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Topic: Stop The Madness That's Killing Jobs
Moondark's photo
Sun 07/05/09 01:40 PM


LONG POST....

But ultimately, I don't think the problem has anything to do with the so-called stimulus stuff working or not working.

Personally, I never thought it would work. Thought it a huge waste of money. Lots of tax money down the toilet.

I think the issue is one inherent to an economy totally based on spending and getting people to spend and a period of people being stable enough and secure enough that business pushed the envelope trying to see how far they could raise prices and still have people buying.

While sales are recovering slightly, showing that the general public is no longer in a panic of worry, the damage has been done and in a way the damage started before people stopped spending.

I don't think we will see the return to such spending abandon as we used to have. People can't get the credit anymore and people have realized they can get buy without as much and we have realized we DON'T need those frivolous "have to have" items that end up sitting in the closet anyway.

But since our economy is based on getting people to buy things they don't need, and spending more than they have, and not saving money, we will continue to see job losses for a while.

I thought Obama had far more potential to become the next Roosevelt than McCain. But politicians are advised by economists that were far more shocked and taken by surprise by what happened than average people who saw it coming years before hand.

So it really isn't any wonder that these stimulus ideas either flopped or had a very minimal impact. All that money would better have been spent if they did more to focus on job creation than anything else.

Look at how many of the Depression era bridges have started to collapse. Some states have great road systems and some have horrible upkeep. If they had actually taken a page out of Roosevelt's handbook and put together a plan to repair and update much of the stuff that has languishied since Roosevelt's 'job stimulus' packages, many people could have been put to work in many states.

It's strange how this isn't a Depression with a capital D, but it still seems that some of Roosevelt's solutions would have had a far more positive impact that what the government has tried to do so far. And I'm including both the outgoing Bush administration and the incoming Obama one.

The political side is relying too heavily on advise from the very "experts" who helped create the situation and who were utterly blindsided when average people saw it coming 2 years before it happened.


We are starting to see projects get off the ground here in Arizona. Hiway projects seem to be the first ones to begin as they have been planned or on the drawing boards for some time now.

The thing people need to realize is that it does take time! The stimulus money was approved only a few months ago. It takes time to get the funds flowing then for the engineers to complete Construction Documents and then the States to get bids on the projects.

I have been around construction industry in my previous life and I know the time it takes to get a project moving. It's not just a snap of the fingers.

I think once it gets going, we will see a great benefit for years to come. Most of the projects slated for my State are infrastructure related that we will be needing well into the future.

We are seeing housing bottom out and it is starting to up tick slightly as well.

One of the things that I believe is causing the recession to continue is that people are still not spending in a normal fashion. People are saving money instead of spending as they are still scared. Seems like our economy is based on people spending and if they change their patterns, it hurts, especially in retail. You can also see the impact it has had on the auto industry when people quit buying cars.

People need to chill out and go back to normal. drinker


I agree that things take time. But first they throw all this money at the banks. Then make it difficult for the banks to give the money bank when the realized they didn't need it. THEN they do the 'stress tests' and discover that some of the banks they thought they really needed to shore up really were not in any danger at all.

Now all those months messing around with that when they could have been doing something to help real people in real need. Creating jobs or creating a more practical borrower assistant program. And Bush's idea of just giving more tax money back was more of a band-aid than anything else. People paid Bills for the most part. It helps out for only the months that people were getting their checks in. It wasn't a 'get the ball' rolling again event.

The ball being uncontrolled spending beyond everyone's means. And you can say all you want about it being the individual's responsibility to save and stay within ones means. When multiple articles out there were describing people who actually try to save money as "horders" it shows a general consensus in the economic and political world that they NEED people to be spending at that level to keep the economy moving. Which means there is a deliberate agenda to keep people spending beyond what they can afford.

One thing I'm glad about in the past year. Those weekly inundation of credit card offers vanished. Less junk mail in my mailbox.

no photo
Sun 07/05/09 02:55 PM
Our government creates many well intentioned programs - the problem is our elected officials never intend to pay for these programs except by more IOU's to the deficit. Maybe it is time that Americans realized that we can't have all these programs cause we really can't or never will pay for them.

Cutiepieforyou's photo
Sun 07/05/09 03:35 PM
What about all the jobs that have been outsourced so that American companies spend less on workers. In the long run, that is hurting us since there are less jobs for Americans. The jobs that are left seem to be on a spectrum. On one end there are jobs that require many years of training and/or schooling. These jobs pay well. On the other end are the service jobs. They pay what?? minimum (I am guessing). The point is that how are these people ever going to get from where they are now to the jobs that pay well?

cabot's photo
Sun 07/05/09 06:47 PM

**** canning unions would be a good start. Productivity would increase and all the outrageous minimalizations of work responsibilities coupled with undue wages (compared to non-union) would certainly help level out the job market and actually require (gasp) a work ethic and personal responsibility.

To the union people...don't get too ticked off at that statement...my brother is union in an admin position and he agrees with me.



Unions are the scapegoat here Krupa. Jmo. Unemployment going up in the summer is really strange to me. That is my barometer on the economy. Jobs are always created in the summer, and decrease in the winter in 4 season states. Wait till this winter, jobs will be lost still. Our so called free trade policies of the last 15 years have totally cut the legs out of the American worker. Soon it will be upper class and lower class, no more middle. Just like the rest of the world. After all it is a "Global Economy" not a US economy.

Anonimoose's photo
Mon 07/06/09 11:24 AM

**** canning unions would be a good start. Productivity would increase and all the outrageous minimalizations of work responsibilities coupled with undue wages (compared to non-union) would certainly help level out the job market and actually require (gasp) a work ethic and personal responsibility.

To the union people...don't get too ticked off at that statement...my brother is union in an admin position and he agrees with me.



Good to know we agree on at least one thing, krupa! shades

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