monoculture has to be done away with smaller comunities.permaculture
change in diet is vital ,it takes 50 times more energy to produce a meat
based diet embrace new technology for energy for non
polluting industry no more using the ocean as if it was a giant toilet
bowl.hey i would get a calouse on my typing finger if i started
sprouting every thing i knew we can do to fix every thing up and the
answers are out there every where localize energy.deacativate all bombs
a lotta energy there could be used to powwer a lota houses for a
while

Hi

Im broke...wouldnt take long to catch up to me Fred

Good morning everyone (0655 local).....

Ummmmm, does anyone have some coffee?

Following Lee's ruminations about the creation of Rumi Nations...

Thinking over these threads and what they might teach us, it seems that
FEAR is a core problem. Those who push the military/use-force and the
self-sufficient/anti-interdependence points of view are all fearful.
Fearful of 'them', 'the enemy', 'those who hate us', 'those who will
attack us', 'those who will exploit us and rip us off.' The enemy may be
Muslims, Iraqis, their own government, criminals, illegal immigrants,
etc. It doesn't much matter: 'there is an enemy out there, and I fear
him.'

It is this fear that impels them to take on secondary points of view
about fighting back, or militant defiance. Those who would seem to
threaten efforts to 'fight the enemy' become secondary enemies -- people
who would trick us into a false sense of security, people who don't see
the threat, cowards who don't want to take on the enemy, people who
won't fight the enemy until he is on our shores, intellectuals who will
talk until it is too late, politicians who lie and only want to enrich
themselves, liberals, idealists, naive people who think everyone is
good, wimps who hate the use of even necessary force, hypocrites who
enjoy security but won't fight for it.

Thus the initial fear of an enemy creates first a hatred of the enemy,
and then a secondary fear of and hatred for those who are perceived as
not understanding the danger of the enemy, or getting in the way of
fighting that enemy.

And with these nested sets of fear, I think it must be near impossible
for a person to think clearly. Bad conclusions are reached and bad
actions are taken, bad in the sense that they are not congruent with the
way the world really is, and bad in the sense that they are
self-defeating, and bad in the sense that they cause massive harm to
others.

Of course, this fear does not stay cooped up inside the body. It ripples
out. Actions are taken that produce fear in others, perhaps in the enemy
and certainly in those who watch those actions aghast. And that
consequential fear grows and leads others to actions that then threaten
the original actor. Back and forth it goes, fear begetting fearful
actions begetting further fear, until how it started and who are lost to
the fog of history and clamor for vindication of those who acted.

So perhaps Rumi-nations must address this core reality of FEAR.

My way is that of a forensic political scientists and of a designer of
solutions. As the forensist, I produce briefings and dissect the
situation and explain why it happened and the role of its parts. As the
designer I produce integrated whole-systems recommendations and help
with the implementation of those recommendations.

But in these extraordinary times what I do is obviously nowhere close to
being enough. The exposition of facts and the provision of solutions is
not sufficient to reduce that level of fear, in the same way that a
phobic's fear is not dissipated by facts and logic. My way works well in
environments where people are masters of their fears, where careful
thinking is possible; it doesn't work well in environments where FEAR
has become the pervasive and deeply-rooted norm, where panic has set in.

Might Rumi-nations lead to addressing this FEAR, perhaps to soothing it,
and to assuaging the emotional and psychological wounds that it
produces, so freeing people up to understand their environments more
realistically, more beneficially?



Oceans

Coffee for you Oceans...and good morning to you..


Have we returned to page one of this thread?

Which is where my thought processes first went, to understand fear as
the motivator , and to then look at arresting the cycle...and addressing
both real and perceived threats, in a non violent way?

Fear is also a re-action to something not understood, which evolves into
anger or violence...fear of the 'different', the unknown, (the
perceived)...

It is conditioning, at it's most basic level...conditioning within
families, homes, communities, society.

Fed and nurturing these fears, by the media, and all it's mediums, by
even parents,...how many times do you hear parents threatening children,
to modify their behaviours, using threats or 'boogeymen' type myths to
manage poor behaviours?

Our societies are littered with some of the most gruesome tales, wrapped
up as fables, and fairytales, to motivate compliant behaviours through
fear.

Even many, or I will even go as far as saying most, religious texts use
fear as a motivator for compliance..also by our very governments, and
their puppets,...until it is a genetic conditioning...or at least a set
of behaviours that are ingrained.

Fear has so many different faces.
We have to recognize all of them first before we can start working on
them.

Good Morning ladies of the world.

I thought maybe tou might be interested in what the women in my area do.
This is a section in the local paper here where I live.
The Asheville Citizen Times. Take a look, and see what the men here have
to deal with. LMAO

http://miva.citizen-times.com/cgi-bin/miva?blogs+blog_id=girlsoutdoors

I don't get your point Fanta...

I miss it completely, women in a "women outdoors" blog type scenario, a
light chat type of medium?

What is to contend with?

Your highest source of energy is your own heart.Yet,the paradox is that
we are conditioned to protect our hearts,a behaviour motivated by
fear.Our fears are communicated to us by thoughts and feelings.There can
be no sustainable change in our experience of life unless we have the
will to choose going for our hearts over resolving our thoughts and
feelings.This is the 7th secret of MAGIC.

Its not a chat, jess its a section of the local paper called girls
outdoors. its filled with activities and interests of local women here.
Check it out, I thought yall might enjoy seeing what women in other
areas do.

OK, you could blog, LOL, but its full of articles!!
LMAO!!!! still its about women and the enviornment!!
The world is not totaly lost. there are good things going on every where
and women are involved!!
Just thought you might find it interesting!!

I did, and I had a little giggle, as to what I know some of the other
women, here in the forums do with their time..and I what I do with
mine...then looked at the type of conversations here...

I still don't understand why it is something the men in your area have
to put up with comment...

That was a light hearted male ego jab refering to the strong women here
and what men have to deal with!

I didnt want to talk about war and killing today and I thought, with all
these posts about women and their roles in the world you might be
interested in what women in other places think of.
I can see it wasnt enjoyed by you, but I tried....

Just found this thread and laughed my arse off. You people will believe
anything.

so peekaboo who the fuk are you?

I missed your last post, Fanta, thankyou, and yes it was
interesting..

Much appreciated..

as women and mothers, from the cradle WE are creating the ambiance of
our nests, we will raise our daughters with empowerment and our sons
with temperance and generosity, and we will consciously be reminded of
what designs our honest natures and cultivate those characteristics
with balance and proportion.

as humans we are bound to do what we do , however, the mind as it
becomes intelligent is like a computer, able to solve more and more
complex issues, this program we have running concerning defense and
power is like some kids beta program full of sensational graphics and
action , a real thriller, great for hollywood, but fundamentally
unsuitable to be a major runner in the system software
...
actually it slows the system down and has trojan horses that cancel out
other important files...and at the end ,proves to be only a horrible
waste of time trying to get it all out of the hard drive.
delete...file on external hardrive for reference.
next.

if only...


as for jobs? the imagination is wide open..we have alot to develope and
produce and change quickly to make this planet free of the need to burn
fossile fuel.
medicine is screaming
use the HUGE bank roll to house the homeless ..train and hire
crews..come back to attending the real needs of evolving communities,
transportation....there are a gazillion jobs but the budget is gone
people.

it's feeding a global monster...weapons

we teach our children what to be afraid of and why. the media feeds
them, their cartoons depict the muslim as a bad guy...a whole concept of
what the enemy was , exploded and every little boy and some girls wanted
to rise up and be their favorite hero and vanquish the enemy!

and children looked at the ethnicity and identified that with
'suspicion'
we collectively , as mothers, when our children came home with stories,
got together and did and integration program of cultural arts amoung the
different groups we have here in amsterdam, which are many, and we
quickly put out a possible fire. we difused the sensationalized image of
osama, and returned our community again into the integrated and
colorfully strong fabric of social life that we all share. this happened
in many villages and cities.

what if we had just let it be? our children would have solidified their
ideas and invested in them and would breed discrimination and fear
everywhere.

we educate our children if we are too lazy it will show up in the
future.
do we blindly allow them to simply absorb anything that they want? um
not last i checked...
rather than being manipulated by capitalism, isn't it more logical that
the consumer CHOOSE what influences their preferences? is it
acceptable just because it makes money? if someone or something seduces
your child into harms way ...what will you DO ABOUT IT?
buckle under the weight and show them what alcoholism looks like , or
eating disorders? show them that they can make these illogical choices
and still survive? how? with what result? that they end up taking care
of you as you die from the deteriorization of your own will and self
respect. how many children are growing up in these kinds of environments
trapped by the limitations of their parents from ever realizing their
AUTHENTIC SELVES.

as as far as having a violent outlet for our violent natures well we
have the capacity to channel that , and use discernment,rational
thinking, commitment to justice with integrity and morality...yes we
have this!!

. and indeed marshall arts, is a very good avenue to dicipline and train
the body mind and spirit to feel protected on all levels....not to
mention a million other possibilities. that are proportionate and
balanced and effective in fullfilling that expression.

if we have fight a war then do it within the contexts of sanctions
arrived at by a governing body composed of many parties and the focus of
these parties is not for the furthuring of corporate business or the
aims of these neocons, but the evolution of our specis as a jewel in the
universe blessed with tools beyond imagination and technology fast
catching up to meet it's curiosity and tenacity to progress. heal our
wounds and we are bleeding.

rather than a draft or service in a military function let it be each
individuals contribution with investing themselves as civil servants in
communities ...re arrange the focus of attention from defense with a gun
to providing security by removing poverty ...your american urban poverty
is a disgrace from a country that boasts such valor and righteousness.

and many countries are guilty of this.

so, so what that your taxes are going to someone you see as a 'failure'
a 'looser' a 'leech' or even an illegal immigrant! so what! it's
better in the BIG PICTURE with the way things look right now, the money
going into this IMMENSE machine...just to exploit your children into
their game.

you must know that there are strategies for this. projects lose funding,
politics put in place for social intervention, become overloaded,
budgets don't meet demands or needs, tension builds , a climate of
oppression is created just in time for the recruitment officers to come
in and sweep the area and offer these young boys and girls a possibility
for a way out. a way out of the trap they were set up to fall in in the
first place, oh don't be shocked....

well if they can do it we can do it.
let their 'service to their country' be to participate and have the
opportunity to present their ideas about how they would like to see
their community evolve , like jury duty but , each family member has a
chance to be apart of the governing board and be an instrument for the
cause of human rights and
a new constitution that embraces the Patriarchal and Matriarchal roles
of what THIS culture needs to balance and heal . the enlisted service
person would then be posted to duty in the area appropriate to their
training. there can still be a navy and even an airforce but to be used
for support rather than defense, THE MISSION ,...aid .Human Rights
and sustainable development in an ecological and responsible way.


believe me....it is just a huge and diverse an enterprise as the
corrupt machine we are investing in now....

this is where we need one of those Matrix dimension leaps...lol

ok hold on ! everybody ...shift

ha ha

so where's the money? this brings us to a point Davinci brought up
about the actual legality of income tax....

$hit it's like giving your kid the money to buy his fix...


what would happen if this information about fed reserve and all this
money you all pump into their pockets..what if it catches fire?

it should as far as i can tell...there should be a system in place to
redirect all those monies into the educational and healthcare systems of
the people they are from., all infrastructure services would be diverted
to a different central bank that was governed by the elected reps,
etc....people that have to be accountable and transparent. women will
play a huge role in dominating the revival of values and morality and
cultural norms and designing thru community support a climate that puts
a lid on weapons.

if the US is still too attached to it's military then let them be
trained and used as teachers and symbols of excellence to be used with
utmost care and respect to what they are capable of. and only by a 'real
consenses'
does the country ever resort to employ them.


so i've been bouncing thru these paragraphs between guests and farmers
mkt and loading and unloading....i have no idea anymore if it has any
continuity...could be i'm raving




of course i am!

global disarmament....sheesh what am i thinking

Alex,
I resemble so much in that post, that, I have no doubt I was cussed two
or three different times! LMAO. I believe we all were.. lock stock and
barrel, did you think about that for awhile??
Has it been a long day?

it's almost 8pm and the sun is blazing high in the sky. we had a hot day
unusual for so early in june. it's been relaxed and very easy just
hectic in moments...
all i know is that i love these long hot summer nights when twilight
seeps into the torquoise and the day melts into the shades of indigo
and rose

LMAO!!!