about just quitting posting here entirely really..... |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Wed 04/10/13 07:12 AM
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I think that everyone here would benefit from reading a book titled "Faith That Hurts, Faith That Heals". Yes, some people have been abused while participating in church activities as children. That abuse leaves them distrusting churches, and you really cannot "correct" them just by lecturing them. You have to get to know their personal stories and then help them work through their emotional pain that resulted from the abuse. Telling victims of religious abuse not to feel a certain way just won't work. I agree. Victims of abuse have to face their abusers, work through their own pain and their own circumstances so they can heal and move on. my point in saying 'get over abuse' was to hold a mirror to the statement that religious should 'get over' ourselves,, Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. That's far different from being told to get over my abuse as if it didn't happen, or get over the effects it had on me......very different. And as for hostility...honestly I get really tired of the back and forth at times.....it gets emotionally draining so when I get quiet that's usually why. I sometimes think about just quitting posting here entirely really..... Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. let me change a few words... not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over your abuse, what I mean by that is realize not everyone going to church shares your expeirence, and while its tragic and sad to have gone through it in your personal journey, try to understand others and not just judge them as abusive or wrong or try to outright label them as dictatorial based upon your own experiences. Thats what I mean when I say plenty of people go through tragedies which they need to mend and move on from. They need to understand people have different experiences (kids included I might add) and it isnt necessarily going to be what you THINK they are expeiriencing. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just become defensive based upon what has happened to us. to tell someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES is exactly the same as telling someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES (And by default the results of those experiences or the lessons from those experiences) |
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I think that everyone here would benefit from reading a book titled "Faith That Hurts, Faith That Heals". Yes, some people have been abused while participating in church activities as children. That abuse leaves them distrusting churches, and you really cannot "correct" them just by lecturing them. You have to get to know their personal stories and then help them work through their emotional pain that resulted from the abuse. Telling victims of religious abuse not to feel a certain way just won't work. I agree. Victims of abuse have to face their abusers, work through their own pain and their own circumstances so they can heal and move on. my point in saying 'get over abuse' was to hold a mirror to the statement that religious should 'get over' ourselves,, Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. That's far different from being told to get over my abuse as if it didn't happen, or get over the effects it had on me......very different. And as for hostility...honestly I get really tired of the back and forth at times.....it gets emotionally draining so when I get quiet that's usually why. I sometimes think about just quitting posting here entirely really..... Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. let me change a few words... not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over your abuse, what I mean by that is realize not everyone going to church shares your expeirence, and while its tragic and sad to have gone through it in your personal journey, try to understand others and not just judge them as abusive or wrong or try to outright label them as dictatorial based upon your own experiences. Thats what I mean when I say plenty of people go through tragedies which they need to mend and move on from. They need to understand people have different experiences (kids included I might add) and it isnt necessarily going to be what you THINK they are expeiriencing. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just become defensive based upon what has happened to us. to tell someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES is exactly the same as telling someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES (And by default the results of those experiences or the lessons from those experiences) The difference though is, you are using your experiences to try and dictate and control other people and behaviors......and that is wrong. You can believe anything you want to on a personal level, but it needs to stay personal. The moment you try and tell someone else how to live by force based on your beliefs you cross a line. THAT is why I can never truly "get over" my abuse because that abuse is symbolic of an overall society problem in how we think and view people. It is something I will NEVER consent to happening again. |
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I think that everyone here would benefit from reading a book titled "Faith That Hurts, Faith That Heals". Yes, some people have been abused while participating in church activities as children. That abuse leaves them distrusting churches, and you really cannot "correct" them just by lecturing them. You have to get to know their personal stories and then help them work through their emotional pain that resulted from the abuse. Telling victims of religious abuse not to feel a certain way just won't work. I agree. Victims of abuse have to face their abusers, work through their own pain and their own circumstances so they can heal and move on. my point in saying 'get over abuse' was to hold a mirror to the statement that religious should 'get over' ourselves,, Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. That's far different from being told to get over my abuse as if it didn't happen, or get over the effects it had on me......very different. And as for hostility...honestly I get really tired of the back and forth at times.....it gets emotionally draining so when I get quiet that's usually why. I sometimes think about just quitting posting here entirely really..... Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. let me change a few words... not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over your abuse, what I mean by that is realize not everyone going to church shares your expeirence, and while its tragic and sad to have gone through it in your personal journey, try to understand others and not just judge them as abusive or wrong or try to outright label them as dictatorial based upon your own experiences. Thats what I mean when I say plenty of people go through tragedies which they need to mend and move on from. They need to understand people have different experiences (kids included I might add) and it isnt necessarily going to be what you THINK they are expeiriencing. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just become defensive based upon what has happened to us. to tell someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES is exactly the same as telling someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES (And by default the results of those experiences or the lessons from those experiences) The difference though is, you are using your experiences to try and dictate and control other people and behaviors......and that is wrong. You can believe anything you want to on a personal level, but it needs to stay personal. The moment you try and tell someone else how to live by force based on your beliefs you cross a line. THAT is why I can never truly "get over" my abuse because that abuse is symbolic of an overall society problem in how we think and view people. It is something I will NEVER consent to happening again. I have no control over anyones behavior nor can I dictate anyones behavior, I have a parental control over my childrens behaviors as well as the right to teach them values and standards the way I see fit, whether its in my home , in a church, or a combination of both it is clear you have not raised children and I am almost done with trying to explain what parenting is,,,,but 'by force' is a subjective judgmental choice of words for the fact that children do not have the resources, development, experience to naturally CHOOSE the best things for them and therefore require the PARENT to step in and , if necessary, 'by force' make the choice for them your abuse is symbolic of the family you were a part of and not much else,,,you shouldnt consent to abuse where people are harmed, but you should also not play GOD yourself by labeling parents choices as abuse just because you disagree with them when you have no evidence that any harm has occurred,,,,,, I know personally hundreds of churchgoers who would give their lives for their children, the fact that they choose to involve their children in an environment of others who share their values does not make them the same as whomever abused you,,,,, anymore than anyone who is catholic is pedophilic or any family that allows shared sleeping quarters is incestuous it remains a fallacious argument to continue the assumption that religion is to blame for your abuse and therefore those involved in religion are abusive,,,, |
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Edited by
JustDukkyMkII
on
Sat 04/13/13 08:08 PM
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Rush says America is dieing... He obviously hasn't taken it's pulse in quite some time...It's been dead for for so long its spirit has departed... ...Time to birth a new one, with real laws to keep it honest so the phoenix rising from the ashes never burns itself again! Who knows?...You might even be able to build a country that doesn't rob from the poor & honest to give to the rich & corrupt. (this looks like a good spot for a bit of "adult ed" in law): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc http://www.infowars.com/special-report-former-deputy-sheriff-reveals-secrets-police-dont-want-you-to-know/ |
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I think that everyone here would benefit from reading a book titled "Faith That Hurts, Faith That Heals". Yes, some people have been abused while participating in church activities as children. That abuse leaves them distrusting churches, and you really cannot "correct" them just by lecturing them. You have to get to know their personal stories and then help them work through their emotional pain that resulted from the abuse. Telling victims of religious abuse not to feel a certain way just won't work. I agree. Victims of abuse have to face their abusers, work through their own pain and their own circumstances so they can heal and move on. my point in saying 'get over abuse' was to hold a mirror to the statement that religious should 'get over' ourselves,, Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. That's far different from being told to get over my abuse as if it didn't happen, or get over the effects it had on me......very different. And as for hostility...honestly I get really tired of the back and forth at times.....it gets emotionally draining so when I get quiet that's usually why. I sometimes think about just quitting posting here entirely really..... Not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over yourself, what I mean by that is realize that not everyone shares your beliefs, and that while it's fine to have your own, to try and understand others and not just judge them as wrong or try to outright dictate to them based on your own viewpoint. That's what I mean when I say religious people need to get over themselves. They need to understand people have different needs (kids included I might add) and it isn't necessarily going to be what you THINK they need. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just judged based on what we believe we know or have been told. let me change a few words... not the same statement, when I am saying for you to get over your abuse, what I mean by that is realize not everyone going to church shares your expeirence, and while its tragic and sad to have gone through it in your personal journey, try to understand others and not just judge them as abusive or wrong or try to outright label them as dictatorial based upon your own experiences. Thats what I mean when I say plenty of people go through tragedies which they need to mend and move on from. They need to understand people have different experiences (kids included I might add) and it isnt necessarily going to be what you THINK they are expeiriencing. We would do far better if we listened and tried to understand rather than just become defensive based upon what has happened to us. to tell someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES is exactly the same as telling someone to get over THEIR OWN EXPERIENCES (And by default the results of those experiences or the lessons from those experiences) The difference though is, you are using your experiences to try and dictate and control other people and behaviors......and that is wrong. You can believe anything you want to on a personal level, but it needs to stay personal. The moment you try and tell someone else how to live by force based on your beliefs you cross a line. THAT is why I can never truly "get over" my abuse because that abuse is symbolic of an overall society problem in how we think and view people. It is something I will NEVER consent to happening again. I have no control over anyones behavior nor can I dictate anyones behavior, I have a parental control over my childrens behaviors as well as the right to teach them values and standards the way I see fit, whether its in my home , in a church, or a combination of both it is clear you have not raised children and I am almost done with trying to explain what parenting is,,,,but 'by force' is a subjective judgmental choice of words for the fact that children do not have the resources, development, experience to naturally CHOOSE the best things for them and therefore require the PARENT to step in and , if necessary, 'by force' make the choice for them Thing is sometimes what you THINK is best for them really isn't no matter how good it may seem to you. What you want for them and what they actually NEED are not always the same thing. A parent may THINK pushing them into their religion is a good thing, or that it's not harming them in any way, but it doesn't make it true even if you can't see the effects yourself or choose to ignore them if confronted with them. But whatever, you can think as you want......I am tired of this.....so I'm ending this now. |
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About what MsHarmony and Kleisto were talking about, I don't think abuse should ever be taken lightly. It can leave a real mental scar. An emotional stamp, if you will. It can take some years to recover, while for others may only take months. Sometimes you just want to finally get away from the abuser, and never look back. Some abusers are just so smart, in how they cover their tracks, that it sometimes never gets noticed by others until the victim leaves.
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About what MsHarmony and Kleisto were talking about, I don't think abuse should ever be taken lightly. It can leave a real mental scar. An emotional stamp, if you will. It can take some years to recover, while for others may only take months. Sometimes you just want to finally get away from the abuser, and never look back. Some abusers are just so smart, in how they cover their tracks, that it sometimes never gets noticed by others until the victim leaves. understood, I have been a victim many times in life,,,,,I once let that victimization cause me to subliminally label and judge all white males,,, I grew out of it and held the INDIVIDUAL Responsible,,,, |
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