Community > Politics, Current News & Events

Topic: 61% Favor Immigration Checks On Traffic Stops
Leigh2154 Joined Sun 10/02/11 Posts: 16479	Sat 01/21/12 03:08 PM
Leigh, are you talking to me or oldsage? I think she is talking to you. But I am sure she will speak for herself Yes, I will speak for myself, speaking of which, would it be too much to ask that you stop making comments about me to others?...It is inappropriate and I find it offensive...Thanks in advance....

Ladylid2012 Joined Sun 07/05/09 Posts: 42269	Sat 01/21/12 03:10 PM
Leigh, are you talking to me or oldsage? I was talking to you Ladylid.... Clarifying

Leigh2154 Joined Sun 10/02/11 Posts: 16479	Sat 01/21/12 03:12 PM
Leigh, are you talking to me or oldsage? I was talking to you Ladylid.... Clarifying

andrewzooms Joined Fri 10/26/07 Posts: 2842	Sat 01/21/12 03:22 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown."

msharmony Joined Mon 08/31/09 Posts: 61041	Sat 01/21/12 03:29 PM Edited by msharmony on Sat 01/21/12 03:30 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown." If I was less law abiding , I Might have one in my home too. My daughters FATHER who was denied entry after going through the LEGAL process of immigration,,,,, but he does have a homeland where he lived his whole life BEFORE applying, so he just abides by the law and remains there,,, this isnt the founding fathers population of people or resources, everyone who asks to cant necessarily enter and live,,,

andrewzooms Joined Fri 10/26/07 Posts: 2842	Sat 01/21/12 03:31 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown." If I was less law abiding , I Might have one in my home too. My daughters FATHER who was denied entry after going through the LEGAL process of immigration,,,,, this isnt the founding fathers population of people or resources, everyone who asks to cant necessarily enter and live,,, That is a good point. Was it for health reasons?

Ladylid2012 Joined Sun 07/05/09 Posts: 42269	Sat 01/21/12 03:31 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown." If I was less law abiding , I Might have one in my home too. My daughters FATHER who was denied entry after going through the LEGAL process of immigration,,,,, this isnt the founding fathers population of people or resources, everyone who asks to cant necessarily enter and live,,, Why was he denied?

msharmony Joined Mon 08/31/09 Posts: 61041	Sat 01/21/12 03:33 PM Edited by msharmony on Sat 01/21/12 03:34 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown." If I was less law abiding , I Might have one in my home too. My daughters FATHER who was denied entry after going through the LEGAL process of immigration,,,,, this isnt the founding fathers population of people or resources, everyone who asks to cant necessarily enter and live,,, Why was he denied? I didnt earn enough to sponsor him ( I was employed full time during the application process), the government doesnt want to support grown people that live here, let alone those coming from other lands and he had been arrested over two decades earlier in his country for 'moral turpitude' for stealing coal ,,,,,

Grim14u Joined Sun 01/01/12 Posts: 390	Sat 01/21/12 03:34 PM
I had no choice but to sneek into this country. I tried the conventional citizenship process but, they wanted me to declare what was under my......Kilt!! And a Good Scottsman will NEVER do that!!!!!!

Bravalady Joined Sun 01/01/12 Posts: 1034	Sat 01/21/12 03:43 PM
Rights are not a given, they must be earned... Incorrect. The definition of a "right" is something that does NOT have to be earned. If it is contingent on anything, it is a privilege, not a right.

Ladylid2012 Joined Sun 07/05/09 Posts: 42269	Sat 01/21/12 03:45 PM
Yikes "Between 7 million and 20 million illegal immigrants are estimated to be living in the United States but the nature of illegal immigration makes the exact number be unknown." If I was less law abiding , I Might have one in my home too. My daughters FATHER who was denied entry after going through the LEGAL process of immigration,,,,, this isnt the founding fathers population of people or resources, everyone who asks to cant necessarily enter and live,,, Why was he denied? I didnt earn enough to sponsor him ( I was employed full time during the application process), the government doesnt want to support grown people that live here, let alone those coming from other lands and he had been arrested over two decades earlier in his country for 'moral turpitude' for stealing coal ,,,,, and they wonder why there are so many illegals. coal to burn?

msharmony Joined Mon 08/31/09 Posts: 61041	Sat 01/21/12 03:48 PM
hard to discern,,right and privilege are kind of interchangable,,, privilege: a right or immunity granted as a peculiar benefit, advantage, or favor : prerogative; especially : such a right or immunity attached specifically to a position or an office right: : something to which one has a just claim: as a : the power or privilege to which one is justly entitled <voting rights> <his right to decide> b (1) : the interest that one has in a piece of property —often used in plural <mineral rights> (2) plural : the property interest possessed under law or custom and agreement in an intangible thing especially of a literary and artistic nature <film rights of the novel> 3: something that one may properly claim as due <knowing the truth is her right>

Bravalady Joined Sun 01/01/12 Posts: 1034	Sat 01/21/12 04:30 PM
It looks like you got that from Merriam-Webster. This is a good example of why I don't like them as a dictionary. If you check any other dictionary, on line or otherwise, I think you'll find a clearer, more traditional definition, of which the essence is "a just claim." However, this is off topic, so we don't need to pursue it. It seems to me that the problem with stopping cars for citizenship verification is that, since it's obviously impractical to stop every car, it does have to be "random" and that is very hard to do fairly in practice. Not to mention the question of what would constitute evidence of citizenship. Every single time in American history that there has been a big wave of immigration, xenophobia has reared its ugly head. It has always come down to fear of "taking jobs away from us." In this economy, naturally people are even more sensitive about it than usual. But many employers say that they simply can't get citizens to take these jobs. In my state, Maine, this is very true of the blueberry and apple harvests. They have to truck in migrants from who knows where. And Maine is a very poor state with lots of people out of work--but the locals simply won't take these jobs. The wages are so low, there are no benefits at all, and the work is godawful hard. The farmers can't raise the wages much because then the cost of the produce would be so high they wouldn't be able to sell. There is no easy answer.

msharmony Joined Mon 08/31/09 Posts: 61041	Sat 01/21/12 05:29 PM
It looks like you got that from Merriam-Webster. This is a good example of why I don't like them as a dictionary. If you check any other dictionary, on line or otherwise, I think you'll find a clearer, more traditional definition, of which the essence is "a just claim." However, this is off topic, so we don't need to pursue it. It seems to me that the problem with stopping cars for citizenship verification is that, since it's obviously impractical to stop every car, it does have to be "random" and that is very hard to do fairly in practice. Not to mention the question of what would constitute evidence of citizenship. Every single time in American history that there has been a big wave of immigration, xenophobia has reared its ugly head. It has always come down to fear of "taking jobs away from us." In this economy, naturally people are even more sensitive about it than usual. But many employers say that they simply can't get citizens to take these jobs. In my state, Maine, this is very true of the blueberry and apple harvests. They have to truck in migrants from who knows where. And Maine is a very poor state with lots of people out of work--but the locals simply won't take these jobs. The wages are so low, there are no benefits at all, and the work is godawful hard. The farmers can't raise the wages much because then the cost of the produce would be so high they wouldn't be able to sell. There is no easy answer. i wouldnt advocate stopping each car, I may advocate , when a car is stopped for a violation, that citizenship id be checked along with driver status but it would depend upon how much more work it would require for police and how they would manage the cooperative effort between authorities,,,which often doesnt work so well,,, I dont know if I Believe that farmers cant pay higher wages, but I do agree there is no easy answer,,,

Optomistic69 Joined Mon 10/10/11 Posts: 5173	Sat 01/21/12 05:43 PM
Every single time in American history that there has been a big wave of immigration, xenophobia has reared its ugly head. It has always come down to fear of "taking jobs away from us." In this economy, naturally people are even more sensitive about it than usual. But many employers say that they simply can't get citizens to take these jobs. In my state, Maine, this is very true of the blueberry and apple harvests. They have to truck in migrants from who knows where. And Maine is a very poor state with lots of people out of work--but the locals simply won't take these jobs. The wages are so low, there are no benefits at all, and the work is godawful hard. The farmers can't raise the wages much because then the cost of the produce would be so high they wouldn't be able to sell. There is no easy answer. Excellent explanation... Happens in all Countries ...Happened here in Ireland very recently with the false housing boom. We had several hundred thousand Polish Lithuanian and other East Europeans enter the country Legally because they are part of The EU. It is cheap Labour and it was Legal.

Optomistic69 Joined Mon 10/10/11 Posts: 5173	Sat 01/21/12 09:01 PM
Leigh, are you talking to me or oldsage? I think she is talking to you. But I am sure she will speak for herself Yes, I will speak for myself, speaking of which, would it be too much to ask that you stop making comments about me to others?...It is inappropriate and I find it offensive...Thanks in advance.... OMG

comfydarkcorner Joined Thu 01/19/12 Posts: 31	Sat 01/21/12 10:04 PM
agreed if the check is made during a traffic stop with an obvious violation, and not because of suspicion of illegal residency.

metalwing Joined Fri 11/14/08 Posts: 26218	Sun 01/22/12 12:10 PM
It looks like you got that from Merriam-Webster. This is a good example of why I don't like them as a dictionary. If you check any other dictionary, on line or otherwise, I think you'll find a clearer, more traditional definition, of which the essence is "a just claim." However, this is off topic, so we don't need to pursue it. It seems to me that the problem with stopping cars for citizenship verification is that, since it's obviously impractical to stop every car, it does have to be "random" and that is very hard to do fairly in practice. Not to mention the question of what would constitute evidence of citizenship. Every single time in American history that there has been a big wave of immigration, xenophobia has reared its ugly head. It has always come down to fear of "taking jobs away from us." In this economy, naturally people are even more sensitive about it than usual. But many employers say that they simply can't get citizens to take these jobs. In my state, Maine, this is very true of the blueberry and apple harvests. They have to truck in migrants from who knows where. And Maine is a very poor state with lots of people out of work--but the locals simply won't take these jobs. The wages are so low, there are no benefits at all, and the work is godawful hard. The farmers can't raise the wages much because then the cost of the produce would be so high they wouldn't be able to sell. There is no easy answer. Nice analysis, but the problem isn't alien workers, it is illegal alien workers. The US has long had work visas and green cards to allow migrant workers and others to work in the US. The problem is the ones who come into the US illegally and stay, using US services, causing problems, committing crimes, etc., without complying with the laws. I don't know many who are against legal immigration. I know many who are against illegal immigration, and giving citizen rights to non-citizens.

Seakolony Joined Fri 11/07/08 Posts: 11968	Sun 01/22/12 12:20 PM
It looks like you got that from Merriam-Webster. This is a good example of why I don't like them as a dictionary. If you check any other dictionary, on line or otherwise, I think you'll find a clearer, more traditional definition, of which the essence is "a just claim." However, this is off topic, so we don't need to pursue it. It seems to me that the problem with stopping cars for citizenship verification is that, since it's obviously impractical to stop every car, it does have to be "random" and that is very hard to do fairly in practice. Not to mention the question of what would constitute evidence of citizenship. Every single time in American history that there has been a big wave of immigration, xenophobia has reared its ugly head. It has always come down to fear of "taking jobs away from us." In this economy, naturally people are even more sensitive about it than usual. But many employers say that they simply can't get citizens to take these jobs. In my state, Maine, this is very true of the blueberry and apple harvests. They have to truck in migrants from who knows where. And Maine is a very poor state with lots of people out of work--but the locals simply won't take these jobs. The wages are so low, there are no benefits at all, and the work is godawful hard. The farmers can't raise the wages much because then the cost of the produce would be so high they wouldn't be able to sell. There is no easy answer. Nice analysis, but the problem isn't alien workers, it is illegal alien workers. The US has long had work visas and green cards to allow migrant workers and others to work in the US. The problem is the ones who come into the US illegally and stay, using US services, causing problems, committing crimes, etc., without complying with the laws. I don't know many who are against legal immigration. I know many who are against illegal immigration, and giving citizen rights to non-citizens.

metalwing Joined Fri 11/14/08 Posts: 26218	Wed 01/25/12 06:21 AM
... "In its latest surreptitious effort to protect illegal immigrants the Obama Administration plans to prohibit both federal and local law enforcement officers from arresting undocumented aliens discovered as a result of traffic violations. It marks the third time this month that a covert plan to shield illegal aliens from deportation gets exposed. A few weeks ago the administration ordered authorities to halt the removal of some 700,000 illegal immigrants who are students while lawmakers craft legislation to officially spare them from expulsion. Weeks earlier an internal Homeland Security document revealed that the president has a secret backup plan to grant illegal immigrants amnesty in case Congress doesn’t pass legislation to do it. This week’s plan du jour is to shield illegal immigrants who break U.S. law by operating a vehicle without a license or driving recklessly, possibly endangering innocent Americans. A draft policy issued by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) says that agency Chief John Morton intends to prohibit his agents as well as local law enforcement officers from detaining illegal aliens stopped during traffic violations..." http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2010/08/ice-won-t-arrest-illegal-aliens-caught-traffic-stops/ The above Obama policy seems to mesh with his speech last night. It would appear that he is preparing for a mass amnesty.