reform is needed on medical lawsuits

reform is needed to allow individuals and smaller businesses to align into large groups

reform is needed to encourage drug competition

the list of possible reforms could be extensive

Congress should drop the public option and concentrate on reforming the industry as it now exists.

It might. Someone was there that didn't need to be in an ER. They didn't have insurance or a regular doctor.

Those with no insurance can go to an ER now and get treated.
The actual percentage of people without insurance is rather small, somewhere around 10%.
The main thing that you will see happen if they pass this bill and put in a Government option is you will see companies drop their insurance plans because it will be cheper for them to just pay the fine the government will impose on them than to insure their employees.

Also in the bill they want to pass is parts saying that if your insurance company changes your plan and its not up to government standards you will have to take the Gov opt.

Also you wont be able to change your plan. So if I would get remarried I wouldn't be able to put my wife on my plan, we would either have to take the gov opt or I keep mine and she would go on the gov opt. If you change jobs you wont be able to by new insurance from that company guess what you will have to go on the gov opt. As this goes on cost to the companies and individuals will increase because there will be less and less in the plans and eventually everyone will be on the gov opt.

So you tell me where are our choices? They say it will drop prices because of compitition but when the playing field isn't even the gov allways will win.

They may not be calling it socialized healthcare but if this passes we are well on our way to it.

Yes, they will be treated but they can't pay for it. We all pay for it in quite a few ways.

We will end up paying even more if this goes through

True in some ways... But WE pay for it.

NOT OUR GRANDCHILDREN.

Actually health care is quite different now, if you have good insurance or money you do not take a number, you move to the head of the line. jmo

That's not true in the ER. I was just there Sunday night with my child. We have insurance. Some people had state insurance. One had no insurance. We went through triage and then were seen in the order that we arrived.

"The United State government is the most inefficient organization in the history of the world. It is filled with waste and corruption. It operates with no accountability and basically no budget constraints. Do a little research on government projects and see how many of them ever come in on time and within budget. It never happens and they’re not even close."

Look into how our government has run Amtrak and the Post Office.

What about the VA Hospital?

I used to work for the VA Hospital. What do you want to know about it?
My ex goes there and so do a few other people that I know.

Besides the mold and asbestos problems, there are many complaints....many about how SLOW processes are and many about the health care....

The VA that I worked at did not have any mold problems. It's old but clean.

Yes, it takes awhile to get appointments to see the doctors and have procedures done. They are understaffed. Bush cut the funds to them. They need more mental health workers too.

Ten years ago they had a 28 drug/alcohol rehab program. Now it's 14 days (that's a joke) and you can't do it more then once a year because they need the beds.

The meds are a good deal.

Every week there seems to be something like this in the news about the Va Hospital

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32175364/ns/health-health_care/

Vets affected by VA hospital errors to file claims
Some now have HIV, hepatitis after being exposed to infectious body fluids

CHATTANOOGA, Tenn. - An attorney is preparing to ask the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs to pay disability benefits and damages for hospital mistakes that may have exposed veterans to infectious body fluids — a complaint that he said could ultimately multiply into many more such demands.

The attorney, Mike Sheppard of Nashville, said he is preparing to file claims with the VA for about 60 veterans, including three women.

Among them are veterans who have tested positive for HIV and hepatitis and others who suffered emotional distress after the VA provided them with initial positive blood tests for infections that turned out to be wrong.

edited to ad date of article:
By Bill Poovey
updated 4:25 p.m. ET, Mon., July 27, 2009

It happens in ALL HOSPITALS


NEW YORK - A woman who died unnoticed on a hospital floor in an upsetting scene recorded by security cameras was killed by blood clots caused by a long period of physical inactivity, according to the city's medical examiner.

Esmin Green, 49, had been sitting in a waiting room at the city-owned Kings County Hospital Center for nearly 24 hours when she collapsed from her chair and slowly died on June 19.

She lay on the floor at the Brooklyn hospital for an hour before a nurse finally checked her pulse.


After an autopsy and weeks of tests, the medical examiner's office concluded Friday that Green was killed by pulmonary thromboemboli, blood clots that form in the legs and travel through the bloodstream to the lungs.

The medical examiner said the clots were due to "deep venous thrombosis of lower extremities due to physical inactivity," complicating an underlying psychological illness: chronic paranoid schizophrenia.

An attorney for Green's family, Sanford Rubenstein, said the finding suggested that the hours she sat in the hospital played a role in her death.

"The length of time that she spent in the emergency room ... very well may have contributed to her death," he said. "Physical inactivity was obviously a significant contributing factor."

The city Health and Hospitals Corp., which owns the hospital, had no immediate comment Friday.

Security guards walked away
HHC officials have previously expressed outrage at the way Green was treated. Six employees lost their jobs over the incident, even before it became public.

Green died while awaiting care in the hospital's psychiatric emergency room. EMS workers had brought her to the center on the morning of June 18. The hospital said she was suffering from agitation and psychosis and was involuntarily admitted after refusing medical review.

The emergency room is chronically overcrowded, and Green waited overnight for further care.

A recording of her death prompted national outrage when it became public last week.

After she collapsed, neither fellow patients nor the hospital's staff moved to help her, even as she thrashed her legs on the floor and tried to get up.

Two security guards and a member of the hospital's medical staff can be seen on the video, stopping to look at Green briefly before walking away. She stopped moving about 30 minutes after falling and was dead when a nurse finally examined her another 30 minutes after that.

HHC immediately reported the death to the state and voluntarily turned over the security records to lawyers already suing the city over alleged patient neglect at the hospital.


Click for related content
Caught on tape: Hospital patient left to die
Some psych patients wait days in hospital ERs

Rubenstein said that had Green been carefully attended to when she arrived at the emergency room, doctors might have noticed swelling in her legs and taken action.

People known to be at risk from deep vein thrombosis are often given anticoagulation drugs or compression stockings, which can keep clots from forming, and advised not to sit for hours at a time.

The condition, however, is not always easy to detect. The National Heart Lung and Blood Institute said about half of the people with deep vein thrombosis have no symptoms at all.

Airlines often advise passengers on very long flights to stroll the aisle, periodically, to prevent blood clots.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

24 hours!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!HAVE ANY OF YOU BEEN TO THE ER LATELY (Besides Winx )

A friend of mine took her elderly mom to the ER last year. She had a 20 hour wait. I was shocked.

My Aunt went to the ER last year and they put her on one of those ER beds in the hallway overnight because there wasn't a room for her.

Three years ago I went. I got there around 9:00 a.m. I left at 6:30 p.m. I was not happy. Then they told me that I couldn't leave to get something to eat because if they called me, I would lose my place in line. I got something to eat anyway. They didn't call me. They were packed when I went. I saw people there for non-ER reasons.

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No one is arguing against REFORM. Citing examples from the current private system does NOT prove that health care will be better because of a government option. Has the government ever had many (any) well run programs???

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Let's look at the government take over of Amtrak - this could happen to GM and Chrysler or health care

*******************************
"The U.S. Transportation Department took over a group of overregulated private railroads that were bankrupt.

The department wrote of Amtrak, “It is expected that the corporation would
experience financial losses for about three years and then become a self-sustaining enterprise.”

No, the above statement wasn’t a joke. Or maybe — given Amtrak’s 35 years of massive red ink — the joke is on all of us who pay taxes.

***********************

All of Amtrak's preferred stock is owned by the U.S. federal government. The members of its board of directors are appointed by the President of the United States and are subject to confirmation by the United States Senate. Common stock was issued in 1971 to railroads that contributed capital and equipment; these shares convey almost no benefits[2] but their current holders[3] declined a 2002 buy-out offer by Amtrak.[4]

Amtrak commenced operations in 1971 with $40 million in direct Federal aid, $100 million in Federally insured loans, and a somewhat larger private contribution.[52] Officials expected that Amtrak would break even by 1974, but those expectations proved unrealistic and annual direct Federal aid reached a 17-year high in 1981 of $1.25 billion.[53] During the Reagan administration, appropriations were halved. By 1986, Federal support fell to a decade low of $601 million, almost none of which were capital appropriations.[54] In the late 1980s and early 1990s, Congress continued the reductionist trend even while Amtrak expenses held steady or rose. Amtrak was forced to borrow to meet short-term operating needs, and by 1995 Amtrak was on the brink of a cash crisis and was unable to continue to service its debts.[55] In response, in 1997 Congress authorized $5.2 billion for Amtrak over the next five years—largely to complete the Acela capital project—on the condition that Amtrak submit to the ultimatum of self-sufficiency by 2003 or liquidation.[56] Amtrak made financial improvements during the period, but ultimately did not achieve self-sufficiency.

In 2004, a stalemate in Federal support of Amtrak forced cutbacks in services and routes as well as resumption of deferred maintenance. In fiscal 2004 and 2005, Congress appropriated about $1.2 billion for Amtrak, $300 million more than President George W. Bush had requested. However, the company's board requested $1.8 billion through fiscal 2006, the majority of which (about $1.3 billion) would be used to bring infrastructure, rolling stock, and motive power back to a state of good repair. In Congressional testimony, the Department of Transportation's inspector-general confirmed that Amtrak would need at least $1.4 billion to $1.5 billion in fiscal 2006 and $2 billion in fiscal 2007 just to maintain the status quo. In 2006, Amtrak received just under $1.4 billion, with the condition that Amtrak would reduce (but not eliminate) food and sleeper service losses. Thus, dining service were simplified and now require two fewer on-board service workers. Only Auto Train and Empire Builder services continue regular made onboard meal service.

In October 2007, the Senate passed S-294, "Passenger Rail Improvement and Investment Act of 2007" (70–22) sponsored by Senators Frank Lautenberg and Trent Lott. Despite a veto threat by President Bush, a similar bill passed the House on June 11, 2008 with a veto-proof margin (311–104).[59] The final bill, spurred on by the September 12 Metrolink collision in California and retitled "Rail Safety Improvement Act of 2008", was signed into law by President Bush on October 16, 2008. The bill appropriates $2.6 billion a year in Amtrak funding through 2013.[60]

The stimulus package gave Amtrak 1.3 billion more.

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This proves pretty much that anything the government runs will never benefit the taxpayers because in thirty years the government has operated Amtrak at a loss. A private company would be bankrupt and knows better than to continue putting money in a HOLE. The government doesn't have to learn that lesson.

The Post Office is run the same way.......

*INFO ABOVE from Wikipedia*

Citing examples only prove that health care needs REFORM. It does NOT prove that the system will be better with a public option. There are plenty of examples that prove the government does not have a good track record of running anything without tons of waste and corruption. Why will it be any different this time???

this is actually not true - not in a doctors office - appointment times are approximate. If doctor takes long with patient before you, obviously you have to wait.

Def not true in emergency room - they take according to injury (life threatening first) regardless of insurance or money. An asthmatic has no wait, why because it can be life threatening.

GO TO CANADA........

Great propaganda, which is about all we are getting right now. Until we know for a fact what is in the plan, I won't be falling for it on either side.