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| Topic: Is Knowledge a Gift from Satan | |
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Yes and a frog has free will. That is exactly what it is funches, you are free to do what ever will you wish to do. And God also says you sin and do Satan's will you will cease to exist. But still you have the possibility of doing as such *FREE WILL*. That is all free will is, is the ability to do as one wants to do. see...you said that if you sin or do Satan's will that you will cease to exist ...it's a threat from God that influence choice .... God told us of the consequence........ speaking to a child, does it not work best when you say "Don't do that or you'll be grounded" Puts a wager on that action, and then we have the free will to take that wager or not do it. It is still nevertheless our choice to use our free will. And regardless if God does influence our choice.......... that is INFLUENCE, that is still not force so in terms not taking away free will. The ONLY way it would take free will away is if it was forcefully done. Cowboy...if God told you of the consequences of disobedience...only means that God has threathen |
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Yes because it is their fault. You keep saying we don't have free will, then try to blame God for the actions they have taken. If a creation is controlling us eg., taking away free will, how would it then be the creations fault? if something was created but didn't work as planned...then the fault lies on the one that created it... |
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Yes and a frog has free will. That is exactly what it is funches, you are free to do what ever will you wish to do. And God also says you sin and do Satan's will you will cease to exist. But still you have the possibility of doing as such *FREE WILL*. That is all free will is, is the ability to do as one wants to do. see...you said that if you sin or do Satan's will that you will cease to exist ...it's a threat from God that influence choice .... God told us of the consequence........ speaking to a child, does it not work best when you say "Don't do that or you'll be grounded" Puts a wager on that action, and then we have the free will to take that wager or not do it. It is still nevertheless our choice to use our free will. And regardless if God does influence our choice.......... that is INFLUENCE, that is still not force so in terms not taking away free will. The ONLY way it would take free will away is if it was forcefully done. Cowboy...if God told you of the consequences of disobedience...only means that God has threathen Not really, would you rather live with with out the knowledge of the consequences and find out one day you're going to burn in the lake of fire because of how you lived your life, but you had no clue it was wrong. Or would you rather know what you can and can not do as to try to give yourself a better outcome? |
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I believe that we are all made in the likeness of god.... therefore....god gave us knowledge....and the ability TO LEARN........what satan has done, is tempt us to do wrong. satan only did what he was created to do....be an angel but he failed...............cast out....... 
wouldn't it more likely be that God failed  GOD failed?????? hardly..........god gave satan the
knowlede to learn....he failed, he failed on his own, therefore was cast out! Adam and Eve and Satan were God's creations...so if they did not do as God planned....then it's God that failed ...you keep trying to blame the creations yes...........god created us all......he also gave us KNOWLEDGE, to learn, to make our OWN choices.......yes, he may have had an idea of what he WANTED....BUT....he also gave us the CHOICE, to let us learn right from wrong...to suffer the consequences, and to learn from them! AND TO BE FORGIVEN!
god gave us the influence......he didnt make our choices for us! WE DID! satan chose to FAIL all on his own....therefore was cast out! and satan wants us to fail also. Thankfully god gave us the knowledge NOT to fail as he did....... |
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Yes because it is their fault. You keep saying we don't have free will, then try to blame God for the actions they have taken. If a creation is controlling us eg., taking away free will, how would it then be the creations fault? if something was created but didn't work as planned...then the fault lies on the one that created it... Not with free will. Because with free will we can DO ANYTHING. Again your thinking would only have worked if we were wired/programmed to live our lives. But we aren't, we have FREE WILL to do anything we please when and how we do it. |
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Yes because it is their fault. You keep saying we don't have free will, then try to blame God for the actions they have taken. If a creation is controlling us eg., taking away free will, how would it then be the creations fault? if something was created but didn't work as planned...then the fault lies on the one that created it... not if we were given a mind of our own, to make our own choices...NO! |
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Not really, would you rather live with with out the knowledge of the consequences and find out one day you're going to burn in the lake of fire because of how you lived your life, but you had no clue it was wrong. Or would you rather know what you can and can not do as to try to give yourself a better outcome? Cowboy...when someone is relating to you that they will toss you into a lake of fire if you do not make a choice in their favor....that is a threat .... and if you view this as being good and your fault...then it's falls into the same realm as low self-esteem or battered-wife syndrome |
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yes...........god created us all......he also gave us KNOWLEDGE, to learn, to make our OWN choices.......yes, he may have had an idea of what he WANTED....BUT....he also gave us the CHOICE, to let us learn right from wrong...to suffer the consequences, and to learn from them! AND TO BE FORGIVEN!
god gave us the influence......he didnt make our choices for us! WE DID! satan chose to FAIL all on his own....therefore was cast out! and satan wants us to fail also. Thankfully god gave us the knowledge NOT to fail as he did....... BL4766 .....for you to say that God may have had an idea is an indication that he wasn't omniscient.......either God knew what he was doing or he didn't know .... also before they took from the fruit there is no indication that God have given Adam and Eve any more knowledge or intelligence than that of a 5 year old...which is another failure on God's part the choices Adam and Eve made were due to a lack of knowledge God that God have failed to give to them or teach them....which means that the judeo-christian religion arised from a lack of knowledge....hence faith |
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Not with free will. Because with free will we can DO ANYTHING. Again your thinking would only have worked if we were wired/programmed to live our lives. But we aren't, we have FREE WILL to do anything we please when and how we do it. Cowboy...you keep saying that with "Free Will" you can do anything....can you use your "Free Will" to make the choice to live forever without food and water and have the abiity to carry it out ...if the answer is no...then you do not have the "Free Will" to do anything |
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Yes because it is their fault. You keep saying we don't have free will, then try to blame God for the actions they have taken. If a creation is controlling us eg., taking away free will, how would it then be the creations fault? if something was created but didn't work as planned...then the fault lies on the one that created it... not if we were given a mind of our own, to make our own choices...NO! if God gave Adam and Eve a mind to make their own choices and the choices they made messed up his plans....then the fault still lies with God ...surely an omniscient God would have known what would happen if he made the choice to give people a mind to make choices |
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I love your ability of debate funches.....
BUT... theres also NO indication that adam & eve DIDNT have knowledge either! thats pure speculation on your part! God let them decide on their own....gave them the consequences to live with....lesson learned....THATS what i believe god was out to do...let us learn by our own mistakes....to live with the consequences....and go on, & learn to do what is right. If he made up our minds FOR US..what would be the point??? No one would of ever done wrong...no one would learn....no one would gain more knowledge....he gave us the ability to learn.....he gave us choices! I believe he gave us a mind-of-our-own.....for a reason. |
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I love your ability of debate funches..... BUT... theres also NO indication that adam & eve DIDNT have knowledge either! thats pure speculation on your part! God let them decide on their own....gave them the consequences to live with....lesson learned....THATS what i believe god was out to do...let us learn by our own mistakes....to live with the consequences....and go on, & learn to do what is right. If he made up our minds FOR US..what would be the point??? No one would of ever done wrong...no one would learn....no one would gain more knowledge....he gave us the ability to learn.....he gave us choices! I believe he gave us a mind-of-our-own.....for a reason. there is an indication that Adam and Eve lacked knowledge ...according to the bible all Adam and Eve knew were how to till the soil and give animals names...a 5 year old can do that you're also welcome to post a passage from the bible that indicate that Adam and Eve had the knowledge or the intelligence beyond a 5 year old |
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Not really, would you rather live with with out the knowledge of the consequences and find out one day you're going to burn in the lake of fire because of how you lived your life, but you had no clue it was wrong. Or would you rather know what you can and can not do as to try to give yourself a better outcome? Cowboy...when someone is relating to you that they will toss you into a lake of fire if you do not make a choice in their favor....that is a threat .... and if you view this as being good and your fault...then it's falls into the same realm as low self-esteem or battered-wife syndrome God didn't present it that way, nor intended for it to be presented that way. God is a loving God and offers the gift of heaven for merely doing a few things throughout your life. God offered the gift of heaven out of love, God doesn't threaten with the lake of fire. |
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Not with free will. Because with free will we can DO ANYTHING. Again your thinking would only have worked if we were wired/programmed to live our lives. But we aren't, we have FREE WILL to do anything we please when and how we do it. Cowboy...you keep saying that with "Free Will" you can do anything....can you use your "Free Will" to make the choice to live forever without food and water and have the abiity to carry it out ...if the answer is no...then you do not have the "Free Will" to do anything no because this shell/mortal body needs it. I still would have the free will/choice not to eat or drink yes. |
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I love your ability of debate funches..... BUT... theres also NO indication that adam & eve DIDNT have knowledge either! thats pure speculation on your part! God let them decide on their own....gave them the consequences to live with....lesson learned....THATS what i believe god was out to do...let us learn by our own mistakes....to live with the consequences....and go on, & learn to do what is right. If he made up our minds FOR US..what would be the point??? No one would of ever done wrong...no one would learn....no one would gain more knowledge....he gave us the ability to learn.....he gave us choices! I believe he gave us a mind-of-our-own.....for a reason. there is an indication that Adam and Eve lacked knowledge ...according to the bible all Adam and Eve knew were how to till the soil and give animals names...a 5 year old can do that you're also welcome to post a passage from the bible that indicate that Adam and Eve had the knowledge or the intelligence beyond a 5 year old What more knowledge was needed when living in a paradise where everything was given to you? |
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God didn't present it that way, nor intended for it to be presented that way. God is a loving God and offers the gift of heaven for merely doing a few things throughout your life. God offered the gift of heaven out of love, God doesn't threaten with the lake of fire. whichever way God presented it doesn't take away the fact that it was a threat...follow me or else ....also creating a lake of fire or a place of torture is not the sign of love |
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God didn't present it that way, nor intended for it to be presented that way. God is a loving God and offers the gift of heaven for merely doing a few things throughout your life. God offered the gift of heaven out of love, God doesn't threaten with the lake of fire. whichever way God presented it doesn't take away the fact that it was a threat...follow me or else ....also creating a lake of fire or a place of torture is not the sign of love There will be no torture though. When you pass away on earth and if you don't receive the gift of heaven you just cease to exist. No torture, no nothing. |
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Edited by
BL4766
on
Thu 06/24/10 08:19 AM
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there is nothing indicating that they had the mind of a 5yr old!
nothing! its obvious their minds were well beyond the 5yr old! they were able to till the soil, that doesnt put them at a 5yr old level!!!!!! that actually says to me that their mind was BEYOND a 5yr old! a 5yr old wouldnt have the first clue.... giving names doesnt mean their mind was at a 5yr old level either! yes, a 5yr old can give names...but the bible DOES NOT SAY that their minds were like a 5yr old!!!!!! im YET to read a passage from the bible that SAYS adam & eve had a mind of a 5yr old......it aint there! |
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Edited by
funches
on
Thu 06/24/10 08:17 AM
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no because this shell/mortal body needs it. I still would have the free will/choice not to eat or drink yes. but you don't have the "Free Will" to remain alive and healhty without food and water .....as long as you have needs...you don't have "Free Will"...it are the needs that govern your will |
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no because this shell/mortal body needs it. I still would have the free will/choice not to eat or drink yes. but you don't have the "Free Will" to remain alive and healhty without food and water .....as long as you have needs...you don't have "Free Will"...it are the needs that govern your will only quoting half the post again i see, playing word games........ you know when you do this it looses it's entire message ment to be and you know this and is why you do it. I clearly said this mortal body needs, but i am not this mortal body this is just a carry shell for us. If i receive the gift of heaven I, what is truly me will live for ever, this body won't, it'll last a mere 60 years if that. |
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