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My apologies. I need to make a correction.
Apollo was not a demigod, he was a full-fledged God as his father was God and his mother a Goddess. Hercules was a demigod, he was half God and half human like Jesus. |
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Davidben wrote: for even "jesus" declared himself as "one with any father", or the same as, so therefore, NO FATHER AS "GOD" TO EXIST, AS HUMANS SO WANT TO MAKE IT... Truly. That is precisely what Jesus taught. If Jesus and the father are one, then there is no 'father' beyond the human condition. That's precisely what Jesus was saying. That's a pantheistic statement that the Christian (the authors of the New Testament) never understood. Cowboy wrote: And I said no, i do not know the name of our father for Jesus never said the name nor is it mentioned through out the bible. Well, why focus on Jesus?  If you subscribe to the idea that the Holy Cannon of Stories we call the Bible is the "Word of God" then God's name is Jealous. [color] Exod.34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God: It clearly states right in the Old Testament that the LORD's name is Jealous. Unless of course you either don't believe the Bible is the "Word of God", or you don't believe it is inerrant. Otherwise, the Biblical God's name is Jealous. There's no need to look to Jesus for God's name. Besides, why do you focus on Jesus? Jesus was merely the Son of God. You are not supposed to be worshiping Jesus, or idolizing him in any way, you are supposed to love the God of the Old Testament with all your heart, mind, body and soul. Jesus was merely his half-son. Jesus was half-human and necessarily had to be in order to claim his genetic inheritance from King David. So Jesus was a mere demigod. Jesus could not have been "The Father" in this fable as others have claimed. It simply doesn't fit in with the rest of the fable. The only way to believe that Jesus and the Father are truly One is to go with the pantheistic view of God as Davidben has so wisely illustrated above. But then that brings us face-to-face with my theory that Jesus was indeed a Mahayana Buddhist Bodhisattva which makes perfect sense. It certainly makes far more sense then the idea of a demigod claiming that he is the same as the father. That would be like Apollo claiming that he was Zeus, or Hercules claiming that he was Zeus. ====================================== Exod.34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God: ====================================== Thank, I did not know of this verse. I truly do thank you. ---------------------------------------- ====================================== Besides, why do you focus on Jesus? Jesus was merely the Son of God. You are not supposed to be worshiping Jesus, or idolizing him in any way, ====================================== I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think?  |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think? Yes Greek Mythology is pretty interesting, but can we please stay on that subject? |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think? Yes Greek Mythology is pretty interesting, but can we please stay on that subject? What subject is that?  I thought were were talking about religious mythologies and whether or not a person can be sure about what they believe. The OP was asking atheists if they can be sure there is no "God". So it makes perfect sense to ask if anyone can be sure that a particular mythology they choose to believe in is the "Word of God". These questions go hand-in-hand. You keep blathering on referring to one particular mythology as though it is unquestionably the "Word of God". But that's ridiculous. How can you be sure that it is? You can't be. On the contrary, you might think that you are sure that it is, yet I am absolutely certain that it cannot be. So clearly we differ in our views. You claim that "Jesus is the only way to God", but that's absurd, all you're doing is reciting from an ancient mythology that YOU have chosen to believe. Are you sure? No, you can't be sure. I mean, sure you can brainwash yourself into believing that you're sure, but that's totally meaningless. At least to everyone else who doesn't think like you. To claim that your choice of mythology trumps everyone else's views on life is the most self-centered and arrogant position that a person can possibly take. Just because the fairytale itself makes this claim doesn't automatically make it true. You're like a broken record. "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" and so on ad-nauseam. I mean, if you want to believe in such nonsense, more power to you, but to act like you're not just accepting some ancient gossip rumors as truth because you feel like it, is just nonsense. You can worship any mythology you want. That doesn't give it any more merit than any other mythology. |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think? Yes Greek Mythology is pretty interesting, but can we please stay on that subject? What subject is that? I thought were were talking about religious mythologies and whether or not a person can be sure about what they believe. The OP was asking atheists if they can be sure there is no "God". So it makes perfect sense to ask if anyone can be sure that a particular mythology they choose to believe in is the "Word of God". These questions go hand-in-hand. You keep blathering on referring to one particular mythology as though it is unquestionably the "Word of God". But that's ridiculous. How can you be sure that it is? You can't be. On the contrary, you might think that you are sure that it is, yet I am absolutely certain that it cannot be. So clearly we differ in our views. You claim that "Jesus is the only way to God", but that's absurd, all you're doing is reciting from an ancient mythology that YOU have chosen to believe. Are you sure? No, you can't be sure. I mean, sure you can brainwash yourself into believing that you're sure, but that's totally meaningless. At least to everyone else who doesn't think like you. To claim that your choice of mythology trumps everyone else's views on life is the most self-centered and arrogant position that a person can possibly take. Just because the fairytale itself makes this claim doesn't automatically make it true. You're like a broken record. "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" "The Bible is the Word of God" "How do you know?" "The Bible says so" "How do you know the bible is telling the truth?" and so on ad-nauseam. I mean, if you want to believe in such nonsense, more power to you, but to act like you're not just accepting some ancient gossip rumors as truth because you feel like it, is just nonsense. You can worship any mythology you want. That doesn't give it any more merit than any other mythology. I have felt the presence of the lord. I know he is real, for I have a substantial reasoning having felt his presence. I believe in no mythology, rumour, or anything of such. When someone is lying, most usually you can feel it. It's referred to as a gut feeling. With this same feeling, I have felt that the lord is real and felt his presence just as you can feel someone come into the room when it's just you in that room then someone walks in. |
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Cowboy wrote: I have felt the presence of the lord. I know he is real, for I have a substantial reasoning having felt his presence. I believe in no mythology, rumour, or anything of such. When someone is lying, most usually you can feel it. It's referred to as a gut feeling. With this same feeling, I have felt that the lord is real and felt his presence just as you can feel someone come into the room when it's just you in that room then someone walks in. That's nice. I feel the same way about my vision of God as well. So clearly our feelings of God have nothing to do with the mythologies we entertain as an archetypal structure to visualize and commune with this divine presence. I have recognized that the divine presence is independent of the psychic archetypes we use to envision it, as many other great spiritual leaders have also acknowledged. Obviously you haven't recognized this yet. That's really the only difference between us.  |
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if one has felt the "divine", and the "divine" word of god, declare's ALL as children of god, than how does one's one personal "feelings" match the "divine feelings", as "all are child gods"...
for even this jesus declared "all ye are gods"... but, many and most that claim to believe in the "good ole book", simply can't handle any such notion as true, as their own elf declared superiority would be destroyed the instant they took such as true. can a child be a child god, and not become as an adult god? only if it believe in "god", and embrace not some bias of only "some" as being of god. for any belief, that believe something or anything, and only applies it "selectively", to some, per it's own feelings as the guide, of course, bias shall be the only thing created by such. a view of "by us", should all other's behave, and believe, and speak, and live their mortal existence. sheer bi us mentality. and THE US? only whom agree with self. all other's? no valuable use or purpose for. seems to be what the very "jesus" stood against. even the "by us", willing to kill to keep the "by us" mentality unobstructed. classic self bias mentality as alwasy in human history. left unchecked, it always comes to hate enough to erase what oppose itself and the self group. |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think? God had messengers before Jesus and after Jesus and provided each messenger with a combination of laws as how to form a path to God that didn't include Jesus ..these combination of specific laws is what constitute as being a religion Jesus is the messenger and the way for those that choose to follow the teachings of Jesus as a path to God but Jesus teachings is not the only way to God |
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I neither worship Jesus or idolize him. I worship our father through Jesus. For Jesus is the path to our father. He is the way. There is no way to the father but through Jesus Christ. Yes, I know how the fairy tale goes, I read that one too. The father is like Santa Claus and knows who's naughty and who's nice, and he deals out rewards or death accordingly. He also kills any of his children who mistakenly think that he's nice. I just finished reading a story about a Goddess named Artemis. These ancient fairy tales are pretty interesting don't you think? God had messengers before Jesus and after Jesus and provided each messenger with a combination of laws as how to form a path to God that didn't include Jesus ..these combination of specific laws is what constitute as being a religion Jesus is the messenger and the way for those that choose to follow the teachings of Jesus as a path to God but Jesus teachings is not the only way to God Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." The Holy Ghost is our father on earth my friend. Would also like to bring attention to this Matthew 3:17 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." that's what I said...that Jesus is not the begotton son of God but the begotton son of The Holy Ghost... |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." that's what I said...that Jesus is not the begotton son of God but the begotton son of The Holy Ghost... Matthew 3:17 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. ======================== Whom do you think the Holy Ghost is? The Holy Ghost is our father on earth in a solid form. |
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Edited by
funches
on
Mon 11/08/10 07:52 AM
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." that's what I said...that Jesus is not the begotton son of God but the begotton son of The Holy Ghost... Matthew 3:17 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. ======================== Whom do you think the Holy Ghost is? The Holy Ghost is our father on earth in a solid form. supposedly everyone is the beloved sons and/or daughters of God....so where does it say that Jesus is God only "begotton son"? |
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Whom do you think the Holy Ghost is? The Holy Ghost is our father on earth in a solid form. Ghosts are not solid |
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supposedly everyone is the beloved sons and/or daughters of God....so where does it say that Jesus is God only "begotton son"? That's one of the biggest fallacies of the Christian religion. Nowhere in the Bible does it even have Jesus making any such claim. On the contrary he supposedly said, "Ye are gods" The verses that Christians point to that make these claims aren't even attributed by the authors of the gospels to Jesus. On the contrary those claims are written in as narrative OPINIONS by the authors. Moreover, there's really no reason to take seriously and so-called 'quotes' attributed to Jesus anyway. Such 'quotes' themselves can only be speculation on the part of the authors. They were attempting to claim to quote him 'verbatim', yet they were doing so decades after the man had died. Moreover, the different authors don't even quote Jesus in precisely the same way in the same situations. So they have revealed via their own writings that they are just guessing at what he might have said, and worse yet at what he might have actually MEANT. The Bible really has nothing to do with Jesus directly. Moreover, even according to these hearsay writings, even Jesus did not instruct anyone to support any particular cannon of stories as the "Word of God", nor did he suggest that they should hold the Torah (or Old Testament) up as the "Word of God". In fact, even the gospels have Jesus referring to the Torah as "Your LAW", not "My LAW" when he speaks to the Jews and Pharisees. He is always quoted as asking, "Does not YOUR LAW say,... blah, blah, blah". He never refers to the Torah as "God's Law" or "God's Word". NEVER. So Jesus never even suggested that anyone should argue that the Torah (Old Testament), is the "Word of God", or that any supposed New Testament (that didn't even exist when Jesus was alive), represents His views! So to hold up the biblical Cannon in the name of "Jesus" is silly. Jesus never even remotely suggested that anyone should do any such thing. He couldn't possibly have done that because the New Testament didn't even exist when he was alive. |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." that's what I said...that Jesus is not the begotton son of God but the begotton son of The Holy Ghost... Matthew 3:17 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. ======================== Whom do you think the Holy Ghost is? The Holy Ghost is our father on earth in a solid form. 'Matthew' was written some 200 years AFTER the man Mathew was done buried. A good analysis of writing style shows that Mathew was either written by 2 people or by a schizophrien. So then... The things put forth by that book (in some instances) are PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the real world. God and his powers notwithstanding... One then must ask themselves what USE such a story would be to the ones that first purpetuated it. Or could it simply be that the only way to bend the story of Jesus to match the prophesy was to insert falsehood? There are many ways to god... The best ones require no tools of man... Nor can the greatness of God be contained in bindings, paper and ink. |
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Jesus was the only begotten child of God. Through Jesus is the ONLY way to our father. Yes before Jesus walked the earth people went to heaven not "through" Jesus obviously because he had not come yet. And that was because they followed the "old" testament, which was the law at that time. But with the coming of Jesus, he fulfilled the old testament, completed it, finished it. Then he gave us the new testament, the new covenant between man and our father. if God provide people a way to him before Jesus then God used other messengers to provide a way to him after Jesus ....also Jesus is not the begotton son of God for it was not God that got mary pregnant...Jesus is the begotton son of the Holy Ghost Matthew 1:18 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Wish to bring attention to "before they were together" and "she was found with a CHILD of the Holy Ghost." that's what I said...that Jesus is not the begotton son of God but the begotton son of The Holy Ghost... Matthew 3:17 17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. ======================== Whom do you think the Holy Ghost is? The Holy Ghost is our father on earth in a solid form. 'Matthew' was written some 200 years AFTER the man Mathew was done buried. A good analysis of writing style shows that Mathew was either written by 2 people or by a schizophrien. So then... The things put forth by that book (in some instances) are PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE in the real world. God and his powers notwithstanding... One then must ask themselves what USE such a story would be to the ones that first purpetuated it. Or could it simply be that the only way to bend the story of Jesus to match the prophesy was to insert falsehood? There are many ways to god... The best ones require no tools of man... Nor can the greatness of God be contained in bindings, paper and ink. Truely - I think it might have been Abra in a far, far away thread who posed the question - how come a severed limb has never been made whole again? Now that would have been an interesting tale. |
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