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| Topic: Guilty ot not? | |
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My years running a clinic (and half a century on the planet!) has taught me there are two distinct polarities to which most ascribe, to one side much more than the other: 1. Shame/Guilt Based (Usually what I call 'The Emotionalists', ruled by their feelings, not thoughts!) 2. Blame/Unaccountability Based (Usually what I call 'The Mentalists', ruled by their thoughts, not feelings!) The 'Guilt Based' - Are always the kinder, more sensitive creatures that wear their hearts on their sleeves and always step up to accountability for their mistakes. When extreme, they take on the responsibility/guilt for everything and everyone and shame their way right into illness (and, yeah, much is most definitely resultant of a deeply religious, childhood hangover remnant!) They better process things and move on when they strive to 'get better'. I have an incredible clinical success rate w/ this community and call them 'The Flyers'. I very much prefer to work w/ this community. IF they don't get stuck in it, they are the healthiest of the 2 types. IF they remain stuck? They become gravely ill much sooner and check out. Sad but true! The 'Blame Based' - Are a nightmare in my experience! They are almost impossible to work w/ and achieve any real, lasting results! Nothing is their fault, they are eternal victims and nothing will ever change that or deliver them into the ability towards healing accountability. Almost as if they've given over control of their lives outcome because it is outside their jurisdiction, someone/something else's responsibility/fault, and they are eternally powerless to change it! This crew generally never wears their heart on their sleeve, do not process their mistakes (NOT my fault types!), do not implement healthy changes and make life a living Hell for the shame based! They take adversity and blame it on the world! They STAY sick and I call them 'The Crawlers'. I will ONLY work w/ this community IF they've identified it and really want to change! I can't treat endless symptoms forever; I am only interested in CURE! I often wonder if the 'Old Souls' are those SO able to step up to the plate of accountability, that they can go overboard. They usually exude wisdom also! And, the 'New Souls' are not able to grasp their role in accountability ... at least not YET!? They can be dumb as rocks, and mean as a rattler! I seriously doubt serial killers, etc. are 'Old Souls'! ... But ... that is another topic! a little off here, (apologies) I dunno, you may have done a little over generalization here. Old souls going overboard, people "STAY(ING) sick", derogative descriptions of people, etc. I realize this is a topic for another day, but each life is lessons for a individual. Saying you only are interested in the CURE is like saying I only want the destination not the journey. It is always about the journey. Perhaps those Blame Based come to you as your lesson in life, you are drawing them to you, for you both to experience and grow, and perhaps they will continue until you're learned how to help them heal. A good practioner stays with the hardest cases, if you are tired and no longer want them to be coming to you, maybe you are done with the lesson for this lifetime and you will continue it with the next life and probally with the same souls. They won't go away you know, nothing ever does until you find peace, not abandonement, and discouragement, failure with what has been set before you. We all encounter this in our lifetimes. Burnout happens when what we are doing doesn't work for too long, you sound tired. JMHO. |
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Edited by
Dancere
on
Tue 12/29/09 10:40 PM
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My years running a clinic (and half a century on the planet!) has taught me there are two distinct polarities to which most ascribe, to one side much more than the other: 1. Shame/Guilt Based (Usually what I call 'The Emotionalists', ruled by their feelings, not thoughts!) 2. Blame/Unaccountability Based (Usually what I call 'The Mentalists', ruled by their thoughts, not feelings!) The 'Guilt Based' - Are always the kinder, more sensitive creatures that wear their hearts on their sleeves and always step up to accountability for their mistakes. When extreme, they take on the responsibility/guilt for everything and everyone and shame their way right into illness (and, yeah, much is most definitely resultant of a deeply religious, childhood hangover remnant!) They better process things and move on when they strive to 'get better'. I have an incredible clinical success rate w/ this community and call them 'The Flyers'. I very much prefer to work w/ this community. IF they don't get stuck in it, they are the healthiest of the 2 types. IF they remain stuck? They become gravely ill much sooner and check out. Sad but true! The 'Blame Based' - Are a nightmare in my experience! They are almost impossible to work w/ and achieve any real, lasting results! Nothing is their fault, they are eternal victims and nothing will ever change that or deliver them into the ability towards healing accountability. Almost as if they've given over control of their lives outcome because it is outside their jurisdiction, someone/something else's responsibility/fault, and they are eternally powerless to change it! This crew generally never wears their heart on their sleeve, do not process their mistakes (NOT my fault types!), do not implement healthy changes and make life a living Hell for the shame based! They take adversity and blame it on the world! They STAY sick and I call them 'The Crawlers'. I will ONLY work w/ this community IF they've identified it and really want to change! I can't treat endless symptoms forever; I am only interested in CURE! I often wonder if the 'Old Souls' are those SO able to step up to the plate of accountability, that they can go overboard. They usually exude wisdom also! And, the 'New Souls' are not able to grasp their role in accountability ... at least not YET!? They can be dumb as rocks, and mean as a rattler! I seriously doubt serial killers, etc. are 'Old Souls'! ... But ... that is another topic! a little off here, (apologies) I dunno, you may have done a little over generalization here. Old souls going overboard, people "STAY(ING) sick", derogative descriptions of people, etc. I realize this is a topic for another day, but each life is lessons for a individual. Saying you only are interested in the CURE is like saying I only want the destination not the journey. It is always about the journey. Perhaps those Blame Based come to you as your lesson in life, you are drawing them to you, for you both to experience and grow, and perhaps they will continue until you're learned how to help them heal. A good practioner stays with the hardest cases, if you are tired and no longer want them to be coming to you, maybe you are done with the lesson for this lifetime and you will continue it with the next life and probally with the same souls. They won't go away you know, nothing ever does until you find peace, not abandonement, and discouragement, failure with what has been set before you. We all encounter this in our lifetimes. Burnout happens when what we are doing doesn't work for too long, you sound tired. JMHO. Perhaps, off for you ... As it sounds as if your practitioner base runs quite differently? This understanding comes from over 30 years in MY clinic, not yours, of course. I wouldn't presume so much, given this contrast. Yes, CURE ... I'm in Natural Medicine and my ethos is to go to the root, I do not treat the branches as in Western Medicine methodology! Thus, YES, the client's destination is me and ending the nightmare, not cradling/perpetuating sickness as if some Holy Grail!? Dump it, and ARRIVE! It is the whole person approach, not the bundle of 'symptoms' that I address. I've an incredibly high success rate at achieving lasting change in chronic issues previously unresponsive for many, many years and failed attempts w/ various other methodologies! Also, people ONLY get to me through word of mouth of other clients, NO advertisements, EVER! And? I assign each client MUCH homework of lifestyle changes necessary to continue work w/ me. It is their car, I'm just a glorified translator and mechanic. Hence, I need responsible, involved, accountable clients. In ratio, they have 1000s of hours alone to my every hour of treating them. True wellness will come through their work and profound lifestyle changes. My philosophy is that they become SO healthy they are at a higher vibration than even I am on, thus move on. Each Flyer always sends back 10 new Flyers unto their 'new life' and freedom from the chains of dis~ease. Yes, I very much 'attract' the 'ACCOUNTABLE Flyers' by design now, and wouldn't have it any other way! Screening in the manner I outlined oversees this fact and I work w/ a willing, responsible for their own work/healing group. It is anything but accidental as to the WHO that is my client base! (Is this thing on?) I'm anything but tired and burned out from this career! I love it and it blesses me and feeds my soul to help SO many! Mentioning it? It actually sounds more like it is you who must be extremely tired and/or burned out, and somehow also believe those 'Blame-Based Crawlers' really are the VERY population you MUST work w/? That or your methods fail to effect real, sustained change? Sounds so tough ... I don't have enough info, only you really KNOW! Either way, suffice to say that we have a profoundly different belief system, approach, outcome, practice and client group by the sounds of it. GL in your work though! |
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I am guilty of my past crimes or suffering now for the better good of the future.
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my grandmother is the queen of guilt trips....got passed down to my mom...I'm fighting it though
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bottom line guilt is equal to insecurity, and the catholic religion, they thrive off such, it feeds the coffers....just my personal opinion......
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memory delete - memory delete. If this doesn't work drink more alcohol and try again. If this still doesn't work, get a really strong magnet or go into a COMA.
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Edited by
Shasta1
on
Tue 12/29/09 11:39 PM
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My years running a clinic (and half a century on the planet!) has taught me there are two distinct polarities to which most ascribe, to one side much more than the other: 1. Shame/Guilt Based (Usually what I call 'The Emotionalists', ruled by their feelings, not thoughts!) 2. Blame/Unaccountability Based (Usually what I call 'The Mentalists', ruled by their thoughts, not feelings!) The 'Guilt Based' - Are always the kinder, more sensitive creatures that wear their hearts on their sleeves and always step up to accountability for their mistakes. When extreme, they take on the responsibility/guilt for everything and everyone and shame their way right into illness (and, yeah, much is most definitely resultant of a deeply religious, childhood hangover remnant!) They better process things and move on when they strive to 'get better'. I have an incredible clinical success rate w/ this community and call them 'The Flyers'. I very much prefer to work w/ this community. IF they don't get stuck in it, they are the healthiest of the 2 types. IF they remain stuck? They become gravely ill much sooner and check out. Sad but true! The 'Blame Based' - Are a nightmare in my experience! They are almost impossible to work w/ and achieve any real, lasting results! Nothing is their fault, they are eternal victims and nothing will ever change that or deliver them into the ability towards healing accountability. Almost as if they've given over control of their lives outcome because it is outside their jurisdiction, someone/something else's responsibility/fault, and they are eternally powerless to change it! This crew generally never wears their heart on their sleeve, do not process their mistakes (NOT my fault types!), do not implement healthy changes and make life a living Hell for the shame based! They take adversity and blame it on the world! They STAY sick and I call them 'The Crawlers'. I will ONLY work w/ this community IF they've identified it and really want to change! I can't treat endless symptoms forever; I am only interested in CURE! I often wonder if the 'Old Souls' are those SO able to step up to the plate of accountability, that they can go overboard. They usually exude wisdom also! And, the 'New Souls' are not able to grasp their role in accountability ... at least not YET!? They can be dumb as rocks, and mean as a rattler! I seriously doubt serial killers, etc. are 'Old Souls'! ... But ... that is another topic! a little off here, (apologies) I dunno, you may have done a little over generalization here. Old souls going overboard, people "STAY(ING) sick", derogative descriptions of people, etc. I realize this is a topic for another day, but each life is lessons for a individual. Saying you only are interested in the CURE is like saying I only want the destination not the journey. It is always about the journey. Perhaps those Blame Based come to you as your lesson in life, you are drawing them to you, for you both to experience and grow, and perhaps they will continue until you're learned how to help them heal. A good practioner stays with the hardest cases, if you are tired and no longer want them to be coming to you, maybe you are done with the lesson for this lifetime and you will continue it with the next life and probally with the same souls. They won't go away you know, nothing ever does until you find peace, not abandonement, and discouragement, failure with what has been set before you. We all encounter this in our lifetimes. Burnout happens when what we are doing doesn't work for too long, you sound tired. JMHO. Perhaps, off for you ... As it sounds as if your practitioner base runs quite differently? This understanding comes from over 30 years in MY clinic, not yours, of course. I wouldn't presume so much, given this contrast. Yes, CURE ... I'm in Natural Medicine and my ethos is to go to the root, I do not treat the branches as in Western Medicine methodology! Thus, YES, the client's destination is me and ending the nightmare, not cradling/perpetuating sickness as if some Holy Grail!? Dump it, and ARRIVE! It is the whole person approach, not the bundle of 'symptoms' that I address. I've an incredibly high success rate at achieving lasting change in chronic issues previously unresponsive for many, many years and failed attempts w/ various other methodologies! Also, people ONLY get to me through word of mouth of other clients, NO advertisements, EVER! And? I assign each client MUCH homework of lifestyle changes necessary to continue work w/ me. It is their car, I'm just a glorified translator and mechanic. Hence, I need responsible, involved, accountable clients. In ratio, they have 1000s of hours alone to my every hour of treating them. True wellness will come through their work and profound lifestyle changes. My philosophy is that they become SO healthy they are at a higher vibration than even I am on, thus move on. Each Flyer always sends back 10 new Flyers unto their 'new life' and freedom from the chains of dis~ease. Yes, I very much 'attract' the 'ACCOUNTABLE Flyers' by design now, and wouldn't have it any other way! Screening in the manner I outlined oversees this fact and I work w/ a willing, responsible for their own work/healing group. It is anything but accidental as to the WHO that is my client base! (Is this thing on?) I'm anything but tired and burned out from this career! I love it and it blesses me and feeds my soul to help SO many! Mentioning it? It actually sounds more like it is you who must be extremely tired and/or burned out, and somehow also believe those 'Blame-Based Crawlers' really are the VERY population you MUST work w/? That or your methods fail to effect real, sustained change? Sounds so tough ... I don't have enough info, only you really KNOW! Either way, suffice to say that we have a profoundly different belief system, approach, outcome, practice and client group by the sounds of it. GL in your work though! Well, I guess you know better...  , but then you sound so angry, I was mistaken. My apologies.
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Edited by
Dancere
on
Tue 12/29/09 11:57 PM
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Well, I guess you know better... , but then you sound so angry, I was mistaken. My apologies.
It seems you are reading quite a lot into my post, stance and opinions that is absolutely just NOT there, NOT even a little bit ... I actually feel I just really took time, thought, effort and care in my reply to you, about your misinterpretation of my original, also very well thought out, post!? Why is what I believe so challenging to you? It is not personal, I do not even know you. It is my truth though, and your filter is rather harsh, then veiled behind an apology? You lost me ... Can we just agree to hugely disagree? Peace to you! Edit ...
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yes, we can agree although I feel you had perhaps were 'reading' into me instead too much, even the last post. I wasn't judging you, but feel that from you. I, too, have worked with people all my life friend. We vastly differ but yet not at all.
Good night, sleep well. Peace to all of us... |
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I mentioned this in a thread last evening and it got me wondering how many of us 'do' guilt often? I live so as to avoid doing guilt. The choices I make, how I treat people and how I allow myself to be treated, how honest I am and how fair I try to be, how having learned to say no, are a few ways that a lot of years of practicing to live guilt free have led me to a life that I feel good about. I have been doing this for so long now that it had to come up in a thread for me to conscientiously think about it. And you?? I feel guilty for not reading "every post" before posting myself. I feel proud for not stating something typical and cavalier. I feel guilty for feeling proud. YES I have regrets for the way I have acted, things I've said or done. I'm not prone to the cliche' of "well, it has brought me to where I am today". I am NOT full of shame. I AM human. I'm proud that I want to take ownership of my mistakes...and learn from them. and the rub.......I feel guilty sometimes....for feeling guilty. |
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my grandmother is the queen of guilt trips....got passed down to my mom...I'm fighting it though
maybe you, me and Tami all have the same mom....my mom hold the crown and trophy. I know of no one who has been able to take it from her as of yet. 
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I mentioned this in a thread last evening and it got me wondering how many of us 'do' guilt often? I live so as to avoid doing guilt. The choices I make, how I treat people and how I allow myself to be treated, how honest I am and how fair I try to be, how having learned to say no, are a few ways that a lot of years of practicing to live guilt free have led me to a life that I feel good about. I have been doing this for so long now that it had to come up in a thread for me to conscientiously think about it. And you?? I feel guilty for not reading "every post" before posting myself. I feel proud for not stating something typical and cavalier. I feel guilty for feeling proud. YES I have regrets for the way I have acted, things I've said or done. I'm not prone to the cliche' of "well, it has brought me to where I am today". I am NOT full of shame. I AM human. I'm proud that I want to take ownership of my mistakes...and learn from them. and the rub.......I feel guilty sometimes....for feeling guilty. Do you think feeling remorse, learning and doing better next time is the same as feeling guilt? |
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yes, we can agree although I feel you had perhaps were 'reading' into me instead too much, even the last post. I wasn't judging you, but feel that from you. I, too, have worked with people all my life friend. We vastly differ but yet not at all. Good night, sleep well. Peace to all of us... Good Night Shasta
Sleep well, sweet dreams |
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bottom line guilt is equal to insecurity, and the catholic religion, they thrive off such, it feeds the coffers....just my personal opinion...... I wouldn't think it is exclusive to just the Catholic religion... |
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I guess guilt =ing - acknowledgment, remorse, ownership, examination - healthy
guilt =ing - shame, self loathing, etc - not |
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I mentioned this in a thread last evening and it got me wondering how many of us 'do' guilt often? I live so as to avoid doing guilt. The choices I make, how I treat people and how I allow myself to be treated, how honest I am and how fair I try to be, how having learned to say no, are a few ways that a lot of years of practicing to live guilt free have led me to a life that I feel good about. I have been doing this for so long now that it had to come up in a thread for me to conscientiously think about it. And you??   So sorry Sea, about the turn of events there. Thankfully guilt hasn't been a big part of my life, except when a child. Learning to say no was the big one for me also, first it was...'can I think about it' and before that would say yes and then make a excuse later not to do. I feel if we sincerely are doing the best we can, not taking shortcuts because we are too tired or don't feel like it, there is a twinge on the consience. Like you...learned to avoid doing that- altho didn't make a habit of it, now always try to live my life with honor and humilty, honesty while being more tactful (that was a tough one to learn, still is at times  ) but when fail...it wasn't because didn't try. I won't lie to someone, may go out of the way not to answer a question that would hurt someone if they don't really need to know but if I did do something, own up right away. My boss was so used to people screwing up before I got there, she'd get all mad and be "Who did this" and I say I did, and here's why. Now she's gotten to trust me and things are going well, for both of us. Luckily, also learned a long tme ago to treat others like I would like to be treated, even strangers.
(and no, am not plugging for the Random Acts of Kindness poster girl ) . Nice to see you bring this up, kinda like a check in and review to see how we're doing. Kinda suspected that you are like that tho
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Good Night Shasta
Sleep well, sweet dreams Thank you L. Sweet dreams to you also.
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yes, we can agree although I feel you had perhaps were 'reading' into me instead too much, even the last post. I wasn't judging you, but feel that from you. I, too, have worked with people all my life friend. We vastly differ but yet not at all. Good night, sleep well. Peace to all of us... Well, no judgement OF you from me, not at all! Just a need to assert not understanding where 'You sound so angry' post was coming from? I just peeked at your posted career and see you are a Social Worker. Such different kinds of work we do, and client groups also. I've never been in your moccasins but have had MANY friends and colleagues in your field! Hats off as it takes a lot of love and dedication; I've seen it to be so grueling and often tragic ... and not enough pay for all y'all give! You are likely a real angel, Shasta, TY for your hard work on Earth ... 
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I guess guilt =ing - acknowledgment, remorse, ownership, examination - healthy guilt =ing - shame, self loathing, etc - not
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melding now?
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