{{{temp}}} you are absolutely right, regardless of whether we or anyone has insurance the COST trickles down. Medical care should not be denied to anyone - but I just truly feel some good old common sense should also come into play. Why walk into an emergency room (in cases of non emergencies) when the expense is exuberant, instead of finding alternate means. Like I mentioned before in my area, there are clinics that work on a sliding scale basis. There are a small number of doctors who also offer free services (free clinics). Use those means when available. jmo

p.s. temp

thanks for not attacking

Fran I do play nice . until you put me in a group of people and call me names because You think Im in the group of people that belongs in that group Im not a member of of. I even voted for Bush the first time. Im not talking socialize medicine. We are seeing that already at subsidised clinics. Please call one, I bet at the least a month wait.Different areas maybe less. Prove me wrong and call. Would love to know!! To me that's a push towards socialized medicine. Leave whats in place there. Put people on existing plans and pay now instead of later. Yes its make me mad, dam right Im paying for Joe the bum down the street. But I see savings coming from every where. Winx came up with one. I believe funding is already there with Accountability at Local and State levels. But that's just me..I don't want "Big Brother" around any more than he is.

Damm that sounded like my dad!

Uh-oh.

uuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh
im having chest pains...right here..it radiates down my arm. psht im NAUSEOUS too!!!


im not beign serious, but a stupid azz say this (without seriosuly haing these pains) and with a heart history...

ER treats him...gives him morphine (HELL YA)
and it does nothing to relive his pains. hes admitted..a thousand tests are done.

happens happens happens.
all the TIME

I have just a couple minutes lets change it up. America, the best nation in the world and Im proud of it!!!!! We wont put all the sick and dying in a room alone to die with no care. We take care of them!!!! We take care of the dying man with cancer, with no insurance but not pay for preventive medicine that might have saved his life. Yes we pay for the addicts morphine at the ER even tho we wont pay for Dr care that would have more oversight and cost way less. We will even pay for Joe the bum down the streets diabetes. He ate to much, he was a Bum after all. We have set a precedent! Definition: Precedent
Precedent
Adjective
1. Preceding in time, order, or significance.

Noun
1. An example that is used to justify similar occurrences at a later time.

2. (civil law) a law established by following earlier judicial decisions.

3. A subject mentioned earlier (preceding in time).


Now if you want to limit care to anyone on ability to pay back, where do you draw the line? Who draws that line? What gives someone the right to draw that line? I couldnt draw that line. Thats why Im offering savings ideas, because We are Americans and We do take care of our sick and dying no matter which party has majority or who we call our president. By the way if my theroy that WE DONT ALREADY PAY is sooo wrong. Please prove me otherwise. I could use the savings.....

i wish it could be fixed.
and if i sound cynical i apologize.
it does suck to spend a night taking care of BS sometimes, but having to do it...because well thats what hopsitals are FOR.

thank you templter you gave me some good inspiring words.

it is awesome that we truly dont discriminate. and it is true that many people are suffering mostly becasue they cant afford preventative care and their chronic disease condition exacerbates frequently.

there is a lot of things wrong with this system. I havent a clue how to fix it. I just know that socialized medicine will make it much worse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialized_medicine I am using this to show that wikipedia is a very biased source and should be not stated otherwise. There are just a couple things I will pull out that I don't considered biased. Socialized medicine is a term used primarily in the United States to refer to certain kinds of publicly-funded health care. Definitions vary, and usage is inconsistent. The term can refer to any system of medical care that is publicly financed, government administered, or both. The United States' Veterans Health Administration, and the medical departments of the U.S. Army, Navy, and Air Force would also fall under this narrow definition. When used in this way, the narrow definition permits a clear distinction from single payer health insurance systems, in which the government finances health care but is not involved in care delivery.[10][11]In the United States, Medicare, Medicaid, and the U.S. military's TRICARE fall under this definition.According to the Institute of Medicine and others, the United States is the only wealthy, industrialized nation that does not provide universal health care.[12][13]The term is often used to criticize publicly provided health care outside the U.S., but rarely to describe similar health care programs in the U.S., such as the Veterans Administration clinics and hospitals, military health care,[31] nor the single payer programs such as Medicaid and Medicare......... I believe what we fear from socialized medicine is all ready here. Look at the ERs, very crowed and a long wait. Please read Medicare and Me. We are already limiting services or what they will pay the provider. I am not for government taking over. I am for using the Private sector to control costs and set a market it can survive on...Or we can take that socialist approach and bail them out when it cant!!!!!!!!! JMO

yup, ive known people that sat in the er for DAYS waiting on a bed to be admitted. and this was in a poor county hospital. A person is not getting proper treatment after they sit in the ER for that many days. The system is too jam packed. the wait to see a doctor in his office can be long. Go to the ER, cuz well you know you need to seek treatment, and sit there for hours. and sometimes you just gotta hope your condition is even diagnosed properly. The more socialization we see, the worse this is going to get. take HIPPA for example. its a stupid program. cant get no info. your loved one is unconscious from an MVA..if he is unavailable to give permission for YOU to talk to his doctor to get information about his condition...good luck. hope you have some legal signed papers. and thats BS.
NOW if you are seeking treatment at a more rural hospital its better. but they dont have the advanced treatments that bigger ones do.

all in all....if prevention of disease was better dealt with (and im talking about availability of cheaper prescriptions, less people eating at mcdonalds and living a sedentary lifestyle) maybe these problems would lessen.

the biggest problems as i see it are the cost of meds. and well of course for the working class insurance premiums are SKY HIGH for some. Im a nurse, i work for a damn hospital...for insurance im looking at $400 a month. and so I take the risk vs the benefit and elect to not have the insurance...given i have no chronic complications at this time. its a RISK..and im sure Im not the only one that works there ass off, pays their taxes and cant afford insurance.

Im really not sure where the costs can be cut for the private sector. to me...how fair is it that i pay (with my taxes) for others insurance but cannot afford the luxury myself. (of course like i said, i know some corners i dont cut..my cell, my cable..etc)

Dam hello!!! I have been doing that my whole life!!!!! I am dead tired of it!!! Is it going to change? It hasnt in my lifetime. I just got tired of *****ing. Change!!!! Have you seen any in your lifetime. I havnt. I even got years on you. I am so f..nnnn tired of paying!! My share of cost for insurance was $340 in 1996 for a family plan. Taken right out of my check. That was just to pay the increases of cost my employer concured since 1991. I was paying that much in 1996. To off set further increases we took pay freezes. Almost 20 yrs paying into a plan that still cost me $400 a month besides what my employer pays. I am down right disgusted what I pay and what Joe down the street gets free.!!! I have felt that way my whole life. Its not going to change until we change it. Heres my biggest problem. I am one of those PROUD AMERICANS with a heart who beleives we take care of our poor,sick and dying. I beleive we already do pay for it and there are lines we cant cross to stop it. So Im for controlling costs. I am tired of paying...JMO

Hey I pay my car insurance bill to them on time....

Here's something that may help to make everyone happy -- give allowances to all businesses - big and small - so that they can pay for all thir employees to have adequate insurance. That way all WORKING people can be insured, with their own merit and by their own job.

That, I think, would be a really good idea.

the healthcare system I am working for is one of the largest this side of the mississippi. i dont think they are anywhere near bankruptcy. they are constantly buliding and expanding.

i work in healthcare. but still do i get any discount insurance? a break? nope. at least them durn insurance comapnies arent making money offa me either though. nope i get to sit and self diagnose and pray.

We have that system in place in the private sector. The problems are the costs from the rest spills over to those who pay. I beleive we as a society already pay for those who cant at higher cost. It is not letting the private sector control costs and set a market that it can survive. The explosion of costs,explosion of technoloy, even the limiting of services is all a sign. The goverment should limit its costs using the private sector. The private sector will control it costs and set that market. The economy takes off and you have less costs to the gov. I beleive % 80 percent of this can be done at the local and state levels. To me thats whos going to benefit most from "The Savings".Its a free market that will ajust its self as the economy goes down or up. I dont want to debate who deserves what. I want to debate how to fix it. If we do nothing imagine in another 10yrs. Whats our kids going to pay.

My mom paid $200 every two weeks to keep my Dad on her company's insurance plan. Then he got Medicare. He gets his meds from Canada. I know other older people that do too.
That's a shame.

I think that would be a GREAT idea. Having an allowance to help pay for healthcare, instead of not being able to offer it would be ideal. I wouldn't mind paying for a percentage of healthcare. I realize most companies dont pay FULL premiums, but I know it is hard for my employees to pay the rest anyway. I am paying a higher wage right now than most other companies like mine, and I am trying to give everything I can to my employees. I learned that treating an employee well and listening to what they say and respecting their ideas is the best way to keep good employees, but with health insurance, that's a VERY heavy load.

I have a small company right now, and even though it is small, I would love to offer healthcare right away, I just can't offer it right now because of cost. If I did, I would shut down.

Tina

Winx

I do not get insurance through my job... they can't afford to give it to us. Obviously my idea is not in place, or they would have that ability. Are we thinking of two different things here?

Thanks, Temp.

I think that it reflects on our country. Many older people that worked all of their lives have to choose between food or meds. Some of those get their meds from Canada due to the lower costs of the meds there. This whole picture is just wrong.