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| Topic: I want a divorce from liberalism | |
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Yes, this is how it works now. The solution? Stop threating them for free. remove the cause, not add yet more problems.
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Edited by
Unknow
on
Thu 01/22/09 05:32 PM
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Yes, this is how it works now. The solution? Stop threating them for free. remove the cause, not add yet more problems. Treat them for free? Where? SOMEONE pays whether they can or not. Who would that be? |
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So we refuse to treat everyone who cant afford to pay? Or just the ones you deem worthy? Who is to make that call? Or just less expensive ailments? Who makes that call? Treat them for free? Where? SOMEONE pays whether they can or not. Who would that be? Well, it is really simple. You do work? You do not want poor to go untreated? Take your money and pay for some of the costs or all. You can even pick and choose. But I sense this may not be what you want. You probably want to reach in my pocket for that, am I right? |
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So we refuse to treat everyone who cant afford to pay? Or just the ones you deem worthy? Who is to make that call? Or just less expensive ailments? Who makes that call? Treat them for free? Where? SOMEONE pays whether they can or not. Who would that be? Well, it is really simple. You do work? You do not want poor to go untreated? Take your money and pay for some of the costs or all. You can even pick and choose. But I sense this may not be what you want. You probably want to reach in my pocket for that, am I right? What I would like to see accountibility on money I, you, we already spend. If there was we would not even be having this discussion. |
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Again What you fail to realize is we already pay for the uninsured at a much higher price. All you have to do is look at our ERs. We dont turn people away for not being able to pay. We treat them. These costs are passed on in higher costs and insurance premiums. Do you not see that? Do you not realize why we cant control health care costs. We have become a country of high cost treatments for low cost ailments. Who do you think pays now? Edited by templter on Thu 01/22/09 02:09 PM Word. |
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What you fail to realize is we already pay for the uninsured at a much higher price. All you have to do is look at our ERs. We dont turn people away for not being able to pay. We treat them. These costs are passed on in higher costs and insurance premiums. Do you not see that? Do you not realize why we cant control health care costs. We have become a country of high cost treatments for low cost ailments. Who do you think pays now? Golly gee, I thought my experiences working in the medical field (ER) whislt preparing for medical school would have provided me with at least a modicum of knowledge/understanding in this area. Perhaps I'm just too much of a simpleton to comprehend the complexities until enlightened by the likes of cut-n-paste "exspurts" now (you know who you are). A suggestion. Try reading the book called "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. Please pay close attention to the chapter that addresses engaging in battles when you are the inferior opponent. Healthcare is a business/service like any other. Obviously the costs gets passed on to cover those who can't/won't pay because of "no refusal" treatment. Try thinking in these terms- your place of employment. What would happen if a customer didn't pay and you couldn't refuse providing your goods/services? You either pass on the cost to other customers or you go out of business (which is actually happening to hospitals in TX... partial cause, two words "illegal aliens"). (Take note here union workers) If you don't expect to work for less than you believe you deserve, you shouldn't expect doctors, nurses, and supporting staff do the same. If you believe every single healthcare provider is in the field because of purely altruistic motives, you are sadly mistaken. Those who can pay for the best, receive the best. One of the reasons we all don't drive Bugatti Veyron 16.4 automobiles (1.5 million). One of the reasons we all don't our own individual Lear jets. Those who can only afford a Yugo, drive a Yugo. Those who can't afford a car, take the bus, ride a bike, or walk. They get by the best way the can. Lawyers and lawsuits. Where there are perceived "deep pockets", there's a lawyer looking to get their hands into them. Healthcare providers are people too, they do make mistakes... just like you. The quantum difference- chances are you (generally speaking)don't have deep pockets when you make a mistake and aren't dealing with life and death situations. Every frivolous lawsuit also drives up medical costs/insurance... resulting in a doctor leaving the profession (most noteably in Illinois, Ob/Gyn physicians). Go find a mid-wife then. "Controlling" costs. The only entity that has that power to control healthcare costs is the government (private businesses/corporations tend to promote growth and self-regulate as per supply/demand). This of course leads to "nationalizing" (a/k/a socializing) healthcare. Going back to the car analogy- we can either drive the vehicle that we can individually afford or we can all be forced to drive Yugos. If the Canadian model of healthcare was so great, why do some of their political leaders and wealthy come to the US for proceedures? I believe the most overlooked in regards to healthcare is personal responsibility and lifestyle choices. "I smoke, resulting in cancer and/or cardiovascular disease... you must treat me". Obesity, sedentary lifestyle, things that healthcare providers have been trying to educate people for decades about. How many millions of dollars have been put into AIDS education, litature, and research? In what segment of society is this disease still growing? Though this may sound harsh and uncompassionate. Culling of the human herd is not a bad thing. It's a necessary thing. Even if the technology existed to cure/treat every single malady on the face of the planet, think of the consequences that would result. Every single organism on this planet realizes something we don't. The strong and very, very, very, lucky survive. I believe our current healthcare system is the best on the planet for one reason. People that want the best, pay for the best. Any complaints? Go Canada or Cuba then. I'm sure they'll welcome you with open arms. Just wondering if acute corsette removal surgery is covered by an HMO. 
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Again What you fail to realize is we already pay for the uninsured at a much higher price. All you have to do is look at our ERs. We dont turn people away for not being able to pay. We treat them. These costs are passed on in higher costs and insurance premiums. Do you not see that? Do you not realize why we cant control health care costs. We have become a country of high cost treatments for low cost ailments. Who do you think pays now? Edited by templter on Thu 01/22/09 02:09 PM Word. |
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Edited by
Unknow
on
Thu 01/22/09 06:32 PM
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What you fail to realize is we already pay for the uninsured at a much higher price. All you have to do is look at our ERs. We dont turn people away for not being able to pay. We treat them. These costs are passed on in higher costs and insurance premiums. Do you not see that? Do you not realize why we cant control health care costs. We have become a country of high cost treatments for low cost ailments. Who do you think pays now? Golly gee, I thought my experiences working in the medical field (ER) whislt preparing for medical school would have provided me with at least a modicum of knowledge/understanding in this area. Perhaps I'm just too much of a simpleton to comprehend the complexities until enlightened by the likes of cut-n-paste "exspurts" now (you know who you are). A suggestion. Try reading the book called "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. Please pay close attention to the chapter that addresses engaging in battles when you are the inferior opponent. Healthcare is a business/service like any other. Obviously the costs gets passed on to cover those who can't/won't pay because of "no refusal" treatment. Try thinking in these terms- your place of employment. What would happen if a customer didn't pay and you couldn't refuse providing your goods/services? You either pass on the cost to other customers or you go out of business (which is actually happening to hospitals in TX... partial cause, two words "illegal aliens"). (Take note here union workers) If you don't expect to work for less than you believe you deserve, you shouldn't expect doctors, nurses, and supporting staff do the same. If you believe every single healthcare provider is in the field because of purely altruistic motives, you are sadly mistaken. Those who can pay for the best, receive the best. One of the reasons we all don't drive Bugatti Veyron 16.4 automobiles (1.5 million). One of the reasons we all don't our own individual Lear jets. Those who can only afford a Yugo, drive a Yugo. Those who can't afford a car, take the bus, ride a bike, or walk. They get by the best way the can. Lawyers and lawsuits. Where there are perceived "deep pockets", there's a lawyer looking to get their hands into them. Healthcare providers are people too, they do make mistakes... just like you. The quantum difference- chances are you (generally speaking)don't have deep pockets when you make a mistake and aren't dealing with life and death situations. Every frivolous lawsuit also drives up medical costs/insurance... resulting in a doctor leaving the profession (most noteably in Illinois, Ob/Gyn physicians). Go find a mid-wife then. "Controlling" costs. The only entity that has that power to control healthcare costs is the government (private businesses/corporations tend to promote growth and self-regulate as per supply/demand). This of course leads to "nationalizing" (a/k/a socializing) healthcare. Going back to the car analogy- we can either drive the vehicle that we can individually afford or we can all be forced to drive Yugos. If the Canadian model of healthcare was so great, why do some of their political leaders and wealthy come to the US for proceedures? I believe the most overlooked in regards to healthcare is personal responsibility and lifestyle choices. "I smoke, resulting in cancer and/or cardiovascular disease... you must treat me". Obesity, sedentary lifestyle, things that healthcare providers have been trying to educate people for decades about. How many millions of dollars have been put into AIDS education, litature, and research? In what segment of society is this disease still growing? Though this may sound harsh and uncompassionate. Culling of the human herd is not a bad thing. It's a necessary thing. Even if the technology existed to cure/treat every single malady on the face of the planet, think of the consequences that would result. Every single organism on this planet realizes something we don't. The strong and very, very, very, lucky survive. I believe our current healthcare system is the best on the planet for one reason. People that want the best, pay for the best. Any complaints? Go Canada or Cuba then. I'm sure they'll welcome you with open arms. Just wondering if acute corsette removal surgery is covered by an HMO.
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Edited by
Winx
on
Thu 01/22/09 06:42 PM
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Beorganic, I feel no pain about what you wrote. I actually feel sorry for you. This statement is false: "Multi-generations receiving some form of welfare living under one roof is not what I would consider "temporary"." That cycle has been broken for quite a few years now. There is a time limit on that help. I think it's 5 years in my state. They need to be working and/or going to school now. Do you have anything more current then 1992? Sheesh. The poverty level is so low now compared to then. Heavy on the opinion/emotion, light on the "facts" (as expected). Old statistics speak louder than none at all. A purely hypothetical situation (knowing that your "precious poor" ALWAYS want to do the right thing, they just need a little help). I'm a single unwed female with a child and already on welfare, my 5 year time limit is almost at an end. OOOOOPS, I become pregnant (by accident, again). You're going to try to tell me ALL benefits cease the moment that 5 years is up? There are NO "safety nets" in place, no exceptions what-so-ever? The government will not look out for/protect that child? I stand corrected... calling you naive is an understatement. "The poverty level is so low now compared to then." I'm having a difficult time following what you are trying to say here. The poverty level is so low, as in there aren't that many people in poverty as there was then? So low that these people are poorer than before? If so, in what way? Feel free provide a recent link informing me of how many have air conditioning, color tv sets, number of cars, ect. they have. nogames- I share your experiences and know exactly what you are talking about. A few years ago I was the coordinator of the Master Gardener program for the local cooperative extension service. The largest city near me has several housing projects for the "needy". Located next to these projects were large plots of vacant land. It was my proposal to the city to use these pieces of land for vegetable gardens for said clients. The city signed off on the project. The Master Gardening program would educate these individuals with a series of hands on workshops and litature these "needy" individuals. Provide equipment, and help them through the entire process (including volunteers to help harvest and preserve crops... with donated supplies). We sent out over 400 fliers. Only 6 people showed up. The very first question asked after my hour long presentation was "If I do this, will this affect my (welfare) link card or my benefits"? I'm eagery anticipating hearing what Winx's excuses/justifications/rationalizations will be in regards to the above mentioned testimonials. "Winx's excuse/justifications/rationalizations"?! Hmmm...condescending and arrogant to me in all posts to me since you've been on the threads. I have nothing to say. |
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I have the sinking suspicion this post was a troll to start. Cant believe I fell for it.
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MIKEY. You fought to protect rights. The constitution gives us those rights. And thankyou for your service.
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WELL GOLLY GEE!!! We bow to the master. It quite obvious you are a superior intelligence sent here to set all the rest of us ingrates straight. The only one to see is insurance premiums triple, the only one to see his taxes go up, he!! the only one with a job...Just who the he!! do we think we are anyway!!!!!! While I am flattered with your platitudes, I must humbly decline the title of master. I assure you that I'm just an ordinary person doing the best I can to get by. If I am perceived as smarter, wealthier, or any possess any perceived superiorities I can only attribute to my G*d given talents/abilities and hard work. If my insurance rates increase twenty-fold and taxes increase equally, I have two choices 1. Work harder and smarter to obtain the best or 2. Completely give up trying to be the best I can be and allow myself to accept and wallow in mediocrity. As they say, the cream always rises to the top. You may hate, loath, despise me (or my message) all you like; However, does that help your life at all and your personal persuits/endeavors? Winxeepooooo- As much as you quote my posts and comment on my comments, people are going to start thinking you have amourous feelings for me (cleverly and thinly disguised as anti-beeorganic posts) in seeking my individual/personal attention. For a "I nothing to say" post you're saying a lot. I swear, between you and Lynann... just promise me no catfights over me, okay hon? Don't get me wrong here, I'm sure you look good in a tight corsette too. |
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I have the sinking suspicion this post was a troll to start. Cant believe I fell for it. Would a complete resume satiate your sinking suspicions? Post photographs of my high school/college degrees (biochemistry and physics)/diplomas/transcripts/athletic awards/medals/military service as an officer in the USMC (how about a nice pic of where I was shot in the neck)/ MCAT (medical school admission test) scores? Would that help at all? Just because I choose not discuss my entire PERSONAL life here proves absolutely nothing. Verily, tis a danger of trying to play a cyber-sherlock and speculating. When it's all said and done, it might me the suspected troll who makes the accuser(s) to look foolish. Might I suggest in the future you choose your battles more wisely? Indifference to you, think/believe what you shall. I apologize for an earlier comment I made about you as well, I obviously gave you undue credit for perceiving you as a smart man. Carry on. |
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Well, I have read through here and I have something to say. Our healthcare system is not the best. People are not treated equally. Granted in a capitalistic society the richest will have better care but it is not fair. Poor people actually die from the lack of care in this country.
Now I thought I heard genocidal reference in the text from bee but I am not sure. The poor are not poor because they want to be, unlike some would try to have others believe and they deserve the same chances to live as the rich or more advantaged do. If a reference was made to "clean out the societal pool of people" by letting them die from lack of care, that is just sick. Some do think they are impressive too much, eh? |
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Edited by
MirrorMirror
on
Thu 01/22/09 08:29 PM
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So we refuse to treat everyone who cant afford to pay? Or just the ones you deem worthy? Who is to make that call? Or just less expensive ailments? Who makes that call? Treat them for free? Where? SOMEONE pays whether they can or not. Who would that be? Well, it is really simple. You do work? You do not want poor to go untreated? Take your money and pay for some of the costs or all. You can even pick and choose. But I sense this may not be what you want. You probably want to reach in my pocket for that, am I right?  Thankfully people that think like you are out of office Its nice to have some warmblooded humans running the show again. Time to bring back some humanity and common descency
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Winx don't let the idiots get ya down.
How often have we seen it here on these boards? The funny thing is... Oopps I better not say it... |
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Thankfully people that think like you are out of office Its nice to have some warmblooded humans running the show again. Time to bring back some humanity and common descency
Incorrect. Nobody ever removed you "descency" from you. You're free to pay for anyone's health care. What you want is the access to someone else's pocket to feel "descent". And to those who smirk, post bananas, and use other means of kindergarten conduct: Don't you wish you had an argument? Show your smartness by refuting the point that you not agree with. Don't pretend that you have won something by withdrawal or repeating the same, or misdirecting, by going ad hoc... Adult are reading this. Sober argument that is not refuted wins. |
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After 8 years of ruining the country, or, let's say, not helping anyone, including themselves, the Republicans, who claim to be Christians, still have no conscience, compassion, or common sense. I for one welcome a New Day in America and the world. The dynasties of the upper class, who will still be flexing their muscle, I'm sure, had better watch out. You must be after my heart!
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What you fail to realize is we already pay for the uninsured at a much higher price. All you have to do is look at our ERs. We dont turn people away for not being able to pay. We treat them. These costs are passed on in higher costs and insurance premiums. Do you not see that? Do you not realize why we cant control health care costs. We have become a country of high cost treatments for low cost ailments. Who do you think pays now? Golly gee, I thought my experiences working in the medical field (ER) whislt preparing for medical school would have provided me with at least a modicum of knowledge/understanding in this area. Perhaps I'm just too much of a simpleton to comprehend the complexities until enlightened by the likes of cut-n-paste "exspurts" now (you know who you are). A suggestion. Try reading the book called "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. Please pay close attention to the chapter that addresses engaging in battles when you are the inferior opponent. Healthcare is a business/service like any other. Obviously the costs gets passed on to cover those who can't/won't pay because of "no refusal" treatment. Try thinking in these terms- your place of employment. What would happen if a customer didn't pay and you couldn't refuse providing your goods/services? You either pass on the cost to other customers or you go out of business (which is actually happening to hospitals in TX... partial cause, two words "illegal aliens"). (Take note here union workers) If you don't expect to work for less than you believe you deserve, you shouldn't expect doctors, nurses, and supporting staff do the same. If you believe every single healthcare provider is in the field because of purely altruistic motives, you are sadly mistaken. Those who can pay for the best, receive the best. One of the reasons we all don't drive Bugatti Veyron 16.4 automobiles (1.5 million). One of the reasons we all don't our own individual Lear jets. Those who can only afford a Yugo, drive a Yugo. Those who can't afford a car, take the bus, ride a bike, or walk. They get by the best way the can. Lawyers and lawsuits. Where there are perceived "deep pockets", there's a lawyer looking to get their hands into them. Healthcare providers are people too, they do make mistakes... just like you. The quantum difference- chances are you (generally speaking)don't have deep pockets when you make a mistake and aren't dealing with life and death situations. Every frivolous lawsuit also drives up medical costs/insurance... resulting in a doctor leaving the profession (most noteably in Illinois, Ob/Gyn physicians). Go find a mid-wife then. "Controlling" costs. The only entity that has that power to control healthcare costs is the government (private businesses/corporations tend to promote growth and self-regulate as per supply/demand). This of course leads to "nationalizing" (a/k/a socializing) healthcare. Going back to the car analogy- we can either drive the vehicle that we can individually afford or we can all be forced to drive Yugos. If the Canadian model of healthcare was so great, why do some of their political leaders and wealthy come to the US for proceedures? I believe the most overlooked in regards to healthcare is personal responsibility and lifestyle choices. "I smoke, resulting in cancer and/or cardiovascular disease... you must treat me". Obesity, sedentary lifestyle, things that healthcare providers have been trying to educate people for decades about. How many millions of dollars have been put into AIDS education, litature, and research? In what segment of society is this disease still growing? Though this may sound harsh and uncompassionate. Culling of the human herd is not a bad thing. It's a necessary thing. Even if the technology existed to cure/treat every single malady on the face of the planet, think of the consequences that would result. Every single organism on this planet realizes something we don't. The strong and very, very, very, lucky survive. I believe our current healthcare system is the best on the planet for one reason. People that want the best, pay for the best. Any complaints? Go Canada or Cuba then. I'm sure they'll welcome you with open arms. Just wondering if acute corsette removal surgery is covered by an HMO.
Get em Temp!!! 
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