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| Topic: Christ without Christianity | |
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No, I KNOW I'm right... That is a fool's belief. Then can you admit that you're wrong? About what? |
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I think he's trying to say that if he can't be right, neither can you.
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No, I KNOW I'm right... That is a fool's belief. Then can you admit that you're wrong? When it comes to faith-based spirituality "right and wrong" are a personal matter. What is "right" for you is right for you. What is "right" for someone else is right for them. It's a fool's belief when a person starts thinking that what's "right" for them is right for everyone. That when all HELL breaks loose.  |
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Cowboy....ONLY because you say you are a christian, am I addressing you about this one ...last.... time: what you are posting here on this forum, is NOT NOT NOT what the bible teaches at all.  I will agree with you on that point MorningSong.  Then please, I beg of you. Show me my error. Cowboy, don't worry about it. Everyone these days are making up their own religions. You have the right to do it to. So don't worry about it. All 4 of you guys are wrong... How would you know? I supposed you think YOU are right. No, I KNOW I'm right... Then prove it. Otherwise, don't make the claim. Same to you next time you speak of "hell", K? I'm only going by what the supposed "good" book says. And even if there wasn't a hell according to it all, eternal death is not any better of an option. So either way, a God that would do either of those things is wrong. But this isn't about me, you made the claim now either back it up or not. The burden of proof lies on you. U so funny! "even if"??? "eternal death"??? How can you be 'only going by the what the supposed "good" book says' if you're not even sure about what it says? If you want to believe what someone else tells you, don't change. If you want to believe yourself, then read it for yourself. Be prepared to learn though... |
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Edited by
MorningSong
on
Mon 11/07/11 05:02 PM
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10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. AFTER we are SAVED ( which comes by believing and accepting Jesus into our hearts }, does God THEN put His laws into our minds and writes them on the tablets of our heart...this does NOT come by WORKS, but ONLY by FIRST accepting JESUS as our Saviour into our hearts (Salvation)....no other way . We can NEVER WORK our way to God....or EARN our way to God by our good works. We can ONLY come to God ONE WAY....... by BELIEVING AND ACCEPTING THE FREE GIFT OF GRACE OFFERED TO US ALL.....JESUS CHRIST....... that is the ONLY WAY TO BE SAVED.........THIS IS THE ONLY WAY BACK INTO RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD !!! THEN AFTERWARDS....Works and Obedience FOLLOWS...because of our LOVE for God Now, which comes as a RESULT of a NEW HEART in us!!! |
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Cowboy....ONLY because you say you are a christian, am I addressing you about this one ...last.... time: what you are posting here on this forum, is NOT NOT NOT what the bible teaches at all. I will agree with you on that point MorningSong. Then please, I beg of you. Show me my error. Cowboy, don't worry about it. Everyone these days are making up their own religions. You have the right to do it to. So don't worry about it. All 4 of you guys are wrong... How would you know? I supposed you think YOU are right. No, I KNOW I'm right... Then prove it. Otherwise, don't make the claim. Same to you next time you speak of "hell", K? I'm only going by what the supposed "good" book says. And even if there wasn't a hell according to it all, eternal death is not any better of an option. So either way, a God that would do either of those things is wrong. But this isn't about me, you made the claim now either back it up or not. The burden of proof lies on you. U so funny! "even if"??? "eternal death"??? How can you be 'only going by the what the supposed "good" book says' if you're not even sure about what it says? If you want to believe what someone else tells you, don't change. If you want to believe yourself, then read it for yourself. Be prepared to learn though... I've read enough to know that the actions described of God in that book are NOTHING divine. I did that by using my mind, you know that thing in your head you use to THINK? You should try it sometime. Oh and you wanna talk funny? I'm not the one believing what others tell me when they say the Bible is God's word. No that's all on you, I know better now. So before you tell me I'm believing what someone else says, I suggest you look at yourself first. |
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AFTER we are SAVED Saved from what? A vengeful bully God who will harm you if you don't do as he says? You'd have to believe in a vengeful bully God that you need to be "saved" from before you could even talk about any need to be "saved". Why would I want to believe in a vengeful bully God that I need to be "saved" from in the first place? Just don't bother believing in a bully God in the first place and you won't have any need to be "saved" from its wrath. Problem solved.  |
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No, I KNOW I'm right... That is a fool's belief. Then can you admit that you're wrong? When it comes to faith-based spirituality "right and wrong" are a personal matter. What is "right" for you is right for you. What is "right" for someone else is right for them. It's a fool's belief when a person starts thinking that what's "right" for them is right for everyone. That when all HELL breaks loose. No, this isn't about spirituallity at all! This is about lies regarding the actuall written words of the Bible. This is about all of you trying to controll how it's to be taken by others. (literally or with each of your interpretations) Sorry folks, but while you see fairytales and unicorns, I see something more. I'm allowed to reject false teachers (and teachings). I'm allowed to think for myself. I don't have to hate homosexuals or "heathens". I don't have to contribute 10% to any church. I don't have to "obey" anyone. |
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Edited by
MorningSong
on
Mon 11/07/11 04:54 PM
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Now...WHEN a person TRULY gets SAVED, he will
FIRST be CONVICTED of His sins.......and will REPENT ...cause God thru the Power of His Holy Spirit , will CONVICT HIM of His sins AND His NEED of a Saviour!!! But....IF a person just blabs with His mouth some empty words ,and he is not convicted of his sins at all , or his need of a Saviour....then most likely nothing happened. (The evidence of salvation will always show in a changed lifestyle afterwards). God first DRAWS a man and CONVICTS a man of his sin and his need of a Saviour, , in order to SAVE that man.
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Peter Pan wrote: I'm allowed to reject false teachers (and teachings). I'm allowed to think for myself. I don't have to hate homosexuals or "heathens". I don't have to contribute 10% to any church. I don't have to "obey" anyone. Did someone try to tell you otherwise? It seems to me that if you are allowed to think for yourself it wouldn't bother you if someone told you otherwise anyway.  |
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I've read enough to know that the actions described of God in that book are NOTHING divine. I did that by using my mind, you know that thing in your head you use to THINK? You should try it sometime. Oh and you wanna talk funny? I'm not the one believing what others tell me when they say the Bible is God's word. No that's all on you, I know better now. So before you tell me I'm believing what someone else says, I suggest you look at yourself first. Yeah, you're funny. Just like a standard "free thinker" you assert that I say the Bible is "God's word". I bet you assert that I take it all literally too, huh? A simple task for you if you can for once stop acting so smug. Find the root words for what was translated into the English "hell" and "eternal". Until you do that, I'll never believe you have read "enough to know" JACK SQUAT! |
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Cowboy wrote: No it's just you didn't comprehend what I was saying. Not ment as an insult either. If you tell someone play with fire, they'll wind up burnt. If they continue playing with fire, it is their OWN fault they got burnt. God doesn't condemn anyone. The only one that condemns someone, is themselves. We are told not to do certain things, and the outcome of it if we choose to disobey. Now, who's fault would it be if the someone receives the punishment? It would be the person in question, not God's. God told us not to play with fire. So why not listen, and obey? Why get burned intentionally? Well, I don't mean to insult you either, but clearly you aren't comprehending what I'm saying. Fire can burn you if you mishandle it. And that would indeed be YOUR FAULT for having played with fire. And that would be especially true if you were warned ahead of time that it was dangerous. ~~~~~ However, God is NOT DANGEROUS (supposedly) You can't "burn yourself" by playing with God. If God want to HURT you he's going to have to do it INTENTIONALLY. If he casts you into a fiery furnace and gnashes your teeth he could have only done this with the INTENT to do you harm. Fire does not INTENTIONALLY hurt you. It just is what it is. If you burn yourself playing with fire, you did that to yourself. If a God INTENTIONALLY casts you into a fiery furnace and gnashes your teeth, he did that TO YOU, ON PURPOSE and FULLY AWARE of what he was doing. So such a God would be a mean cruel bully. And to try to pretend that the person merely 'burned' themselves because they didn't listen simply doesn't compare at all. The Biblical God would need to be an INTENTIONAL BULLY. He's a sentient being who has CONTROL over his own actions. He's not just a mindless flame. So your comparison with a nasty BULLY God with playing with fire doesn't even come close to addressing this issue. I hope that you can understand my point by now. I can hardly spell it out any plainer than this. You can't put the "blame" for a nasty cruel God onto the person that he is being cruel to. That's nonsense. And this is especially true in the case of mere "non-belief". That would just be a truly nasty bully of a God. Your analogy with playing with fire doesn't fit at all. FIRE is not a sentient being. GOD is! So if God hurts you, he did it on PURPOSE. Knowingly and intentionally. You can't "burn yourself" by playing with God. If God want to HURT you he's going to have to do it INTENTIONALLY. If he casts you into a fiery furnace and gnashes your teeth he could have only done this with the INTENT to do you harm. No you can't burn yourself by playing with God, you burn yourself with playing with fire eg., not obeying God. God doesn't want to harm you or hurt you in any possible way. No verses say he wants to gnash your teeth or that he will. Only that there is gnashing of teeth in hell. Gnashing - Grind (one's teeth) together, typically as a sign of anger. (of teeth) Strike together; grind. The verse in reference says "There will be". Does not say "your teeth will be gnashing" or anything of such. While in hell one would hear these teeth gnashing in the background. If he casts you into a fiery furnace and gnashes your teeth he could have only done this with the INTENT to do you harm. You tell me why he would want to through you in the fiery furnace and gnash your teeth and you will know the reason you're there and who in the long run through you there. Fire does not INTENTIONALLY hurt you. It just is what it is. If you burn yourself playing with fire, you did that to yourself. And if someone goes to where their is gnashing of teeth, they did it themselves. If one obeys God and does as he wishes, one won't go where there is gnashing of teeth. So it is still the person's fault, it is the person who condemns themselves to hell. So your comparison with a nasty BULLY God with playing with fire doesn't even come close to addressing this issue. Works perfectly. If one gets burned playing with fire, it was cause he was playing with the fire. If one gets burned in hell, it was cause he was playing with God so to speak. One doesn't get burned in either occasion if they did what they were suppose to do. You don't play with the first stick, you won't get burned. You don't play with the laws God has given us, you won't get burned. |
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And hopefully, everyone one day will realize it was about RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD all along......and was never about RELIGION (religious WORKS) at all. It is entirely about relationship with God. |
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Kleisto wrote" I've read enough to know that the actions described of God in that book are NOTHING divine. I did that BY USING MY MIND, you know that thing in your HEAD you use to THINK? You should try it sometime. Kleisto....WHEN God DRAWS you, He will come Knocking on your HEART, not your mind. NO ONE come to Faith to believe in God thru the mind, but thru the heart. |
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AFTER we are SAVED Saved from what? A vengeful bully God who will harm you if you don't do as he says? You'd have to believe in a vengeful bully God that you need to be "saved" from before you could even talk about any need to be "saved". Why would I want to believe in a vengeful bully God that I need to be "saved" from in the first place? Just don't bother believing in a bully God in the first place and you won't have any need to be "saved" from its wrath. Problem solved. There is no saving from God, there is nothing to be saved from with God. We are saved from Satan and the only thing he offers, death. |
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10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. AFTER we are SAVED ( which comes by believing and accepting Jesus into our hearts }, does God THEN put His laws into our minds and writes them on the tablets of our heart...this does NOT come by WORKS, but ONLY by FIRST accepting JESUS as our Saviour into our hearts (Salvation)....no other way . We can NEVER WORK our way to God....or EARN our way to God by our good works. We can ONLY come to God ONE WAY....... by BELIEVING AND ACCEPTING THE FREE GIFT OF GRACE OFFERED TO US ALL.....JESUS CHRIST....... that is the ONLY WAY TO BE SAVED.........THIS IS THE ONLY WAY BACK INTO RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD !!! THEN AFTERWARDS....Works and Obedience FOLLOWS...because of our LOVE for God Now, which comes as a RESULT of a NEW HEART in us!!! I've bolded the untruth up above. According to the Bible, there is another way... |
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10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. AFTER we are SAVED ( which comes by believing and accepting Jesus into our hearts }, does God THEN put His laws into our minds and writes them on the tablets of our heart...this does NOT come by WORKS, but ONLY by FIRST accepting JESUS as our Saviour into our hearts (Salvation)....no other way . We can NEVER WORK our way to God....or EARN our way to God by our good works. We can ONLY come to God ONE WAY....... by BELIEVING AND ACCEPTING THE FREE GIFT OF GRACE OFFERED TO US ALL.....JESUS CHRIST....... that is the ONLY WAY TO BE SAVED.........THIS IS THE ONLY WAY BACK INTO RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD !!! THEN AFTERWARDS....Works and Obedience FOLLOWS...because of our LOVE for God Now, which comes as a RESULT of a NEW HEART in us!!! I've bolded the untruth up above. According to the Bible, there is another way... May I ask what the other way is? God looks away from sin. If you have sinned, that sin remains in you till you are forgiven. The only way to be forgiven is through Jesus. So again, may I ask what the other way is? |
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Edited by
MorningSong
on
Mon 11/07/11 05:21 PM
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Peterpan wrote:
I'm allowed to reject false teachers (and teachings). I'm allowed to think for myself. I don't have to hate homosexuals or "heathens". I don't have to contribute 10% to any church. I don't have to "obey" anyone. Without FIRST Believing and Accepting the Free Gift of Grace that God Offers us.... then yes.....anything else BEFOE that , is just in vain......dead works!!! BUt again, AFTER Salvation, Works and Doing Good WILL FOLLOW (which shows the PROOF that we ARE saved), and ONLY THEN , Will our Good Works and Obedience PLEASE God. ONLY THEN AFTERWARDS!!!! NOT BEFORE !!! |
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10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. AFTER we are SAVED ( which comes by believing and accepting Jesus into our hearts }, does God THEN put His laws into our minds and writes them on the tablets of our heart...this does NOT come by WORKS, but ONLY by FIRST accepting JESUS as our Saviour into our hearts (Salvation)....no other way . We can NEVER WORK our way to God....or EARN our way to God by our good works. We can ONLY come to God ONE WAY....... by BELIEVING AND ACCEPTING THE FREE GIFT OF GRACE OFFERED TO US ALL.....JESUS CHRIST....... that is the ONLY WAY TO BE SAVED.........THIS IS THE ONLY WAY BACK INTO RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD !!! THEN AFTERWARDS....Works and Obedience FOLLOWS...because of our LOVE for God Now, which comes as a RESULT of a NEW HEART in us!!! I've bolded the untruth up above. According to the Bible, there is another way... May I ask what the other way is? God looks away from sin. If you have sinned, that sin remains in you till you are forgiven. The only way to be forgiven is through Jesus. So again, may I ask what the other way is? Actually a better way to explain it is, sinning in itself is turning away from God. So how can you get somewhere when you continually turn away from it? |
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May I ask what the other way is? God looks away from sin. If you have sinned, that sin remains in you till you are forgiven. The only way to be forgiven is through Jesus. So again, may I ask what the other way is? Why do you claim that the "only way to be forgiven is through Jesus?" |
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