Here is a simple breakdown of the process:

The law of attraction: This is the moving force of the universe. That which is like unto itself is drawn.

The creative techniques: CONSCIOUS CREATION: This is the creative technique of purposefully (consciously) using your thoughts and beliefs to create your reality and attract what you want into your experience.

Unconscious creation: This is what most people do every day--- by thinking and believing things they do not necessarily want to create. They perpetuate what is, and they create more of what they do not want.

Emotional Intelligence: This is knowing how to direct and change your emotions.

Emotions and feelings: Let your feelings be your guide. They will tell you if you are attracting what you want or keeping it away.

You mention: Unconscious creation: This is what most people do every day--- by thinking and believing things they do not necessarily want to create. They perpetuate what is, and they create more of what they do not want.


This is the tricky one indeed, especially if you are exposed to so much activity around you that is negative. City life!

but yes I am working on that!

In time I will understand this technique. I guess for those that understand the laws of attraction, they wonder why it is so hard for others to understand this.

you must admit if it was easy the world would be a different place all together.

so yes maybe in time I will understand this technique and use it efficiently primarily to help others and not too much for my personal needs.

I know a different take on this then most who use the laws of attraction for their own beneficial needs only.

It is interesting. Thank you for sharing this.

You have to realize that you cannot create reality for other people. But if you can use the techniques to help yourself and maybe to get rich, then you can certainly help others.

But the most important thing you can help them with is teaching them how to create their own reality in a purposeful manner. This puts the power of creation in their hands and they do not have to depend on someone else 'helping' them.

So don't worry about thinking you have to be altruistic and only help other people. You cannot help other people unless you know full well how to help yourself and empower yourself.

One way you can help other people is to help them feel better, and they will then think better thoughts.

Jeannie, all of your arguments for the so-called "Law of Attraction" are non-arguments not any different than the ones that religions people give for their religions.

You, yourself, have publicly chastised the Christians on this site for their erroneous claims that just because so many millions of people believe in Christianity it must be true!

Yet, here you are restorting to this same non-argument propaganda brainwashing tactic.

Also:

You have already made it perfectly clear that we are not responsible for the decisions and actions of others, and that we have no control over the actions of others.

Therefore you have shown me in no uncertain terms that even if your so-called Law of Attraction should have any validity it wouldn't apply to my specific concerns anyway.

So I don't understand is why you continue to claim that I don't understand the Law of Attraction?



I understand perfectly!

Your own personal claims are oxymoronic. Your claims cannot possibly be true becasue you keep changing your stance.

I cannot simultaneously be responsible and not responsible for the actions of other people that have a direct affect on my life.

You agree that I cannot be responsible for this and that I am not attracting their free will actions.

This is all that I have ever held from the beginning.

You are actually in agreement with me on this point.

So I don't see why you are claiming that I don't understand.

The "Law of Attraction" does not include my abilty to control the free will actions of other people who can and do have a direct affect on my life (even in quite physical ways on occassion).

You are all over the board.

One minute you claim that if we are raped we attracted that event to us.

But then you turn around and claim that we are neither responsible, nor can we control the actions of others.

We if we can't control their actions, then we most certainly can't 'attract' them in to acting, because that would be a form of controlling their actions.

Either we control the actions of other people or we don't.

You have already stated that we don't.

So be it.

I'll take your word on that point and accept that the Law of Attraction cannot help in matter associated with the behavior of other people who negatively affect my life.

I cannot possible be attracting their actions for to do so I would need to be controlling them!

I've held all along that such a scenario could only be true in solipsism.

You dismiss this as being untrue.

Yet, you haven't addressed it at all.

All you do is just keep rattling on that we are responsible for attracting the actions of others, yet we are not.

That's oxymoronic.

You'd need to explain how that can work without conflict.

Untill then you speak with forked tongue.

You are attempting to demand that we are both responsible and not responsible simultanteously. But that's absurd.

Abra,Isn't life itself oxymoronic and absurd?

Abra,

You cannot create reality for other people. You cannot control their thoughts.

You can, however, attract them into your experience and you can allow them to effect you, and you can willingly participate in their drama.

That is what you do.

p.s you do not understand perfectly

I have no problem with this.

This is the basis of all tradtions of magick.

However, most of these traditions recognize that we cannot possibly control everything.

I have told you time and time again and I am beginning to wonder why you can't hear me or understand my simple words.

We don't control "everything" (as individuals we can only control our own personal experiences and reality..... "NOT EVERYTHING."

There is more to reality than what we percieve.

Wallace D. Wattles (One of the original Law of Attraction authors) writes in his book "The science of getting rich" about the use of the will:

HE STATES THAT TO USE THE WILL TO CONTROL OTHERS OR TO ATTEMPT TO CONTROL THINGS IS NOT THE PROPER USE OF THE WILL.

How To Use The Will


To set about getting rich in the certain way, you do not try to apply your will power to anything outside of yourself.

You have no right to do so, anyway. It is wrong to apply your will to other men and women in order to get them to do what you wish done.

It is as flagrantly wrong to coerce people by mental power, as it is to coerce them by physical power. If compelling people by physical force to do things for you reduces them to slavery, compelling them by mental means accomplishes exactly the same thing; the only difference is in methods.

If taking things from people by physical force is robbery, then taking things by mental force is robbery also. There is no difference in principle. You have no right to use your will power upon another person, even “for his own good,” for you do not know what is for his good.

The science of getting rich does not require you to apply power or force to any other person, in any way whatsoever. There is not the slightest necessity for doing so.

Indeed, any attempt to use your will upon others will only tend to defeat your purpose. You do not need to apply your will to things in order to compel them to come to you.

That would simply be trying to coerce God and would be foolish and useless. You do not have to try to compel God to give you good things, any more than you have to use your will power to make the sun rise. You do not have to use your will power to conquer an unfriendly Deity, or to make stubborn and rebellious forces do your bidding. Substance is friendly to you, and is more anxious to give you what you want than you are to get it.

To get rich, you need only to use your will power upon yourself. When you know what to think and do, then you must use your will to compel yourself to think and do the right things. That is the legitimate use of the will in getting what you want — to use it in holding yourself to the right course.

Use your will to keep yourself thinking and acting in the certain way. Do not try to project your will, or your thoughts, or your mind out into space to “act” on things or people. Keep your mind at home. It can accomplish more there than elsewhere. Use your mind to form a mental image of what you want and to hold that vision with faith and purpose.

And use your will to keep your mind working in the right way. The more steady and continuous your faith and purpose, the more rapidly you will get rich because you will make only POSITIVE impressions upon substance, and you will not neutralize or offset them by negative impressions. The picture of your desires, held with faith and purpose, is taken up by the formless, and permeates it to great distances — throughout the universe, for all we know. As this impression spreads, all things are set moving toward its realization.

Every living thing, every inanimate thing, and the things yet uncreated are stirred toward bringing into being that which you want. All force begins to be exerted in that direction. All things begin to move toward you. The minds of people everywhere are influenced toward doing the things necessary to the fulfilling of your desires, and they work for you, unconsciously. But you can check all this by starting a negative impression in the formless substance.

Doubt or unbelief is as certain to start a movement away from you, as faith and purpose are to start one toward you. It is by not understanding this that most people make their failure. Every hour and moment you spend in giving heed to doubts and fears, every hour you spend in worry, every hour in which your soul is possessed by unbelief, sets a current away from you in the whole domain of intelligent substance.

All the promises are unto them that believe, and unto them only. Since belief is all-important, it behoves you to guard your thoughts, and as your beliefs will be shaped to a very great extent by the things you observe and think about, it is important that you should carefully govern to what you give your attention. And here the will comes into use, for it is by your will that you determine upon what things your attention shall be fixed. If you want to become rich, you must not make a study of poverty.

Things are not brought into being by thinking about their opposites. Health is never to be attained by studying disease and thinking about disease; righteousness is not to be promoted by studying sin and thinking about sin; and no one ever got rich by studying poverty and thinking about poverty.

Medicine as a science of disease has increased disease; religion as a science of sin has promoted sin, and economics as a study of poverty will fill the world with wretchedness and want. Do not talk about poverty, do not investigate it, or concern yourself with it. Never mind what its causes are; you have nothing to do with them. What concerns you is the cure.

Do not spend your time in so-called charitable work Do some of these bold statements challenge or confuse you? Get the insights and thoughts of other like-minded people in the or charity movements; most charity only tends to perpetuate the wretchedness it aims to eradicate.

I do not say that you should be hard-hearted or unkind and refuse to hear the cry of need, but you must not try to eradicate poverty in any of the conventional ways. Put poverty behind you, and put all that pertains to it behind you, and “make good.” Get rich. That is the best way you can help the poor. And you cannot hold the mental image that is to make you rich if you fill your mind with pictures of poverty and all its attendant ills.

Do not read books or papers which give circumstantial accounts of the wretchedness of the tenement dwellers, of the horrors of child labour, and so on. Do not read anything that fills your mind with gloomy images of want and suffering.

You cannot help the poor in the least by knowing about these things, and the widespread knowledge of them does not tend at all to do away with poverty. What tends to do away with poverty is not the getting of pictures of poverty into your mind, but getting pictures of wealth, abundance, and possibility into the minds of the poor. You are not deserting the poor in their misery when you refuse to allow your mind to be filled with pictures of that misery. Poverty can be done away with, not by increasing the number of well-to-do people who think about poverty, but by increasing the number of poor people who purpose with faith to get rich. The poor do not need charity; they need inspiration. Charity only sends them a loaf of bread to keep them alive in their wretchedness, or gives them an entertainment to make them forget for an hour or two.

But inspiration can cause them to rise out of their misery. If you want to help the poor, demonstrate to them that they can become rich. Prove it by getting rich yourself. The only way in which poverty will ever be banished from this world is by getting a large and constantly increasing number of people to practice the teachings of this book. People must be taught to become rich by creation, not by competition.

Every person who becomes rich by competition knocks down the ladder by which he rises, and keeps others down, but every person who gets rich by creation opens a way for thousands to follow — and inspires them to do so.

You are not showing hardness of heart or an unfeeling disposition when you refuse to pity poverty, see poverty, read about poverty, or think or talk about it, or to listen to those who do talk about it. Use your will power to keep your mind OFF the subject of poverty and to keep it fixed with faith and purpose ON the vision of what you want and are creating.

Yes, and no.

Even most traditions of magick recognize that the world is not solipsism.

This is why many of them have images of 'good and evil' magicians and forces playing out against each other.

All I'm trying to point out is that Jeannies extremism would require solipism.

Jeannie is basically ignoring the fact that there is more than one free will at work.

Consider the following:

Jeannie goes into the locker room of a Hockey team and tells them that they and they alone can attract the outcome of the game! It's entirely IN THEIR MINDS!

Then she leaves and goes over to the opposing team and tells them the VERY SAME THING!

Which team did she lie to?

I think she lied to BOTH of them.

It simply can't be true for BOTH teams simultaneously.

The only way it could be true for the first team is if they were IMAGINING the exsitence of the second team!

That's SOLIPSISM!

In order to give the second team the same reality of existence it cannot be true that the outcome of the game is entirely dependent on the mere mindset of either team

I cannot be true for both teams simultaneoulsy if both teams are to have a free will reality. SOMETHING'S GOT TO GIVE! One team MUST LOSE!

Do you see why reality cannot be entirely determined by the thoughts of a single individual like Jeannie susggests!

Unless, of course, you're willing to accept solipsism.

That's the only way it could be true.

And that is all I have ever held from the get go.

All I'm saying is that for the "Law of Attraction" to be true as Jeannnie would like to present it then she must accept solipsism.

I've suggested this to her a very long time go. But she refuses to accept solipism because she doesn't like it.

So this is a case where she likes the results of solipsism, but she doesn't like the COST.

Well, everytime I agree with this you accuse me of refusing to take responsiblity for "everything" that happens to me.

You want your cake and eat it too!

Like the Hockey teams in my last example you want me to believe that it's ENTIRELY in my power to WIN THE GAME, yet you refuse to recognize that you also want this to be true for the OTHER TEAMS TOO!

Someone HAS TO LOSE! IT'S BEYOND THEIR CONTROL!

And everytime I point that out you accuse me of being a whinning person who refuses to take responsiblity for the outcome of EVERYTHING in my life!

Everytime I try to address this issue you TURN IT into a personal attact on me claiming that I'm unwilling to take RESPONSIBLITY!

That's just a NASTY distraction tactic to avoid having to address the REAL LOGIC!

I'm just trying to explain to you that it has nothing to do with me or my personal feelings about life.

I'm trying to explain to you why your model can't be true for everyone simultaneously whether they are willing to take responsiblity or not!

The only way your model could be true is if solipsism is true.

But you have vhemently rejected the notion of solipsism many times!

You thoroughly detest soplisism evidently.

Perhaps there is a personal reality (as JB seems to be saying)and also an overlapping reality defined by the group consensus?

Hey Morning people.. all this hassle makes me want to throw in the towel, and goto church and I dont like church.

Wheres a win win mannn? wheres a win win? theres something that in abras last post I noticed, he speculates something missing. Lemme just put this out there for my own knowlege.. Is there a higher power involved? Even it being the universe itself? Something a greater power outside yourself?

Also, OP what is the idea of karma in relation to this topic? I dont know if I missed it, but noones brought up karma.. which is an obvious energy based belief.

OMG! She's back!

Abra,

You are representing me and my beliefs incorrectly. All that you talk about is only what you understand and what you see. You need to open your eyes a little wider.

As for your example and the team who wins the game, even if I told them both about the law of attraction and visualization techniques, it will be the team who understand them and actually practices them that wins.

It will be the team that believes they can win and practices these techniques and the team who intends to win, that wins.

The team that laughs at the idea and does not believe they can improve their game by their thoughts and beliefs who will be the team that does not win.

But the creative techniques are NOT about the competitive mind set. It is the creative mind that gets what it wants.

These creative techniques are used by professional sports teams a lot and by body builders, and for weight loss, and for businesses and large corporations. They will be the ones who accomplish what they set out to accomplish.

lol.. I dunno, Im srprised you guys are still around today talking about this myself.

Everything is not about you Abra.

And you ARE responsible for everything that happens TO YOU.
THAT is your reality and your experience.

Your reality and your experience is not EVERYTHING.

Some of these same discussions have been going on for over a year

Wow!