the trick is to educate and inform the masses. Let them make their own decisions. If they can't then they should move. This has always been what our founding father's intended.

I know of no safe depository of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them but to inform their discretion.
Thomas Jefferson

i'm sorry...but if you legalize meth, you make it more acceptable.

i never want my kids to think that meth is okay...and i certainly don't want parental use to be destigmatized, either.

This is riduculous..you people really think people on meth can think? Think straight? Think with a conscience? They think alright. They think about meth. About not coming down because it is terrible coming down. It is terrible the itching, the nose scratching...the sores...the face...the constant paranoia...the hair loss...the weight loss..the mouth so sore you can't eat so you get more meth so it doesn't hurt. You use any excuse to get it. A bad hair day...anger...and it makes anger even worse...you become wicked...you will hurt someone if you feel the need. Pain means nothing on meth. Meth users will steal you blind. Meth users are smart. They know how to find and get the means to have that fix.
Meth users have their faculties taken away. They will tear a house apart to find that imaginary spilled dope. All white, yellow, or brown powder looking substance looks like dope. The carpet will be scarped, the floor will be gone through. The windows of most will be closed and boarded up or covered up with something. You will see eyes peeking through them all hours of the night.

They will have guns...loaded ones...to keep those imaginary people in the trees out and the cops away. They will kill anyone they feel will come in and get them. They hear things not there. They go looking for whatever they think is there. They will kill over a quarter paper.

You cannot eduacate a meth user. It takes over the mind, the will, the brain. The body and the mind does not belong to the user when using. They can be helped. They can stop. But only after they want too. Only after being clean for awhile. Only after the after effects are gone. One will not be clean of this drug for at least two years. The effects hang on at least that long. The jerks, the sounds, the actions are still there for that long.

Anyone who says that people should be able to do anything they want...should live with a meth user. Or at least be real close to one. See how it is.

Kat

i'd say two years is very conservative.

MANY years to get over...and the "flat" feeling never truly goes away.

neither do the dreams.

The problem is that unlike pot, meth IS NOT a recreational drug. Many meth addicts give up their lives, friends family work, making it much harder for them pay for their habit, but the desire for it does not go away because one cannot afford it. It makes them turn to criminal activities to get the money or try to make it themselves, endangering neighbors by playing with highly volatile chemicals. Doing so is dangerous sober, but worse when one is strung on meth.

on one hand do any of us really have a right to tell another what they can or can not put into their bodies?

on the other meth is dangerous, destructive and has no redeeming qualities and the world would be a better place if it were never discovered

Hmmmmm...Has the same qualities as alcohol when abused.....

except Cap'n Morgan doesn't make your teeth fall out

No it kills your liver, tears apart families, ECT....Dam sounds familiar!!!! Only legal!!!

Allow me to pose a question to the supporters of legalizing white death...


Say I came up with a substance that had no redeeming qualities other than it was addictive as hell. I then dope up a cola beverage and call it, ... let's say Blue Monkey Cola.

One drink and you are hooked. So badly hooked you actually will kill people to get more of it when you are out.

How legal and ethical is that?

Ever hear of Caffeine Withdrawals? I have...

Peace out.


P.S. Legalize something that causes people to go completely psycho? Think I will start smoking Loco Weed now!

That is a good argument, Andy, but it doesn't do one thing:

It does not give you any right you did not have before. Namely, you did not have a right to make decisions regarding my body or my mind. And this argument did not give you such right.

In light of this, it doesn't matter, what is the justification. As long as my right to govern my own body is abused, I then reserve the right to abuse the rights of others, and I will make my own justifications on that.

Sounds fair?

As long as you're fine sacrificing my freedoms and my rights to do harm to my own body, for your leisure of not bringing up your children properly, what kind of respect for your rights do you expect from me?

Legalizing it would of course give the right to the meth user. But it would be taking your rights away. A meth user would take full advantage by that law. Your family and friends and people you don't even know would most certainly be affected. It takes over neighborhoods and homes It takes over lives. Meth users become illogical and deadly. Meth users do not care. They really wont care if it is legal. Cause it wont matter. Being legal would make it too expensive to get anyway. It will still be bathtub.

Kat

Legalize it and the problem will remain. Addicts will do anything to get their next fix, morals and laws be damned. It is not a case of individual choice, but one where the greater good of society must out way that of the individual. One use can make someone an addict. Making it legal removes a social stigma, making seem alright. The problem is that freedom from that sigma makes seem like trying it won't hurt, but one use will often make one an addict. Locking an addict away isn't best answer, but neither is legalizing it. Addicts need treatment.

I understand where everyone is coming from. Why sugar coat this by hiding behind the false pretense of helping people and call it like it is.

People are against the use of meth, therefore their morality over rides anyone's right to control their body.

Call it like it is. People are too stupid to make decisions for themselves. Especially important ones like drug use. So let the government play nanny and do what's best for us...

Just realize one thing. You are willing to fund and empower gangs and drug lords that use violence on a regular basis. As long as having a nanny is important enough to put up with increased gang violence we should all be ok with no longer having to make our own decisions.

When an informed person becomes addicted to something, it was their own decision. They were willing to accept those consequences. If someone becomes addicted, fund raisers may raise money to support rehab centers, but it is still up to the addict to come around.

If someone becomes addicted, loses their job because they are undependable, it opens the job market for someone more responsible doesn't it? That means when Jonny or Joe can't find a job because they are a victim of a falling economy, this will open up opportunities for him that weren't available before. Nifty how that works. In a free society those with the desire to succeed are allowed to. Those without enough desire, or no ambition, won't. This is nature.

I honestly think this war on drugs is a waste of time, energy and money. People will do as they will anyway.

Look at prohibition. No one stopped drinking. But the criminals got rich as hell didn't they? And we sure spent a lot of money going after them...

In this case..ignorance is not bliss. It can kill you. Piss on the government...it is not what matters here. What matters is that this drug and the people using it will be bad for the enviroment and it habitants. This drug is a no brainer.

People that have done this drug...well many were smart enough to know better. The high is one that is wanted over and over again.

So...let me ask this..if making something legal will save money why not make child molesting legal? It might be against the moral of some but also not to the molester. He may see it as his right to do as he wishes. Why not make driving drunk legal? I mean..it would save money?

I was a speed freak for years. You do not know me...but there are those that do. I was hell on wheels. I know things you don't. I know people you don't. I know what it is and what it does. I knew then and I know now. I hated what it made me. I hated what it did to me. I hated seeing the way people took care of their kids..if they even did. I hated me. That made it even more of a reason to do it. It killed my feeling. I could care less about you when using. Your blood would not phase me. Your pain would not phase me.

Meth is a drug that will never and should never be legal. This is by far the worst drug to ever hit America. It is more dangerous than Heroin. Heroin users are more laid back. Methies...they are not. They are so out there...I mean...oh hell...to an unknowing...you will never understand.

Kat

My sympathies for your struggle. Also, my focus in my rant was not the government. It is the ignorance that you were talking about.

You prohibit something you empower drug cartels and criminals. You fund them. You also waste money and resources on combating such things. This strains the economy. Instead of having productive jobs that add to the GDP, and letting people hold onto the money so they can buy up this capital, you are spending it on a never ending war that i believe has no positive outcomes.

Also, to answer your questions, the child molester is violating the rights of the child. The drunk driver is violating the safety of others. You see where this is going. The dangers of using drugs falls immediately on the drug user. If this user violates the rights of anyone else by robbery, assault, etc, then they would suffer from the full extent of the law. See where i am going.
Basically I'm saying that it is ok to play with fire, but if you burn someone you will be held accountable.

Kinda like letting children have a little more responsibility. You know. You can stay up as late as you want, as long as you get up for school in the morning. You know that sort of thing...

You used, you struggled, but you overcame. I highly doubt you will ever touch the stuff again. But there is a difference. If it were legal, i would theorize that the money you spent, instead of going to a drug dealer, would go to a store, or company, where the drug COULD be regulated.

People are smart enough to make their own decisions. If they can't that is their loss.

But cheer up. I'm not saying we make all this legal from the get go. It should take years with careful study. Start with pot. See what happens to the population. See if crime does in fact go down, see if the economy is helped, etc. If it has a positive effect, then legalize another drug (the least dangerous at the time), and so on. See where it takes us.

It is not up to you or I to tell someone how to live their life. It is not up to you or I to force our morality on someone else. Well, not in a free country anyway.

But, we should ask ourselves... Do we really want to be free? I don't think most people do.

I don't know who was the first to bring coffee out of the jungle.
The story I heard was;
Explorers were exploring the Columbian jungle and smelled this wonderful aroma they had never smelled before. They followed the smell ans came upon a group of Indigenous. They had a big pot over a fire boiling away. One of the explorers dipped his cup in and sampled it. He liked it a lot and enjoyed the high it gave him.
After boiling for a while, they pulled the pot off the fire and poured the liquid onto the ground.
The explorers asked why they did that.
They told them, they eat the beans and pour off the poison.

A little off topic but this reminded me of the story.
Meth is baaaad stuff.