funches...I owe you an apology. my mouth tends to get ahead of my brain at times. no matter what i thought....i should have kept my mouth shut. that's one of my flaws

again...I do owe you an apology

Because if the children had stayed, and grown up , they themselves would also have become wicked and evil.......because they would have been INFLUENCED by their environment already.... ....

and the wickedness would most likely have affected their lives also...to where they would become a product of the very destruction they were accustomed to.....

and God knew this....


and God saw it best to just take them all to heaven(speaking of the children ).

Funches...study the Word for yuorself also..and learn..

As I had already said earlier, the child would eventually have grown up, IF the child had stayed....

and then a lot of the inherited generational things would have passed on to child........

if a child for instance, came froma an immoral and evil and wicked generation, quess what, a lot of the generational curses probably woud have passed on to the child....

Is Hell still part of the Christian belief or is there an attempt to either brush it under the rug or play like Hell simply disappeared from the bible, do followers of Christianity today tell others of their belief without including Hell and isn’t this an attempt to be deceptive,

are the followers that actually admit that all non-believers are destine to Hell now considered to be Extremists because they actually follow the Christian belief and spread the word of Hell without deception

Also if Jesus philosophy is one of Love then why is he a part of allowing souls to be torture in Hell for an eternity and doesn’t this make Jesus hypocritically evil

I have seen children who had terrible parents grow up in terrible environments, yet in the end they have without the help of any religion become trouble free adults that created great relationships and become fantastic parents to their offsprings.

Even though they don't believe in Jesus Christ as their savior or the God of Abraham they believe they will go to a greater place if they pass away.

That is because they know in their hearts that regardless how hard their environment is, how bad situations are, they believed in themselves and created the best results out of their situations.

I am living proof of this.

A God/Goddess/Energy/Higher Intelligence/Life Force/Spirit that has the power to create should also have the wisdom to figure out a different way to guide those that have gone in the wrong direction into the right direction without the use of violence such as eliminating a whole planet of living species such as the Noah's Flood or using scare tactics as exteriminating a soul for eternity - hell.

Then of course there are many who don't believe in Gods and are contempt with Atheism or Agnotiscm and live a less troublesome life in general because they don't worry about what was or what will be. They live the NOW in life.

So in the end to believe in fear tactics, which includes "fear of hell" or "fear of what might happen to you" is just another strategy to find obedience for the mass population by a few individuals who want it all.

It sadly seems it still works for many people around the world today.

Is Hell still part of the Christian belief or is there an attempt to either brush it under the rug or play like Hell simply disappeared from the bible,

do followers of Christianity today tell others of their belief without including Hell and isn’t this an attempt to be deceptive,

are the followers that actually admit that all non-believers are destine to Hell now considered to be Extremists because they actually follow the Christian belief and spread the word of Hell without deception

Also if Jesus philosophy is one of Love then why is he a part of allowing souls to be torture in Hell for an eternity and doesn’t this make Jesus hypocritically evil

According to the Bible Jesus wasn't sure of anything. The New Testament claims that he said that he did not come to change the laws and that not one jot nor one tittle shall pass from law. Yet, he denounced the stoning of sinners, he taught us not to judge one another, he taught us to forgive instead of seeking revenge, but all of those things fly in the face of the laws of the Old Testament. So clearly, if the New Testament is an accurate record of what Jesus actually had to say, then Jesus was very confused and inconsistent sending extremely mixed messages.

Also the authors of the New Testament have Jesus saying the following:

John 5:23 "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:"

So if we take Jesus to be the Son, then the Father (the God of Abraham) has committed all judgment unto Jesus *(See Note at bottom of post: I personally disgree with this entirely, as I feel that "the Son" simply means mortal men in general)

John 12:47 "And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world."

Here Jesus clearly states that he will not judge anyone for not believing in him. (This is totally the OPPOSITE of what Christians claim he stood for!) In fact, anytime a Christian claims that we need to believe in Jesus we should quote them John 12:47.

But it won't do much good, because then they'll just quote John 12:48,

John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

But this flies in the face of John 5:23 where Jesus says that the Father hath committed all judgment to the Son.

Clearly this text is ambigious and confusing at best. Why would an all-wise creator of this universe send such mixed messages?

*Notes:

The idea that Jesus was the only Son of God actually goes against what Jesus preached. Jesus said that "Ye are Gods". In fact, Jesus claimed to exist prior to the invention of the God myth by saying, "Before Abraham was I AM", clearly he wasn't claiming to be the Son of a God if he existed before that God existed!

Finally if we take the word "Son" to mean any mortal man (as we are all children of God), then it actually fits in perfectly with Buddhism and the Pantheistic view that God hath committed all judgement unto the Son. We our the judges of our own existence!

In fact, Jesus even alluded to this when he said that we will be judged as we judge. This is true because we are indeed the judges!

Personally, I think the whole religion is a train wreck as an institutionalized dogma. Clearly the words in the text are extremely ambigous and clearly sending mixed messages. In fact, Jesus was the antithesis of the God of Abraham so that's a huge mixed message right there. But the New Testament is full of contridictions and inconsistencies of it's own.

The idea that any God would punish anyone for not believing in a seriously screwed up mythology is absurd in and of itself. Such a God would not be a God, it would be a demon.

Yahshua had all Judgement as he is commanded by the father,

Thier is a difference.

He spoke that thier was a sin unto death. That sin is in constant motion for those who say they believe.

Yahshua is seen at the White Throne Judgement doing the Judgeing by thier works.

he never condemned anyone or blasted you might say but the religious elite.

They accused him of being in company of sinners. He said the well do not need a physician.

This was a double edged sword because they were the biggests sinners of all. Deception was the order of the day as it is today.

They got on to him for forgiving someone of thier sins. That nobody could do that.

Yet he said a simple word..is it harder to say to this man get up and walk(a cripple) or to say to this man your sins are forgiven.

They did not know what to say because Yahshua had healed the crippled.

He was simply showing them they were hypocrites they need a physical healing to believe. When in fact a pure heart and love for one another is all you need to heal the mind. The sinner.

All sins originate in the mind. As he said in the sermon on the mount.

The Law Yahshua Up HELD to it's fullests. No where in the law does it say you have to stone anyone. It may of been done but thier is no law that says you have to.

This is true with any death penalty, If we would learn from the law you would see that the victim has full control within the law to do as they wish.

Men took it and said this is what will be done. That is/was the commandment that was against us that Yahshua took away.

Yahshua's showing he had the right to forgive sins while he was alive is also telling us he did not have to die.

he knew that it was to come to that by knowing the will of the people.

They fullfilled the Prophecy not Yahshua being killed.

He ended by being obedient to the LAW and showing that thier is no greater law than one for another and loving Yahweh.

A friend is one who will die for you..The greatest friend. Yahshua said he was our friend and he proved it by example.

His ressuerction was because of keeping the law perfectly whether it meant his death or not.

This has always been possible but never done before.

Him doing this the father Yahweh granted all things unto him.

Forgiveness of sins through him. The father said he would gibve him anything he wanted if he asked and he askes for our forgiveness.

The sin that is not forgivable he has no control over. It always has been unforgivable and always will be.

No one saves you. They can't. They can tell you about the word but each individual decides whether they will accept it or not.

The theorocracy of you having an Immortal soul you can not find anywhere in the bible.

I would challege anyone to show proof that the bible says you live forever no matter what you have done.

Eternal life is a gift not a right.

The unsaved as most would call them mainly just cease to exist. They are thrown into the Lake of fire which no man can live in.

Yahshua said do not fear him who can kill the body but fear him who can kill the body and soul in Ghenna The Lake of fire.

The doctrine of an eternal soul and eternal torment came from Dante play.

The religious leaders of the day seen this as a scare tactic to win converts and it is still here today.

No different than when Yahshua walked the earth and said you prefer the doctrines of men over the commandments of Yahweh and they do.

Any one who teaches men will be tortured in hell forever should read these verses.

Matt 5:16-20

16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
KJV


Notice people will even make it to the kingdom who break a commandment and teach men so.

So why are the scribes and Pharasees not going to make it?

Because they teach deception.

They teach as if it were sowhen it is a lie.

That is why you must exceed the righyeuosness of the scribes and Pharasees.

they took it upon them selves to add to the word and to take away.

Eternal torment is adding to the word.

What do we see at the end of the book.

Rev 22:18-19

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, Yahweh shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, Yahweh shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
KJV

This apperently means doing away with the law.

The ones who claim the Holy bible and do these things are in far more trouble than the unbeliever ever will be.

As Yahshua says about you who do this..

Matt 19:1-20:1
19:1 And it came to pass, that when Yahshua had finished these sayings, he departed from Galilee, and came into the coasts of Judaea beyond Jordan;
2 And great multitudes followed him; and he healed them there.
3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.
11 But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.
12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.
13 Then were there brought unto him little children , that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them.
14 But Yahshua said, Suffer little children , and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.
15 And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence.
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, Yahweh: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18 He saith unto him, Which? Yahshua said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
23 Then said Yahshua unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
26 But Yahshua beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with Yahweh all things are possible.
27 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore?
28 And Yahshua said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children , or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.
30 But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first.


KJV

This has very deep meaning to it.

The children are whoever you run across and tell them lies about the book. You risk the Judgement when you do this.

The Euruchs are can be several different people as he says only those who can bear it would be those who keep themselves spotless. Stay virgins for the word.

They are also the ones who come and hear the word but reject it because you are no speaking the words of Yahweh but the words of man.

He speaks about divorce also this is the ones who are young in believeing and then see the Hypocracy and so they leave and metaphorically divorce from the believers.


These again are the children as we all are told we are children.

So if you stick by the word and not what men say you have nothing to worry about.

If you stick by man made doctrines you have condemned yourself and it would of been better if you were never had been born..Blessings...Miles

"Milesoftheusa" ..I have to agree..even Jesus said that only the father knows certain things ...since god is supposedly omniscient and Jesus admitted to a lack knowledge of certain events this proves that Jesus was not all knowing and therefore not a God ...Jesus's own words disproves the trinity

I have seen children who had terrible parents grow up in terrible environments, yet in the end they have without the help of any religion become trouble free adults that created great relationships and become fantastic parents to their offsprings.

Well, I have read through the threads and all I can say funches is that you definitely have a very jaded view of spirituality unless I am reading you wrong.

So let me get this right? According to you if I do not accept your brand of belief I am doomed to eternal Hell? I see other Christians arguing against you and yet you seem to adhere to the Fire and Brimstone brand of Christianity. For as well and soft spoken as you attempt to come off with the others it hides a fanaticism of one clinging to fundamentalist views of the Christian faith.

"smiles" ..."MorningSong" seems to be suggesting that since the parents are tainted then the children should be killed because they have been deemed incapable of being rehabilitated or just not worth the trouble for a supposedly all powerful entitiy to rectify ...

so if the children were drown because they are tainted then that would also be the reason to sending them to Hell