There is one way a man could elevate himself above any divinity or diety, even if only for a moment...
and that is through pure selfless courage



(This is not ment to offend anyone. And my intentions are to DISCUSS this topic using sound reason and logic)

sounds like the ultimate in humanistic conceit to me

well ha ha maby. hear me out
God cant die right? can God fear if he cant die? of course not.
fear is an emotional response to an anticipated pain or danger.
is it possible to have courage if your not afraid?

So God cant be couragous can he? we all know men can.
dont we want our children to be better than us? the next generation should always be stronger right? (of course thats not always the case) so wouldnt it make sense for God to want the same for us?
A man can rais himself higher than any God through courage.
true and pure selfless courage

Interesting perspective...

I think someone has been staying up too long

i think your probably right. ( =

Just for the sake of argument...

That's an interesting bit of sophistry - along the same lines as "can God can't make a rock so big he can't lift it".

The problem with both is in the assumption that God is incabable of something (feeling fear or make a rock so big he can't lift it.)

But since God is omnipotent, by definition, that is a false assumption.

The error is in assuming that God is incapable of feeling fear. He can choose to feel fear if he wants. Just as he can choose to be unable to pick up the rock if he wants.

If that were not so, then the very definition of God is a falsity and thus both arguments crumble completely to dust because the whole subject of the arguments does not even exist.

uh.. yeah.

That's a twist on the old "Who is the bravest superhero? question.
Superman could never win because he was invulnerable, i.e., how can you be brave if nothing can hurt you?

yeah, and mines bigger than yours, and dont you forget it.


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Please, stay away from steroids.

no ma am its not, look up the definition

But he cant Die so he cant fear.
( =

if he is omnipotent, than theres no way he can die right?

if his power is unlimited, than how can he possibly die or feel fear. i guess he could if he wanted to, but than hes not omnipotent.
no, i think God cant feel fear

By whose definition of God?

I don't define God as omnipotent.

Those kinds of definitions are truly absurd anyway. If God true was omnipotent and infalliable and all-perfect then God would be totally responsible for everything and there could be no such thing as sin or evil, for from whench would they come?

These are fallacies in thinking that have been perpetuated for eons by outrageous creation myths that simply can't be true. The main thust of these definitions is to try to place the blame of sin and evil onto mankind to lay a guilt complex on him and thus subdue him to authority. But even that is an outrageous fallacy for if mankind could create evil then mankind would have a power that God does not have.

This fallacy goes beyond absurd. It is even said that God cannot look upon evil or sin. How absurd is that? Once again man would have powers greater than God.

Many people also say that God weeps when someone is cast into hell. But how crazy is that? If God weeps he must feel that an injustice has been done, but that would fly in the face of the idea that he is supposed to be all-merciful and all forgiving. In other words, if someone is cast into hell it could only be because they genuninely deserve it and knowingly chose it of their own accord. So what would there be to weep about?

The whole idea of a 'perfect' infalliable god who also has an EGO is absurd.

The very idea of trying to personify God in terms of human ego, emotions, and frailties can never work. That is just an attempt to create God in the image of man. Besides if God had created man in his image then in who's imagine did he create the dinosaurs? And why did he even bother with that at all?

I also don't understand the assertion of the OP:



Who says that death is the only thing to fear? For me personally death is the least of my fears. I have no fear of death at all.

Why should I fear death? What's to be afriad of in death?

On the contrary, I'm actually looking forward to death.

I'll either just black out and never even know I died. What's to fear in that?

Or I'll finally meet my maker. I personally have no fear of meeting my maker. My God is like the Bible claims then only one of two things can be true:

1. He truely is just and merciful (in which case I'll go to heaven)
2. He truly is a heartless bastard (in which case I'll have plenty of company in hell)

I personally can't even imagine a God who is so dastardly to send any soul to a place of eternal damnation. Any such God would be totally unjust and heartless.

As a mere mortal man, if I had to take over the Biblical system and only choose certain souls to let into my "heaven" then I would simply 'delete' those who don't make it. Why send them to eternal torture? Who's going to benefit from that? Certainly not me. I would not benefit from knowning that souls are suffering for all of eternity. So I would simply uncreate them. Make them vanish into nothingness like is was before they had been created.

Just based on that alone I would be the compassionate superior to the Biblical God because I would never send anyone to eternal damnation.

So the story can't be true because such a God would be lesser than many mere mortals (I know that I'm am not alone in being the compassionate superior to the Biblical God) There are many people who reject that religion for this very reason. They recognize that the God of the Bible would need to be a heartless bastard if the claims of the Bible are true. Therefore they have no choice but to reject that mythology as obviously being false because they already know that they are compassionately superior to such a God (which would be impossible). Therefore the mythology must be false.

Since gods are created by man, all that incompass gods are manly qualities. So to say man would be capable of these qualities, of course, it is all him to begin with. Now the imagination part of it, of flying and zapping with our hands would have to be figuratively describing our powers as humans not the reality of it.

And there is the most fundamental paradox in a nutshell. If he can choose to die, he's not omnipotent. If he can't choose to die, he's not omnipotent. So there's no way he can be omnipotent.

Sky, I am only quoting you because what you wrote brought up a question in me .. my comments are just part of the discussion of the OP.


How can one experience if they are all. We need something to brush up against, something to react to in order to 'experience'. What does up even mean if there is no down? What is down if there is no gravity?

We are the ones living in a world of contrasts, of duality, of opposites.

This God, source, universe ... how can it know separate if it is all of it? How can it experience fear when it is not fearful nor courageous but holds the essence of all of it.

It is humans that create these notions of God in terms that we can understand ...and we live in place of duality. Of right and wrong, of fear and courage, of up and down. If you experienced none of those things would it make you more or less elevated than a being who did ... I suppose that depends upon your perspective.


...as for man surpassing any God ... how can you surpass what you are?

We certainly can surpass our constructed notions of God though.

Excellent point.

According to the fundamental premise of that pantheistic philosophy, any question based on god having or being only one “side” is completely meaningless. So you’re absolutely right and “courage” is a meaningless concept when applied to god in that context.

Or another was of expressing it could be that because god is everything, he must necessarily be both infinitely courageous and infinitely fearful. And since no human could be either, no human could "rise above god" through courage.

weather hes every thing or not, even if hes couragous(which he cant logicaly be) its still doesnt hold a candle any where near a couragous man.
IE
its a great thing for a man to give uhis life for his country, very noble and brave. but is it extra ordinary? no its not. its whats expected of him, and its in man nature to protect, defend, or attack. what is extraordinary, and a perfect example of selfless courage, is a woman who stands strong with self poise and pride, while her man or child goes off to war. That is completely against a mother or wifes nature, and that is courage.
God, or Achillies, or superman are great sure, but there not doing any thing extra ordinary by being strong or couragous are they?
(not that they dont deserve praise)
so even if God 'chose' to feel fear, man did so knowing that he is mortal and may die, which is in fact Superior

IF YOU EVER ATTAIN a pure selfless courage,

_____________ JUST REMEMBER:

________ GOD'S GIVEN IT TO YOU!!! _________

So, How could a wo/man elevate her/himself above God through something which is God-given? ? ?