yea it needs to be a collective or our kids will kill us! lmao!!

i guess as mothers we have to choose clearly with no flex. NO YOU
ABSOLUTELY MAY NOT DRINK THAT BLEACH!!!!!



lmao!

I think it takes a lot of love, to teach somebody to unlearn these
things, things that have been manifested in our brains through media and
the world we live in. It will not happen from today to tomorrow though,
it is a slow process that needs patience.

Good evening/morning/afternoon Alex, Lee, Andrea, Fred, AB,
Zap!

Evening, kid!

Harry.



To unlearn, I wonder....

For I was a product of generations prior 'hangovers', the Victorian
regimancy of the 1920's through my paternal grandparents, the Doctor
Spock era of the 1950's from my parents, the whole 1960's 70's love
peace and brown rice, within my social structures of friends, and their
parents...

and then school...an archaic and un changed constitution, with only
deciamal, and currency as the changes within my learning structures.

lessons my parnets had learnt, within school.

So the opportunity to be programmed, was huge, the potential for
oppression...vast.


And somehow, I have 'unlearnt' these programmes...somehow, they are
being deleted from my hard drive.

So the potential is possible...the desire, the will, the hunger....is
there...to NOT DRINK THE BLEACH !!

I have some serious dyslexia...a glitch in my hard drive
today...processors working over time..

..._...[..______________________''
....../ `---___________----_____[]===D
...../_==O;;;;;;;;______.:/
.....),---.(_(__) /
....//(..)),----"
...//___//
..//___//
.//___//



IT WOULD BE EASIER TO JUST SHOOT URSELF.

I found this...or rather it found me, yesterday whilst in the salt
mines..

"Nothing we ever do goes unnoticed
There are traces of me in you, and you in me
And whatever the evening news may say
It's getting better day by day
Step by step, little by little
Decisions made by common people
Like you and me
Are made for eternity..

So WE CAN change the world"


It is from "Quantum Knowledge" a publication..

And paint me idealistic, and optimistic, all the colours...for it is
what I do believe.

and it is not so easy when the peer groups of both parents and children
see NOTHING WRONG with playing war games or shoot em up cowboy and
indians...ugh....

how long have we poisoned our children with these stereotypes!!??

we invented their heros!! and then we blame them for acting out.

Andrea it will take a long time but actions can be taken and effective
now.

BOYCOTT WAR TOYS and educate child care givers and begin in itiatives to
reprogram our way of thinking.

war is not healthy for children or other living things.

i have active initiatives boycotting war toys...some years ago we got
banned a whole range of toys that were all war toys and guns that
looked to real for any of us to be comfortable with. we had them
blacklisted....all over the country... you will never see these toys
sold here. (from this particular manufacturer)

no one here really cares or knows much about the fads and trends that
america eats up like a obese child....and there are many.

we have never been in a walmart. hope i never do.
we do not buy into consumer madness as americans do. over there it's
like if it's new everybody has to own one whether they like it or not.
owning stuff has become more important than being someone.

when you approach the org.'s that already support a non-violent
lifestyle, anthroposophic org.s and such, green peace, amnesty int. war
child you can find many ways to become involved in eradicating some of
the useless and overboard out of proportion manufacturing of
inappropriate toys and games.

when enoug boycott and they actuall lose money?? THEY WILL ADOPT NEW
LURES, STRATEGIES TO SELL THE CONSUMER.

YOU THE CONSUMER MUST CHOOSE WHAT YOU WANT TO HAVE ...NOT the toy store
or the manufacturers dictating what you must have .

believe me when they see a toy become unpopular they quickly abandon it.
our initial peer groups develope with our toys...do you want to play
with me? i have the coolest toy!

whether the toys become adult or remain in the toy box we are selecting
each other based on what we have...rather than who we are. but as a
little kid , how can you be able to know who someone is yet???

well if they have cool toys who cares?


let this all roll around in your heads for a minute ...


more coffee!!

my turn now! lol

Taking responsibility?

Turning off the computer, the video games, the computer games,
unplugging the tv???

Remove these programmes of heroes and battles, and cyber synthesised war
manoeuvres???

But what will our children do???

Who will become their heroes???

Who will entertain them, when I just want five minutes to myself??? (In
reality more like an hour or two)

I can hear the outcries, and the outrage, from here.


Stepping up to the plate, and really parenting our young, that ole 'walk
the walk' thing..

Teaching them, showing them, leading them by example, not 'passing the
buck', or the remote, or the wallet...

Sitting down with them, and veiwing their age appropriate programmes,
and really seeing them for what they are, and the subliminal messaging
that is added to each advertisement, each cliquey, fashionable new
programme, new toy, new 'must have'...and then saying NO.

No MORE. This is not ok, for my child, it is not ok for me.

Protecting our young from the sensation overload being poured into their
developing minds.

Encouraging instead imagination, based on morals, and ethics, and
playing with them.

Being in the moment with your child, being the same parent who watched
them with bated breath as they took that first wobbly step, scanning for
all the sharp corners waiting to leap out at that precious child.

It doesn't end, ever, there are sharp edges waiting to harm our young,
as they take tentative steps into the different stages of their
development.

That's where I see a problem.
These people that can't live without tv, don't know what else to do with
themselves.
Both my exes were like that, and me? I hate tv, haven't watched in ages
and have given mine away.
But my son had to grow up with the two extremes, either tv all the time
or no tv at all.
I'd rather take him out in the park, to the playground, or discover his
hometown, and my then husband came home, tv on, doing nothing.

It is a huge responsibility...this kid thing...
I never let my sons play with toy guns...ever! Much to the shagrin of my
own mother, who was an avid hunter...oh yes we had many a heated
discussion on it, especially around deer season...lol
And when my boys became teens and started copping an attitude, that's
when I bought a one room cabin on 10 acres, with no electricity and no
running water and only a fireplace and a wood cookstove to heat...they
were 14 and 15 at the time...The nintendo and games were packed in a
box...I was very unpopular for about 2 months...and then all of a sudden
a change in attitude came...instead of *****ing about having to run to
the outhouse in the snow, they worked on how to keep themselves warm
when going...
Instead of complaining about water, they learned to conserve the water
we packed home...
Instead of complaining about being bored, they picked up books and
started writing...
They learned how to build walls, so that they could have their own
rooms....
Chopping and hauling wood became sport to see who could do the most...
It was a long long year! And they were so appreciative when I finally
agreed to get electricity and water, but they earned it...
During that year we got word, that they had lost their father who had
left when they were babies...never to be seen again...But now..they had
become the men of the house so to speak...and had taken their
responsibilities well....
My youngest son, spent time in the Army, so yes he has picked up a
gun...My oldest has never...Are they men? Absolutely....
I am proud of my boys...
Oh yes, it's a big responsibility....

Thanks JJ...

My story is similar, except that my children were born in that one room
cabin with no electricity, and no running water...

For 13 years their young minds knew no different, if they visited my
parents, or others who were 'civilised', tv held fascination for maybe
half an hour, then their bodies kicked in, and kicked up, and they were
out!!!

So, in point, just looking at five women who have posted here, Alex,
Red, Andrea, JJ and myself, from the US, Amsterdam, Germany, and then
Ireland, and Australia.

Five women from different upbringings, all chose similar paths, similar
ways to raise our young...

We are doing it...it is happening...

It will not be all women, and men, it is the nature of things...

But with this tiny snapshot, here, five stories all very similar..in
raising our young..

It is possible...there is no limit..

Thank you Lee....I find all this very interesting...and am enjoying the
thread immensley...
Yes it is possible! All things are possible if we choose
it...

when i was young my brother and i received boxing gloves for a xmas
present,my brother is 5yrs younger than me i love my little brother he
loves me.cant ever remember watt happened to those boxing gloves i think
they went mouldy in their box

That's a great story....my sons are 14 months apart and
certainly had their boxing times, without the gloves! Thank
goodness I was a tomboy!

Good morning, everyone...

Isn't this a truly wonderful thread?

I am hoping to be able to post a bit later on.

Love you all.

Oceans

Hi Oceans! Have a great day...and yes I agree...great thread!

My eldest son and I practised Mu thai, a form of kick boxing, and also
conventional boxing...he needed a way to use his energy...he was still
male, and enjoyed the whole adrenalin rush, risk taking challenges, of a
teen...

It was just harnessing, and channeliing those urges to express his
physicality into useful and non violent ways.

Yes boxing is violent, I wore many a bruised rib, and the odd black eye,
but I gave as many as I got.

He took up water skiing, surfing, (which is a family sport anyway),
motorcrosse, and many other gender related sports, his need to challenge
himself physically was huge.

There were times, he was snap tempered and leant towards violence...but
his disciplines, and teachings, within boxing, became his hand brake.

My youngest son, is more contemplative, and as the steady march of
puberty arrives, he has wandered into Aikkido as a sport, of contact,
and skill...he also has taken up AFL, and although not a physical child
by nature, his maleness and desire to be more physical, and challenge
his body, is also being channelled in productive ways.


I do not dent, males genetically, and inherantly, have strong desires
for physical challenges...as do many women...

iIt is the productive use of these, that do not encourage or embody
violence, and the use of weapons, that I strive for....


And yes my eldest picked up a gun also, when he joined the Army, and
yes, understands the power, and the death attached to them now.

I think that's awesome Lee...
We spent alot of time camping and fishing and canoeing before they
copped the teen attitudes so to speak...
And have lived in Alaska for 4 years, so we were very much out in the
woods...
Only when I brought them to a larger city is when the problems began...
But I too had them on dirtbikes and backpacking....And my youngest would
kill me for this...but he was even taking my oriental dance classes. He
took piano and guitar...and karate
Where my oldest did the highschool sports...gymnastics and karate
I am now beginning Taichi and am very excited about it...wished
this available where I lived when they were young....
We had alot of fun together...
But within that fun, it did teach them the values that they carry
today...