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| Topic: If you do not like it? | |
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I don't think it's questioning they find rebellious. But, you sure as heck better not come to wrong conclusion.  Its sometimes so hard to understand why it seems virtually impossible for some seemingly highly intelligent people to even fathom the possibility that others' "conclusions" (those that don't look just like theirs) may also hold a grain of truth. As if even considering the possibility would threaten to completely destroy their entire archetypal paradigm. it wont destroy it my lady, and some like eljay are more liberal than others, it has nothing to do with intellegence, it has to do with faith in what is beleived by them. Isn't faith just another word for no evidence? Because with evidence there is no real need for faith. not necessarily, you have faith your car will start everyday when you turn the key in the ignition, but some times it doesn't right? Yet there is evidence that most of the time this is the case - logic is like that also, it works most of the time, but once in awhile it doesn't. we all have faith in things that dissapoint us at times. Their faith is in something they feel CAN'T dissapoint them, be they right or wrong, it is their belief. I understand, But I have actual evidence that my car has started, so it's not a blind faith. There is no proof of anyone being heald by prayer, or that a god or gods exist. Do I think that people that believe in these things are stupid? no, of course not. I just but faith does not make it so. The hale Bob sult had faith that the comet would take them to their heaven, faith did not make it real. |
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SEAMONSTER:
I understand, But I have actual evidence that my car has started, so it's not a blind faith. TRIBO: true, but if you never had or owned a car or had never have ridden or started one, yet all who did or had told you this would be the case if you ever had the chance to - would believing them not be the same blind faith? - would your faith then be of no account? just asking? SM: There is no proof of anyone being healed by prayer, or that a god or gods exist. TRIBO: I'm not sure that "prayer" is that which supposedly "heals" i think it's thier instrument of asking for healing from thier god. I have seen what they call Miracles even with my dad who died of cancer, he lived for 2 yrs after the dr.'s said he had maybe at the most 15 days to live from the time they cut him open till he passed. i guess it depends on what your concidiering miracles - if you mean raising someone from the dead or having missing limbs grow back - then i to have never witnessed such a thing, though i wont say it's impossible, i think most of what we hear is BS and unprovable in that realm. Unless i see such with my own eyes i wil never believe it, all i see is stories that are unable to be substantiated so far. someone who knows someone told another someone that such and such. as to god/s - i don't beleive in thiers but i do beleive there is something that created me - i know that i didn't give myself life. therefore i search. Do I think that people that believe in these things are stupid? no, of course not. I just but faith does not make it so. The hale Bob cult had faith that the comet would take them to their heaven, faith did not make it real. TRIBO:  Actually they might have - they for sure left this plane of existance, maybe thet did find thier heaven - who knows.
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I don't think it's questioning they find rebellious. But, you sure as heck better not come to wrong conclusion. Its sometimes so hard to understand why it seems virtually impossible for some seemingly highly intelligent people to even fathom the possibility that others' "conclusions" (those that don't look just like theirs) may also hold a grain of truth. As if even considering the possibility would threaten to completely destroy their entire archetypal paradigm. it wont destroy it my lady, and some like eljay are more liberal than others, it has nothing to do with intellegence, it has to do with faith in what is beleived by them. When faith supercedes logic, it begins to look like fiction. does it not take faith to believe in logic? Yes... Logic requires some Faith based on previous knowledge. Therefore... Logic does not stand without Faith... |
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I don't think it's questioning they find rebellious. But, you sure as heck better not come to wrong conclusion. Its sometimes so hard to understand why it seems virtually impossible for some seemingly highly intelligent people to even fathom the possibility that others' "conclusions" (those that don't look just like theirs) may also hold a grain of truth. As if even considering the possibility would threaten to completely destroy their entire archetypal paradigm. it wont destroy it my lady, and some like eljay are more liberal than others, it has nothing to do with intellegence, it has to do with faith in what is beleived by them. When faith supercedes logic, it begins to look like fiction. does it not take faith to believe in logic? Yes... Logic requires some Faith based on previous knowledge. Therefore... Logic does not stand without Faith...  
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Dictionary definition of Dilusion:
a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact Dictionary definition of faith: belief that is not based on proof There realy is not alot of difrence in the two. If you tell a child that santa is the one bringing them their gifts. They tend to believe it with all their hart that it's so. They have blind faith, but it does not realy make it so. And no amount of faith will change that. And I know atheists that have had their cancer go into remission and are alive today. So why is it that it's just a coincidence when it happens to an atheist and a miracle when it happens to a christian? I don't resly believe in what I have no evidence for. Does that mean that there is absolutly no type of something out there that we may see as a god? no, but I can't see any reason to think that there is. |
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Dictionary definition of Dilusion: a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact Dictionary definition of faith: belief that is not based on proof There realy is not alot of difrence in the two. If you tell a child that santa is the one bringing them their gifts. They tend to believe it with all their hart that it's so. They have blind faith, but it does not realy make it so. And no amount of faith will change that. And I know atheists that have had their cancer go into remission and are alive today. So why is it that it's just a coincidence when it happens to an atheist and a miracle when it happens to a christian? I don't resly believe in what I have no evidence for. Does that mean that there is absolutly no type of something out there that we may see as a god? no, but I can't see any reason to think that there is. and i'll defend your right to feel and think how you will SM, no problem. as to my dads remission or my moms Multiplesclerosis, or others, none were christian per se, nor was i, I see/saw them as miracles simply becuase they went against the physicians prognonsis' - and lived well beyong there given times - it is/was personal. i would concider that to be the same for anyone not just in my case or an atheist case. though they would or might not think so. For me i still have faith for things i don't really have evidence for, like other dimensions or universes, or UFO's or etc.. But thats just me. |
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Dictionary definition of Dilusion: a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact Dictionary definition of faith: belief that is not based on proof There realy is not alot of difrence in the two. If you tell a child that santa is the one bringing them their gifts. They tend to believe it with all their hart that it's so. They have blind faith, but it does not realy make it so. And no amount of faith will change that. And I know atheists that have had their cancer go into remission and are alive today. So why is it that it's just a coincidence when it happens to an atheist and a miracle when it happens to a christian? I don't resly believe in what I have no evidence for. Does that mean that there is absolutly no type of something out there that we may see as a god? no, but I can't see any reason to think that there is. and i'll defend your right to feel and think how you will SM, no problem. as to my dads remission or my moms Multiplesclerosis, or others, none were christian per se, nor was i, I see/saw them as miracles simply becuase they went against the physicians prognonsis' - and lived well beyong there given times - it is/was personal. i would concider that to be the same for anyone not just in my case or an atheist case. though they would or might not think so. For me i still have faith for things i don't really have evidence for, like other dimensions or universes, or UFO's or etc.. But thats just me. I do see your point and it makes sense. |
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all im really saying SM, is that even if you don't have faith in god or miracles you still have faith - even atheist have faith, there faith is that they are correct in their belief that having faith is stupid or silly. my take on it is - we all have faith - in "something/s.
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There is only one thing that I am absolutly sure of. That is that some people are really stuck on themselves and try to prove to others just how smart they are by using all kinds of words that in reality mean very little. The only reality that there actually is, is that there is no reality. We make it up as we go along!
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There is only one thing that I am absolutly sure of. That is that some people are really stuck on themselves and try to prove to others just how smart they are by using all kinds of words that in reality mean very little. The only reality that there actually is, is that there is no reality. We make it up as we go along! Hmmmm? interesting - how did we make up our birth? how did we become? |
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There is only one thing that I am absolutly sure of. That is that some people are really stuck on themselves and try to prove to others just how smart they are by using all kinds of words that in reality mean very little. The only reality that there actually is, is that there is no reality. We make it up as we go along! Hmmmm? interesting - how did we make up our birth? how did we become? |
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There is only one thing that I am absolutly sure of. That is that some people are really stuck on themselves and try to prove to others just how smart they are by using all kinds of words that in reality mean very little. The only reality that there actually is, is that there is no reality. We make it up as we go along! Hmmmm? interesting - how did we make up our birth? how did we become? CE, i was asking a serious question, you said " we make reality up as we go along" i took that as meaning while we are here, but how could we make our birth up how did we come into this existence that you say is the "only reality" to be able to say that the only reality is what we MAKE UP?? to make it up would mean having to be present in order to do so - but if when born we did not have that means then how is this so? |
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There is only one thing that I am absolutly sure of. That is that some people are really stuck on themselves and try to prove to others just how smart they are by using all kinds of words that in reality mean very little. The only reality that there actually is, is that there is no reality. We make it up as we go along! Hmmmm? interesting - how did we make up our birth? how did we become? CE, i was asking a serious question, you said " we make reality up as we go along" i took that as meaning while we are here, but how could we make our birth up how did we come into this existence that you say is the "only reality" to be able to say that the only reality is what we MAKE UP?? to make it up would mean having to be present in order to do so - but if when born we did not have that means then how is this so? A trolling CE will go... A trolling CE will go... Hi Ho The Larry Oh... A trolling CE will go... |
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awww!! i just wanted to welcome the new guy SL - now you went and spoiled it -
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Just got back here, been busy.
Wanted to say, I thought this was a good thread, lots of discussion and consideration and I could see the time and thought that was put into many of the comments. That was nice. Miles: As always I appreciate your answers and your honesty. I could sense frustration in your first post, I'm happy it didn't stay long. We've all been there, the written word is sometimes given less value than a face-to-face communication. I think that's wrong because there's something more permanent about the written word. I liked the way Tribo responded to my question about tolerance as well. I also liked what Ruth said: "I am notoriously rebellious. However, since I don't believe in the Christian teachings I guess I can't really rebel against them." There's some logic there, how can one agree to a fault if one does not agree with the idea that declares the fault? I also feel that there's no harm respecting what others believe as long as the respect can still be mutual and sincere. That means there are some things we have to 'tolerate' of others and it is not for us to deny anything that equalizes our status to one another. It is for us to make sure each person has as level a playing field to make their lives content as we would expect for ourselves. If we don't extend this kindness, and allow each to walk their path unfettered by our denials, how can we be sure that we are not to blame, in the end, for their downfall? - no matter how we view what that downfall may be or what we think has caused it. Happy path seeking to all. |
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Thnx Red -
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